The Jerusalem Post is reporting that an indictment will be served against Justice Ministry official Amnon de Hartuch for slapping United Torah Judaism MK Yackov Cohen in the face during a Knesset Finance Committee debate in July – as reported HERE on YW.
MK had told reporters that he was assaulted by Justice Ministry official Amnon De Hartuch following “a heated argument over the Torah’s values.”
Even my father never hit me this way,” Cohen had said. “He gave me a slap like I’ve never received before. My world went dark. I call on the justice minister to dismiss him.”
According to eye witness accounts, Cohen told De Hartuch, “You’re destroying the Torah world”. De Hartuch responded by saying, “You are a beast, shut your mouth”.
Cohen then said, “You’re worse than the Germans; they wanted to destroy the body and you want to destroy the soul”. De Hartuch said to him, “If you don’t shut up I’ll slap you”. Cohen replied, “I’m waiting”.
At this point De Hartuch slapped Cohen, the witness said. A Knesset guard who witnessed the exchange immediately apprehended De Hartuch and took him to a nearby room.
De Hartuch was then detained for questioning by the police.
Join the official YWN WhatsApp status
36 Responses
i hope they get that rasha good but unfortunately i beleive that in the communist state of israel he’ll get let off the hook
. such chutzpa of him to slap Harav Cohen Shlita
Engaging in violence is nothing new amongst zionists.
Ot Azoi! Let’s pray that the police will follow what the Torah says, Tzedek Tzedek Tirdof.
Why did Cohen have to be so provocative? You can’t put yourself in danger and then expect to have a ness save you.
not to say that the rasha was right. but i don’t understand Rabbi Cohen.Rabbi Cohen said “i’m waiting” (for the slap) , and he got it, so what is he complaining about?
what ever happened to:
ma hu rachum af ata…
dont forget – de Hartuch is also a FRUM guy – with a family
The reality is that as usual the confrontation escalated and got way out of hand. instead of a trial – lets find a mechanism for de Hartuch to do “tshuvah” and obtain “Kaparah”
fanatical behaviour and words from both sides caused this incident
If I had been in de Hartuch’s shoes, I too would have been tempted to slap Cohen. De Hartuch has been doing a great job of enforcing the rules and making sure that taxpayers’ money is distributed properly. (I’m sure no one here needs reminding of the halochos regarding community funds.) In response, Cohen was disgustingly offensive.
The fact that de Hartuch is a frum Jew doesn’t have anything to do with it. Nor does the fact that Cohen wears a black hat.
torahis1, while true we all suffer from this affliction (violence), amongst the zionist it has been the standard modus operandi from the time they formed as a political entity.
Jos’,
How would you describe the Hafgonos in Yerusholayim with bottles and glass being thrown , pushing and shoving, putting other people in harms way??
Last I checked, it was the Frum who were engaging in violence…
That pic of Cohen on this blog represents a man who is ‘farbittered’. Negative comments with regard to him dont surprise me in this case!
#4, the hate here is emanating from the likes of violence-prone zionists such as de Hartuch.
zionflag, A slap on the wrist for violently slugging another Jew is woefully insufficient for this madman (who aside from this incident, is a known self-hating anti-Torah bigot.)
In Israel, hitting a rav is not a crime. When someone spilled hot tea on Yael Dayan he got three years, but when that nutcase Meir Baranes brutally bashed up R Bistritzky AH (the first time) he got a 3-month suspended sentence and a 1000-shekel fine. And when six months later he tried to murder the rav, he was allowed to plead insanity and was sent to live in a loony bin, from which he gets regular vacations!!!
#7. De Hartuch is Frum?!?!? he has an agenda and a history that is so anti frum and anti Torah, that makes that impossible to believe!
Chazal tell us that the Amei Ha’aretz hate the talmidei chachomim more than the goyim hate the yidden.
Joseph,
As a Zionist (in that I believe that it is a good thing that Jewish people have a state – however imperfect – in Eretz Yisrael), let me clearly state that you are motzi shem ra against me and many other Jews (including those who are moser nefesh by serving in the IDF to protect their fellow Jews from danger).
Let me be perfectly clear: I am not mochel you for the motzi shem ra.
dd, I don not ask for, nor do I need, your mechila any more than the Brisker Rov and the Satmar Rebbe do.
I wish a refuah shelemo for your misguided philosophies.
torah-his, it is you who constantly spew your hateful anti-Torah bigotry against others on YW, including your sly attacks against YW Editor himself — who to his great credit actually tolerates you and allows some of your (less Torah bashing) messages to actually be posted on these boards.
You ought to thank YW Editor, rather than make your underhanded attacks.
it would be a big kidush hashem for MP to be mochel.
Rabbi Cohen’s statement that “You’re worse than the Germans” is the old Nazi accusation, only slightly tempered by not using the word Nazi. It is well established that this accusation marks the end of any possibility of reasonable discussion. Given the emotional baggage which goes with it, it makes one wonder what Rabbi Cohen hoped to accomplish.
