Dear Editor, as an avid reader (and subscriber) to your wonderful website, I was hoping you would share my plight with the rest of the oilem in hopes that no one has to go through what I went through this summer.
Baruch hashem it was not life threatening, nothing illness related, or something of that nature.
I grew up my whole life spending summers with my family in bungalow colonies. As the years went by my parents (and my in-laws) moved up the food chain and bought summer homes in the mountains. I, and my siblings all spent our first few summers there after we all got married. Once our children got older or our families grew, my siblings all continued the chain and rented their own bungalows with their friends.
This year was my year to make the jump. Together with a small Chevra of my friends, we searched the mountains all winter to find our own colony to rent.
As we narrowed our search down, there was one place that had room for our entire Chevra; in this place we all had the option of renting 1, 2, or even 3 bedroom bungalows at rock bottom prices in the heart of the mountains.
You’re all reading and either saying impossible, or what’s the catch? The owner seemed like a very Ehrlich, Yeshivish, and trustworthy Ben torah. We all did our homework, and although we did hear not such great things (it was litoyeles) we decided what the worst case scenario is, we have to fix our own leaky sinks, and fix our own screen doors? We will deal with it.
Boy were we in for a surprise…… but we were not going to find out yet.
When we all met with this owner to sign our contracts and give him our postdated checks, two of us decided with the owner that if they pay up front before May, he will finish two brand new four bedroom units. Obviously the idea of paying upfront in February was a little taxing, but to have a brand new four bedroom unit? The owner said the reason why he wants their money upfront is he needs the money to finish these units.
Being the good friends that we are (or were) we all added in to our contracts that if these bungalows or if any of the other units we rent are not ready at the beginning of the summer, we would all get our money back. We even got the owner to sign this! All you legal eagles can debate if this is legitimate or not, and what chance we have in a court of law. Well, this was not the point. We only wanted the owner to see how serious we were as a group to move in, and to not mess anyone over (especially those two families in the four bedroom new units).
As it got closer to summer, we first realized we were dealing with a crook when he cashed all our checks two weeks early (again you legal eagles, feast away). Apparently, it was through a Gmach so that makes it legit, right? We didn’t make a big deal being it was so close to the summer. Regarding the new units, he used to give us such believable info like “the kitchen is coming in two days”, “the sheet-rock is already there”, “I might even put in a Jacuzzi” and etc. again, we bought his garbage.
Today I write this letter, after I packed up my family to move back to the city. My two friends never moved in this summer. They feel that besides the owner burning them, their friends did nothing to help. The kitchen is still sitting on the floor waiting to be installed etc. etc. Basically, my friends paid over seven thousand dollars each this summer for a bungalow that was never finished.
The first question you might ask is why didn’t we all pack up and move out like our contract stipulated? Well, we all saw that the bungalow was up, and all it needed was another few days of work until it is finished. So my friends move in a week late, worst case scenario two weeks? Besides when we hounded the owner (who has a new cell number every week) he assured us a few more days. Besides we all walked into it to examine ourselves, and saw with our own eyes exactly what had to be done.
My friends got back the first weeks rent the first week so we thought this owner means business.
Boy were we wrong.
The reason why I write this letter is to raise awareness with the entire oilem who goes upstate to be wary of owners who have a reputation. There is no reason why while I am in the city and the electric gets shut off because the owner did not pay his bills in months that I have to lay out thousands of dollars – being the owner was never there – and my wife (and others) are screaming on top of their lungs in the dark (oh and the check he gave me to reimburse me, bounced).
Or, after smelling a gas leak, to hear from the gas company that they will not come down to our colony unless the outstanding payments are paid (thank g-d for 911).
These are just a few stories. If you think my Chevra had it bad you should hear the stories from the other side of the colony like having a bungalow and when anyone flushes it all comes up under the porch- for three weeks.
Chevra beware of shady owners! Don’t let them think they can continue their crooked ways and bilking the next innocent crowd. It’s sad, but this owner advertises in ehrlich papers, and walks around like he is the next gadol hador, he sends his kids to respectable Bais Yaakovs and yeshivas and lives in a very frum neighborhood. Baruch hashem myself and my friends were raised properly and we will not do anything to stoop to this guys level. However, his day will come, and this guy owes us big, and lots of money.
If you or your friends are thinking about renting in the mountains next summer, let this be a lesson.
Thank you,
“Upset Upstate”
New York.
Join the official YWN WhatsApp status
85 Responses
I heard about this guy- a Rasha Mroosha- he tells people whatever they want to hear just to get them off his back! I hope he loses his colony after these guys take legal action.
good luck
There are crooks in every business.
If you don’t say where this place was, then your just waisting other peoples time. Be more specific.
