An asifah was held this past Motzai Shabbos in the home of the Mir Yerushalayim Rosh Yeshiva, Rav Nosson Tzvi Finkel Shlita, to launch the Ramat Eshkol Vaad. In attendance were members of the Vaad, together with their Mara D’Asra Rav Tzvi Shirlin Shlita.
Invited as well were representatives of the various other Vaadim who gathered to hear divrei chizuk and bracha from the Rosh Yeshiva. Sanhedria HaMurchevet, Sorotzkin, Romeima, Ezras Torah, Tel Arza and Belz Vaadim are currently running, with more neighborhoods in the works. B”H the Vaadim have been quite successful in helping keep housing affordable for yungeleit. The Rosh Yeshivah gave his Explicit Brocha to the Askonim who are involved and to those who abide by the standards of the Vaadim.
YeshivaWorld would like to remind its readers who are planning to move to Eretz Yisroel or have children who are, not to sign on an apartment or agree to a price before checking with the local Rental Vaad. Rental Vaadim were started with the backing and encouragement of Gedolei Yisroel (Rav Dovid Solevatchik, Rav Shteinman, Rav Scheinberg, Rav Dan Segal, The Ga’avad Rav Y. T. Weiss and others) to stop recent rent hikes, some by as much as 100%. These hikes are forcing some serious B’nei Torah to curtail their learning in Eretz Yisroel and are causing financial strain to many others.
Sources in Ramat Eshkol say the community is using the rent issue as an impetus to work on a greater plan of community building. The plan is to create a spirit of belonging and foster a sense of permanence amongst the avreichim of the area. The Vaad will enable avreichim to settle in the neighborhood without worrying about skyrocketing rents or taking on overwhelming mortgages. Steps are also being taken to address common concerns chutznikim have in acclimatizing to Israeli society. Other needs being attended to separately include neighborhood shiurim and vaadim, a brand-new N’shei and an Anglo minyan/shul.
Vaadim:
Belz 057 314 6700
Ezras Torah / Tel Arza 02 537 8223
Ramat Eshkol 052 768 6823
Romeima 052 766 0567
Sanhedria HaMurchevet 02 582 4491
Unsdorf / Sorotzkin 02 537 4547
(Submitted By Vaad)
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60 Responses
The Vaddim are doing tremendous work.Why is there no Vaad in the Machal-Maalot Dafna- Arzei Habira neighborhoods?
When I brought this up I was told that “they don’t need it”.Im hoping this was the answer of a ignoramus and not the true feeling of the organizers.Within these areas there are many many families that would benifit tremendously from such a vaad.Whether there may be a slightly higher porportion of “haves” than “have nots” is regardless and quite frankly should not go into the cheshbon.We are dealing with bnei torah – kollel families and they should not be taken advantage of, either.
Kol Hakavod to the Ramat Eshkol Vaad! It’s about time somebody took the initiative! These past few years have seen a huge increase in rental prices and we know countless yungerleit who are overpaying their Israeli landlords, not to mention fellow English-speaking “sub-letters.” With the Gedolim’s support, let’s hope the Vaad’s efforts will yield tremendous results. Hatzlacha!
How about tackling the big one- that the local Bais Yakov will not accept American kids? That is the most crucial issue
The vaad in Ramat Eshkol and other places are filling an important need. The small percentage of people for whom money is not an issue and are willing to pay tremendously inflated prices for rent are hiking up the prices for everyone else and damaging the character of the neighborhoods. It’s time that someone enforces fair prices, since individuals don’t always seem to be concerned about the communal impact of their actions, as long as they get the place they want.
Thank you to HaRav Nosson Tzvi, HaRav Tzvi Sharlin, and all the other Gedolim involved in this important project. They truly care about the needs of the klal – even if it means taking a strong stand.
The organizers of the vaad are doing everything al pi daas torah and should be rewarded for their hard efforts.
כל מי שעוסקים בצרכי ציבור באמונה הקב”ה ישלם שכרם
ZR the rent is so high that we cant even stay long enough for our kids to go to “the local Bais Yakov.”
How about setting up some vaadim for Boro Park and Williamsburg ?
I would love to drive a Mercedes. The problem is that they usually cost about $50,000. Maybe we should organize a Vaad to boycott their company until they lower prices.
Jerusalem is one of the most sought after cities in the world to live in. Everyone understands why Manhattan has high rent prices. Whats the difference in Jerusalem?
