Justice Menachem Klein, who sports a kippa sruga (knitted yarmulke) on Wednesday, stated that the chareidi population has in essence exhibits a de facto recognition of the Israeli judicial system.
In a ruling handed down he stated that even though chareidim wish to portray the courts as secular, a system not adhering to Jewish Law, “I sit here and see an Israeli flag to my right and the menorah of the Beis HaMikdosh behind me [on the official state symbol]. I do not see stars or other heathen symbols and I am not an idol worshipper” stated Justice Klein.
The background involves a case addressing checkbooks that officials of the Beit HaTalmid Yeshiva reported as stolen, seeking the court’s intervention to prevent the cashing of a number of checks, with one written in the sum of NIS 24,000.
The rabbis believe they know who stole the checkbooks, but after asking Ashdod’s Rabbi Shmuel Gross, who is affiliated with the Gur chassidic community, they were told it is prohibited for them to give the name of the suspect to the goyish courts, referring to the civil judicial system.
Justice Klein stated the de-legitimization of the court system and the calls to the community not to appear before the court do not permit hiding documents and ignoring the court. As such, the judge has called upon police to open an investigation against Rabbi Gross for interfering and hampering with a police investigation.
Klein stated he does not deny a feeling of painful embarrassment caused by the attitude of this sector of the community towards the courts, labeling them courts of the gentiles, stating the Jewish People lost their independence and sovereignty with the destruction of the Second Temple. Since then, the Diaspora has hounded Jews and the courts of the gentiles have not defended or stood up for them.
Concerning the chareidi public, Justice Klein sees a sizable chasm between the rabbis and the masses, with the religious community needing and relying on the judicial system, and for the most part, they view the courts as an objective reliable body – thereby granting de facto recognition of the court system, which tries to operate as an independent body which seeks not to exhibit preference or prejudice towards any part of the mosaic which comprises the Israeli people.
Drawing a proof to strengthen his position, Justice Klein turned to the newspapers Hamodia and Yated Ne’eman, stating in the past, the chareidi population would not converse in Hebrew on a day-to-day level but today, these important newspapers are indeed published in Hebrew, representing a major turnaround in the chareidi community as compared to 100 years ago [vis-à-vis the state and the national language]. The chareidim 100 years ago would never have believed that such important and central newspapers would be published in Hebrew.
The judge then quoted from various sources in religious texts, seeking to prove that with the fall of the era Malchus Yisrael, the judicial authority was placed in the people’s hands, the courts, and as such, the court system cannot be viewed as Gentile courts.
“Never in our history have there been so many yeshivas and Kollels he added, thousands of talmedei chachamim, experts in Shas and scripture, those familiar with Torah and Law. Nevertheless, they opt to leave behind the opportunity to engage in adjudication, as well as passing the opportunity to incorporate Jewish judicial practice and its principles within the courts as practiced in the State of Israel by the people of the land – and of this, we must feel profound sorrow.
(Yechiel Spira – YWN Israel)
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28 Responses
Awesome job, Judge!!
finally a judge with a brain
Justice Klein’s observations regarding the status of the Israeli Courts are curious. The Courts especially the Supreme Court act with no oversight or limits or jurisdiction/ justicability. Court opinions consitantly seem to go out of the way to defy Jewish law as well as Jewish/Zionist sensibilities.
The spiritual corruption of the Judical system is so complete that Justice Klien’s remarks are just incredible.
illini07;
the question is not whether the judiciary of Israel is illegitimate or not. The question is if we look at the system as a Jewish system-like Bais Din, or do we say that it’s like a goyish court.
It seems to me that if the Israeli court does not rule according to the Torah way, it should indeed be considered a goyish court.
Lets put all feelings aside lehalacha the israeli court is not a jewish court and “mesire’ still applies.
Frum Jews should NOT go to the civil judicial system rather they should go to a BAIS DIN who follows the laws given to us by hashem!!!
The good judge said: “Never in our history have there been so many yeshivas and Kollels he added, thousands of talmedei chachamim, experts in Shas and scripture, those familiar with Torah and Law. Nevertheless, they opt to leave behind the opportunity to engage in adjudication, as well as passing the opportunity to incorporate Jewish judicial practice and its principles within the courts as practiced in the State of Israel.”
Does the good judge mean to convert all Israeli law to comply with the Shulchan Aroch??? Any Israeli law that is in conflict renders all laws
and courts Archa_ot ha_Akum. Jewish judges do not
cut it if they don’t follow Jewish law- all of it. -JYK
levelheaded-
please learn hilchos mesira and report back. start with the aruch hashulchan who speciffically says that it does NOT apply today in civilized countries and especially for monetary issues
By and large, with a few notable exceptions, the chareidi ”masses” do not recognize the legitimacy of the secular courts in Israel. And they follow the Rabbonim’s admonations not to cooperate with the Israeli court system.
straightshooter
i guess your more leaned than rabbi gross from ashdod.
Absolute jibberish
Just asking, BTW Is it essential to know what type of yarmulka he wears?
