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i didn’t follow that gematria…
everything’s in proportion. i’m being paid very little, and i’m paying very little. this is especially true in ‘bnei Torah settlements’ such as kiryat sefer and beitar illit, where the whole society is based on kollel families and their specific needs. they are paid very little by their kollels adn supplementary incomes from their wives, but in turn, the tuition is very little, rent is almost a third of what it is in yerushalayim, and food/clothing prices are a mechaya!
but about making aliya which was really the discussion here, major things to take into account are the emotional capablities of the children and their ability to adjust.
some married women braid their hair so that it won’t by mistake slip out from under her hair covering – it’s more secure than a ponytail.
>>””because “nachas is not tied up only in returning to yiddishkeit” is a very very true statement.””
>”If Yiddishkeit is of paramount importance to a Jew, then that is an absolutely abhorrent statement.”
but philosopher, who cares about a math test? it’s not yiddishe nachas to get a hundred on a math test! who cares about math when there’s all those mitzvos to be proud of??
math taught in schools today is a goyishe subject! what’s there to be proud of??
lol!
but it’s really not.
if you’re female, don’t go to the public garbages at night; they hang around there (although i’m not quite sure what being female has to do with it…)
philosopher, that sounds like a great idea, thanks!
philosopher: when your child comes home IY”H with a hundred on a math test, what will you say?
wellinformedyid – first of all, for a second i thought you were telling me to be happy. lol!
anyway, i have had an interlinear siddur since my bas mitzva pretty much, that’s AT LEAST 😉 seven years, besides having a very good Hebrew, so i actually know what i’m saying.
and i’m still having a problem. not concrete – i’m very makpid with zmanim, daven shacharis and mincha every day, etc, but most of the time, it’s rather automatic, like i don’t have the patience (what an awfaul thing to say) to stand and concentrate on every word.
(this is just interesting: for a while, a couple months back, i had terrific shemona esreis. i coulnd’t figure it out. a couple weeks ago i realized that that had been exactly when i was the companion of the mother of a specific chassidish rebbe in e”Y. cool, no?)
mod – that’s true. but it’s still very frustrating not to FEEL during set tefilla. very – does anyone have any ideas?
philosopher – i did not talk about respecting the sin. i talked about showing the kid acceptance even if he hasn’t made a spiritual step yet.
love and acceptence makes in a thousand times easier for a kid to come back, and even just to make that first step. it’s not going to cut it to decide, i’ll start showing him respect when he ‘decides’ to come back and does something about it – because it’s much much more likely to happen only after he’s shown acceptance.
i personally cannot guarantee where i would be right now had my grandmother not shown complete acceptance and love for me whatever i was doing that wasn’t according to the Torah.
josh – i disagree. i think it gives the boys a very powerful push upward, and it also causes them to act in the bekavodig manner of a ben Torah from that young age. where does it say that the disgrace of talmidei chachamim was caused by boys dressing like their rebbes?
i didn’t understand that bit about the kohanim, can you explain it again?
wolf – 🙂 it’s not true. i never said that the people wearing logos are any worse than those who do not wear logos, i said that those who do are not for me. maybe it’s because i was tortured through school by logo-wearers who were totally absorbed in themselves and what they could do to elevate their status, but i have this bad feeling about logo-wearers. of course, i said i would have to ‘think very hard’ about marrying someone who wears logos, not that i never would. i would have to make sure for myself that the logo isn’t reflecting something undesirable.
josh – hachitzonius meorrer es hapenimiyus. even if we’re not on such a high level, dressing like a talmid chacham can make it easier for us to get there.
tzippi – it’s a great story, but i think that the point was a different one, although i sort of see how it connects here. the point was that he was so involved in kiruv, avodas hakodesh, that he didn’t have time to change into ‘bekavodig’ clothes before davening. but what i’m saying here isn’t really that. i’m trying to define and find the reason for, what is considered bekavodig.
if you want them fluffy, try substituting the water, or even just half the liquid, with seltzer. it’s supposed to help.
maybe i’m blind or maybe i never peeked at my brother’s and all my clients’ (i’m a housekeeper as a side job) shirts while i fold them, but i never saw any logo on any white shirt. on the other hand, i have seen logos on colored shirts.
and i would have to think very hard about marrying someone who did have a logo on his white shirt.
and i would NOT let my boys wear logos on their white shirts. it’s stupid. i’m a girl and i never wear logos.
that having been said, i still believe that white shirts are respectable for b’nei Torah. it’s plain and simple, and bekavodig at the same time.
just a question – why don’t rabbanim (note the term rabbanim, not rabbis) wear colored shirts?
