A passenger on a bus was wounded lightly from shattered glass on Tuesday afternoon after Arabs threw stones at it in the A-Tur neighborhood of East Jerusalem. The person was treated by MDA and police were searching for the stone throwers.
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17 Responses
Golda Meir stated ” There is no such thing as a Palestinian, nor is no such thing as Palestine.” Thank you for correctly calling the stone throwers as arabs. On a day when so much activity is being generated by the Israeli Independence Day blog post from earlier to halt a second a realize who the real enemy of the Jews are.
urbmase
This may seem like picking nits, but I’d like to suggest that the real enemy of the Jews are the Jews. If we get it right, they will see it correctly. The arabs, nazis, liberals, missionaries, etc. are not our enemies.
Nobody needs to slam me as being clueless, idealistic, goofy, or whatever.
I don’t mean to pretend that we shouldn’t take actions to protect ourselves from harm that may include arms, protests, and whatever else. But the real enemy is the “s’or sh’b’eesa” and the real weapon is Torah and Mitzvos!
“The Nazi’s are not our enemies” (sic) No comment needed.
In truth, even the Arabs themselves called themselves “Syrians”.
In this case, the Arab could’ve been Israeli or so-called Palestinian, which is why YW Editor was doubly correct in calling the perp an Arab.
Irrespective of one’s views on Zionism, the real reason that the term Palestinian, particularly when applied to Arabs is offensive to Jews, is that it implies an historical country named Palestine, which, of course, never existed in Eretz Yisrael (nor elsewhere).
Also, the name Palestine is based on the now-extinct Philistines who occupied parts of present-day Gaza (ignoring the Jews who, for thousands of years) resided throughout the rest of the territory).
As well, on maps prior to the early 20th century, the area is labeled Judea, which is more appropriate than Palestine as this was its name from antiquity until the invading Romans, after the Jews’ Bar Kochba rebellion, renamed Jerusalem to Aeolina Capitolina and dropped Judea as the province’s name as a punishment to the Jews.
I imagine most people know that the Jerusalem Post used to be called the Palestine, as were the Jewish WW-II era refugees referred to as Palestinians.
Ms. Meir may have had other connotations in mind when she made the above statement, but she is largely correct.
urbmase
Taking quotes out of content is a technique that you can choose to employ, but it would be more engaging if you could challenge what I say in context.
Perhaps I falsely assumed that we agreed on certain assumptions (a mistake that I make regularly). Let me explain. When a dog is hit with a stick, it will (often) bite at the stick. It misses the one who holds the stick. I don’t mean to compare you to a dog, but all of our supposed enemies are just sticks. When any of our “enemies” hit, bite, murder, or torture us, it is upon us to respond by asking what Hashem is demanding of us.
This is due far more space than I am willing to give it here. I didn’t mean to say that I like Nazis. I didn’t mean to say that they are nice. I didn’t mean to say that they are good to the Jews. I meant to say that they are not our enemies because that is not the focus that Hashem wants/demands from us. He wants us to perfect ourselves individually and collectively.
As the mishna (and, yes, l’havdil, the bumber sticker) says, “Ain lanu al mi l’shayain ela avinu sh’bashamayim.” “The only One to rely on is our Father in Heaven.”
Our enemy is the yetzer hara – far more powerful than any other perceived enemies. I would like to make it clear for the record: I don’t like nazis. Being Jewish, I, too, had massive amounts of family wiped out. Please try to see what I am saying. I am truly sorry if I wasn’t clear in my first post. I’d love to hear a response if it’s respectful. I’d still pay attention if it weren’t.
Yosi
It says ‘Migalgilin Zechus Al yedai Zakai Vichovoh Al yidei chayov’
Hashem chose the nazis to be the shlichim because they were deservant of doing this bad deed, the same way Hashem sends a ZAKAI to do good for someone. So, even if this was Hashem’s decree, its perfectly appropriate to deem the Nazi’s enemies because THEY were chosen to do this horendous job!
I guess for the sake of intellectual honesty (and possibly to prove me wrong), I’d like to know exactly how to tyche enemies and if it’s a Torah term. Soneinu is either (my weak dikduk comes bubbling forward) the ones that hate us or our hated ones. Neither definition would be troublesome to the above hypothesis. However, perhaps there is a word that would prove me wrong. Any help?