By the way, does anyone know how to contact the Ramat Eshkol vaad?
lomdus- the point is that the owners are taken advantage of avreichim that are trying to come to EY and live a kolel lifestyle.When the rent is so high, than many avreichim are forced to leave.Though kollel may not be your hashkafa that is the matter at hand.No one really needs to live in Manhatten.Many yungerleit “need” to live in yerushalayim as that is where their yeshivas and kollelim are…Yes technically there are other places to learn but many feel they are shteiging best where they are.
Lomdus: You are an idiot!! We as frum jews should know better! If it was up to me I would live in Montana (where it’s cheaper) somewhere but I can’t since I need to educate my kids in yeshiva. Problem is we as frum jews we need to live in groups so we have the proper food, education etc… I don’t live in Lakewood but I think it’s ridiculous the way the prices are. Monsey and Brooklyn are more closer to the city so it’s more understandable. If you are in the middle class financially, you should be able to live somewhere in one of these large frum cities in the northeast. Problem is now you can’t as was mentioned in the previous tuition thread on this website.
So you asked “Whats the difference in Jerusalem”? So one answer may be is Manhattan is financial capital of the world with thousands of companies. Rich executives decided to live closer to their work place which drove the price of real estate up. We as frum jews no matter what STATUS you are (poor, rich etc…) should be able to live in Jerusalem, Lakewood etc…
Ramat Eshkol’s number is 052 76 86 823. Hatzlacha.
No one asked these yungerleit to live in Ramat Eshkol and pay these high prices. There are cheaper neighborhoods such as Neve Yakov and Kiryat Hayovel. One can even leave the city and go to Betar, Kiryat Sefer, Tel Zion, or even Givat Zev. The bottom line is that these avreichem are spoiled. They only know how to be “moser nefesh” if they live in certain areas and can eat out often.
People like Lamdus who think living in Yerushalayim is a luxury taka shouldn’t be living here
what about lakewood? i am sure the vaad will be doing something
This is not a good idea. Economics 101 – Price Controls do not work. This is an artificial manipulation of a market which is driven by supply and demand. A better idea would be for the leaders to show leadership and actually do some strategic planning and build housing developments in an affordable part of the country. The same can be said over here in America. New York has become too expensive. The Frum Oilam needs to build new communities in affordable locales.
Lomdus, what a dumb analogy. A Mercedes is a luxury and therfore only a wealthy person ought to purchase one. Living in Jerusalem is every ones right and therfore real estate owners should take that into consideration.
Too late, but nice try. We were one of the first few families who moved there back in the day and were forced out recently due to rent increases by 200%. Lomdus, to answer your legitimate question, a frum Jew who runs a business cannot use only “market factors” to formulate policy. He must use halacha also. And there are halachos about gouging. IT IS GOUGING when a top floor, no elevator, run down, unfurnished, moldy apartment went for $600 and is suddenly going for $1400 one year later! You are right that the market will pay for it – there is always some rich sucker who has a richer father-in-law happy to put his maideleh wherever her friends are at any price- but that does not make it halachikly okay.
Keep up the good work.
Next the need to fix the educational system for bnos and banim, need some parks with basketball hoops, places for girls to jump rope, more garbage pails in the street, benches to sit on, and an attitude of tolerance for all. Since Rav Nosson Tzvi grew up in Chicago, he can relate to these democratic ideas.
#1 Mr. TelKup as you already know, ppl in arzei think living on $2000 (besides for rent) is not TOO MUCH so of course they dont need a vaad, the more they pay the richer they feel!
It is very nice to control rent (from the renter’s perspective), but rent is merely a reflection on the actual cost of the dirah. Did it cross anyone’s mind that the owner of the dirah may have a mortgage and without the rent would not be able to pay for it?
Every jew is entitled to 4 amos of kevurah somewhere in Eretz Yisroel, not a furnished apartment with an elevator in Yerushalaim!
Below is a copy of the letter that was recently sent out to Ramat Eshkol landlords in hebrew and english:
Dear Fellow Bnei Torah/Landlords,
The purpose of this e-mail is not to discuss the many reasons why rent control is unfair to landlords and bad for the greater community, as we’re sure you’ve already thought of and discussed some of them on your own. The purpose of this e-mail is to begin the process by which we hope the baalei dira of Ramat Eshkol can come together to protect the investments we’ve worked so hard to make.
