In cooperation with the Ministry of Industry & Trade, a number of chareidi soldiers are in a course training them as home electricians, providing them with a skill that will assist them following their discharge, possibility providing them with a trade that will facilitate earning a livelihood. The four-month course is being given to the new inductees in Holon.
The course is given in a civilian vocational training facility that has 600 students in 28 different courses, including 15 new programs that recently got underway.
During the four-month period, the soldiers will also attend a daily torah shiur.
(Yechiel Spira – YWN Israel)
Join the official YWN WhatsApp status
21 Responses
First of all, I’m very strongly opposed to IDF service.
But this is a good thing. People should have an occupation (except for the 5 to 10% greatest learners who should be in kollel) and make a living. I know of a chassidishe electrician in Canada whose brother is a chover (dayan) on the Badatz of the Edah HaChareidis in Yerushalayim עיה”ק. Another brother of them has a makolet in Meah Shearim. And all three wear a shtreimel, peyos, and are proud yidden who are well respected by everyone who knows them.
sounds like a great idea
torah im derech eretz .. as productive members of society
good luck and much success
(kudos to the tzahal)
So that the army doesn’t have to hire Arab electricians – the problem with the construction trades is that most home buyers want lower prices, which require low wages for workers (why do you think so many American home buyers prefer hourses built by illegal immigrants if they can find them).
#1 you said “And all three wear a shtreimel, peyos, and are proud yidden who are well respected by everyone who knows them”
wouldn’t it be even more beautiful if they wore a shtreimel, peyos and were proud Yidden who also went to the Army? I am glad that you give your approbation to working and making a living Please explain why most chareidim who read the posuk “Sheises Yomin Taavodoo” do not believes that it is Me DeOrais?
To #1 if it wasn’t for HaShem’s protection in using the Tzahal in here in Israel, you wouldn’t be able to pray by the Kotel, visit Kever Yosef, and go to Hebron and many other holy sites. I bet that you are one of those that hate the Medinah but loves to benefit from it to the fullest without lifting a finger to contribute in its development, whether in doing time as a soldier or doing Sheirut Leumi.
#1 Daniel Breslauer, sorry to have to tell you that you are a huge hypocrit. From other comments I have seen by you, I know that (if you were telling the truth then) that you are, or were, IN Eretz Yisrael. If not for those serving in the army, your yishmaeli cousins would slit your throat and you wouldn’t be writing any comments at all. So, while IDF service may not be for everyone, and there are legitimate reasons for SOME not to serve, to make a broad statement as you did, that you oppose IDF service, is the height of hypocrisy. Since you are benefitting in amajor way by the service of others, you should either change your attitiude or change your residence!
I’m disgusted that the comments here already show that Yeshiva type people allow themselves to be brainwashed by ‘foreigb’ media sources when it comes to understanding our brothers in Israel.
Do u think frum people simply dont work because they dont wanna work? Is that the impression you get from Haaretz or Kol Yisroel?
Frum people dont work because its so hard to get a decent paying job?
Frum people dont work because society doesnt allow them.
So any jobs are closed off to frum people. You will never see a frum person working in the Interior or foreign ministry. The electric compnay and Bezeq have almost no frum employees!
The non-frum keep the frum out of these good secure governmnet jobs deliberatley. My grandfather lived in Israel and only once in his life had a decent oaying job and that was when he worked for The Israel Post. (mail service). Many frum people got jobs at that time because the Communications minister was frum.
20% of frum people serve in the army. But not one will ever be promoted to a high ranking officer.
I myself tried to join Army Radio. I was shown the front door. Army Radio is for the Ashkenazi Secular elite (like bibi’s son)
#5 – that same chover of the Badatz also holds that it is forbidden to go to the Kosel, Kever Yosef or Chevron.
And #6, if it weren’t for those Zionist pigs, then we would be living in complete peace with the Arabs without any violence at all. This is (supposed to be) a chareidi website, and the vast majority of chareidim, the rabbonim, are strongly opposed to army service (except a *handful* of rabbonim who approve it for a *handful* of people). Even Rav Steinman or the Gerrer Rebbe did not say that EVERYONE should go to the army – they only said that a few troubled youth or those who have nothing else to do should go to the army.
To # Gordie,
Who do you consider to be “frum”? The streimel ,long peyote, zebra looking Jew or a shomer Shabbat and mitzvot Jew. Because, there are many like the later choice here, all over Israel in many key jobs. The problem here is that many “frum” Jews will start to make demands of the work place like separate lounges, separate water fountains, and many others demands. In any other places like in America they would not dare to ask such things only in Israel and when they don’t get what they demand they prefer not to work but rather they send their wives to work and to deal with the house and the kids on top of that.
There are many jobs out there, are you willing to work without making to many demands?????
“if it weren’t for those Zionist pigs, then we would be living in complete peace with the Arabs without any violence at all”.
This is the biggest FALLACY ever.