Is nobody aware of the consequences of using the “N” word? Not just its target, but anyone who hears it, thinks only the worst of the user.
Had any one referred to me as a Nazi or German I would probably that a swing at them as well argue but argue fair!
EXCUSE YOU ALL, Amnon de Hartuch IS ONE OF THE BIGGEST SONEI FRUMME YIDDEN IN E”y I’m not Making Cohen any Tzaddik but this guy is non-stop in making problems for the charaidishe oilum. also those concerned about the Goverments money it all comes from our dear uncle Sam. and for the record whoever is a bigger ganev wins so why shouldnt the frumme get the $$
Machlokes between Yidden can never result in any good – as borne out by this argument between two members of the Israeli government.
But civilized debate has much merit.
That said, I just hope that those who defend Zionism are not defending leaders of the Jewish State who do not strictly adhere to the Torah and Hashem’s laws.
We must learn from what the Torah says: We can appoint a Melech over Klall Yisroel, but the Melech must always carry with him a Sefer Torah wherever he goes. This is to constantly remind him that there is no such thing as democracy or self leadership by Yidden. Yiddishkeit is a dictatorship, and Hashem is our dictator, and a Melech is just a pupet of Hashem.
When we go to war, it must be with a Sefer Torah; when we make decisions regarding anything that may have a Halachik implication, it must be with a Sefer Torah; when and how we put on and tie our shoes, must be done with a Sefer Torah.
Any Israeli leader that leads without clinging to a Sefer Torah is simply deluding himself and his constituents. It simply can’t be done.
Leading Klall Yisroel can only succeed when holding tight to a Sefer Torah.
I believe that is the main argument and discontent with the Zionist government. Time and again, since the very inception of the State, they have displayed disdain – and at times real hate – towards anyone, anything and everything that remotely has to do with Torah-true Yiddishkeit.
This is not just trying to lead without a Sefer Torah, it is trying to lead while burning a Sefer Torah!! It can never succeed, and must be shunned by anyone who holds true to Torah-true Judiaism – and by anyone I refer to all stripes of Yidden.
DD: I don’t believe Joseph was referring to you when he mentioned how Zionists have been violent since they became a political entity, so no need to take offense nor go on about not being mochel him.
People who like to come on here and remind their fellow Jews that Zionism is terrible, use the term Zionism to refer to its ideology and its perpetrators, not to those who have been mislead into believing that Israel is wonderful or those who serve in the IDF to protect the Jews that live in the holy land.
Like it or not, Zionists use violence to a greater degree than the (rest of the) civilized world. Who forcibly expelled their own people from Gaza? Zionists. Who brutalized their own people at Amona (and elsewhere)? Zionists.
This is recent history, to say nothing of the rather bloody 50+ years before. Joseph is correct, and I’m sure he meant no offense to you, personally, despite that.
ttoe,
You say “whoever is a bigger ganev wins so why shouldnt the frumme get the $$”.
Pardon me? Are you saying that we should do whatever it takes to win? The Torah says lo tignavu, and doesn’t make exceptions if someone else is a ganev.
Your views are a truly despicable distortion of what being frum means.
torahis, Ever heard the expression those who live in glass houses should not throw stones? Well, the stones you are throwing are best if self-directed. You are a known quantity on the YW threads for your denigration of those who hold unbending Torah values, and your belligerence towards Torah scholars and their edicts.
DD,
The Brisker Rov minced no words in his assailing zionism and the zionists. The words used here against the zionists are charming compared to what the Rov ZT’L said about them.
Brisker, gut gezugt.
torahhis1, You have no concept of what you are saying (which isn’t new.) I am relating these Gedolim’s opinions on this matter. And I am doing it mildly, where they have done it forcefully.
A few Brisker quotes from Maran Hagoen HaRav Chaim Soloveichik of Brisk ZT’L:
“The Zionists do not make Jews heretics in order to have a state, they want a state in order to make Jews into heretics!”
“The Jewish people have suffered many (spiritual) plagues — the Sadducees, Karaites, Hellenisers, Shabbatai Zvi, Enlightenment, Reform and many others. But the strongest of them all is Zionism.”
Why are some people stuck in a time warp and still fighting a 100 year old battle that ended long ago. Israel today is filled with so much Torah, and more and more of the Torah derech is being adopted each passing day as the secular population dwindles and the frum population grows. Sure there is plenty of work left to do and many many problems but isn’t it clear by now that Israel is a fact? And isn’t it the best thing for the Jewish people to bring more Torah and Kedushah to Israel?
torahhis, You find all parts of the Tora you disagree with ”funny.”
It is your ad hominem attacks that you engage in when your argument fails on the merits that gets you nowhere with anyone.
In fact I do not speak for these Tzadikim (the Brisker, Satmar, etc.); I merely mimic what they have implored.
Don’t ya just love “quotes” taken out of context?
is1-
“Your beligerance and hostility to other Yidden has diminished your credibility completely.”
