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Itzik_s: “I have even heard those who suffered the most at the hands of their neighbors, namely Polish Chassidim, speaking Polish with construction workers and maids in Boro Park and seemingly enjoying the dialogue.”
The Polish you heard from the Polish Yidden in all likelihood was a very primitive form since very few frum Polish Yidden ever mastered the language because of the rampant Anti-Semitism. Few attended secular schools beyond the early grades and Yiddish was spoken/written exclusively.
Not so for the Hungarian; Czech; German; etc. Jews; for them secular education was mandatory. Many, in fact, never spoke Yiddish.
And the reason that they “seemingly enjoying the dialogue” is because to themselves (inneveinig) the Polish Yidden are saying, “Look peasants, while you and your ancestors stole our properties; tortured and killed us; at the end you Polakim are working for me and cleaning my shmutz”.
When Joseph and I agree on something, you know Moshiach is around the corner.
Jothar: Thanks for the history of pants but that was not the point. As Joseph indicated, the pants example was not to compare pants to Yiddish but to show that some things are so obvious that it does not need to be discussed in s’farim.
Funny though, Jothar, should we discard our Talmud Bavli shas and just use the English Art Scroll version? Would you say there’s no kedusha in the Aramaic language since it’s not Loshon Hakodesh and not the language spoken today? Or do we recognize that the talmud in it’s original form was the best way to acquire it’s teachings and we try to understand it by using the English Art Scroll as an aide but not to replace the original C”V.
Also “the bachurim in Slabodka – Reb Aaron, Reb Yaakov, Rav Shach, Rav Hutner, Rav Ruderman” all spoke Yiddish after leaving their native country and their mode of dress also evolved into the kapote mode of their Rebbe, Der Alte fun Slabodke.
Jothar: Don’t be silly.
“vi shteit” that you have to wear pants in public?
Some things don’t need to be written.
Jothar: Are you saying that speaking Yiddish is the same as speaking any other goyish language?
Are you saying that Yiddish translations of Chumash and T’filah have the same flavor as English or German translations?
Are you saying that T’chinos in Yiddish have the same g’feel as those translated into English?
Paleeze.
lakewoodwife: Thanks
Joseph: Sh’koach!
When we were in yeshiva years ago, the higher class Rabbeim, teachers, did not speak English very well, and their Torah would be less understood if given in broken English. However, this is how Yiddish was learned in the classroom. Since Yiddish incorporates a lot of Hebrew (and now English) and when in a learning or drasha setting, half of the content is the same as when in English, i.e., quoting chazal; t’nach; talmud; commentaries; etc.) So many English speaking people may lose almost as much even when in English.
But the key is to give your self the opportunity and be eager to learn. Like any language, the more you do it, the easier it becomes and before long, you’re one of them.
lakewoodwife: Sounds delicious. Can you make it with the skin off?
How about that recipe? Thanks.
Yiddish evolved over many hundreds of years much like the (Yin)English that is spoken in the Yeshiva and chasidik communities today.
Yidden across Europe spoke the local language of their countries, mainly German/Slavic/Russian languages and communicated with each other in writing and orally and much of this communication incorporated religious/torah themes since this was the life and existence of Yidden. So in a great sense, Yiddish is mamish a “holy” language and so to might (Yin)English be one day, l’chora.
Any language can be used for corrupt purposes. The evil personalities of our biblical history spoke lashon hakodesh since this was their everyday language. Was Korach or Eisav supposed to use a “foreign” language for their evilness?
You can’t read and understand the writings of Shalom Aleichem or other non-religious Yiddish writers without a good foundation in T’nach; Halacha and Minhagim; and even Talmud. While there is a certain purity in learning Torah in Yiddish, which can’t be replicated in any other spoken language today, R’ Yaakov Kamenetsky instructed that childern in Torah V’daas be taught in English because the Torah should not be made a “karban”, sacrificed, for the sake of Yiddish.
It was Lashon Hakodesh, the language of the Torah, not modern Ivrit, which unified Gedolim from all parts of the world.
For many years I’ve tried to dissuade my married daughters from giving themed m’shalach manos but a “necteger tag”, no one paid any attention to me.
