Following the split chareidi vote on the bill in Knesset to save the Ulpana neighborhood homes in Beit El, Rav Yisrael Gellis on Wednesday, 16 Sivan 5772 told the following story.
Rav Gellis explained the story took place in the time of HaGaon HaRav Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld ZT”L and he felt that from this event one may extrapolate what should have been done concerning the Ulpana homes.
There was a property in Meah Shearim that belonged to sheikh, a resident of Kfar Lifta located in the Jerusalem corridor. One day, a member of the old yishuv decided to purchase that property for a number of families. 100 people became involved in the effort to make the purchase of 170 dunams (42.5 acres) to construct homes for 100 families.
It was realized that the actual property was too small to accommodate the new area that was to be constructed for the families, so each night, a number of people went out and moved the border markers a bit to enlarge the property on the south and west sides.
The sheikh was not present in the area and he did not measure the property. Apparently he did not become aware of the nighttime activities, which in actuality resulted in the borders being moved into an adjoining plot of land.
One of the old yishuv residents was not comfortable with what was taking place and decided to approach R’ Sonnenfeld to ask if the gezeila of the property is permitted.
The Sonnenfeld responded that it was not gezeila, but “pediya” (redeeming). “We are not stealing land but rather redeeming land. We are paying the Arab because this is the galus and there is no alternative but in essence, it is not his land”. Therefore, the actions are permitted and that area has become known as Meah Shearim.
(YWN – Israel Desk, Jerusalem)
Join the official YWN WhatsApp status
10 Responses
B’mechila, can Rabbbi Gellis bring evidence or witnesses that indeed HaGaon HaRav Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld ZT”L poskinned this way in the story described above? Otherwise, I am very mesupak.
This story about R’ Sonnenfeld has the the markings of so many other similar stories indicating that the story is either false or missing some vital piece(s).
This type of action would violate so many details of gezel and dealing with non-Jews as well as presumed excessive stupidity on the part of sheikh. Moving the markers a few inches might not be noticed, but moving them so much that it would make such a large difference and not being noticed by either the seller or local governing official seems absurd.
Um…. Is this supposed to imply that R’ Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld zt”l who was the founder of the Eidah HaChareidis as well as Neturei Karta (though the latter was very than the N”K of today) would support that MK’s vote in the knesset to support the religous zionist enterprise. That’s quite a laughable proposition.
Therefore the CHAREDIM are now going to validate and increase “Yishuv Eretz Yisroel” with a passion..(LOL)
This is a known shitah of Rav Sonnenfeld who completed a kinyan on a property in Meah Shearim on Shabbos (with a minor), and that is why Rav Yosef Chaim came on aliyah to Eretz Yisroel against the advice of his Rabbonim and Family members.
zionflag, watch out. You are playing with fire. What you said is nothing less than motzeh shem rah on Rav Sonnenfeld.
Rav Shach was vehmently against settlements. Degel Hatorah was founded by Rav Shach. What a disgrace to his legacy. This article is a chilul hashem and it is doubtful that rav yosef chaim sonenfeld who worked hard to build relationships with his Arab neighbors would ever have said such a thing.
#2, this is not גזל הגוי, which is forbidden; it’s עושק, which is permitted so long as it won’t cause a chilul haShem. The Torah says לא תעשוק את רעך and לא תסיג גבול רעך. The Arab is not רעך. And it is a clear din in Shulchon Oruch that the prohibition on אמירה לנכרי is suspended in order to buy property in EY; this was no chidush of RYCS.
Everyone doubts this story could be true??
I know, thats no shock, the average frum head is full of oil made tamei by the greeks.
The Gemara Ive read says one can sign a document to purchase a house from a goy in Erets Yisrael, on Shabbat!
Not giving the arabs an inch, or any other goy isa halachic requiremtn, that is heavily represented in the works of halacha.
Do you think it is otherwise? One is absolutely forbidden to rent to goyim, or to sell to them, any tiny little piece of Erets Yisrael.
So while you are doing backflips to serve the god of kashrus, say by eating only yoshon, keep dissing efforts to take The Land back, and hold on to what we have. These are clear obligations.
Sorry guys- you all have it wrong, the story is probably true but that isnt the issue. The issue is what did Gafni ask Rav Shteinman. Rabonnim give Piskei Halocha according to what they are asked – Gafni asked what suited him to ask!!!
The Gemara Ive read says one can sign a document to purchase a house from a goy in Erets Yisrael, on Shabbat!
To sign a document?! Chas vesholom. It’s an issur de’oraisa, an Av Melacha; no Gemara can permit it. What is permitted is to have a goy sign it; the same rabbonon who forbade amiro lenochri permitted it in this case.