16 Responses

1. Perhaps the woman did intentionally carry the mace to assault the man. I don’t want C”V anyone to be assaulted. But if charedei men are going to continue to assault frum women verbally or physically over bus seats, then they better watch out or they might get a face full of mace. All women should carry protection against assault. Men have no business “instructing” women where to sit. We can sit wherever we like. You men don’t like it, sit elsewhere.

2. Sounds like a piece of this story is missing.

   Before we rush to judgment about what happened, let’s hear the rest of the story.

3. Facts:
   -The country IS secular.
   -Mehadrin bus lines anger the secular (who are, for the most part, tinokos she’nishb’u, and find the gender seperation insulting.)
   -The result is the opposite of kiruv. It pushes the frei further away from any degree of positive feelings toward Yiddishkeit.
   Solutions:
   -Work on educating the chilonim as to WHY Frum Jews do what we do.
   -Do NOT force chareidi practice on those that are not ready for it.
   -Set up private van or bus lines for those that feel they can not ride mixed buses.
   BOTTOM LINE: “You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar!”

4. #1 – the article does NOT say this man verbally or physically assaulted this woman. This was a designated mehadrin line, and he “instructed” her to that effect.
   She has a right to not like it, she has a right to fight the whole idea of mehadrin buses in court, she has a right to wait for a non-mehadrin bus, but for what this man did, she has NO right to spray him with mace.
   She deserved to be arrested.

5. The original idea of having a private co. operate them was the best rout. They should have never let Eged buy them out…

   and the public should remember that it’s a private iniciative which is mearly operated by Eged, and not part of the regular city system – if you like it’s rules then use it, if not – stay out.

   Go explain that to an Israeli…..

6. Could someone explain why is this different than ‘segregation’ in a Shul or a Wedding? if private people order a bus they could set the rules as they see fit. Just because Eged was affraid of compitition and baought it out, doesn’t make it any different then a Chareidi person making a Simcha.

   [and do these women really want men to fall on them?]

7. I wish people would know the status of the situation before commenting.
   to#1 She does not have the right to sit wherever she wants and the same goes for you as a Mehadrin route was created to accomodate the public that requested it. She has the option not to ride on it.

   To #3 the Mehadrin lines were created because Eged was putting every block in the way to not be able to establish a Hareidi bus line and have to compete. The creation of the meharin buses was a business decision on the part of Egged. These women need to learn to be sensitive to others as well.

   To#4 yes she should have been arrested

8. Additional details.
   Lady is 60 years old? Man is 18?

   What other details are missing?

9. kol la kavod to the lady, Egged is a public bus line, if the “charedim” want a segregated, they mind as well have their own bus line, didnt Rav Feinstein z’l said that there is nothing wrong with mix buses and anyone can sit where they like? If these more holy than thou “charedim” don’t want to look at women, so pull out a sefer and read until you fall asleep.

10. #9 – though I have mixed feelings about these bus lines, this woman (NO “lady”!) was WRONG!
    This particular bus line was designated as a mehadrin (i.e. seperate seating) bus line, and the (young) man did nothing wrong by informing her of that. He did nothing abusive or offensive.
    She DID definitely do something wrong, and illegal, by spraying him with mace.

11. to ‘Uzi007’ [9], this IS their own bus line, which Eged ensisted on running to avoid competition. But you probebly love what she did regardless of right or wrong, just because she sprayed a ‘Chareidi’…

12. to Uzi007 [9], …and this is not mearly to avoid “looking at women”, but to avoid being pushed and falling on them.

13. I remember reading a story about R’ Shlomo Zalman ztz”l where he was riding on a bus alone at night on Rechov Yafo, and a not tzniyusdigly dressed young lady sat down next to him.
    Rather than saying anything to her or moving away from her to another seat, which would have been embarrassing to her, he stood up and got off at the next stop and WALKED home (to Shaarai Chesed – a pretty long walk).
    ‘Nuff said…

14. Here’s a note that Rabbonim have encouraged to be given out on buses (For those who don’t understand the Hebrew, it’s basically a polite request to women not to sit in sight of men and cause them difficult trials so as not to drive away the Shechina). I myself gave it to women a number of times (as I was instructed to do by Rabbonim) and in some cases they voluntarily got up and moved.

    בס”ד
    בכל הקוים המהדרין
    כולל קוים 1, 2, 3, 10, 11, 16, 25א 31, 56 וכו’ וקוים אחרים המשרתים האיזורים החרדיים
    כל הנשים והבנות החשובות מתבקשות בכל לשון של בקשה לשבת רק בחלק האחורי של האוטובוס שלא לגרום לגברים נסיונות קשים ר”ל, והגברים הנוסעים בקוים האלה מתבקשים להזדרז לתפוס את כל המושבים הקודמים של האוטובוס בכל הזדמנות כדי לא לתת לנשים ובנות מקום להכשל, וכמובן לא לשבת בחלק האחורי כדי לא לגרום אי נעימות לנשים.
    והכל כדי שלא להרחיק בזה את השכינה ממנו, ולשומעים ולשומעות ינעם בזה ובבא וכל אחד יזהיר בני ביתו ע”ז, .ובזכות שמירת גדרי הצניעות יבא משיח צדקנו בב”א.
    (מורי הוראה אמרו שמצוה לפרסם מודעה ז וגם התירו לתתה לנשים בעת הצורך.)

15. If we act like radical muslims,
    we should expect people to
    respond in kind

16. The article says the man “instructed” her. Who authorized him to instruct anybody. What method of instructiopn did he use? Please, Mr. Spira, report more fact and less opinion in your dispatches.