No exaggeration, we receive and give scores of m’shalach manos and at least half of those we receive are cleverly themed. We also receive many pre-packaged types sold by “Tzadaka” organizations, but while the contents and containers are very fancy; I enjoy the home baked/cooked items far more.
M’shalach manos were intended to not, be m’ayin, look carefully, into the kitchen of the sender but to enhance fellowship of friends and neighbors. It is a good idea though to indicate whether the “mezonos” items are yoshan.
Someone once asked my Rav in shiur what he thought of themed m’shalach manos. He responded that the question was once posed to Rav Soloveitchik by a talmud, whether themed m’shalach manos were assur to send. Rav Soloveitchik answered that themed m’shalach manos were stupid and anything stupid is assur.
notpashut: Good G’zagt (well said)!
There are many nuances and heterim associated with this halacha. However, the prohibition is to SIT or LEAN within four amos “in front of” or “behind” or “to the side of” someone davening shmoneh esrei. However, for “walking or passing”; the issur is only “in front of”. You can walk behind or to the side of a person davining shmone esrei.
Many times it’s the home and local yeshiva and environment that create the battleground for our young people.
There are a number of very good frum regular “out-of-town” (non co-ed) high schools that are not as judgmental as “in-town” schools and give teenagers a lot more breathing room. Many parents of At Risk Teenagers have gotten their children back along with their happy faces as a result of the success of these schools.
By the time teens are at the “At Risk” level, parents should be more concerned about gaining the trust and happiness of their child, than the child’s frumkeit. You can’t be a frum Yid without being happy. Ivdu es Hashem b’simcha.
I heard from a renowned Rav that teens at the “At Risk” level are probably not m’chuyiv in mitzvos anyway.
I have witnessed many Rabbonim (most)in Flatbush saying “Gut Shabbos” to every Yid they pass or meet in the street: young and old, male and female; including Joseph’s Rav.
Moshejoe, thank you.
Joseph, what are your feelings regarding this issue?
Most important: Consult your Rav for guidance on these issues, not “he said, she said” blog posts.
Moderator: I was wondering about that myself.
I had a post removed the other day about the virtues of some camps (Help in choosing a Camp); a very positive post about Camp Sternberg and Camp Tubby. I also had a post that added a couple of singers to cantoresq’s list; which didn’t make it.
While this was last posted several weeks ago, I just noticed it and have some thoughts on the topic.
My Rav once commented that he receives many shailos on many divergent and critical matters from all types of people, but the one shaila that he is never asked, which he considers one of the most important is: “Which yeshiva do I send my child to?”.
A Rav should be aware of the different aspects of the schools and just like there is no one shul or one Rav for everyone (Asei L’cha Rav) but rather you need to find the shul and Rav that is best suited for you; the same is for schools.
Every child is different and there is no one school for every child. All of our daughters started in Prospect Park Yeshiva (seven) but for high school, we only had four going there. While Prospect Park was the right choice for the four, the other high schools were more suitable for my other daughters’ personalities and all excelled in their own schools. I know that Rav Bulman ZT”L and other Rabbonim sent each of their children to a different schools for these reasons.
Unfortunately, we tend to use only one school for economic reasons.
Be prepared though, your daughter’s hatzlacha in Prospect Park or other Yeshivos may mean that her frumkeit; midos; secular education; halacha; hebrew language; Jewish history; speaking ability; will be far superior to that of the yeshiva bochur that she is set to date for shidduch purposes and many times she will have to settle for an exterior facade rather than the real thing.
jphone said: “I am willing to bet that most YWN bloggers never heard of the “most popular” Ner Yisroel musmach, (nor should they care to – as this person became the head of the JTS) popular in the sense that more people heard of him than probably, lihavdil elef havdalos R” Ruderman Z’l himself.”
Cherrybim’s response: Are you sure about your “head of the JTS” comment? Who would that be?
To Azi: I assume that it’s not true because Ner Israel is only around since 1933 and there haven’t been too many chancellors at JTS since that time. So going down the list is a pretty simple m’tzios to verify.