Just a few important points:
– For a myriad of reasons, the community of Ramat Eshkol is very distinct among the communities in which rent control has already been instituted and (prematurely) declared a success. For that reason there is a strong consensus among tenants, landlords and prominent rabonim that rent control is already doomed for failure in our neighborhood.
– The most important thing we can do as landlords to ensure that failure, is to maintain a unified resolution not to give in to economic, and far worse, social intimidation. This applies whether you rent out or live in the apartment you own. It’s very important that our friends in the community realize that rent control will be disastrous for many earnest kollel and working couples who have worked hard to secure a stable financial future through home ownership.
– In the event that rent control were to get off the ground in Ramat Eshkol it is imperative that nobody give in and demand rents below the fair market price they rightfully deserve. Our neighborhood is in incredibly high demand by a diverse group of people, and it is extremely unlikely that your apartment will ever go unoccupied.
– Many of us agree that it would be counterproductive for baalei dira to attend the meeting that is to be held this coming motzoi shabbos. Numerous requests have been made by the rent control vaad for landlords to attend this meeting. This is because they (and we) understand that if our faces are seen among the crowd it will substantiate their claim that rent control is merely an agreeable compromise between tenants and landlords. We need to make it clear that we take our parnassah seriously and won’t be placated. If for any reason you disagree with this reasoning, we want to hear from you.
– Please forward this letter to any home-owners you know, and forward their contact info so they can be added for future letters. If you have any input or questions about this matter please don’t hesitate to contact us.
Together we can protect our investments.
Best Wishes and a Good Shabbos,
– The Ramat Eshkol Homeowners Association.
Lomdus – We’re not talking about people who would love to live in Yerushalayim but can’t come because of the price. We are talking about people who have already been there for 3-5 years+. These kollel couples did not move to Shaarei Chessed or any upscale Yerushalayim neighborhoods. They came to Ramat Eshkol which was a run-down, chiloni neighborhood with no ashkenazi shul but was the cheapest place to live that was walking distance to their yeshiva. They raised money to build shuls and hired rabbonim. Suddenly, they are told by their landlord – if you do not pay double (or more) rent than you have been paying for the past 5 years, you have to leave. They have no where to go because every other landlord of every other apartment is saying the same thing.
Ramat Eshkol only became a sought after neighborhood when a few brave couples moved there and worked hard with mesiras nefesh to start a frum infrastructure there. Now, those same people are being kicked out of their homes with no where to go so some rich little girl can reap the benefits of their hard work.
MirBoy- we, as a newly married couple live in Arzei. Please don’t generalize. Ever.
No our parents are NOT supporting us, nor do we have a large, shiny nest-egg to dip into. We both work and he learns. The price we saw had strings attached which we didn’t know about and as good Jews couldn’t/wouldn’t back out of at last minute.
A Va’ad would be a wonderful idea. In this place especially. When our contract ends, we have no choice but to move elsewhere. Sad but :shrug: we have no choice. and yes, EVERYONE has a right to reside in Yerushalayim. Gd will make sure we all fit, why are people worried? Do your hishtadlus and let Him take care of the rest.
In regard to gouging, unfortunately, that’s what being a human being will do to you. The best of us get greedy (though they may justify it..well, my neighbor did it to his tenants with no lightning bolts/I have to pay my own bills etc.)
Agreed, 2k is an insane sum for monthly ‘sundries’, but unless you move in here and open up a really-well-priced supermarket and CHANGE THE MINDSET HERE the prices ain’t a changin’.
mazip, you have a good point. But you should know
that the Baalei Dirah also artificially raising the prices. They are only getting it because of a lack of knowledge on the part of the new people coming into these neighborhoods. A main part of the Vaad’s job must be to keep people informed of the situation and acceptable price ranges.
Yasher Koach to all members of the various Vaadim and the Rabbonim backing them.
Bad, bad idea!
Recently, in Zimbabwe, in an attempt to control inflation, Mugabe ordered a 50% cut in prices of basic commodities. What happened next? The store shelves emptied. It wasn’t worth producing and selling items, so the people suffered.
Same idea (albeit on a smaller scale here). If you force rents to be low, then landlords will be reluctant to rent properties. More importantly, builders will be less likely to build. As a result, the shortage will get worse.
Some people will benefit in the short run, but it will make things worse in the long run.
