US President Barak Obama met with 15 Jewish leaders, delivering a mussar message, rejecting allegations that he is maintaining a hard-line position towards Israel.
The president explained he is working to assist Israel in overcoming the demographic problem, which may be achieved by implementing the two-state solution, but this he explained may only be accomplished by Israel engaging in “serious self-reflection”.
According to the daily Haaretz, one of the participants called on the president to maintain a lower approach regarding difference with Jerusalem and America’s insistence that all construction be halted in settlements, but Obama reportedly rejected this, stating during the Bush administration’s tenure major differences were kept away from the public spotlight but this did not assist towards obtaining regional peace.
Regarding Iran, the president explained the door to dialogue remains open but if the Iranians opt to ignore the opportunity, then the US will have to weigh options, adding it would be a mistake to discuss this in public.
He referred to Israel as a “true friend of the United States,” adding he remains committed to use the narrow window of opportunity to bring peace to the region.
According to Haaretz, attending the meeting were representatives of “the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, the Anti-Defamation League, Hadassah, the Jewish Council for Public Affairs, the National Jewish Democratic Council, the Orthodox Union, the United Jewish Communities, the Union for Reform Judaism, the United Synagogue of Conservative Judaism, the American Jewish Committee and the Conference of Presidents of Major Jewish Organizations, which is led by long-time Obama acquaintance Alan Solow“.
(Yechiel Spira – YWN Israel)
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24 Responses
I hope those “Jewish leaders” gave him a serious challenge.
Rabot machshavot b’lev eesh, atsat HaSh-m, HEE TAKUM!!!
A one state solution will lead to a situation in which Eretz Yisrael is dominated by Arabs, or, in which non-Jews have less the full citizenship (something like the American Jim Crow, or the like the traditional status of Jews in Europe and the Middle East before 1948), or, in which the Arab areas are a less than independent non-sovereign entity. NONE OF THESE ARE GOOD FOR THE UNITED STATES, and all will guaranty extended conflict with the Muslim countries.
For frum Jews, the one-state solutions are probably acceptable. Indeed, if there was peace, we could probably ally with the Arabs against the Hilonim (something the secular Jews worry about-when they talk about “demographic” problems they are as likely to be talking about us as the Arabs). However for the Americans, who need good relations with the Muslim world, on-going conflict is bad.
He does have a very NARROW window to bring peace. If he can’t show major accomplishments, he could end up as a one-term president, or at the least, lose control of the Congress. He has only about 16 months to get something to show for his efforts.
He may have convinced himself, but he hasn’t yet convinced me. Ha can convince me by his actions, not by his words.
HoModia wrote in this morning’s edition that NCYI (Young Israel) was not invited. Was the Agudah invited?
He is a true soney Yisroel, except AIPAC adn the OU the other groups are all Marxists, who will support the chosen one no matter what, a real eriv rav who like Jews in WWII cooperated with the Nazis (hear that Rahm Emanuel?), he will not be happy until Israel is weak and Netanyahu did not change from last time around, he does NOT a spine.
Where is agudah??
Would anyone expect OBAMA to admit, yeah, of course, I am an Arab supporter and agree to israel’s destruction?
“the demographic problem” One of the well repeated LIES that have become facts on the ground.
Obama is right about one thing; Israel IS a true friend to the US. However, there is no reciprocation.
#8 – A few years ago when the Israelis experimented with direct election of the Prime Minister, many nationalistic Jews complained that a Left wing candidate could win even though the Right wing candidate would have a majority of the Jewish vote.
As it is, because of the willingness of the Palestinians to be a silent partner to a left wing government, the Right in Israel needs 61 seats to form a government, but the left only needs to 51 seats from Jewish/Zionist votes. And these numbers only include Arabs with Israeli citizenship under current law – excluding the West Bank, East Jeruslem and Gaza.
While I as an anti-zionist see the future in an alliance of the Hareidim and the Arabs (and in general, of all the “people of faith” against the seculars, both in Eretz Yisrael and worldwide) you as a zionist have a problem. You can either engage in genocide or adopt a “Jim Crow” government, that will guarantee war with the Muslim world and preclude any outside assistance to Israel, or you must face the reality of the Arabs playing a major role in Israeli affairs (imagine Bashara or Tibi as prime minister some day).
Giving Pres. Obama the benefit of doubt, at best he is a wimp in not demanding; the same “serious self-reflection” from both sides.