In 1921 the Rabbanim of the old Yishuv went to visit an Arab Sheik and made a ‘so called treaty’ with him, to save the YISHUV HAYASHON community. A month later that Sheik was murdered by the Mufti of Yerushalayim (forefather of Arafat and others)who declared war on every Yid in Palestine. He initiated the Kosel riots, Chevron massacre and Galilee murders. This is the most frequent used LIE & INACCURACY — no ARAB ever was willing to live PEACEFULLY with Jews. Maybe for short periods of time but not for an eternity.
Know your history, the massacre of the leaders and Rabbanim in Cairo was in the early 1800’s before the ‘hateful’ Zionists even ventured towards nationalism.
JEWS are with peyos and without. In the army and sitting and learning. Working and shteigging. Ashkenazi and Sefardim. Rich and poor. Learned and am haeretz. Right Wing and Left. Passive and Activists.. All types!!!! It has been like this since the birth of the 12 tribes and will continue with the coming of Mashiach ben Yosef and finally Mashiach ben Dovid. Get along and kvell when there is good in the world. If you are interested in training as an electrian, then join the program, if its not your bag then pursue some other line of avodah.
The reason most able-bodies chareidim do not work is that in Israel, without IDF service, most jobs are not open to them.
It makes no difference if you are frum or not, without discharge papers from the IDF you CANNOT even apply for most jobs.
Most Chareidi men would be thrilled to find a job that pays enough to support a family.
If there was only an alternative “kosher” service that the Chareidim could do, and receive the discharge papers, they would FLOCK TO JOIN.!!
To DANIEL BRESLAUER – No one is more critical than I am of MANY or perhaps even Most of the policies of the Israeli government (and the actions of its police), BUT you have crossed a line when you talk of those “Zionist pigs”. First of all it puts you in the camp of the enemies of the JEWISH PEOPLE! When the Iranians shoot a nuclear missle at Eretz Yisrael (if they had their way) it will NOT differentiate between chareidi and chiloni, and it is with THOSE sonai Yisrael that you have allied yourself with your terminology. Furthermore you only show yourself to be a tremendous ignoramous by your incredibly foolish statement! You say “if it weren’t for those Zionist pigs, then we would be living in complete peace with the Arabs without any violence at all” Really?!?! Then perhaps you can explain why decades BEFORE the medina came into existence, arabs were attacking Jews all over Eretz Yisrael and butchering them! Did the massacre in Hevron in 1929 take place because of the Zionist state that came TWENTY years LATER!!! You better thank the IDF EVERY day for being there to protect fools like you. And if you think HaSh-m will protect you from the Yishmaelim, think again, because YOU are a sonai Yisrael! HaSh-m loves every Jew, those that are shomrai mitzvot, and those tinokot she’nishb’u (which is what the majority of those Zionists you hate so much are) that are not YET shomrai mitzvot. Remember the Beit HaMikdash was destroyed because of sinat chinam, and every day its not rebuilt it is for failure to be m’taken that avaira. It is aseret y’mai t’shuva Daniel – WAKE UP!!!
I have one question. According to those that are against Zionism. How do we give the Arabs the Medina back? Little by little or the whole thing at once? If we give the whole thing do we sign a treaty with them that they won’t kill us or do we leave it up to them? If little by little which parts first? Do jews get to keep their houses? What if an Arab wants the jews house?
Daniel Breslauer – you have crossed all lines of decency. Whether or not you believe that the army is for frum men (and I agree that there are problems; and yes, I hope that my sons are able and willing to devote these years to learning); to talk about the army in such language shows a total lack of hakaros hatov.
Nachal Chareidi was set up, with haskamos of many leading Rabbanim, and is doing a valuable service, in getting boys who otherwise would be in the streets, or working in a pizza parlor – off the books, back into frum society, with a parnossah; with Torah and yiras shamayim; and with self-esteem.
As I said earlier, I daven that my boys are in the % that WANT to devote their younger years to full-time learning, but if they chaz v’shalom become “bench warmers” then I can think of no better option than Nachal Chareidi.
Reply to #6–Geordie
the idea that Israeli society is keeping “frum” people from jobs is nonsense. Your idea that “frum” people cannot be promoted to high rank in the military is also nonsense. To be a high ranking officer in the IDF you first have to be a low-ranking officer in the IDF, and then a middle-ranking officer in the IDF. In other words, to be a General officer, one must serve for a great many years. Nobody is going to make you a colonel just for enlisting. Today, many high ranking officers in the IDF are shomer mitzvot, and to see kipot in General Staff meetings is not at all unusual.
Are you only speaking of Hareidim? Like I posted, if you don’t serve, you don’t get to be an instant general. The army does not promote on the basis of Rabbinical advice.
Furthermore, I have news for you. Thousands of Israelis in the IDF want to have jobs in Army Radio, and few such jobs are available. To think that you were rejected because you are religious is nonsense. What about all the secualr Ashkenazim who were rejected?
As far as jobs in the civilian sector go, you are incorrect as well. Religious people are found in every single field in Israel, at upper as well as lower levels of society. Again, are you speaking of Hareidim? Well, it turns out that for a great many positions, one must have an education in something other than Talmud. Perhaps that is the problem with your approach.