As mazip said above: Economics 101.
Potato Kugel,, have you just landed in Yerushayalim?. Ramat Eshkol has been a frum, shomer-shabbos shechuna since after the 6day war, with a large ashkenazi shul filled to capacity every shabbos. As a learner in Yerushayalim in the 70’s, I spent a shabbos a month visiting relatives and family friends (some still live there)in the area. Quite frankly, now it looks run-down, messy in comparison to then. WAKE UP & smell the coffee!
I don’t know enough about the real estate market in Israel to comment on that directly, so that I’ll leave alone. But, how about doing something like this in the USA?
I’d love to see a system where a seller can’t eithersell for more than X% above his original purchase price, or charge more than what an independent RE Agent Committee set up by a Va’ad declares what the Fair Market value of the house to be.
I agree with those that say this will not work in the long-term.
What will help is if people build more and bigger apartment buildings. That will help supply meet demand. Those buildings will only happen if real estate developers see a way of making profit. Rent control makes sure that less buildings get built not more.
Meanwhile people here complain that people moved to neighborhoods because they were cheap and build it up and now have to move when the rent goes up. But their need for cheap housing was a sacrifice they claimed they were willing to make when they started.
this is a pointless discussion. it is not possible to control prices and it is cruel to poor people to give them false hope. the vaadim should devote their efforts to areas that they can have an impact on. markets set prices and there isn’t anything anyone can do about it. this is simply the way Hashem made the world. believe me, if prices could be controlled they would have been for everything and since the beginning of time since no one wants to pay more. it just isn’t possible.
I cant believe there are frum Jews who think EY is not the place we all belong. No wonder moshiach isnt here yet. Why should he take us somewhere we dont really wanna be?
Shouldnt we all wish we were there even if we cant be due to certain circumstances?
Dunno ’bout u but I cry every time I see pictures of our holy yerushalayim… wishing I was able to live there. Maybe one day soon…
sayitlikeitis –
1) I don’t know what Ramat Eshkol was like in the 70’s. I’m glad it was a nice neighborhood then. I am describing what it was like in the 90’s when kollel couples first moved there.
The 2 oldest running ashkenazi/chareidi shuls in Ramat Eshkol are Bnei Torah, which was started in the 90’s, and Bnei Yeshivas which was started after 2000.
2) You agree with me that Ramat Eshkol is a run down neighborhood now. That is why kollel couples moved there – because it is run down, it was cheaper rent. There is no reason for a run-down moldy apartment that has not been renovated at least since the 70’s, on a 4th floor with no elevator, to be over $1000 a month rent.
The bottom line is that rental vaads DO work, which is why the landlords are so scared – as you can see from some other posts.
Rental Vaads have already worked in other communities, and most importantly they have Daas Torah backing them.
#22 mr hocker 18 joe z- perhaps living in rechavia would be a more economic idea for a kollel couple?Obviously not! please do not generalize and attack the arzei community as a whole- your comments reeks of jealousy!
Unfortunately, what worked in other areas will probably not work in Ramat Eshkol. How are you going to tell a young couple in America, who want to come to Ramat Eshkol that they can’t come, even though they could afford it?
The argument that they are messing others over won’t work, because they’ll say the alternative is for them to be messed over and have to stay in America!!!
What are you going to threaten them with? No rav has said it’s assur. So now what, the N”shei? Don’t make me laugh!
And also, somebody just came out with a FAKE CONTRACT G”MACH! So now how is the vaad going to fight that!!!
It all jut seems so hopeless…
Ramat Eshkol’s fake contract gemach number is 052 76 86 823. Hatzlacha.
Sayitliktitis, I don’t know what went on in the 70’s since I’ve only been in Eretz Yisrael for 9 years(and I wasn’t even alive in the 70’s), but I do know that when I first came to Eretz Yisrael, Ramat Eshkol was not a frum neighborhood, yes there were a few frum people living there, and the yungerliet who lived there would get made fun of by poeple living in Dafna and Arzei that they lived in a chiloni neighborhood. Only about 5 years ago did Ramat Eshkol really turn into a frum neighborhood of Yungerliet. 5 years ago the gabbai of the shul used to beg the guys in the neighborhood not to daven maariv in yeshiva so that they would be able to have a minyan. Now there are over a dozen minyanim for maariv in the shechuna and every single one is packed solid. So alot has changed.