_______________________________
(PS All those ready to jump on me for “benefit of doubt”, give it a break, that’s not my point. )
#10 – Eisav sonei es Yaakov – no? What is this forming an alliance with Arabs – suddenly when there is peace they will love us and trust us? It is nice that during the three weeks – we still have our sinas chinam. Oh that is right – as long as people aren’t religious it is ok to hate your fellow Jew. Sometimes I wonder – what exactly makes certain people frum – generally i expect ahavas yisrael, good midos, love for your fellow Jew as a part of it.
Fact is, secular, non religious Jews are a majority and if there wasn’t the war against hte arabs, secular non religious Jews would unite against the Charedim – get rid of their subsidies to learn, their lives living on the public dole, their lack of army service. Don’t kid yourself. It is only because Jews in Israel are preoccupied with life as it is now that Charedim are allowed to live as they live now.
#13- if Israel keeps the West Bank and Gaza, you will have a population of at least 40% Arabs (versus 20% as it is). If you let them vote in Israeli elections, you give up any hope of Jewish control of Eretz Yisrael. If you either “transfer” them (as in how the Germans “transfered” us somewhere to the east, as they claimed), or keep them but as non-voters, you totally alienate the rest of the world and guaranty a war that it is unwinable by Israel (and all it takes is a few nukes and Israel is Judenrein).
# 13- it seems that you have fallen prey to racist ideas if you somehow believe in the acceptability of jim crow laws.
Berlin rabbi I am with you.
akuperma: it appears that you are allignining youself with arabs against jews. Whil I do not agree with secularism, they are jews. Perhaps you have heard of a principle:kol yisroel areivim ze lawze.” Perhaps not. Surely you are aware that the arabs want us all dead. Not just for us to give the palestinians their own state. Not just to give then the right of return. Not just for us to all leave and give them the deed. They want us all dead. Not just the fria jews, the secular jews, the mizrachi jews, the moderna, the tziyonis. They want the charedim dead also. A palestinian would just as soon put a bullets in the heads of your children as anyone else.
Akuperma: I continue.. Your concern for Jim Crow laws, and human rights and your fear of Iranian nukes if we don’t capitulate is all a smokescreen, all a lie. You hate your own bretherin enough to want to side with those that would kill them (and the rest of us, and you too). Iunderstand why Hashem has so far held back sending Moshiach. He must be weeping (metaphorically) as he reads your writings.
To “mastergary” (#21): Over time I have read many of Akuperma’s on-ine comments and my opinion is that he is an erliche yid whose comments are well thought out and eloquently expressed…whether I agree with all of them or not. You call him a “hater” of his brethren? This ad hominem attack is totally inaccurate and unwarranted. Given your concerns about Hashem’s weeping at anyone’s writings, you had better run for cover. I hope that Akuperma grant’s you mechilah.
Lenco49: Would you ask for mechila from Kamtza for running to the Romans against his fellow jews? Would you ask a Kappo for the Nazis for mechilla? I think not (I hope not) and similarly I do not need to ask for mechila from someone so vile that he would even suggest an alliance with arab murderers against his fellow jews. Akuperma’s eloquence means nothing — antisemites throughout history were eloquent. Father Koglin had his own radio show from which he so eloquently preached that FDR should stay out of the war for the Jews. Stephen Wise eloquently lobbied to FDR that he not bomb the tracks to Aushwitz.
Erliche? Erliche how? does he have tchailes on his tzitzis? Does he wear 2pair of tefilin? It wasnt for lack of erlichkite that the chrban bayis took place. It was for attitudes and expressions that Akuperma has expressed here.
Mastergary (#23): You disagree with someone and so feel free to lace your disagreement with an allusive slew of aspersions: “Kappo,” “Nazi,” “vile,” “anti-Semite.” Sigh! I am so disheartened by your sinas chinam, especially at this time during the 3 weeks.
A Jew disagrees with another Jew by debating on the merits…not by calling him nasty names. Does the term “master” in you handle refer to being a master of insult and calumny? When you appear before the Bais Din Shel Ma’alah, do you really want the Satan to be able to accuse: “You alluded to another Jew as a kappo, a nazi, a vile anti-Semite. How do you consider this a demonstration of Ahavas Yisrael?” Sorrowfully, you will stammer for an answer before the Ribbono Shel Olam…and you will not be able to find one.
There is a fascinating video on Rabbi Lazer Brody’s website [Lazer Beams] entitle: “Palestinians of Jewish Origin.”
Apparently, three genetics researchers at Hebrew University have discovered that many Palestinian “Arabs” share the same DNA characteristics as Ashkenazi Jews. Not only that, but some have the genetic marker identifying them as Kohanim. Interviews in the field have led to the (anonymous) admission by many West Bank Muslims that there are stories of Jewish ancestors in their families.