Perhaps, the closest thing to what was claimed by jphone may be that R’ Shaul Lieberman of JTS learned in Slabodke with Rav Ruderman and Rav Hutner.
jphone:
“I am willing to bet that most YWN bloggers never heard of the “most popular” Ner Yisroel musmach, (nor should they care to – as this person became the head of the JTS) popular in the sense that more people heard of him than probably, lihavdil elef havdalos R” Ruderman Z’l himself.”
Are you sure about your “head of the JTS” comment? Who would that be?
Driving a vehicle is not about “getting away” with things.
Just like a physician is trained to practice medicine in a particular manner so that it becomes second nature and thus he minimizes fatal situations, so to we need to train ourselves to obey all traffic regulations — even at 3AM — so that it becomes part of us and we will therefore save future lives and doros of people in the process. Besides, it’s the law of the land and in the long run, it saves not only lives but time and money as well (TIME: fighting tickets and in court; MONEY: on tickets, towing to pound, and attorneys; etc).
The music of Michael Shapiro.
I have some super “frum” neighbors who never ever shovel snow or salt the ice from the sidewalks of their homes. These people are machmir about everything except for putting others in a Sakana situation. Even when you avoid walking on their sidewalks and need to walk in the street instead, you are dodging cars and again in a dangerous situation. So before giving muser for others lack of “frumkeit”, take care of your own shortcomings.
David Bar-Magen: You said
“I do not even wish to discuss whether he may be slapped; there is no argument there.”
Mayan_Dvash: Rav Yoseph Berl ZT”L told me the following regarding corporal punishment:
Many of the Chassidik chadarim would also thrash the children for not knowing their lessons. Joseph, do you agree with this method of positive reinforcement too?
He is a good man.
We will contact him and see if it’s as cut and dry as you claim, or if he agrees that there is alot of room for being flexable.
When it comes to p’sak din, a Rav must hear both parties before issuing a decision.
Also, he will be informed as to the name of the Gadol I am referring to.
I am relieved though that you’re saying you have a Rav; which unfortunately is not the case with many Yidden after leaving the Yeshiva world.
OK Joseph, put your money where your mouth is.
What is the name of your Rav?
Joseph: You love to ignore and skirt around factual points of YWN postings. It’s because you don’t have the halachic l’maise piske din to back you up and as a result you mislead the masses.
What do you know about stringencies of halacha? Anyone can read. But that’s not called learning.
Again, for all the YNW posters, do you have a Rav and do you consult with your Rav on regular bases?
Lessmoderorthodox: Havn’t you ever heard of something called: PRIVACY.
You made some pretty sweeping accusatory statements. If you can, provide some specific instances for me to address.
Joseph, it’s very obvious that you don’t have a Rav to speak to, or else you would, instead of always paskining on your own in matters that are way above you, no matter how well versed in learning.
Rav Moshe had more stringent pesak din in many areas and less stringent in others. However, they were all l’chatchilla according to Rav Moshe.
Can anyone in the yeshiva world please tell me why you refer to HaRav Soloveichik as JB?
oomis1105, I’m glad this stirred up some good memories for you.
Also, why don’t you make the real thing yourself? I prefer chicken or veal liver over beef.
You just need to know some basic halachic rules on kashering the liver.
It sure beats anything you buy already prepared.
Joseph, I was told directly by one of today’s Gedolei Hador who is the son of the Godol Hador of a previous generation that they had a SJS situation in their family and the wife of the Godol Hador continued to have contact with the intermarried person(child) and to have the person over in her home as well.
I am deliberately being vague as you can understand.
We are not living in the same times as when certain gezeiros were initiated by chazal for deterrent purposes.
So before anyone any one makes a judgment call of this nature, it is a good idea to first speak to their Rav or Poseik.
Halavai we all become Balei T’shuva and Halavai we all come down from the high frum pedestals we put ourselves on.
Frum from birth Jews! Our Midos and Yiras Shamayim is in the toilet; how dare we denigrate and second guess Geirei Tzedek.
Naturally, we frum from birth Jews have no psychological problems with our frumkeit; only the pitied Geyrim and Balei T’shuva do. Yeah, right.