By the way Lomdus I agree with what you’re saying I also want a Mercedes and I think you’re idea is a good one. I’ll start printing up the fliers and making the initial phone calls tonight.
What is a fake contract Gemach?
Also Mr.Telkup #35 and #1 I am not attacking Arzei or the wonderful Waldmans Shul, I am merely saying that someone who needs 2,000$ to live on (besides rent) shouldnt be seeking the help of a vaad (especially that is not including the money he makes off shidduchim)
I assume the fake contract gemach provides people with rental contracts that show a fictitiously low rent-price; to be shown to the vaad, and thereby beat the system. This is another unfortunate example of why I think the wonderful work of these vaads will ultimately fail.
Does anyone know what Reb Elyashiv Shlita, the Sar Hatorah, and Rav of Yerushalayim, if there is one, said about these “Vaadim”???
I do.
I heard from a good source that Rav Elyashiv is against the vaadim.
I heard from a better source that a certain Rav in the Sorotzkin area went to Harav Hagaon Rav Elyashiv within the last two weeks and asked about certain specific Vaadim including Ramat Eshkol. The answer was that it was a good idea. Also the Rav of Ramat Eshkol’s two “chareidi” shuls is a Talmid Muvhak of Harav Hagaon Rav Chaim Pinchos Sheinberg, and he would not do anything like this with out a Psak from his Rebbe.
As a long time resident of Ramat Eshkol, our rent has climbed slowly over time with the popularity of the neigbourhood. Many of our friends however have had their rents go up 50% and more in one rental increase. Today a friend told me their landlord is raising their rent from $650 to $1000. This likely means they will have to leave 6 months earlier than planned.
We also have friends that own apartments in Jerusalem and some might leave to go and work in Chinuch/Kiruv in the US and were hoping to have rent cover their mortgages when they leave. The proposed vaad means many will likely sell before they leave.
I do beleive that a distinction should be made between people already living in a community and newcommers who would like to settle in Ramat Eshkol (or any of the other higher priced neighbourhoods).
It seems very different to raise someones rent 50% in one year, thereby forcing bnei Torah to leave their current community and on the other hand charging new tenants high rents.
For existing tenants a drastic rise in rent like 50% in one year, even if justified by economics, by most standards is extreme. Jewish landlords would do very well to try and work out a manageble compromise so that long standing tenants are not thrown out onto the street and forced to relocate under much financial hardship. A gradual rise over time is always acceptable and will give people time to move if need be.
However, on the other hand, Ramat Eshkol (and other areas of Jerusalem) are prime real estate and if a new Tenant is willing to pay a high price for a apartment in a desireable place, its difficult to see the intervention by a Vaad as anything but a redistibution of wealth from landlords to tenants.
No one has a right to live in Ramat Eshkol or Belz or Sorotzkin. There are very fine neigbourhoods of Bnei Torah with cheaper rents in other parts of Israel. Its a spoiled attitude to say you won’t commute to the MIR from Neve Yaakov, Beitar or RBS. Hundreds do it already. If it does not fit your lifestyle, perhaps your values need to be checked.
In fact keeping rents low, prevent other neigbourhoods like French Hill from “turning over”, doing a disservice to all of Yerushalayim.
The Vaad would do well as a resource so people are not taken advantage of by helping to negotiate unreasonable price rises. However, The Vaad, as an instrument of keeping rental prices artificially low for all newcommers, smacks of selfishness on the part of renters and borders on “genaiva” from the landlords.
I also love Paran, but it might just do me some good if high rents make life a little less comfortable.
Mr Mirboy-I would reiterate that this is a serious topic and not the place for shout-outs.On a more persoanl note if someone makes some money on the side,he should not be expected to put that towards rocketing rents rather to put it in savings.I believe most kollel couples are living on much less then $2000 a month (besides for rent).I don’t believe that is the case of the rechavia “kollel” families.
Go get dressed-you will be late for pictures!!
I love paran- why should renters have the inconvenience of traveling from afar? why should the landlords double the rent? No one is asking them to lower the rent to an unreasonable amount- but just to keep it in a normal range.The landlords were making their $800 a month just fine until now and their is no geneiva by telling them not to raise it to $1200
granted there is a demand and that is the real estate market but telling bnei torah to have to travel on a bus for 40 or 50 minutes(in many cases not being able to go home at all during the day) is not necessarily the better option.True hundreds do it but thats because they want to be able to pay $500 a month…The line has to be drawn somewhere
Who is the “Rav” of Ramat Eshkol?