i hope for your sake and your children’s sake that all of your children will be clearheaded teenagers really.
because “nachas is not tied up only in returning to yiddishkeit” is a very very true statement.
the first step an OTD kid makes to return is very often being clean, sober, or whatever else they were doing that isn’t what a Jew should be doing. and the only way that that will become ‘the first step’ is if those close to him show him that he’s giving them NACHAS, even if it’s not necessarily the most yiddishe nachas you can think of.
on the other hand, if all you do is say ‘sorry joe, love you and all, but you’re still not religious -‘ it’s most probably going to be the end of his return journey before it really began. chas veshalom.
please just keep in mind that it’s very hard nowadays to know who is a ‘willful repeated unrepentant Torah violator.’ some people really don’t know, and others, who actually know the halachos, many of those weren’t raised to appreciate, love, and follow the Torah, so why should they – from their point of view.
that’s why – hate the action, not the person.
what’s a sliding scale?
why should you pity his neices? if they’re used to him not talking to him, then it’s not a problem! i WISH my cousins and uncles wouldn’t talk to me!
but anyway, i don’t care about faux pas. it’s my opinion that the yeshive uniform is respectable looking. that’s all.
wolf – no.
but i do stick to my guns here.
gavra_at_work —
where???
i’d have to say that i never noticed that the black hat is a faux pas in the summer; where i come from and where i live now, the straw hat is the faux pas. last i checked, anyway.
i believe that a black suit and white shirt is a very respectabel looking uniform, and that’s one reason why they wear it. same with the hat.
i myself would only marry someone who wore this levush because of that reason, not because i think he has better yiddishkeit – i’m just into looking respectable.
just about that comment before ‘was the yo really necessary’ – who cares? obviously he felt the need to say it. and it’s not a bad word – i say let it be!
i would tend to agree with wellinformedyid on this. i would like to add that it’s important to hate the action so that we’re careful ourselves with it. it’s very hard to be ‘accepting’ as the world understands it and still keep our own standards as high as they belong.
lesschumros, that’s exactly my problem. except that since i also have a slight visual problem that affects my reading, reading from a text only makes things worse. does anyone know if there’s anything (not professional – too expensive) to do about that?
people have found me out but i don’t care. i’m proud of my opinions and anyone who doesn’t like them stays away from me (personal experience). and if they stay away from me then it certainly makes no difference one way or another if they know ;).
thanks.
i didn’t say be quiet and calm down i said throwing stones doesn’t help in the lease, and even i, who considers myself (and am considered by others) very frum and tznius, have a difficult time not getting turned off when i’m yelled at ‘lo tznua’ in meah shearim – k”v someone who really is doing something wrong. your goal is not to turn them off (not off the derech, just gives a really bad feeling that’s hard to grow past) is it? i didn’t think so.
i just say that soft words are probably going to get you where you want more effectively.
PLEASE keep being right and decisive about your correct opinions/facts, but i don’t understand why the abrasiveness is necessary!
i agree with you but as you can see, hotheadedness (kanaus really) isn’t getting you anywhere in the threads so you might as well me right and nice as opposed to right and abrasive.
mosherose, while i agree with you a hundred percent, your manner of speaking (posting??) has me very nervous. it sounds very kitrug-y, is it possible for you to tone it down a bit??
i love this thread!!!
why is it that every time i need a fifteen bus a two comes, but when i need a two (and come on time!!), two fifteens come before the two comes late??
i saw in my hallway a bike and a shopping cart leaning against a pole. guess which one was locked up with the bike lock? WHY??
thank you!! for giving the world that information. seriously, no sarcasm intended.
lashontov – i like the periscope mashal. very accurate.
samshtark – it is not the freier’s fault necessarily – in fact, most of them (according to my rav and many of my teachers) are tinokos shenishbe’u and not responsible for their actions. that of course doesn’t refer to actual apikorsim, but even that is not easily defined by laypeople.
WE, you and me (well i can’t speak for you, but for myself), are the ones at fault, b/c WE know what is right and fall for the wrong sometimes anyway, and WE need to up our ante, not they, theirs.
when the top level is higher, automatically, the bottom rises with it.
may Hashem bring the geulah shelaima bekarov!
shudder. but i think myfriend is right. it absolutely doesn’t have a place with us.
not the cheap goyishe kind.
da – shir hashirim is NOT romance. it’s an allegory to the deepest LOVE that Hashem has for klal yisrael and vice versa. this is not romance – chas v’shalom!
romance and love are two different things.
i agree. how do you suggest that one teaches his child to expect that mashiach can come any day w/o making it sound like that person made it sound to me?