Nachal Chareidi is doing a valuable service, in getting boys who otherwise would be in the streets, or working in a pizza parlor – off the books, back into frum society, with a parnossah; with Torah and yiras shamayim; and with self-esteem.
THIS IS NOT AN ACCURATE ASSESSMENT of the majority of boys who join Nachal Chareidi. It would pay for you to visit them at their base, introduce yourself (only males are allowed on the grounds)– ask about their background and you may find that their are ehrlich, menschleicht, frum from birth, graduates of all types of yeshivos, anglos, etc. part of the platoon.
bs”d
to # 1
What’s wrong to serve in an army protecting Jews ?
Yes , there was and there are lots of wrong stuff in the army but still to serve is “biggest Kidush Hashem” and the opposite , I don’t want to mention it now as we are in the 10 days.
If there are Talmidim (the real ones and they are very very small in number) that can sit and learn safely it is “be Hasdei HaShem” that he allowed us to have our Jewish pride back after 2000 years and abeled us to protect ourself .
Just pray for those that are in the front and lying in ambushes with little sleep and no comfort .
It hurt me deeply as Gilad Shalit is rottuing in a dungeon in this holidays and you stil oppose army service .
Go make teshuva not for yourself and for nothing but for Gilad’s zehut .
david
Hey Breslauer,
As a charadi who served 4 years in the IDF, why dont you meet me for lunch one day so that you can call me a pig to my face?
For the record, I am faaaar from a zionist, but thanx to people who are ready to take the bullet for a selfish person like you, you are able to go to the Koisel etc.
Yochi, -good gezucht!
My opinion is not nearly as strong as that of the other tens of thousands of followers of the Edah. There is no ‘hakaras hatov’ for the IDF. There is nothing we owe the Zionists שר”י other than murder and bloodshed. I suggest you people read Vayoel Moshe, Al HaGeulah VeAl HaTemurah, some of Divrei Yoel, and other seforim and letters by others, signed by rabbonim and admorim, motzim and chevrei badatz.
If you accuse me of standing with ‘the enemy’, of being a traitor, then I proudly stand together with ‘traitors’ the likes of the old Satmar Rov, the Maharitz and Maharim Dushinsky, the Minchas Yitzchok, Reb Arele of Shomer Emunim, the Rebbes zt”l and shlita of Toldos Aharon, Toldos Avrohom Yitzchok, the manhigim of Breslev, Rav Moshe Halberstam zt”l, Rav Meir Brandsdorfer zt”l, Reb Itzele and Reb Yankele of Pshevorsk, the Minchas Elozar, and hundreds of other rabbonim. I proudly stand together with those ‘traitors’.
I see that this site has changed from representing the yeshivishe / chareidi world, into representing the chardal world.
Your opinions do not even match with those of the leaders of the Litvishe world. I have only heard of Rav Steinman approving IDF service for youths who have no other occupation, mainly for troubled youth. I have not yet heard of Rav Eliashiv or Rav Nissim Karelitz or Rav Kanievsky or Rav Auerbach approving it. If they did, please correct me.
The ‘leaders’ of the Nachal ‘Chareidi’ joke are fools themselves, they are not ‘chareidi’ in any way, and putting on a black jacket and hat and a beard won’t change that. Yoel Schwartz has been condemned by several gedolim. The others come from places such as Shaalavim, which is most definitely not ‘chareidi’.
Reply to #22
Daniel Breslauer wrote: “There is nothing we owe the Zionists שר”י other than murder and bloodshed.”
Tell that to the doctors and nurses who heal you (Zionists and Zionist trained) when you are sick.
Tell that to the farmers who grow your food (Zionists all) and the truckers who bring it to market.
Tell it to the many Zionist taxpayers who support the Chareidi institutions of learning and other mosdot.
Tell that to the many nonchariedim who voluntarily donate to hareidi causes. I am sure that this attitude will prove helpful in convincing them to dig deeper in support of your mosdot.
Above all, tell it to the soldiers (including the Nachal Chareidi) who risk their lives protecting the citizens and residents of the State, including the ones who refer to them as “pigs” and “fools”, as well as protecting exclusively Hareidi communities.
Although it is a shame that more Chareidim do not serve in the fine units of the Nachal Chareidi, I am happy that those such as Mr. Breslauer will remain outside of the framework of the IDF-and general Israeli society as well. He is not fit to shine their boots, much less carry a rifle (or a sefer). If his idea of his Zionist brothers is that we are “pigs”–he is free to leave the State so that he is not corrupted by us, and to pray wholeheartedly with his Satmar brothers that the State is overthrown by the Arabs.
One would hope that he will be intellectually honest enough not to avail himself of any Zionist services, tainted with “murder and bloodshed” in the meantime. One would hope–but not believe it will happen. Honesty, intellectual or otherwise, seems to be no part of the world of Mr. Breslauer.