Ooooohmigosh! I cannot LIVE without my daily stroll down Rechov Paran with my bagaboo-ed baby and my iced coffee! If you raise my rent then I will have to move to Neve Yaakov or someplace equally ghastly–and then how is my husband gonna learn?!
Tek.
You did not properly address any of the points I raised. Landlords should not double rents in one year. And who are you to decide $800 is normal. Pehaps $1200 is normal. I paid $640, 5 years ago for a 4 room and now pay $1000. Perhaps the people who have to travel, because they can afford only $500 should not be forced to do so. Why not set the price back to $640. How exactly did you come to that number $800 ?
According to your standards of normal, since you can apparently afford $800, thats how the rents should be determined. Rather short sighted don’t you think ?
Again, my simple point is, that hiking rents too fast is problematic, for an existing community. Signing up new renters, who have other reasonable choices, at the expense of landlords, some of who are your friends, because you and others like you decided $800 is what you can afford is dishonest and selfish – and just perhaps – genaivah !
Harav Tzvi Shirlin is the Rav of Ramat Eshkol. I was just mevarer that HaRav Hagaon Rav Chaim Kanievsky was posed the specific Ramat Eshkol shailo by a Vaad member. He said the renters are right and to ask Rav Elyashiv. Rav Elyashiv was asked and agreed to Rav Chaim’s assesment of the situation.
Duvid613 – The Rav of Ramat Eshkol is Harav Hagoen Rav Tzvi Sharlin, Shlita. He is the rav of both Bnei Torah and Bnei Yeshivas, the 2 chareidi shuls in Ramat Eshkol.
Wif – I take offense to your comment. I live in Ramat Eshkol and for a bein hazmanim TREAT, my husband and I SHARED an ice coffee from Sam’s. We could never afford to just buy one stam.
Everyone knows that 90% of the bugabooed, ice coffee ladies are from Arzei or other neighborhoods, not Ramat Eshkol.
ILoveParan – your idea is very nice hypothetically, but practically it can not work. If the vaad makes a distinction between the people living in Ramat Eshkol already and the new people who are coming in, the landlords will be more than happy to kick out their current tenants so that they can get higher prices from the newcomers.
Show me one landlord that will let his current tenants stay in the apartment for a rent-controlled price instead of kicking them out and replacing them with a brand new couple for double the price.
The point of the vaad is to keep the community that was built with mesiras nefesh. The landlords have every right to do what they want. However, residents of a community have equal right to do whatever they can to prevent their community from becoming a 1 year honeymoon spot – since no one can afford to live there for longer than that.
Mr. Kolleleit
Unless you heard it from Reb Rlyashiv himeslf, I would not quote him. While Reb Elyashiv probably did “like the idea”, he said to make takanos like the Vaadim want to make need more conditions and was not excited about it.
Kollel4real, etc.
As a side note, i find it interesting to see that when Rabbi Sharlin is trying to lower the rents, he becomes Harav Hagaon… But when the rabbonim in Ramat Eshkol want to separate from the Americans, when they want their children in different classes than the Americans (yes, YOU), then the attitudes charge.
kollel4real- please don’t be guilty of the same generalization that you are accusing wif of…
“everyone knows” is a ridiculous comment.. keep the generalization of neighborhoods out of it.
I loveparan-like everything in life there are gedarim,at some point it was decided that it is getting out of hand and than AL PI DAS TORAH a vaad was created to ensure that prices arent inflated even more.
It is not selfish or geneiva- everyones agrees that it is normal for prices to slowly increase $640 -$800 in 5 yrs is a very reasonable increase…at that rate in 10 yrs the rent would just be breaking $1000(we can hope by then that salaries will also have been increased a bit etc as per normal inflation)…again a rapid ridiculous increase from $800-$1200 in just a few months is what brough about the necessity of the creation of the vaad
Iloveparan, just wondering why is it genaivah?
I have lived in Jerusalem for 18 years. I won’t argue economics – I am a capitalist & I realize there isn’t much one can do.
but let me just say that there is no connection between Israeli economic reality & the real estate situation caused by all the Americans (and others)coming to Israel.