I really feel bad for you. I was with the previous group for the past 5 years & we finally had enough & B/H found another place for all of us. He will say whatever you want to hear & never keep to any word of his. His checks will always bounce(I only know of 2 occasions when they didn’t)(VERY RARE) & it ends up costing you more b/c of bounce fees. I think everyone should know his name so they don’t get screwed also. ##### ###### IS A CROOK!!!! WHOEVER YOU ARE DO NOT EVER GO INTO ANY KIND OF DEALINGS WITH ##### #####!!! HE IS A DISGRACE TO FRUM YIDDEN & WILL GO STRAIGHT TO GIHENNOM FOR THE WAY HE DEALS WITH US!!
Editors Note: Until there is a P’sak from a leading Posek to publicly post his name, it will not be exposed on Yeshivaworld. Thanks for your understanding.
i heard it was somewhere in Loch Sheldrake
I hope that someone asks the shailoh if the name could be publicized!!!!!!
There are two sides to every story. who says these 2 renters are so innocent. From what I’ve heard of this story the “oilem” that was renting at this place was not 100% aidel in their dealings with the owner. It seems to me there were many occasions in which they acted unfairly to the owner. Some of their checks bounced or were not paid in time for him to work properly and on top of that there was lot of hezek done to the colony by theses so-called bnei torah.
Their harsh arguments with the owner were not always done with the proper derech eretz and basic bein adom l’chavero.
I am not judgfing but the bottom line is there are two sides to every story and we shouldnt rush to blame people who are trying to make an honest living
Its appalling to hear that someone that considers himself a ben torah or at least try’s to give off that impression can totally disregard one of the Aseres Hadibros (Lo Signov) never mind the chillul Hashem! Yom Kippur might be michaper for that but its not michaper for bein odom lichaveiro.
Middle of Nostrand – the fact that there are crooks in every business doesnt make it right!
Pray tell, how is stealing from people called making an honest living?
The problem is that he has been brought to beis din & he just shrugs them off again & again. The only way to get to him is to take him to real court. Even then I don’t know if anything will be gained b/c he will never pay & you will be down in legal fees. Some of these indivduals tried to sue him, but the lawyer told them not to b/c they will never get their $ even if they win. Postmaster: I think you should post his name so that this ends his gneiva from happening again & again. He knows that there is a great shortage of bungalows & he will get another group of suckers every year. We must put a stop to this! Please think about it.
Editors Response: Kindly get a SIGNED letter from a respected Rov (we will verify that he in fact wrote and signed it), and it will be posted – along with the letter. Until then……… (rolling eyes….twiddling thumbs)
M4 – post #8 Yom Kippur will not be michaper for any aveira in which a person does with the intent to ask forgiveness on Yom Kippur.
again, m4, you dont know the story. if you had a broader picture of the story (i do) you might not be so quick to blast.
Let me begin by saying that the “oilem” is a frum eidel crowd that acted respfully and al pi halacha in every matter throughout the summer. The “oilem” shared the colony with chasidishe crowd and never had any run-ins or arguments over any frumkeit issue because the “oilem” is a frum and eidel group.
There are two sides to every story, but the facts are facts. This group was fully paid up in March and only ran into problems when they arrived to the colony.
Of course he will say that, but the fact is that there are already at least 100 people that will say he is lieing. Every year he tries to look for something that he can say that we did to the bungalows so that he doesnt have to give us back our $. Its always something extreemly trivial, like a tiny hole in a wall, or b/c one guy was upset at him so he found a way to get around putting $ in the dryers & used them for free(its pure geneiva what he did, but it doesnt give him the right to hold back everyones $). Remember it was ONE person, everyone else treated him with the utmost respect, myself included(I beleive, he is just a crook looking to weasel his way out.
EDITER PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHO YOU CONSIDER A RESPECTED ROV. RAV BELSKEY GOOD OR HOW ABOUT RABBI REISMAN ?
Editors Response: Either one is fine. Email it to [email protected]
i happen to be related to the victim of the story, the colony owner. How can someone who puts all his kochos in to making sure the group has a great summer every year, day in and out, be harrassed and villified by these posts? no one will disagree that he has a history of going “lfnim meshuras hadin” in all of his business. rabosei- is balt yom kippur!
OK Editor, how do I send you the letter? I can definitely get at least 1. Please hurry b/c the 2007 chevra is not going back & I know he will be actively looking to get his next victims since they did not give him a deposit for next year. We all gave him deposits last year b/c we were desperate, good luck to us ever getting that $ back! He actually gave us all one big check but every time its presented we check first if it will clear, guess how much is in there every time? One big $0.00.
A similar story this summer, my sister paid full price for her bungalow when I tell you that it looked like living in a shed but never mind! when requested to fix a leak in the cieling the owner finally after a few weeks bought the material to fix it mind you its still sitting under a tree outside the bungalow
Loch Sheldrake….
What did you expect?
Ein oimrim Loch Sheldrake eiloh Loch Shel Dreck
EDITER : WHO DO YOU CONSIDER a respected Rov ????
