25 Responses

1. Interesting to note. Rav kanievsky did not sign. Is there a reason the shakers did not go to him?

2. A nice proclamation to increase torah learning, hasmada (IOW – out of the street & into the walls of the Yeshiva), pure life, & to decrease Chillul Hashem.

   Frankly when there’s a proclamation against internet… the info is stated clearly, NO smartphones, NO laptops & computers except for business, etc.
   This statement is vague, generic & almost parave. No mention of protests, violence, blocking roads, inconveniences to innocent people & attacks against security forces.
   Oh well!!!

3. Helpful, but short of an unqualified repudiation of what has been happening and those who have encouraged this ongoing chilul hashem

4. So, where does this talk about the Peleg protests?

5. The most important name is missing. I didn’t see Rav Aurbach’s name on the list.

6. Interesting to note. Rav kanievsky did not sign. Is there a reason the assskanim did not go to him for his signature?

7. R” Chaim probably was not asked to sign as he is not a rosh yeshiva. Interestingly, the more clearly stated condemnation here is for insulting talmidei chachamim who disagree with the Etznikim, although if you read between the lines you can see they are telling the bochurim to go back to the beis midrash and not participate in these protests.

8. zionflag. Nonsense. Pashkevilin signed by roshei yeshiva are always exactly this explicit, whether about technology or . Everyone knows exactly what’s being said, unless they wish to be purposefully obtuse.

9. Very nice letter of chizuk.

   But how does this letter address the protest issue? (Answer: it doesn’t)

10. Ash
    “exactly what’s being said” – is WHAT???

11. Reading is a skill that apparently not everyone possesses. The first nine lines, and the last four lines, all say to stop monkeying around, stop making a chillul Hashem, get back in the bais medrash and elevate the world of Torah and a Ruach tahara with Limmud Hatorah. All in very clear words.

    Then there is a third of a sentence near the end of the first long paragraph that talks about a recent escalation that involved bizui talmidei chachamim. If anything was written b’derech remiza, that was it.

    For Gedolei Yisroel who live with the ultimate ideal of anticipation for the day of Umal’ah haaretz de’a es Hashem, using a language that says שעוזבים מקור מים חיים, וגורמים לחילול שם שמים בפרהסיא בהשפלת כבוד לומדי התורה וחכמיה is about as strong as it gets. They are saying these people are being pogem in the entire tachlis of our existence on this world.

12. I respectfully disagree with anyone who says this is giving explicit condemnation of peleg protests. at this point we shouldn’t have to read between the lines just from the comments here you can see it can get taken in very different manors. we are not talking about uneducated people here. the Rabannim here know exactly what they are writing and saying and there’s a reason they have not said anything straight out against peleg….what that reason is nobody here can know unless you ask them directly……maybe they are saying stop making comments on ywn

13. Realisticguy:

    I propose a simple answer. Too many rabbonim and roshei yeshiva are obsessed with the pressure to control the oilem by dictating what not to do. There are so many gezairos on everyone today, don’t wear this, don’t go here, don’t eat this, don’t do this or that, etc. We have yet to see Gedolei Yisroel emerge from these obsessions in the chinuch system, or yeshuos gedolos emanate from these bans and issurim. The roshei yeshivos that signed this Kol Koreh are painfully aware that proclaiming an issur on the mayhem and public disgrace won’t work. It might even backfire and embolden the forces of violence, claiming that these “goons” don’t understand what is happening. They brilliantly framed their message as the need to sit and learn and bring chizuk to Limud Hatorah. If these protests are about sitting down to learn, why don’t they indicate that this is their true desire? The Kol Koreh accomplishes this.

14. Realistic guy – I’m with you!!!

15. One assumes the Peleg hoodlums (aka talmidim of R’ Aurbach) have the maturity and sophistication to “read between the lines” or understand the nuances of this kol koreh. Instead, it reads more like a musar shmooz about the primacy of limud torah, avoiding bizui talmidei chachamim (presumably in relation to criticism of R Aurbach although never mentioned by name) etc.

    If anyone believes this will have any material effect on the demonstrations, I’d like to talk to you about a bridge I have for sale at a very attractive price

16. You know, Katanhadorah, it says a lot about you that you use the phrase “Musar shmooze” as something negative.

17. It clearly did have an effect, considering that the protests stopped the same day that this letter was printed.

18. Reading some of the comments were horrendous
    It’s one thing to write disrespectfully about the peleg guys and another to have the chutzpah to write against the gedolim…
    who exactly feels they have the right to ask where is Rav Chaim Kanievsky’s signature??? We’re not talking about you’re local orthodox Rabbi….

    Watch out friends you’re playing with fire!!!

