The Jerusalem-based Eida Chareidis has decided this year, not to oppose Thursday’s scheduled to’eva parade in the capital as it has in recent years.
According to a Chadrei Chadarim report, askanim met with “inciters” to warn them to refrain from inflaming the atmosphere and not to provoke followers into violent protests or actions which are contrary to the decision of rabbonim. They fear that a small number of American students with ‘nothing to do’ seek action and thereby engage others in provocative activities contrary to instructions from rabbonim.
The Eida points out they still plan to oppose the “tamei” parade but will do so diplomatically.
Eida leaders admit that the protests in recent years “got out of hand” and they were a chilul Hashem.
Earlier in the week, a protest event took place in Yerushalayim’s Beis Yisrael neighborhood. HaRav Moshe Sternbruch Shlita, Rosh Av Beis Din, addressed the event. He explained Hashem is testing us, to see if we protest this abomination. He warned not to protest will bring disasters upon Am Yisrael.
Later on, a number of talmidim registered at a local Yeshiva took to the streets and burned garbage receptacles and attempted to block traffic. Two arrests were made.
The parade is scheduled for Thursday, 26 June, beginning in Independence Park at 4:00PM and making its way to Liberty Bell Park.
(Yechiel Spira – YWN Israel)
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28 Responses
Why the mention of the “american buchrim with nothing to do…”? I must say that when I leart in e”y there were way more isreal-particulary yerushalmi-buchrim with aparently less than nothing to do besides activly seeking action wether by bleaching a semenary girls clothing or burning a dumpster. So hence that statment on the american bochur is grosly mistated! Thanx and have a chilling early morning and day!
Let us all protest by davening for the Geulah sheleima and when Mashiach Tzidkeinu comes there will be no more Toevos!!
Not to protest at all is silently condone.
Nonsense! Do you protest every non-tznius lady you meet? Every non-kosher restaurant?
Nobody would know or care about this filth if the Eida would stop talking about it.
Nothing is worse than Chillul Hashem and Bitul Torah; and removing bochrim from the BM is both – especially when they are gawking at a To’eva (Shame) Parade.
This parade would be a non-issue if not for the HELP of the Eida.
well said #1 I also dont think it is far to blame american bocherim they are in yeshiva learning they probbly dont even know about the whole parade!! They just dont want to blame themselves for the disruptions!
TO #1
re ur point in 2.
1] Chillul Hashem is a halachik term.[i.e. it has definitive halachik parameters]. This means ur feelings or opinion that it is a chillul hashem is irrelevent to any frum halacha abiding jew [unless u are a poseik].
in fact something may seem to be a chillul hashem to a laymen a when in fact it may even be a Kiddush Hashem & vice versa.
2] ur posting that u [“many of us…”] knew better than the rabanim “for years” is to disgrace the torah & its talmidia chachmim.& u undermine their leadership!! – a Bizayon Hatora vilomdeha. u may not know this – but to be mevaze a talmid chacham is a grave sin.
[btw i personally am not part of the eida community]
3) Why blame the “American” students “with nothing to do”? Sometimes weeds in the yard are homegrown
who said they were AMerican?
blame the americans ha ha
Obviosly, from your report, there is a difference of opinion among the GeDoLim. Rav Moshe Sternbuch of the Edah HaChaReiDis believes “MiDeShaska RaBonon, Shma MeNay DeNeeCha Lay.”
Perhaps, we can say “AyLu, VeAyLu DivRei E’ Chaim!”
Let each person follow the advice of his Rav, and act accordingly.
While the Eidah doesn’t need my “haskomo” I think they are finally realizing that they do more harm by protesting in the charedi part of Jerusalem (against something that’s occuring only in the secular part of Jerusalem). By all these signs (poskvillim) and wild protests etc they are exposing all our innocent little children to this “schmutz” which they wouldn’t have known without. Children see, hear and understand much more than we think. Then they ask questions and dicuss with other children.
It’s a very hard decision as in the end it HURTS that this is happening in the holiest city.
NeveAliza
Don’t you relize till the Americans came to town there was no such thing as a Hafganna! 😉
Very strange indeed
Protesting should not be a choice between chillul hashem or nothing. We could learn from Ghandi the power of non-violent, peaceful protests.
By the way, many of the American students are already home – let’s not cast aspersions unfairly.Take responsibility for your tamidim and teach them self-control.
#2 wrote: “To protest with violence is to engage in the same activity as the marchers.”
How is it the same? The marchers are promoting a toeiva lifestyle.
Interstingly enough, the yerushalmies I’ve spokin with during previous hafganot on the prade had no idea why exactly they were protesting other than some general knoledge of a “shmutz prade”. Its craaaaaaazy!
we are in golus
if we were not, there would be no protests
they would all be given skila
HaKodesh BoruchHu calls it an ABOMINATION in his eyes.
and in Yerushalaim!!
Pinchas would know what to do
#5
I assure you that if there was a pritzus parade (much like the toeivah parade) ther would be protests, the eidah chareidis don’t protests the people just the publicity
Oy! What has befallen my eyes!
see kesuvos 29, eventhough the death penalty isn’t in effect, there is still “din dales missos b”d”. Hashem has his ways of taking care of things. Burning garbage cans accomplishes nothing besides for distracting people from the issue at hand, wasting our arnona (tax) money,{replacing all the garbage bins etc.) wasting time with traffic delays and endangering lives of shomrei torah u’mitzvos with fires. Fires burn, and destroy. Obviously, there is a need to be mechazek ourselves. Let’s do it possitively.