This unscrupulous and corrupt behavior (to say the least) unfortunately is widespread OUTSIDE the ‘mountains’. For those in the parsha of buying new construction in Lakewood, BEWARE!! There is on ‘frum looking’ ‘frum sounding’ builder who has raped yiddin of their lifesavings!!! He sold homes on paper when he didn’t even own the land. Unfortunately, hes been taken to bais din by many, but like all these terrible people, why listen to bais din? They are reshaim who only G-D will punish. What goes around comes around!!
PLEASE READ CAREFULLY: To all those who are trying to submit comments using a user-name similar to the person in question, the comments are being deleted instantly.
Please don’t waste your time, or the moderators time.
When a signed letter from a Rov is sent to us for publication it will be posted.
If this is a legitimate story,publicize it everywhere that Jews do business,including,Jewish Press,Yated, Hamodia,etc. Write letters to prominent rabbonim and get a bais-din.to condemn his actions. Did you have a real estate lawyer work with you for your protection? Is everything in writing,signed and notarized? Does this fellow actually own the real eatate?This information is (should be) available to the public in the town hall. If he really is doing this,he must be stopped and our community must be made aware to not do any business with him. A notice can be sent out just to boycott him and do no transactions without saying what he (allegedly) did. You can warn the public without accusing him in detail. Please keep us up dated and may Hashem make eveything come out right. (some of our “very-frum “,or “frum-looking” businessmen beleive that outsmarting another is OK,and even brag about it. )Dishonest business is just as sinful as non-kosher meat,no matter what kind of hat you wear ,where you ‘daven’ or who you know. Under Hashem ,we are judged first with how we deal with each other.A frum person is not frum by the way he dresses. Actions speak louder than mere words or looks. Disguises are easy to get,but Hashem will still see us,no matter how or where we try to hide.
To the one who has to change his screen name – what you are implying is that if someone wronged you, you can do the same to them. In case you didnt know, this is called nekama which is also a lav diorayso.
a fool is born every day. anybody who puts his $$ on keren hatzvi need not tell us his surprising ending when we already know it.
I heard that he threatened a person in the colony for asking him a question.
To which he (the owner) said that this person should be hung for doing so.
what type of human being is he?!!!
A few years ago I was in the same situation with the same bungalow colony. We heard crazy stories about the owner but wouldn’t belive them because the same crowd wanted to return for another summer. He told us that he didn’t want them back. We collected checks from my group and sent them to him. Some things weren’t entirely sent the way he asked for them. I received a phone call from him that day and realized from the conversation that he truly was a nutcase. Since it was a holiday weekend he couldn’t cash any checks for a couple of days. We decided to stay away from him and got the whole group to stop payments on all the checks before he could cash them.
The unbelievable stories that you hear about him are true. Stay away from this guy!!!
You only have yourself to blame if you are completely naive when doing business…you gotta watch your own back.
This story has truth and these people are friends of mine– I will not post the name of the owner as until Bes Din comes out with a P’sak its Assur.
However, its a lesson for all of to learn to watch our backs!
To Mr Ed G. Woodberger, whoever you are, how can you possibly say with a straight face that “someone who puts all his kochos in to making sure the group has a great summer every year, day in and out”, when the guy never showed up to the place throughout the whole summer year after year except at the end when it came to collecting deposits? How do you think we knew exactly when to come to try & get our deposits back? He is extreemly predictable, the only time he is truthfull is when he tells you that he is coming to collect deposits. You cant imagine the stuff we went through every year. Bungalows without electric the whole summer, without stoves the whole summer, whole bungalows being flooded with sewage & all their belongings being ruined, ALMOST BEING KICKED OUT OF THE COLONY TWICE!! BY THE CITY B/C THE PLACE WAS ILLEGAL B/C OF COUNTLESS VIOLATIONS & WAS FAR FROM UP TO CODE. Did he ever come to take care of these things, NOPE, we had to beg the inspectors to have rachmanos on us! I can go on & on. There is no way that all these people are making up these stories & the owner is the “VICTIM”!?! So please dont lie throuhg your teeth. We are in the proccess of getting those letters signed by rabbanim & he will be exposed for what he is VERY SOON. A FILTHY CROOK!
One addendum to Chaim Yankel’s (28) note. One person in our group decided to stay because how could this guy be that bad. After suffering through the summer, our friend who has come to his senses and spends his summer with us, went over to Mr. Ganev and told him he doesn’t like to admit he was wrong but said it was the worst decision he made.
Nothing that comes out of the ganev’s mouth can be taken at any value.
I too suffered at this terrible bungalow colony. I warned some of the renters this year about the conditions in the colony and the nature of the owner. Any of the renters have hard evidence of what they claim (recordings, videos, medical bills suffered at his expense, etc)
Last year, I heard that some of the chevra took out an add in a heimishe paper warning about the owner- who is connected with the right people and totally unscruplious.
Every year his victims promise that they are going to take him to beis din.
This colony is rented out to non-jewish people during the rest of the year; and they have become violent with him in the past.