    Btw most of us reading info (and commenting as if we get it all)on YWN don’t understand the nuances of paskevilen and from the comments don’t understand the general culture…

19. To Doom777

    right and wrong….the phrase normally contemplates an uplifting message as to how bnai torah should engage in appropriate and moral behavior….however the kol koreh here doesn’t really address, much less condemn, the underlying behavior of the Peleg hooligans and probably will do little to disuade them from continuing to impose much pain and suffereing on the klal. In that context, your right….its a negative in the sense that its lofty wording and degree of abstaction may not do much to assure and end to these disruptions.

20. It is pretty clear what the letter is saying. The reason why it is so vague is probably because deep down they don’t want to take everything off the table. Under the current circumstances public protests etc. are wrong. If CH”V there comes a time that the Yeshiva Bochrim are being taken by force to the army or military prisons I would see acts of violence towards the Israeli government (but not civilians) as self defense. Some of those who signed the kol koreh probably feel the same way so they don’t want to unequivocally rule it out.

21. It is very clear that the askonim had to write a letter that the roshei yeshivos would agree to sign and they would not agree to sign a letter against protests (protests were always used and no one ever came out against protests that were done with the guidance of gedolei torah) but this letter could have been signed by Rav Auerbach too because he to definately does not approve of violence at protests the gedolim mean what they say and say what they mean they may be a little vague but to talk about the protests and not mention one word about them?

22. We can debate endlessly whether or not the signatories here had in mind the current protests. To me it appears they are speaking more to those individual members of the public who had the chutzpa to interrupt (or worse) Roshei Yeshivos that disagreed with their own R”Y on some contentious issues.

    Nevertheless, even if the signatories here are referring to the protests and asking them to cease protesting, we have to remember that the protesters have their own Roshei Yeshivos who support and encourage the protests to continue. Therefore what you are left with is a machlokes rabbonim. And each individual will need to follow their own Rosh Yeshiva. If your R”Y is a signatory and opposes the protests, don’t protest. If your R”Y is not a signatory above and believes the protests are helpful for Klal Yisroel in our fight against the atheist government of Israel that wants to forcibly drag us out of our butei medrashim (as fact that both sides to this machlokes – including those who believe the protests are counter-productive – agree is the ultimate goal of the government), the follow your R”Y’s instructions and go out and protest.

23. A more accurate translation:

    We hereby affectionately address the tens of thousands of those who toil in the Torah, who diligently learn in the study halls of the holy Yeshivos and the Kollelim, to reiterate the obvious matters concerning our traditions of the way of the Torah – that it is the obligation of all G-d-fearing Bnei Torah to strengthen the precious value of the Holy Torah, and to strengthen the diligent learning in the Torah study halls with pure and eternal fear of Heaven, and to take every precaution against being in any way dragged after actions which are not in keeping with the ways of the Torah, which forsake the fountain of life and which cause a public desecration of the name of Heaven and a debasement of the honor of those who learn Torah and its Sages, and which have increasingly in recent days caused disruption to those who dessiminate the Torah, and a disparagement to its great leaders, and it is our duty to have mercy upon and to pray for those who have erred that they repent their ways.
    And we hope that through our increase in the strengthening of Torah learning and the strengthening of learning books of mussar, a spirit of purity will be aroused over everyone, and the promise of “the world will be filled with knowledge of Hashem” will be fulfilled.

24. NU? so after this was issued, the protests continued. Now what?

25. these are some of the greatest gedolim we have however when i lived in eretz yisroel before this terrible machlokes began i dont think any of the signatures was considered in the same league as rav aurbach r dovid soloveitchik or rav moshe sternbach all of who support the bnei torah stand on giyus in the many kol koreis that came out in those days these people didnt sign yet not to chas v’shalom belittle them they are now gedolei hador who we millions of times greater then us however as you can see from all the kol koreis that were put out over a decade ago they are all from a differant generation then r shmuel Aurbach. the head of present head of chinuch atzmai (an organization which doesnt go along with r shmuel Aurbach) rav leizerson testifies publicly (anyone can ask him) that rav shlomo zalman aurbach told him “in this generation (that was many many years ago when the greatest gedolim of the previous generation were still alive and r shmuel aurbach was still young) the amount of people who know the entirety of talmud bavli and yerushalmi in depth till the halchic outcomes of all the sugyos can be counted on one hand however i only know two such people: Rav Elyashiv and my son Rav Shmuel. also if you look through the thousands of letters rav shach wrote there is only one gadol he refers to as “sar hatorah” and that is r shmuel (in his letter to r moshe reichman) i dont trust people stuck in a machlokes ppl are so biased but i trust what was always excepted before the machlokes began. i heard as well from R Yitzchak Kolodetzki (R chaim Kenievsky’s son in law – he’s alive and well and visits america often so this can be verified – that his father-in-law Rav chaim never meant to say anything against r shmuel or his close talmidim who mfollow him he only spoke against ppl who are only trying to fight against rav shteinman. in short dont trust what ppl unless it can be verified