A concerned resident of Yerushalayim Ir HaKodesh
They fear that a small number of American students with ‘nothing to do’ seek action and thereby engage others in provocative activities contrary to instructions from rabbonim *****************************************
EIDAH, have you ever seen or attend a burning garbage protest, the talk is either in Yiddish or Ivrit, and the walk is Israeli all the way…. don’t blame a small number of American students as the culprits. It just ain’t so.
JD Don’t you relize till the Americans came to town there was no such thing as a Hafganna!
BALONEY, check out photos of demos in the 1950’s-60’s and you will see that Charedeim know how to protest loud and clear. What do Americans have to do with this?
Is not what #3 or “back off” talking about also a toeva? If I’m not mistaken, it is either on par with or a greater aveira than the subject of the parade. Or is it just that nobody got wind of what #3 even said.
My fellow brothers, can just someone of the above commenters explain to me, when there is a public toiavo march going on in the holiest city of the world, – unfortunately – by our (estranged) brothers and sisters, you claim that protesting against them is a huge chilul hashem. while you feel that protesting (violently) against the eviction of Gush Katif was “alright” with everyone.. can someone please draw the line for me?
So far we have 27 comments at the time I am posting. Koheles writes “eis l’dabeir v’eis lachashos.” The comment submitters would do well to leave it to real Talmidei Chachomim to decide when and where to apply “l’dabeir” or “lachashose.” You can be sure they are not reading the public opinion of YWN comment posters to come to their conclusions.
“They fear that a small number of American students with ‘nothing to do’ seek action and thereby engage others in provocative activities”
Are the children who spend shabbos throwing rocks at cars (and people!) also “American Students?” It seems to me that that is the breeding ground for the out-of-control protests.
MR Yechiel Spira SEEMS TO SHOW A PATTERN OF YU MENTALITY . I BELEIVE HIS ARTICLES BELONG IN THE MIZRACHI / MODERN ORTHODOX WEBSITES REATHER THAN THE “YWN” . HIS USE OF QUOTATION MARKS RATHER THAN OUT RIGHT LEFT WING OPINIONS ARE ANOYING AS WELL . THE “inciters” AS HE CALLS THEM MAY IN FACT BE LESHAIM SHOMAYIM . LETS NOT FORGET THE ENEMY IS THE SHAME PERADE .
Amusing to read conflicting descriptions about what’s happening outside my front door…
B”H Shalom u”Brochoh! There appears to be an enormous “steerah” or “clash” of ideas going on within this article. First, the reader is told that the Eida will not hold demonstrations against this desecration. Then a few lines down we read the following ”
Earlier in the week, a protest event took place in Yerushalayim’s Beis Yisrael neighborhood. HaRav Moshe Sternbruch Shlita, Rosh Av Beis Din, addressed the event. He explained Hashem is testing us, to see if we protest this abomination. He warned not to protest will bring disasters upon Am Yisrael.”
It seems that Rav Sternbuch Shlita “forgot” to check in with his contemporaries. Or does he simply believe differently than they do? In my puny little world w/ my punier little mind, I appear to agree with the Rav at this moment. G’d Forbid, Heaven Forefend that Am Yisroel amv”sh should be chastised for this abomination that might take place in our Holiest City – the very center of the entire Universe! We are being tested? Then what are we really supposed to do?
Before I continue, I think everyone needs to stop writing loshon hara about yeshivah students, past, present, or future. What happens cannot be changed now. The students are not the issue. The issue is, do Jews, any Jews have the right to protest this scheduled event? I say, not only do we have a right to do so, in fact, we have a responsibility to do so !!! I call upon the Eida HaChareidis to please explain to Am Yisroel how they came to their conclusion. We have a right to know and they have a responsibility to explain it to us. Perhaps if heard their reasons, or read an explanation, we would all see that they are indeed 100% correct.
I ask that all of us – no matter where we are right now, to contact the Eida and request that they immediately explain themselves. If they respond, who am I to make such a request, they don’t have to reply to me, then gently remind them that they are our supposedly leaders, the princes of the tribes, and they must lead with an open mind and a clear understanding. If we do not understand them, how can they expect all of us to follow them? I just don’t understand how on one hand one of the greatest Gedolim in the world today can comment that HaShem Yisborach is “testing” us with this issue, yet his colleagues clearly disagree with him. This being the case, what are we supposed to do? There is still time, thank G’d, to find out. To approach the Gedolim HaDor, ask for clearer understanding. Tell them what Rav Sternbuch pronounced, ask their opinions. We’re not talking “modern” hashkofohs verses “yeshivish” or “chassidish” – although many of the Eida Rabbis come from various backgrounds, they often appear to arrive at the same conclusions on a regular basis. I do not have a problem with following them, but I do have a problem with doing so “blindly”. Especially when one of their own has already publicly disagreed. Can someone out there – especially those that are blessed to be in Israel attempt to contact these Rabbonim and ask for explanations? Or contact Rav Sternbuch and ask how he came to a different conclusion. I will add one more item, in the past several months we have all been witness to many extraordinary events in the world – earthquakes, floods, droughts, etc. – and if seems that much of the world has,
kol bli ayin hara, been affected by one thing or another. Many explain this as the birth pangs of Moshiach Tzidkeinu. If this is true, and there is even a slight hint or possibility that HaShem is indeed “testing” us as His Chosen, then I think we need to rethink this issue (and many others) long and hard, and make sure that our leaders are indeed making the proper choices, not only for their own good, but for the good of all Jews everywhere.
The only potential violent protestors are the draft-dodging Bochurim who are not sitting in Yeshiva and learning, and who don’t work CV. Americans? I think not. But don’t worry if word leaks out that the mushchasim might carry an Israeli flag…..well that’s a completely different matter.
#33
They don’t because they come to conclusions based on their Torah knowledge and not on leidig gei’er activities.