I would encourage someone to finally expose this crook for whom he is. Someone, go to your local ruv or dayan and instead of blogging anonymously, expose this man and let him defend himself infront of a dayan.
i know for a fact that this story is true because i was in the colony-and to the “cousin”—the victim is NOT the owner. i would not even use the word victim and his name in the same sentence. he is nothing short of a liar and a thief and he is a disgrace to jews everywhere. there are two sides to every story—the people in this colony were wronged for no reason and the owner was the one who blatantly lied and stole.
the health inspector was there this past week and said that the pool did not have a filter on it for the entire summer and there was no chlorine in the water. the inspector put up a sign saying that the pool was shut down and it should not be used. one hor later the sign was ripped off the door (wonder who did it)and people were told that there ws no problem and that everything was fine and that they can use the pool. (needless t9o say that people did not use thepool again)he was afraid that the prospective renters for the next season would see it and not rent!! people were wondering why their children kept on getting virusis the whole summer.
They say “a sucker is born every minute”.Among frum people.it is more than that. We are naturally trusting of “frum” people.However,Yisroel b’tach b’ Hashem,not in people. This emphathizes the need for good education Torah,middos halocho and secular.
If it’s TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE
sage old advice: kofin osoh ad sheyomar rotzeh ani
I personally think how it’s so sad that the avodah zorah of money has become so rampant in our society. what pple will do for money is incredible! Even if it’s not to this extent…I personally cannot understand how pple rationalize this..lk hello.. ur frum? u don’t realize that there is a din v’cheshbon for everything. In a society of keeping up with the cohen’s and building houses with money you don’t have. just seems lk prioreties got a little confused. But then again, we still have to remind ourselves that they are PLENTY of ehrliche pple out there, their ehrlichkeit may just not be publicized as much. so don’t lose faith in am yisrael!
Did anyone get a letter signed by the Rabbi yet?
Dear readers
As a renter in this colony this summer let me tell you first hand a little about this guy, firstly we were promised before the summer that when we get there he will have a brand new swing setor he will credit every family $100, and 2 brand new units. We pulled up the first sunday and lo and behold there was no swing set and the 2 units were nowhere near done so we started calling the owner. He first told us that he promised within 24 hours everything will be done. The first week went by and thur nite when us men got up everything was exactly the same. So we called him again and he promised ON HIS MOTHERS LIFE it will be done by sun nite.(Ether he hates his mother or she is dead) of course nothing was done. That’s when we relized what we were dealing with. So we all decided that we will start doing things our selves a few of us went to toys r us and picked up a swingset and put it together ourselves. Then the next week someone was missing their kid and we found him out in the parking lot so the woman started calling the owner and asking for a fence before chas vshalom a kid wonders out into the street, the owner agreed on the phone that it is sakanas nifashos and that he will do it the next day. We are leaving today and there is still no gate. Now that was all bad enough but we dealt with it. But when we called him at the end of the summer and thretined that we are not leaving untill he legaly evicts us he started screaming that we r ruining his business and if we stay our kids will get cancer and our wifes will die within the year. Now that crossed the line and now I want people to tell me that we are dealing with a normal frum person
Is he the same guy that said the lousy pshat on eating the Mon? Swing set? No big deal. I can be moichel. But I can’t be moichel the shoiteh who said the Mon pshat.
Rabboisai – Elul!
hDear All,
I know that all your comments, aggravation, and upsetness is something I can truly sympethize with. I have gone to the bungalow colony and rented from owners from when my oldest daughter was 3 yrs old. She is now 33. Owners in general, try to make the most money they could by giving the least they can to their renters. But everyone look around them see what is going around this world…Hashem is seeing all the “wrong” that people are doing and are punishing the innocent as kaporos. Please make sure that you are all going according to daas torah. and I do want all of you to have a swimming pool that is legal and all of you to have what you deserve. But put everything in perspective.Do it in the “right” way in regard to Hilchos Shmirias Haloshon and with the Rabbis who know how to deal with these issues…. It is only then that Hashem will see that we are all trying to do “our” best [not just gossipping, and e-mailing } and bring us to the geula sheleima. from and “old” lady who has been there and sees what is IMPORTANT now!!!!!
to the whole “oilam”‘
I WARNED YOU ALL!!
WE DONT HAVE TO KNOW HIS NAME IF YOUR NOT INVOVED WHAT DOES IT HAVE TO DO WITH YOU AND ITS NOYB!! YOU DONT REALLY CARE ABOUT THE PERSON WHO WAS ROBBED YOU JUST WANT TO KNOW WHO DID IT FOR THE HOCK. DO WE REALLY MEAN IT LASHEAM SHMAYIM
AND BY THE WAY IN CASE YOUR WONDERING IT IS ELUL!!!!!!!!!!!!! SO WAKE UP
sb, Vkol haam yishmau vyerau, v’lo yizadon od.
