Forum Replies Created
-
AuthorPosts
-
May 22, 2015 8:34 pm at 8:34 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083309newbeeMember
“Passuk? Gemara? Rambam? Shulchan aruch? Mishna Berurua?
I’d be happy to provide all.”
I always like to see references
May 22, 2015 8:26 pm at 8:26 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083308newbeeMember???? ??? ??? ???, ??? ????? ?????? ????????? ???? ??? ???? ????. ????” “?????? ??????? ?????? ?? ?????
????? ???? ???? ????? ?? ??? ???? ?
Eat an onion and sit in the shade and do not eat fat geese and chickens because your desire [for food] will [constantly] run after you. Reduce what you spend on food and drink and and add to your home (i.e. olam haba, see ben yehoyada).
You think the ramchal and this gem didnt know about that one, dare I say, most-often abused gemara of all time. And like I quoted before, all these inyanim about how its great to enjoy gashmius is that you connect it to rechnius. but its immature and naive to say anyone off the street can simply say “I want this $100 per pound steak to make my ruchnius better” and make it so. It takes a madreiga to do that. For us, the key is moderation.
May 22, 2015 5:30 pm at 5:30 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083302newbeeMemberubiquitin “asid liten din vecheshbon al kol sheraasa eino velo achal”
Roughly translated: In the future [you will have to] answer for any [mutar] item [that you] saw and did not eat”
???? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ??? ….???? ????? ???? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ??????? ???
??? ??? ???? ??????? ??? ?
May 22, 2015 4:55 pm at 4:55 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083299newbeeMembersimcha613: “And since these people are (and I quote) “very wealthy MO BTs etc”
I actually said (and I quote) “but then I realized it was probably geared towards very wealthy MO BTs”
I used the words “geared towards” and you said I said “these people are”
I did not mention anyone specific nor did I say it applied to everyone who attended. I simply refereed to the focus group.
“I have never heard anybody say that if you enjoy eating or even “stuffing your face” on shabbos (assuming we arent dealing with achila gasa) then you should avoid it.”
My rebbi publicly says that about people who stuff their faces on shabbos.
“Just by eating cheesecake and baked ziti, and enjoying it you get schar!”
oy vey
May 22, 2015 4:48 pm at 4:48 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083298newbeeMembermentsch1: “you get all sorts of rationalization. “I have a big family, I give a lot to tzedukah, its not an aveirah.”
Well said, and thank you, could not have said it better.
DaasYochid: “I read newbee’s words that way.”
Yes, thanks, thats what I was trying to get across. The excitement you have for that delicious shabbos meal should enhance your shabbos learning and family interactions. It should put you in a better mood so you can elevate the ruchnius part of shabbos too (since on shabbos gashmius is meant to elevate ruchnius unlike a regular weekday when gashmius tends to do the opposite). But if you are rushing through shachris to get to lunch, thats a problem.
“I think your objection to the halachic dinner is that it’s a more extreme form of redifas hataavah than we’re used to, and cloaked as a religious experience.”
Correct.
May 22, 2015 1:36 pm at 1:36 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083284newbeeMember“although I don’t think you have yet to articulate it well”
By all means, if you can articulate the point better please do so.
These levels are so “lofty”? Oy vey.
May 22, 2015 12:54 pm at 12:54 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083282newbeeMemberYou are referring to a chiuv seudas mitzva.
On a side note, if the main reason you look forward to shabbos is that you get to stuff your face with stuffed chicken and meat, you should not be stuffing your face with stuffed chicken and meat. The gashmius of shabbos is for the people who have less gashmius over the regular week and whos neshamos can handle the gashmius.
Same goes for cheese cake and baked ziti on shavuos.
May 22, 2015 4:03 am at 4:03 am in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083275newbeeMemberOk so call it for what it is. A fancy dinner of gashmius with some torah entertainment on the side to make the meal more tasty and fun. Thats all.
May 21, 2015 10:13 pm at 10:13 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083272newbeeMember“I think that’s a very cynical and unnecessarily judgmental way of looking at it.”
I think its an honest way of looking at it- and we should call things for what they are. The entire concept of “elevating gashmius” 90% of the time just leads to elevating the amount that gashmius is indulged in. And the next day when the meal is over, the people are going for the next fancy restaurant- not the next blatt gemara about kosher birds.
May 21, 2015 8:29 pm at 8:29 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083269newbeeMember“So they have taavos for good food just like you.”