Yosi:
Shalom shalom. The best agreement is simply to agree to disagree. In fact, I really enjoyed what HaKatan stated above. Intellectual, well stated, and non-inciteful. I am tsafartit, and an Israeli citizen. My views are based on first hand experience, as a war veteran, and a’doti Jew.
The word Amelek mean anything.
yosi
i understand your point, what you said was a backlash, and i understand why you bent backwards so far to make your point being the opposite extreme.
what you said of course, in truth, is not the truth
of course the nazis are our enemies, i dont believe you disagree.
NOTHING happens to us that is not the will of H”BH, that doesnt mean we dont have enemies. the two are not mutually exclusive.
im not telling you anything you dont already know
do you have friends? do they do tovahs for you? is that not the will of H”BH. does that make them NOT your friends. do you not owe them gratitude?
Feival: Yofi v’nachon!!! Todah rabah lach.
Feivel,
A’vadai, you are right. I appreciate that you appreciate what I was trying to say. I realized as I was away from my computer a better way to say it.
It’s a mashal brought by the Chovos Halavavos or a pious man (his lashon is chasid, but if I use that without a translation we could set some folks off)who sees some young soldiers returning from the battlefront. He says to them (I’m paraphrasing – my sefarim are two stories down and I’m too lazy to go down), “You think that you’re returning from the big battlefield. You’re returning from the small battlefield.”
You are both right. The nazis are certainly our enemies. I was wrong. My point, however, now worded more accurately, is that we shouldn’t lose sight of where the big battle is to be fought. The bigger battle and more essential battle is fought in our batei midrashim and batei tefilla and utlimately in our hearts.
Nachon?
urbmase, thank you for your diplomacy. See above post.
One of the things that I’ve seen on Amalek (I believe brought in Ohr Gedalayhu) is that it is the gematria of sefek. Of course, Amalek sought to destoy us throughout history b’gashmiut, but the battle with Amalek is also a battle b’ruchniut. He tries to bring us into a world of doubt.
Also, there are three (at least) p’shatim brought on “asher karcha baderech.” 1) Lashon kar – he tries to cool us off. 2) Lashon mikra – he tries to get us into a world of cause and affect where we fail to see Hashem as the root and cause of all that happens, and we think that things just happen. 3) Lashon kari – spiritual defilement especially al inyanim ishut. These point also towards an understanding that I was trying to bring out.
I think #2 in above paragraph is a source for much of the arguing on this site. There are many here who are very quick to point out that it is all from Hashem, perhaps not explaining themselves very well. There are others here who seek a political explanation. They aren’t (I hope) denying that Hashem is behind the scenes, but their explanation is focusing on the mechanics of the natural world.
I lean (obviously) towards the first approach. There is a great danger in trying to understand K’lal Yisroel in any terms other than the Torah’s terms. Our history makes no sense. We don’t make sense without the Torah context.
Ken, nachon! Yofi
“Ki Setze LaMilchomo al O’yevecho…”
The word Oyev (or O’yevecho) appears no less than twice in the Torah. Grab a concordance if you want more places
One of the Gedolim was asked how we will ever overcome our struggles with Ishmael in the galus. Every day, this yid said to the Rebbe, the situation just seems to get more and more difficult. The Rebbe answered that just like the Berlin wall fell, and Communism along with it, without one shot being fired: the Arabs will also fall in the most magnificent manner in a totally unexpected way.
This we see clearly in our days from the fall of Saddam Hussein, yemach shemo. A few years ago he was waving a rifle in the air, striking his chest, and threating Clal yisroel with a fiery destruction. Not so long afterward the Americans pulled him out of a hole in the ground were he was hiding. This is a wonderful nes if we ever saw one.
We must strengthen our emunah in these days and look to Hashem with hope and longing. yeoosh (losing hope) is a very dangerous ploy the yetser hara uses to take us away from true avodas hashem. Be strong. Chazek ve amatz lebecha.
Yosi Bishuk I agree it’s our aveiros that are doing it they are just shalichim from Ha-Kodosh Boruch Hu that’s it!