My dear sir, my sentiments exactly. Except I feel them for your posts, that is. Your hostility toward frum yidden, the concept of da’as Torah, and the yeshivishe velt is truly off-putting, considering the site you are visiting.
“I’m really getting tired of hearing the same tired old line from you people”
I do wonder why you visit and post here so often- there are so many other sites that are more in line with your philosophies. Throughout many threads, you have made your hostility toward the yeshiva world and its allegiance to da’as Torah quite clear. Why troll here, if you feel such vehement disagreement with this site and its administration?
“It’s actually funny at this point. If I were to say it’s light outside and you were to say its dark, you would call me anti-Torah. BLAH BLAH BLAH, It’s falling on deaf ears my dear fellow posters.”
This is playground talk. Additionally, it appears that your ears were “deaf” to the yeshiva world from the onset of your visits here.
Please try to interact respectfully with your fellow bloggers, and offer your opinions with appropriate derech eretz.
torahhis, I challange you to point to even one post where I called for violence. It is just more or your rabble-rousing trash you use when you fail to rebut an argument, after you engage in ad hominem comments.
Do you judge the Brisker Rov ZT’L’s comments above (quoted by Brisker) to be ”Bderech Nachas”, or do you judge him like the rest of us here at YW to be spewing?
The bottom line is you defend the indefensible, based upon Torah law, and when someone else here at YW does point out the wrongdoings of say the zionists — backed up by documented Daas Torah — you lose what little sanity you posses and start calling entire frum communities names — something you are a documented repeat offender here on YW.
On every blog all comments are “DAAS MACHASHAV”, for those lacking in lashon hakodesh it means, “Computer Knowledge”, not to be confused with Daas Turah.
In case you still think there is something wrong to criticize zionists in the most harshest terms.
From Maran Hagoen HaRav Avigdor Miller ZT’L in Awake my Glory (Chapter: The Leaders of Israel):
754. The Zionst leaders together with the Reform “rabbis” aided substantially in the destruction of the European Jews.
In July 1938 President Roosevelt convened the Evian Conference to consider the problem of Jewish refugees. At that time a German offer was made to release Jews at $250 per person. The Jewish Agency, headed by Golda Meir, decided to ignore the offer.
At this conference, the delegation from the Jewish Agency made no effort to influence the United States or any of the 32 other participating nations to open their gates to admit German Jews.
755. When a shipload of Jewish refugees on the Danube river were refused permission to disembark anywhere, Henry Montor the leader of the United Jewish Appeal explained that they could not be allowed to sail the Holy Land because “Palestine cannot be flooded with old people or with undesirables”. (Feb. 1, 1940).
756. On Nov. 25, 1940 the Haganah commanders ordered the blowing up of the ship Patria in Haifa Harbor as a protest against England’s plan to send refugees to Mauritius instead of to Palestine, and thus 272 Jewish refugees perished.
767. Because the Jewish populace of Eastern Europe, like those elsewhere, had ceased to regard the Gedolei-Torah as their leaders and spokesmen (740), and they had given prestige and power to atheists and enemies of the Torah, now in their hour of bitter need they were given a taste of the bitterness of non-Torah leadership. At the famed Kastner trial it was revealed that the Zionist leaders in Hungary, in cooperation with the world Zionist leaders, had betrayed the Jewish masses and had prevented them from taking steps to save themselves by flight over the nearby border. At the same trial it was also revealed that Joel Brand, the emissary who went to meet the Zionist leaders, in Turkey and Palestine, to plead for a relatively small ransom fund to save many Jews from annihilation was deceived by the chief Zionist leaders and was maneuvered by their trickery into a British prison, where he languished in despair until all those that had sent him were wiped out.
768. Rabbi Weismandl sent urgent and impassioned appeals for small funds to stave off the deportation of thousands. The assimilationists and Zionists of Switzerland and other neutral countries and of the rich countries and of the rich communities overseas refused his request. The Reform “rabbis” and the disloyal, to whom the public Jewish funds were entrusted, scorned the messages which Rabbi Weissmandl smuggled out at the risk of his life, and they allowed the masses of Slovakian and Hungarian Jews to be transported to the German killing-centers.
769. It was because European Jews put their trust in atheistic Zionist leaders that these leaders everywhere became the lackeys of the Nazis in all the Ghettos. They were the machinery, which served efficiently in the task of keeping the Jews docile and of persuading and coercing them to be sent off to their deaths. No Torah leader ever cooperated with the Nazis in the destruction machinery.
I don’t see you “winning” (if thats your stated goal.) Most people here obviously disagree with you. And many great Jewish leaders have been directly quoted here painting with a “broad brush” (as you put it) the zionists.
torahis1, I notice you copy the terminology of your idealogical opponents — i.e. belligerence, ad hominem…
I’m glad you are learning a thing or two from Ed, Joseph, etc.
In any event, their criticism of zionists, by referring to “zionists” without qualification, has been the same terminology used by the many Gedolim critical of the zionists. So you are off the mark in saying they are broad brushing, demonization and hostility — as the Gedolim used the same language regarding the zionists.