It is wonderful all these Yidden are coming. But…it is expensive for those of us here already! It has REALLY changed things. the newer Americans (seem to) have much more money to give for rent – they come for a short amount of time – and maybe are willing to just spend more for the short time period they are in Israel.
this is life….but there is a sense of shock for many of us when we hear of people paying $1000 for a 2 bedroom apt when this amount of money would have gotten you a total luxury place just a few years ago.
Hey TEK: “but telling bnei torah to have to travel on a bus for 40 or 50 minutes(in many cases not being able to go home at all during the day) is not necessarily the better option”
What kind of argument is this? The average working person also has a substantial commute and guess what, they dont come home during the day either!
Guess what? The world does not revolve around you having a more convenient life.
telkup (#1, 35 , 46 , 47)- i think bugaboo arzei couples (even if they only ended up getting the Baby Jogger) should not be giving their opinions into both Ramat Eshkol (or Rechavia) local politics. Rather stay in your little cuckoon in Arzei for a few years and then sell your furniture for $20,000$ so this cycle will only continue (p.s. whats the point of lowering rent if you still have to put down CrAzY money for furniture????)
Kudos to mylogic37 (#11) “We as frum jews no matter what STATUS you are (poor, rich etc…) should be able to live in Jerusalem, Lakewood etc…” Since when did we as frum Jews rely on outside philosophies (“Economics”) to dictate how to live our lives? It’s definitely something to be taken into consideration, but what about DAAS TORAH? And KOL YISROEL AREIVIM? The Gedolim are all saying to do this because it will help many yungeleit NOW. We DO care about our neighbors. We don’t say, ‘Sorry Yossel, you gotta move again because you have not’. Or, ‘You’re kind is not welcome here, only bessere mentchen need apply’. What do you think it means ‘Aniyei ircha kodmim’? My point being that not everyone living in any given place is in the same tax bracket. Yiddishe cities and communities are made up of all types because everyone has something to offer the next, and I don’t mean gelt.
I don’t understand the owners’ position. If you struggled and bought and hope to live there long term, don’t you care about the ‘tsurah’ of the neighborhood? Or are you only concerned with yourself right now? So What! – to the guys who made an investment. What gives you the right to decide how well your investment should do? How can you do that on the backs of Bnei Torah? Also, home ownership is a poor way to secure a stable financial future, Duvid613 (#24). Just ask any Economist 😉 Anyway, the vaadim aren’t making anyone lose on their investment. The prices are still quite nice returns and no one that I know bought thinking that prices would get as ridiculous as they have been getting. So guess what? They won’t be! Don’t make investments on yungeleits cheshbonos. Not in farfetched stock deals and not in farfetched rent prices. You guys are working neged harabbonim without any daas torah.
I take offense at those who imply that the vaad is not for those who can afford high prices. Of course it is. Why should we give more money to non-frum people. It should stay by us so that we can do mitzvos.
And anyway, if anybody should stay in Ramat Eshkol, etc. it’s the people who can’t afford higher rent. Why should they have to commute. Doesn’t anybody realize that that means that they have to take the bus! They can’t afford taxis!
And by the way, it doesn’t matter what R Elyashiv holds, there are enough Rabbanim who say to do it that we have al mi lismoch.
The only thing is that we got our apartment from somebody who had to leave because they couldn’t afford the higher prices and if there would have been a vaad then we wouldn’t have been able to come. The only other apartments were in Neve Yaacov and THAT’S not an option. But now that we have an apartment I really want the price to stay like it is, or maybe get it lower.
By the way, it’s nice to see that for the vast majority of renters are behind this. Getting together to save money. I mean any renter not behind this is an idiot! What? He doesn’t want to save money!!!
Lomdus- there is a difference between working pp and kollel yungerleit! Yes ! We take into account different options that will allow avreichim to learn better! Better they should not have to travel than line some investors pocket.
MirBoy- as far as furniture is concerned you are %100 right. $20,000 is ridiculous.I believe I have a right to be commenting as at least I am in the country! BTW maybe those that are living for free in grandparents apartments and don’t have bills to worry about- should keep out of the discussion!
TEK #62- “there is a difference between working pp and kollel yungerleit! Yes ! We take into account different options that will allow avreichim to learn better! Better they should not have to travel than line some investors pocket”
Maybe we should all cheat on our taxes and lie about our incomes to scam our ways onto medicare.
After all, kollel yungeleit need “better options” to ensure they can learn. Why should we be concerned about anyone else but ourselves?