Rabbonim attending a motzei Shabbos kenos against drafting chareidim are less than pleased with the fact that Yahadut Hatorah is entering into coalition talks which may result in a compromise solution pertaining to the drafting of bnei Torah. Walla News quotes kenos organizers as saying that they feel it is incorrect for Yahadut Hatorah to release messages of compromise, a willingness to accept one formula for drafting bnei Torah or another. The reject the very sitting in a room and indicating a solution may be reached, rejecting the concept of drafting any chareidim into the IDF.
The daily HaPeles newspaper affiliated with the Yerushalmi faction of Degel Hatorah reported that participants in the kenos reject any discussion of any compromise, seemingly innocent as it may be. The representative of the Sephardi bnei Torah, Rav Yaakov Ben-Naim sent a message to Shas MKs, calling upon them not to participate in talks surrounding a chareidi compromise on the draft issue. “We state that one may not sit with the other side to discuss this. It is like playing with fire” Rav Ben-Naim is quoted as saying.
HaRav Baruch Shmuel HaKohen Deutsch of Yeshivas Kol Torah attended the kenos, warning “Needless to say no one sitting here feels they just want to draft bnei Torah. They want to secularize Klall Yisrael G-d forbid, beginning with the bnei Torah. The matter demands mesirus nefesh.”
The words of HaGaon HaRav Shmuel Auerbach Shlita who remains uncompromising on the issue were heard at the kenos too. The rav is quoted as saying “we must do what we can without wavering and without discussions. There must not be negotiating. This is a basic tenet of Yiddishkheit and we must take it to the end.”
The participants reached a decision, that they cannot support any change in the issue of drafting bnei Torah. The kenos called on elected chareidi leaders to leave the negotiating table and protest instead, demanding a new law that will protect those involved in the continued study of Torah.
(YWN – Israel Desk, Jerusalem)
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9 Responses
rejecting the concept of drafting any chareidim into the IDF.
Learning, not learning, working, job training…..is the answer NO CHAREDIM IN THE IDF…
i love it when they say the following
The rav is quoted as saying
in my simple english this means we are not sure what he said.
We hear in Har Nof that our Bostoner Rebbe Shlita has been invited to join the organizers of this kenes as he has great influence on MK Meir Porush.
1. Note that they are not demanding government funding for people learning full time, only that they be left alone.
2. Note that at least some of those mentioned above are from groups that have always recognized the Medinah, at least to the extent of accepting money from the government and participating in their elections. These are not the Satmar, Eidas hareidus or Neturei Karta. This is critical since if resistance to conscription is more than a handful of hard core anti-zionists it will be a curiousity – but if it includes a broader range of Bnei Torah then the resistance poses a serious threat to the medinah. They can arrest a few protestors – mass arrests would raise too many questions internationally.
3. The most logical solution would be to allow anyone to assert a religious objection to military service, and to basically switch Israel to a volunteer (i.e. professional) army. That would also allow Hareidi baal ha-battim to enter the economy without having to deal with the army. If the army seriously wanted Hareidi recruits, they would have to offer religious accomodations and good pay – and would probably get many. However a major goal of the Lapid plan is to stop the rapid growth of the hareidi community, and for that they need a universal draft with no exemptions, based on either learning full time, or gender.
akuperma, you miss the point! Your posts always talk about a professional army. There is more than just militery service. The VAT is a whopping %17 percent. Do you know what it’s like? Never mind importing anything will incur moss. The issue goes beyond the draft. Please consider the following:
1. Child subsidies, for which the Haradi public gets lots of.
2. Arnona discount, do you own your home and pay property tax? Now imagine that the guy next to you pays a small percentage cause he’s a Haradi learning Torah. So you Mr. Tax payer are flipping the bill for your next door neighbor.
3. Preferential housing and subsidies. As the price of property in Israel zooms through the roof. Mr. Haradi gets a discount on his new Dira. Meanwhile Yosi Israel has to pay full price. Or, if he’s lucky, he may also get a discount. But remember, that %50 of discount housing goes to the Haradi public. But, the represent %10 of the public. It’s excellent PR for the Haradi public.
4. Yeshiva Stipends per student. The Yeshiva gets NIS ~500 per boy per month. That’s about USD $130 a month. Multiply that by 100 boys and that’s a cool $13K per month or a little over $150K annually.
There is more than just “conscription” at stake here.
if they dont serve they cant take benefits/ we cant afford it anymore. The cjaredim won. The Israelis thought they would disappear. Now that we won, we must take responsibility and play by the rules.
Jerry:
1. If they don’t get their way on getting patronage, the Hareidi parties will not support whatever the government wants on other issues (economic policy, welfare, settlements, whatever). The money is horse trading. Every groups negotiates for “its share”. That’s how a parliamentary system works. Remember, some hareidim don’t accept yeshiva subsidies, and at most get the same sorts of benefits given to anyone living in Israel regardless of ethnicity or religion. This is an economic issue and no more. No one will lose sleep over it. As long as hareidim are treated the same as other Israelis who refuse to serve in the army, no existential problem.
2. If the hareidi parties don’t get what they want on conscription, that is to say exemptions for anyone who refuses to go, and instead you have the government raiding yeshiovs and seminaries to arrest people for draft resistance – the establishment hareidi parties will be either discredited or forced to return to decisions made earlier in the 20th century to support the zionists and their war. The “deal” in the mid-20th century is that the Hareidim wouldn’t object to the zionists going to war, and in return the zionists would let them live as they understand halacha. Mass arrest of yeshiva students and seminary students, and you’ll get hareidim back to negotiating with the Arabs (cf De Haan)- and that will doom the medinah since a clearly Jewish alternative to the continuation of the war will undermine Israel’s international position.
Number 5. $130 per month for Yeshiva bochurim. How much come from outside of Eretz Yisrael for this. Seminaries are $7000 to $10,000 a year which by the way pay staff who pay VAT on everything the buy. Now they want fullvat on fruits and vegetables also. Seminary and bochurim spending money which is usally around $50 to $75 a week. Food, restaurants,telephone,cleaning, travel, etc etc. Plus plus parent coming and spending in hotels, restaurants, car rental,tours, gifts to take back home, many buy apartments and the list goes on. Number 5 I believe the Yeshivas and Sems earn their money
First of all, Seminaries are costing close to 20K presently.
“The “deal” in the mid-20th century is that the Hareidim wouldn’t object to the zionists going to war, and in return the zionists would let them live as they understand halacha” – What is this a Spielberg fantasy or just kuperma “facts on the ground”?