#40,
I don’t chap. You wanted to leave. And then you said you’re not leaving until he evicts you?
Please explain.
Having dealt with (actually – let’s be honest here – having been cheated and lied to by) a less than honest builder about 20 years ago (who was honored by some big yeshiva in another neighborhood…), let me just add my two cents: first of all, I regret not following my lawyer’s advice (who also happened to be a family member)to sue the guy; and the only way I was able to fall asleep for many years was by repeating to myself: in 120 years Hashem will make the final cheshbon with this guy. I sympathize with anyone who was cheated or victimized. We all feel violated by these type of “ehrliche” crooks, unfortunately there are too many of them running around taking advantage of those of us who are too naive to do the proper research and too drained to chase after them.
I also believe that we are too pressured to provide unrealistic goshmius and it is certain to drive some to less than honest means to obtain it.
Ok, I know this is off the topic a bit. But what drives a person to do this? Probably, he is desperate for money. Our frum world has gotten out of hand when it comes to money. Everyone has to be and have the best, the best clothing, the best sheitel, the best jewelry, the best house, the best furniture, the fanciest wedding, bar mitzvah, vort, etc etc. Everyone is looking to make an impression on the next person. Perhaps if we can come back down to earth the need for so much money will be lessened, and we won’t have people so desperate for money that they have to be crooks, or end up doing other illegal things that put them in jail. On another matter, maybe we need to allow men to pursue other careers besides “going into business.” We have to stop looking askance at a college education that can allow men to become accountants, actuaries, lawyers, doctors, physical therapist, special ed teachers, etc. and make a decent living without having to resort to all kinds of shenanigans that crop up in the business world. I am not saying we don’t need business people – we do, but we could use frum people in other professions as well.
YW Editor,
You write, “Until there is a P’sak from a leading Posek to publicly post his name, it will not be exposed on Yeshiva world. Thanks for your understanding. “
You also write, either Rav Belskey or Rabbi Reisman Psak is fine.
What and where is the Psak of your Daas Torah that you are constantly talking about and WHO ARE THEY?
Editors Response: WHAT P’SAK??!! What Psa’k is YW constantly talking about?
None.
And you ask WHO is our Daas Torah?
Two answers:
1)You’re on a “need-to-know’ basis, and you don’t need to know.
2)YW Editor is a Rosh Yeshiva of the biggest Yeshiva in the world. Its called Yeshivaworld.
If you don’t like answer #2, then please see #1.
Gold, says:
‘Probably, he is desperate for money. Our frum world has gotten out of hand when it comes to money. Everyone has to be and have the best, the best clothing, the best sheitel, the best jewelry, the best house, the best furniture, the fanciest wedding, bar mitzvah, vort, etc etc.’
Yes the Aseres Hadibros says ‘lo signov’. But it also says ‘ Lo Sachmod,,,,,’ Since when is Jealosuy and excuse to steal??? The only one to blamed is the Ganev himself, PERIOD!!! Either he was the victim of a poor Hashkofoh or its his nature. The way other people lead their lives, as long as its honest is CERTAINLY not the problem.
For those of you who think that the majority of crooks in the FRUM world are those that hide behinda beard and payos, YOUR WRONG !
Unfortunately even a few of those are too many but
I can tell you from personal experience that their
numbers PALE in comparison to the rest!
sammygol,
collegiate…proliferate…paradox…ostentacious…inventorial…
You sound ao prust with these “English” words! Where’s your chezkas kashrus??
i cant beleive all of these stories that i am reading! the same happaned to us!
for the first time- this summer my wife and i decided to rent our own bungalow instead of heading out to our parents for the summer. we were a little late with this decision- so we decided to settle for the “ok” bungalow. we got there the first day- AND LET ME TELL YOU- WE WERE NOT TOLD MANY IMPORTANT IMPORTANT DETAILS!!! WE NEVER NEVER WOULD HAVE TAKEN THAT HORRIBLE THING!!!
obviously the owner/manager told us before we saw it that it was the most beautiful brand new bungalow in all of the colonies that he manages- and if we wouldnt have taken it, he would have! so of course we paid in full befor the summer, and boy was that a mistake! we paid for everything including day camp, electricity and every other little bill that he told us about. but after we saw that disgusting bungalow- we were desperate for a refund! what he told us were absolute lies! we called him maybe 10 times a day for the first two weeks- (oh and by the way… we werent even there- we moved back into our parents home) and his message box was either full or not working. we left scathing messages- but of course it meant nothing. finally finally he called us back and we went on and on… (theres more to the horrific story that i am leaving out- for the sake of everyones time!) and of course he promised to reimburse us for at least the day camp that my child isnt attending and the utilities that we are not using- and some of the money of the bungalow.
but you think we ever heard from him again?!?!? NO WAY!!!! till today i am leaving him messages asking him how he can sleep at night knowing that we are not mochel him for what he did to me and my family- you would think that an ehrilche frum yid would be bothered by this statement!!!!!!
please help us try to find this guy… and send him where he deserves to go.