Why not take advantage of the Germans Y”S when it’s to our benefit?
I will, however, never go to Germany or Poland for any reason because even 60 years after the Holocaust, I consider their populations murderers and soil drenched in Jewish blood.
Isn’t it amazing that Poland never compensated Yidden for stealing their properties. After the Liberation,in fact, the Poles murdered those Jews who came back to reclaim their homes.
oomis1105-
1) Grind equal amounts of Canned Peas and String Beans. Place the ground String Beans in a colander and drain well. When String Beans are fully drained, combine with Peas and…
3) Add a little salt and pepper to taste; if needed.
This is a serious reply: Drink a glass of water before going to bed. You’ll have to get up in the morning; just don’t go back to bed.
Sweet chulent with ketchup… Sweet Liver… what other delicious haimishe foods are being ruined with the American sweet palate?
How about sweet potato kugel?
Or, sweet p’tcha. Maybe not, we already have jello.
Intellegent and Joseph:
Are you saying that yeshiva bachurim of the past which included future Roshei Yeshiva (i.e., Rav Hutner, Rav Ruderman, Rav Shneiur Kotler,etc); Chief Rabbis and Rabbonim are to be criticized for not knowing this chazal? Candid photos show them in very stylish dress.
The yeshivashe styles included:
SHABBOS- SUITS: Iridescent; Plaid; Sharkskin; Neru; Bell Bottoms; Wide Lapels worn with wide ties; Narrow Lapels worn with narrow ties; Herring Bone; Tapered; Seersucker; Polyester. Also, Sports Jackets and slacks.
SHIRTS: Turtleneck, Colored and Patterned shirts; even on Shabbos.
HATS: Charcoal; Grey; Brown; actually any color; small brims; Velour.
It was also very rare to see bochrim in litveshe yeshivos sporting peyos behind their ears or with beard growth.
It’s unfortunate; these guys start out lishma but end up following the green and the kavod.
Baruch Hashem a decent fellow like Noach Dear got out of the politics garbage and is now a judge.
Hikind has long ago left for the green and Felder is for the birds…er…pidgins.
It’s unfortunate but that’s why chillul hashem is one of the worst aveiros. It just takes one person, one incident, to cause so much everlasting damage to so many people.
This is a message to you married women:
Do you know where little boys learn to litter? From their fathers.
Take it from someone who stays after shul is over to clean the tables from used tissues and other mess that are left by the holy mispalilim. Yich! Besides being disgusting, it’s a bezayon to the kovod of the bais haknesses.
It’s the same people who don’t put back sidurim and other s’forim. They feel that they’re doing you a favor by coming to learn or davin. They should clean up after themselves too?
And women, I have a feeling they are also this way at home.
I’m coming out of semi-retirement to add my 2 cents for this post, it seems harmless enough.
Also, for those of you who are makpid on Yoshon. It’s time to start putting away barley for the season.
To letterwriter:
Whenever I have heavy duty questions, I consult my Rov, he sure makes my load a lot lighter.
Let’s try this:
Traditionally, we have foods which are considered “Jewish”, yet have been borrowed from different cultures and regions. They have passed the time test for Jews. Such foods include: potato kugel; challa; p’tcha; herring; borsht; even cholent.
To saythatagain:
UJM: I’m surprised. You’re a holy Jew. If you can’t find a way to do something l’chatchila, so don’t do it. What you had to say to Chanie wasn’t a Yarog V’al Yavor issue. No one was going to die if it was left unsaid.
Real yeshiveshe men with the right hashkafos aren’t wasting their time and showing off their foolishness and ignorance on the internet.
The “machmir boys” prowl the internet and draw unsuspecting women into conversation.
They are privy and have opinions on many untznius things. Where are they getting it from? Not the bais medresh. Are they trying to release their guilt here?
Like was said on other YW discussions, these “machmir boys” are getting their jollies and want to get a reaction, especially from women.
They can’t learn, they can’t put two sentences together that are grammatically correct. Were they born in America?
They are immoral people and unsuspecting women are should be alerted to the danger associated with these internet predators and imposters.