If you want to talk about me, I dont remember the last time I spent more than $12 on a meal besides shabbos. My typical dinner is rice and some chicken.
May 21, 2015 8:04 pm at 8:04 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083268newbeeMember“But instead of just eating good and exotic food, they tried to mix it with Talmud Torah”
A more accurate statement would be, “instead of just eating expensive and exotic food, they tried to rationalize it with talmud torah.
The Torah aspect of it provided some intellectual entertainment along with the meal. Like those renaissance fairs they used to have where they fed you ancient types of dishes and explained to you how it was made in ancient times while you were eating it. And the next day when the meal is over, the people are going for the next fancy restaurant- not the next blatt gemara and maharsha.
May 21, 2015 7:15 pm at 7:15 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083264newbeeMember“so you’ve never eaten at a nice restaurant?”
I’ve never eaten exotic delicacies like that while trying to make my meal seem like it was a grand spectacle of kedusha and tahara- an halachic dinner. If I eat expensive food, I admit its the madreiga im on right now, and call it for what it is. There are many people that can learn plenty well about kashrus while living off rice and pasta, while other people I guess need to literally eat what they learn about in order to arouse their interest in Torah.
May 21, 2015 6:42 pm at 6:42 pm in reply to: Women staying up all night on shevuos and being tznius all night. #1082628newbeeMemberThe feminists only learn on shavuos night and the non-feminists learn every night besides shavuos.
May 21, 2015 6:39 pm at 6:39 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083262newbeeMember“Mesilas Yesharim is not a book of Halacha like the Shulhan Aruch.”
Thats right, very good. Its the most widely read and cherished mussar sefer in Judaism. And the point could not be more pashut from his words.
May 21, 2015 4:52 pm at 4:52 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083259newbeeMember“These considerations would unquestionably cause one to spurn the pleasure of eating, showing its good to be not truly good and its evil to be truly evil….One will be made especially aware of the truth of what is being said if he considers the many sicknesses connected with eating or at least the heaviness that one experiences after meals and the vapors that becloud his brain” -mesilas yesharim
The fact that so many people got sick is a great example of why mesilas yesharim is the most widely cherished mussar sefer.
May 21, 2015 4:24 pm at 4:24 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083256newbeeMemberzahavasdad “There is no such thing as a “Yetza Hora for exotic delacies” If its Kosher its Kosher and a Mitzvah to eat it”
Mesilas Yesharim Chapter 15
“When it becomes clear to a person that this good (i.e. exotic foods) is utterly fictitious and the evil inherent in it is real due to its base nature…”
“There is no pleasure more short-lived and perishable than that of eating. The food is only enjoyed in a persons mouth, and once it leaves the throat to descend into the intestines, its memory is lost and the food is forgotten, as if it had never existed.
Bread will satiate one to the same extent as the delicacy of fattened geese.
One will be made especially aware of the truth of what is being said if he considers the many sicknesses connected with eating or at least the heaviness that one experiences after meals and the vapors that becloud [variant: confound] his brain. These considerations would unquestionably cause one to spurn the pleasure of eating, showing its good to be not truly good and its evil to be truly evil….This is the intent of Solomon’s statement (Ecclesiastes 7:2), “It is better to go to the house of mourning than to the house of feasting.”
May 21, 2015 4:09 pm at 4:09 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083255newbeeMemberLess people would have gotten sick if they would have taught mesilas yesharim instead.
May 21, 2015 3:04 pm at 3:04 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083251newbeeMemberzahavasdad: I never said a word about what one is required to do.
“The average yeshiva or shul usually don’t spend big sums of money on unnecessary expansion”
You must be kidding. It all depends on the location.
You are getting sidetracked. My gripe is not about expansions, was about the idea of the “halachic dinner” being a seudas mitzvah of kedusha, tahara and talmud torah when really its just an excuse for people to satisfy their yetzer hara for exotic delicacies.
May 21, 2015 3:01 am at 3:01 am in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083246newbeeMember“Newbee, you assume everyone supports the kollel system and is required to support them.”
I mentioned kollel along with feeding the poor and thought it was obvious I was not referring to a specific group- but was rather asking if the money this was raising was going to tzedaka or shule expansions. Not kollel specifically.
May 21, 2015 12:31 am at 12:31 am in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083229newbeeMemberThere is nothing halachic about this, its just a way to rationalize eating exotic foods. The gashmius in people are attracted to exotic things. The fundraising, was it to feed the poor (which is kind of ironic) support poor kollelman, or to build another unnecessary expansion?