I’m amazed how so many commentators come up with excuses about why supposedly observant Yidden steal. They’re not stealing because they’re pressured for money. If that were the case you would have alot more ganovim walking around. EVERYONE is pressured for money.
Ganovim steal because they’re lacking Hashkofos.
They’re in denial that parnossah is decided by Hashem and every Rosh Hashana it is decreed how much we will earn that year. They actually fool themselves into thinking that they can up their parnossah by stealing other people’s money.
We’ve also been the victim of such a ganev. We know that this was a decree from Hashem. We are grateful that we did not have to kim up in some other way.
#49 and others: Be careful about being “moser dino lashomayim” as chazal tell us that you could ch’v be checked out first.
There are two sides to every story. Here is my story. We are ב”ה going to the same place for the past 11 years. Our owner/manager officially asks for a deposit in March. For whatever reason we didn’t pay then. We didn’t even pay at the begining of the season. Not in the middle. NOT EVEN AS YET. They haven’t said a word to us!
It would be avak loshon hora to disclose this colony מדין אכסניא טוב – גמ’ ב”מ. There ARE nice people out there!
p.s. I Hope to pay today!
eyes wide open:
Just because you didn’t pay attention during English classes, does not mean you should demean (mevayish, bla”az)others who can actually articulate themselves without resorting to a plethora of Yiddish, and a smattering of Lason Kodesh.
And yes, I went to a fine Yeshiva in Boro Park, and I did not attend college.
And Sammygol – way to go. I dont know who you are, but your comment is right on the money.
EYES WIDE — I think that Sammy is still waiting for a refutation of what his point, as opposed to a shrill criticism of his English.
I think that Sammy makes a good point, although I would have used some different language.
The bottom line is that many of our communities approach issues of Shabbos, Kashrus, Pritzus etc. with Talmudic precision, but somehow neglect to apply the same attention to detail when it comes to financial matters.
I’m not saying that this makes people hypocrites; everyone is stronger in certain areas than in others. All I am saying is that it’s very curious that the laxity tends to show up in cash-related issued (the main exception being when there is a cash-related issue that also involves a very public display of Frumkeit, such as cancelling ElAl tickets).
As a lawyer, I deal with Jews and non-Jews of all stripes, and it perpetually saddens me that people don’t see someone with a Kippa and say “Aha — at least I know I’m dealing with someone who I can trust.” I don’t know if I would say that the opposite is true, but “just as good as the Goyim” is not the standard we should be aiming for.
It’s time to be a real light unto the nations and not just a Kosher Lamp. Or worse.
Mrs. Gold – you usually make very points. sorry not this time (post #50). If the stories are true, I am not a bit interested in why someone would lie, steal and cheat – the “why” is between them and the Creator.
Yes we are in times where finances are tough – for some of us it is tuition, mortgage/rent on a modest house, food, clothing and transportation costs NOT the newest and fanciest sheital, car mansion etc…
Additionally, this behavior has nothing to do with the chosen profession of the villian in the episode. I know an accountant who went to prison for embezzlement in NJ. I have read of doctors who are in prison for medicare/insurance fraud and of course their are lawyers who have become greedy and and ended up the river also.
moving on Post #55 – I thought that was clever/humorous post (and I usually enjoy the posts of sammygol)
since when did this become a forum for whether or not to have a college level english or not?
i happen to be one of those 2 bungalows that were not built yet. aside from the obvious monetary losses i have from the original money not being returned, i had plenty other losses. i had to pay for another daycamp for my kids to attend, i bought tons of things for the bungalow which were useless to me at home, and g-d knows what else.
for any one to say there are 2 sides to the story obviously doesnt know the “agmas nefesh” that we went through this summer. this man didnt stop at ripping us off, he threatened my wife, calling HER a maniac, for calling him to return OUR money. on numerous occasions, i went to the colony to look for him to discuss our situation face-to-face (his 25 cell numbers were not being picked up, disconnected, or the mailbox was full). on the rare occasions that i actually saw him there, he hid from me in bushes or ran as fast as he can to his car and sped away. rather than talk to me like a mentch or chas veshalom admit his wrong. when i finally got through and asked for some money back (this was only halfway through the summer)his excuse was that hes not a bank and cant just refund our money.
as of yesterday, the unit is fully done ready to be moved into. this is because he rents them out to college kids during the year and is scared to mess with their money.
to # 46 “sb”- what do you meen its nobodys business. if thats the case i have a nice place for you to go next summer. just put all your money in cash down the drain. dont you want people to be aware and not get messed up again? or are you too self-righteous to care about anything other than what YOU decide is lashon haraa?
from what i understand not paying counselors telling them that they cant buy their plane tickets to go home after working all summer, or not having the pool ready in time, not having the units ready (that were already paid for four monyhs in advance), not having the playground ready or rather not having it all which by the way was another agreement in the contract is called G”NAIVA rather G’ZAILA and the owner should be held responsible!!!!!
i also understand that this person finished the two units for goyim that were moving in for the new semester.. whats that all about?????