The implications of this research are stunning, especially if it’s true that the final geula is imminent. It would be a wonder-of-wonders if Moshiach arrives and reveals that masses of Palestinians are actually remnants of the lost tribes of the Northern Kingdom of Israel…that they are our brothers. What would then follow is their becoming Chozrim B’teshuva and the Palestinian ‘problem’ would instantly disappear.
If someone would have suggested this possibility before the age of genetics — that Yesha Muslims are not Yishmaelim at all, but really Bnai Yisrael who were forcibly converted millennia ago — we would have thought them insane. But how do you argue with DNA? Things are becoming very interesting indeed.
Lenco49:Like the movie The Wizard of Oz, your hypothesis is a fanciful work of fiction. Present day situation is that the palestinians are murderers of Jews and Americans. There is nothing religeous about defending the killers and the enablers of killers of our people. Unfortunately, some of our bretheren attempt to demonstrate some sense of moral or intellectual superiority by inventing excuses or justifications for the actions of our enemies. Perhaps we should attempt to be mekarev the next homicide bomber that is caught, maybe he is one of the ten lost tribes, maybe he was a former melech yisroel in another life.
Lenco…your the one who turned the discussion into an ad hominum fest by using yeshiva-boy musar-like plattitudes in place of a rational argument. You appear to to take my references very personally. Are you, like akuperma, anti semitic xxx soryy antizionist? Would you allign YOURSELF with arabs against fellow jews? Were you amongst those embarrasing, pathetic looking creatures who stood on the sidelines at the Salute to Israel Parade, wearing their kappotas and holding placards comparing Zionism to Nazi-facism? Do you tell yourself that you’re superior in frumkite to other Jews, like your brother in-diatribe akuperma?
I’m not a secularist. But many kudos to all Jews, datiyim and otherwise, who helped build and defend the medina. Every IDF soldier, frum or soon to be… who has been R”L killed or maimed did so l’shaim shamayim.
Defend your own. And don’t consider yourself superior if you are willing to defend as eloquent, erlich, l’shaim shamayim or any other plattitude, those who would side with muslims agaist fellow jews. I’ll take my chances with HB’H for telling it like it is. I’d rather not have to explain myself for turning on achainu beis yisroel (or defending those others who did).
By the way, re your hypothesis about the palestinians being from the 10-lost tribes: Elvis was sited walking along 13th Ave last shabbos.
> MASTERgary wrote [but I fixed the spelling]: “your the one who turned the discussion into an ad hominem fest by using yeshiva-boy mussar-like platitudes in place of a rational argument.”
>> An “ad hominem fest?” I NEVER use insults, jeers, or contemptuous and abusive language. I debate on the merits, although I admit to a tendency towards sarcasm sometimes. And yes, this is the derech of “mussar” (even if I fall off on occasion), the mussar which you put-down as platitudinise. That says a lot.
> Nice guesswork about who I am. You know what? I’ll tell you a little. I’m ba’al teshuva of some 30 years who came to Judaism through MO but drifted to the right. I guess I’m ‘chardal’ (chareidi/daati leumi). I was at Woodstock in ’69, marched on Washington against the Vietnam War; I have cried at the kever of the Ramak in Tsfas and at the Kosel in Yerushalayim. I am an ardent zionist (of the religious type) who is on the Nefesh B’Nefesh waiting list — I don’t believe that Jews belong in golus any more and need to heed the admonition of the venerable Rav of Yerushalayim, Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld, zt”l, who chastised Bnai Torah for not making Aliyah. I’m a law school graduate and have taught American History and Constitutional Law for more years than I’d like to recognize. I am now retired. I learned in Chareidi Yeshivas and I’m comfortable davening in either a Young Israel or Agudah shul. I have six children all of whom learned or are learning in Chareidi Yeshivas in Eretz Yisrael. I am gray-haired and bearded and will soon be 60 years old (if I was younger I would be joining the IDF) and have therefore lived enough years to learn a thing or two about life.
> “I’ll take my chances with HB’H for telling it like it is.”
>> Good luck.
> “By the way, re your hypothesis about the Palestinians being from the 10-lost tribes: Elvis was sited walking along 13th Ave last Shabbos.”
>> Nice wisecrack…but I never did care too much for Elivs. Anyway, it’s not MY hypothesis. I was just reporting about the fascinating genetics research being done at Hebrew University. You don’t like the implications of that research? Too bad. The genetic relationship between Jews and Palestinians is “fact,” (although the Ribbono Shel Olam might be playing a little DNA-trick on us…who knows). In any event, I repeat: the implications of this research are fascinating, especially for those who believe that the final geula is imminent.
[I’m done with this thread]