May 20, 2015 5:40 pm at 5:40 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083207newbeeMemberfrom what I read it was a $100 minimum, so I suppose its likely people spent hundreds of dollars per person, but I dont know for sure.
May 20, 2015 5:13 pm at 5:13 pm in reply to: 'Halachic Dinner" – What do you think about it? #1083205newbeeMemberAt first I thought it was a joke, but then I realized it was probably geared towards very wealthy MO BTs who love expensive food and Rov Joseph Ber Soloveitchik (in that order)- so then I said yea, I guess this makes sense.
May 13, 2015 7:48 pm at 7:48 pm in reply to: Would I be Jewish ? Some orthodox say yes some no #1077289newbeeMember“I consider myself an Orthodox Jew.”
What does this mean? Since your conversion, have you always kept shabbos and kashrus? Did you do anything when you were 13?
How old were you when your mom converted?
newbeeMemberbava metzia 84b- you see that only bitul torah was docheh what he was trying to do.
??? ????? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ??? ?????? ????? ???? ???? ????? ??? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ??? ??????? ???? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ????? ???? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ?? ?? ?????? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ?? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ?????
????? ????. ???? ???? ?????? ???? ????? Rashi
????? ???? ??? [?????] ?????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ????? ??? ???? ?? ???? ?? ????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ?? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ?? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ????? ??? ?????? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ???? ????
newbeeMemberThe OP seems like a tzadik and the topic is bitul zman on the thread below.
newbeeMembernfgo3: care to elaborate???
newbeeMemberyehudayona +1
newbeeMemberWhat good is going to come out of this thread?
newbeeMemberMilitant Islam is most similar to Nazism.
Militant Leftism is most similar to Communism.
Both were very bad for the Jews.
Germany and Russia had a truce for as long as it suited them.
newbeeMember$40 a month per kid?
Many people cant afford to put away $40-50 a month per kid every month for 20 years. More realistically, even if many people did do this, if the family is tight that money would be used up way before 20 years because of some medical emergency, needing to pay rent, needing to leave a rent deposit, needing to get some sort of car- no matter how junky, needing to see a dentist- the list goes on an on. You are living in a world that many people would consider fantasy with your 20 year at $40 a month technique.
newbeeMemberI force myself to take a shower once a year at a minimum, whether I need one or not.
newbeeMembergolfer: “I happen to know for a fact that some people enjoy cigars.”
Few! I thought you were going to say you only have substantial evidence that some people enjoy cigars, but you lacked enough data to prove it as fact.
“there’s a whole long list of reasons why the takanos idea (of limiting wedding costs) just never took hold.”
What is this so called “long list of reasons?”
newbeeMembersyag- accroding to you these people are still being lifnei iver on lo sachmod. according to me though lo sachmod does not mean that you should not what others have for yourslef also, it means that you should not want their personal items. So its a lose – lose either way you look at it.
newbeeMemberDont take it out on the couple, Rabbonim should refuse to be mesader kiddushin at very expensive weddings and bans should be placed on expensive weddings.
I have been to weddings where they had personal cigar rollers, I have been to weddings where everything was so fancy that the couple could not afford to invite their own extended family members who wanted to come, they paid for all these expensive things over their own family members who could have came if they just had it at a more affordable place- its disgusting
newbeeMemberThe whole concept that its fine for people to buy very fancy things as long as they give tzedka is mamish wrong. How do they not realize the pressure it puts on others.
May 4, 2015 2:42 pm at 2:42 pm in reply to: Should the wishes of racist parents that I not date their child be respected? #1076260newbeeMemberYou do realize if race played no role in marriage, there would be no white people, asians, blacks etc. everyone would be one bland color- sounds kind of boring to me.
People are not racist if they dont date you because you are black, green or purple. Many ashkenazim refuse to date sefardim and visa versa. Some people like yellow cars, some people like blue cars. Are they shallow, possibly, it all depends on the situation.
newbeeMember“Jews in Banking and Wall Street got the blame”
No they didnt you are talking about some youtube posters. No serious political figure blamed the Jews. There is zero chance of a Nazi-like dictatorship starting in the US. In Nazi Germany, anti-semitism had been brewing in Europe for a very long time, and there was very little cultural diversity in terms of percentage of the population.
newbeeMemberNo- this is not possible in any reasonable sense. The chances are so infinitesimal of this happening in our lifetimes in the US. With ever increasing cultural diversity and technology that allows for transparent communication and education.