Dear editor-
i think this should be pinned on your front page for a while becuase this is obviously a hot topic.
Shkoyech for you, the editor of YW, for creating the perfect fourm to brainstorm and figure a tora’dika way to address this problem. Mazel tov on being the fourm and having the zechus of trying to fix the bor b’rshus harabim and being mikayem lifnei iver-
Everyone, keep focused. The issue isn’t this specific bungalow colony, pressures of parnosah, or how much of a theif the owner is. We all know what Rabbi ******, the owner of the colony in question, and what many other bungalows are like is like-
How can we make this discussion l’toeles- (and not just ranting)-
1) There be a fourm to review bungalow colonies? (i.e, if you have question about a computer, you check out pcworld.com or cnet.com, a car you check out consumerreview.com- a doctor, nydoctorprofile.com)- The advantage of this would be that owners would have to “step-it-up” and provide paid for services or else the whole heimishe olam would know and not go there next year.
2) In terms of this bungalow in particular, I don’t think it would ever be possible to collect money from him, even if a judgement would be decided against him. Baruch Hashem, I have heard that the yearly rental that he has is about to fall through.
3) CHECK IT OUT BEFORE GIVING SOMEONE MONEY! I know for a fact that the victims from this year knew what they were getting into.
4) The same way that rabonim got together to decide about limitations on weddings, strawberries, the hang-out problem in Monticello, etc. Let there be some formal minumum guidelines of what is expected from a bungalow. The problems described in the origional article happen in many colonies-
5) If a non-Jewish buisnessman would conduct buisness in such a way, there would be fliers on the doors of shuls to stay away from that person. This is a question for the YW readership, what is the shomer torah umitzvos way to deal with crooked buisnessmen?
Welcome “upset upstate” to the chevra of people who have been victimized by Rabbi *****, hopefully we have no more members next year. :>
hey Bob, out of curiosity how was this “oilem” warned?
Can you be more specific?
Bob one more question
where do you have the chutzpa to call this slumlord a “Rabbi”
Bob-
How can you call this guy a rabbi? Also I was never warned. When did you warn ME?
Reading these comments I see that there are a lot of people that don’t agree fully with the attitude of the “chevra” that got taken for a ride. Let me ask all of you a question, when moving into a Bungalow do you expect there to be doors on the bathrooms? And if there weren’t what would you do?
I too was part of this “chevra” who was riped off by my Fellow jew. to all you people out there who think that there is another side let me ask you this, what would you do if you had no stairs to your upstairs? these are just a few things that Rabbi XXXXXXX said will be fixed but was never done. all in all the “chevra” that went had a great time only because we wanted to have a good time. Yes we all could have sat around and moped abt all theses things but we did not. the toeles of this letter was to be modea evreyone about this place, an absalute dump, with an absalute liar and gazlin as an owner. we were trying to get the word out this way we (chevra) is not over the lav of lifnai eiver.
wishing all including rabbi XXXXXX a chasima vichasima tova and a gut gibensht year!
How would you feel if at a time when you currently the bungalow as a renter he decides to have a bunch of animals walk into to see peoples units without having the decency to even ask people had things around if somthing had gone missing we should take the loss!!!!!!!!!
Better yet at the start of the summer some of the units did not have electric so he decided to forbid one person from coming up out of the goodness of his heart. so when asked if there would be a refund for the days that he might miss he just laughed and hung up
Then 2 repeat 2 days later the electric company came to turn off the electric we called him he swore that he would pay us if we just paid them. We did he gave us a check we deposited it and low and behold it bounced we only got the money back by chance . That is a whole nother story.
Just like there is a certifying company for the kashrus of food, there should be one for bungalow colonies. The description of this place is horrible, but why are people returning year after year? I do not get it….
We will not be going back there next summer. however we were not properly warned about what type of rasha this guy is. that is why we wanted yeshiva world to post his name and the colony name in order to save other people the agmas nefesh we had this summer.
They were warned that he is difficult to deal with- not that he is an outright ganav
we all left the colony yesterday and today and although it was very tempting to damage the property out of frustration not one person evrn made the slightest form of “hezek” to any unit. This proves what a fine and eidel crowd we are and really got burnt this summer.
If anyone knows of a bungalow colony with a decent owner we are a group of 16 that are seeking a nice place…. so please let us know….
sammygol-
oilem is only responding to post # 7.
it’s easy to sit back and be amused by this story or use this as a place to talk about their own agendas or “cute” yiddish vignettes as some people seem to be doing.
people-
post something usefull like how to stop this or how i can get my money back. just repeating that we were warned(still waiting for bob’s response) is not helping a single bit.
#68 & #74 it’s a bizayon to the title of “Rabbi” to call him that.
Post nos. 82 is pure SUPERFLUOS REDUNDANCY.