What type of yarmulka does Noah Deer, Dov Hikind, Malcolm Hoenlin, Avi Shafran, Lipa, Avrom Fried, Pinny Lifshitz, Dovid Zweibel, Nachum Siegal, etc. WEAR? and therefore
Chareidim refuse to recognize any civil authority that does not dole out money.
levelheaded-
it’s called protecting your own
comment #14 is inappropriate. you join hands with those that call Chareidim (and they mean all Yidden) leeches.
is this the exact same court that mattired stores to sell chametz on pesach what’s jewish about them
Reb Yechiel Spira LOY”T:
Yasher Kochacha for your excellent and interesting reporting from Eretz Yisrael. However — BiMechilas Kovedchem — this article is very one-sided, tilted to the wrong side.
As Commenter No. 7 and others have said, the problem that Rav Gross and all other Ehrliche Rabbanim have with the Israeli secular courts is that they do not follow Halachah. (Modern Israeli law is often Keneged Halachah.)
As a responsible “Yeshiva World” journalist, it is your obligation to interview Rav Gross and/or other Rabbanim and have them present the Halachah that the prohibition against Arkaos applies to all secular courts, including Jewish ones.
“Justice Menachem Klein, who sports a kippa sruga (knitted yarmulke) on Wednesday,”
what i can’t figure out is why he only wears one on Wednesdays!?! Does this mean that the other days he wears none at all, or perhaps on the other days he wears a black velvet one, or a gerrer kappel maybe?!
🙂
Kudos to #18
I’m surprised on the way YWN has reported this and gave a pass to #1 & #2 (#2 – pure Am Haratzes)
“Never in our history have there been so many yeshivas and Kollels he added, thousands of talmedei chachamim, experts in Shas and scripture, those familiar with Torah and Law”
Really now! and where may I ask did he get such information!? Throughout the generations tanaim, amoraim, rishonim, all the great yeshivos from sura and nahardaa to volozhin, our nation has always been steeped in Torah. Ve’dibarta bam ve’lo bidvarim be’tailim has always been taken literaly until not too long ago. How one can have the chutzpa and the ga’ava to say such a thing is beyond me. (unless he meant all those people that learn daf yomi, but if that’s what he means by ‘experts in shas’, och un vey) Where has our dor gone!?!
I hardly no anyone who would submit themselves to a Bais Din voluntarily. I know of no one who would go a second time. Most Frum Jews trust the courts more than the Batei Dinim. This may be unfortunate, but it is a fact.
yeah i dont evn know why thcomment #1 and #2 come to this site
to flash@3;29,does it make it right and is that the only thing wrong you see in these supposedly most ‘frum’ jews.i doubt these people you talk about care about much else other then their money….
Amazing the Ignorance & stupidity keeps coming.
YW how come your site attracts all these Idiots & Psychopaths, very rare do i find common sense in these comments.
All courts in the State of Israel have the Halacha like the courts in the USA.
If somebody Steals & i am trying to protect my own possesions its not called MESIRA. so all you dummies first go & learn & than write comments that agree with Halacha.
#14: Yofi
#25 “Just study Shoftim and Neviim”, that’s right study Shoftim and Neviim, but in the right way with the mefarshim, and you’ll see that the pashtus isn’t always how you think. Read R’ Avigdor Miller on history and you’ll see the right Torah’dike hashkafah on Jewish history. Yes their were some Ovdei avodah zara, but they were only a small miut, (and even they also believed in the Ribono Shel Olom). And what you bring from mesechtos dealing with civil crimes and business fraud, I really don’t know what you are trying to prove. We got the Torah which is a Code of Law, with how to deal in every circumstance. Does that show on the people’s level?! And yes the average jew in Russia couldn’t learn, but what about the Tanaim, Amoraim, are we greater then they chas veshalom?! I don’t recall now where, but there is a Gemara about the thousands of Talmidim that were in the Yeshivos of Bavel. And thats without talking about the previous generations. During the time of the Beis Hamikdosh what do you think people did all day! What about Chizkiyahu that put gaurds by the Batei midrashim to make sure that EVERYONE was learning Torah. I can go on, but I think it’s enough. Ve’hameivin yavin.
27 is correct. One does not have to allow himself to be robbed. According to most authorities, one can get an injunction from a civil court without any heter arkaos, pending the case coming to bais din or the issuance of a heter arkaos, in order to protect his property. In the case of Israeli courts which have time and again violated halacha on major issues, such as allowing toayva parades, or demanding that the rabanim issue a heter mechira when the gedolei yisroel said no, allowing goyim to be called Jews (giyur not necessarily kihalacha,) insisting that soldiers evict their families from Gush Katif with no provision for “conscienctious dissent”, etc. The court has shown it is a continuation of the Bolshevik mindset that founded it. The fact that a man with a Kippah sits on the bench means nothing. A man with a Kippah addressed a large synagogue in Manhattan erev pesach. He was the Pope. It is said that he davka picked an orthodox synagogue even though a reform synagogue might have offered a larger audience, because he didn’t want to be the only one in the building wearing a yarmulka.
B”H its good to see Am Yisroel so united- ACHDUS