The bigger threat, though extremely unlikely, is the US becoming more like communist Russia than Nazi Germany, where a militant atheism could gain power and prevent mitzvos if they have a even a tiny sliver of intellectual appeal, i.e. shechting will be banned because its painful to animals and a bris mila will be banned because the baby does not have a choice in the matter.
newbeeMember“Can the person caring for the person use the Kosher Light Switch and feel good that they are not violating any of the hilchos Shabbos?”
Poskim wont change the tzurah of shabbos in order to prevent people from being over a lav or to ease their emotional discomfort- better to tell them the right thing to do over and over again and hope they change- appose us changing for them. A rov needs to be consulted for the questions of hospitals and the like. From what I have learned and heard, there is essentially no place for the kosher switch in our homes.
We see that the rabonim created a tzurah of shabbos- we should have the table set nicely, light candles, drink the meal over wine, we cannot ride on a horse because we “may break a twig”- the underlying reason is the rabbis did not want people’s shabbos to look like a weekday and riding on a horse and the like would ruin the tzurah. Its not only what is technically permitted that matters. The kosher switch has both very real melacha issues and zilzul issues and I dont see it having any place in the Jewish home now or in the future.
newbeeMemberbejoyful: i really think what you are saying has no place on this thread- this has nothing to do with my opening question. you are just side-tracking the real question and causing people to go off on tangents.
newbeeMemberthat doesn’t mean the laws of nature are fake, it means Hashem overrides them in a miraculous way for some people.
newbeeMemberthe question is why the gem says a nes nister can happen for a regular person, this is brought down by rabenu bachya. why would health be different.
newbeeMemberno one is denigrating doctors. the question is since a nes nister can work for things hidden from the eye, can this apply to health as well. the case specifically given by the gem for this concept is produce.
newbeeMemberrabenu chananel says that the grama does not work if its the way its usually used. its intended purpose is to make something happen- thats what its made for- this is called meiseh, so I dont get the entire concept. Many times poskim will be meikel for cholim- how can you apply this to everyone when we are dealing with a chiuv kares according to rabenu channanel?
newbeeMemberbe joyful: “a very depressed person is allowed to take depresson pills”
you just said in another thread that medicine is 100% fake
newbeeMemberoy vey
April 30, 2015 3:14 pm at 3:14 pm in reply to: "Distance Your Path from It" � The Dangers of Academic Study #1141278newbeeMembertaka: He basically said college was all about trying new things and finding out who you really are, came from a MO background.
“but also for personal fulfillment” tell him to learn torah and do mitzvos- it will also be a lot cheaper.
I think a bigger problem is not that people mamish go off the derech from college- but they sacrifice all of their learning time for it and between that and davening 3 times a day they have no time to learn. The only learning they end up doing is the 5 min google search for a halachic issue that comes up or a brief glance at a daf yomi. Most talmudic skills are lost within 4 years after Israel.
April 30, 2015 4:24 am at 4:24 am in reply to: "Distance Your Path from It" � The Dangers of Academic Study #1141275newbeeMemberwhat do you mean? how does that answer the problem of people not being able to eat because they cant buy food or cant afford to see a dentist? because someone took a humanities course and went off the derech means someone else with a solid foundation should be somech on a nes or starve?
April 30, 2015 3:44 am at 3:44 am in reply to: "Distance Your Path from It" � The Dangers of Academic Study #1141273newbeeMemberCan you please copy and paste the answer you are referring to.
One thing I will never forget from my first year in college (in all honesty one of the few things I remember), in a seemingly innocent psych course- one young man came in the beginning wearing a keepa, at the end of the course he stopped wearing it. The professor kept going off on tangents having nothing related to the course material how silly and contentious religion is and about this woman who was suffering from being brought up orthodox.
April 30, 2015 3:00 am at 3:00 am in reply to: "Distance Your Path from It" � The Dangers of Academic Study #1141271newbeeMember“There is no doubt that if the standard of living were lower, the nisyonos would be lower…Chazal had an idea: pas b’melach tochal. ”
I agree that many, many people should lower their standard of living- there is no need to become a fancy lawyer or doctor in order to make 200k per year and work 24/7 when you have 2 kids.
But what about the people who can only afford food to eat if nothing happens to their car, and if they have to fix their car, they dont eat, if they dont fix their car, they dont work, and hence they dont eat. what about the people who can barely afford rent? who dont eat every day or only eat pasta in order to pay rent. The people who sit in pain day after day because they cant afford to see a dentist. These are just the basics- cant lower it more than that.
-
AuthorPosts