If you admire the fact that people excersized self control after being victims of fraud, just give them the credit without dangling the ‘nekama issue’ in their face.
It’s truly admirable that they didnt seek some sort of revenge after such an experience.
AL TODIN ES CHAVERCHO AD SHETAGIA BIMKOMO!
I was there last year and the year b4 that, and I am happy to report that I still owe the owner, (aka… RABBI, GANIV, CROOK, ROSHA MEROOSHA, EHRLICH FRUM YID) $1800 from last summer.
As one of the previous posters mentioned, about sewage filling into bungalows, my friend’s unit and my own unit (we were attached), were the ones to be zoicha to have everyones sewage enhance our bungalows, (mind you it was on shabbos morning during davening, so of course we just had to stand and watch as the bungalows were filling with sewage and could do nothing about it). The problem was finally fixed on Sunday about noon when we had to pay roto rooter ourselves, because he owed them thousands from previous services. (just a quick mention: services are refused due to past due balances to companys such as water, electric, oil, gas, and any/all companys that provide services needed to run a bungalow colony).
Anyone who can try to defend this man, is a happless pathetic indiviual.
as to all the renters this summer, all i can do is apologize for leaving the bungalows for you guys to endure, but I am sure you can understand why we had to leave.
TO THE EDITOR: I KNOW YOU DON’T WANT “HIS HONORS” NAME MENTIONED ON THIS SITE, BUT WOULD YOU HAVE ANY QUALMS IF INTERESTED PARTIES WOULD EMAIL ME DIRECTLY FOR THE INFO? I WOULD HAVE NO PROBLEM LEAVING MY EMAIL ADDRESS FOR ALL.
Sammygol,
You know its quite sad that after all the crticism you’ve been getting on this blog for your obnoxious way of talking to your peers, you still persist! Its as if your laughing it off! And I hate to ‘kick a man when he is down’ but,,,,,
Your arrogance is way out of control, and you normally pick on those who hit the target.
A little inspiration might be in order at this time of year;
Chazal tell us;
KOL HAMASHPIEL ES ATZMO HAKODOSH BARUCH HU MAGBIHU’
you can throw that criticism back at me if you want or to others. The problem is that mussar is more impressive from someone who earned the right to give it!
AIZEH WHO MECHBOD? HAMICHABED ES HABRIOS!
your Kovod Habriyos is a triple zero, my friend. Really,try to improve in the coming year.
Oh and Sammy, I stand by tmy post with regard to the ‘Satmar’ cop, and so did most of the other commentators!
One more thing Sam,you write;
Who was judging others when he posted this nonsensE?’
Who is ‘he’?? ‘I’ POSTED THAT COMMENT.
Yep, while your brushing up on your middos, learn how to talk like a gentleman:)))
nameless-
I apriciate comment # 85. I was not able to move in all summer as ive stated in my previous posts, but i was there for a shabbos as a guest. beleive me, looking at my half-finished bungalow that i still didnt gey my money back for, it was the hardest thing in the world to resist demolishing the unit out of anger and frustration. (sammygol- like you holding back from correcting someone grammer or hashkafa). thank g-d i was able to withstand that nesoyon.
82.
‘kINDLY TREAT OTHERS AS SUCH INCLUDING THE sATMAR COP YOU LAUGHED AT,,,,,,,,’
LOL, please get real!!! For the sake of lashing back in order to have the last word you suddenly become the defender of what YOU would normally call ‘A Charedi phony’??????
You can now add ‘hypocracy’ to your loong list of qualities. TRY TO CHANGE THAT AS WELL!
For the record, i wasnt laughing at him, just saw him as a victim of a confused hashkofoh, thats all!
There is certainly an improvement as seen in your nos. 93 POST. B’H some of the mussar did indeed sink in.
However you talk about showing ‘restraint’ and that we have to ‘abide by certain standards of behaviour’
Hashem hates an ‘Echad Bipeh Viechod Bilev’, Sammy!
Hameivin Yovin!
Git yur to you;))))
Sammy ‘Einstein’ GOL,
I meant to say I am not a ‘HE’ but a ‘SHE’
Sounds like the start of a beautiful shidduch
off topic, but it is part of the thread
nameless was lectured for supposedly making fun or laughing at a cop whose identity is known (picture and all) because she is not known and she was re-named “shameless” by the one giving the lecture.
this same person who gave the lecture may or may not be Sammy Gol or sammygol — we do not know who this unknown person is who lectures about showing restraint in other posts and about not doing improper things b/c HaShem wants us to show restraint and avoid improper behavior.
it is correct that we should show restraint so perhaps, sammygol-the unknown should show reatraint when referring to Ms. nameless and stop referring to her a shameless as he/she as done in this thread and perhaps other threads as well.
md(but-not-a-Doctor)levine
MD,
Thanks for reinforcing my point but wasnt that clear in my nos,95 post?
Ksiva Vichasima Tovah to you