Two Orthodox Jews have launched a legal battle over a decision to install movement sensors to control the lights in their Bournemouth flat block.
The couple claim they cannot leave or enter their property at Embassy Court, Gervis Road during Shabbos because of the motion sensors that have been installed in the hallways.
The couple suggested a compromise, which would have seen them pay for an override switch that would disable the sensors when required.
But this was rejected by the management company, who said it would set an “unacceptable precedent” and could not be defended to all the other lessees.
Following these unsuccessful negotiations, both sides sought legal advice and court action has begun, although this is still at a very early stage and as yet there is no date for a hearing. The management company is accused of breaching the terms of the lease, the Human Rights Act 1998 and the Equality Act 2006.
In a statement to Embassy Court residents, the management company state: “The directors believe that almost all lessees at Embassy Court support the actions taken by the management company to reduce communal lighting electricity costs, and to reduce repair and maintenance costs by preventing heat damage to light fittings and prolonging their life.
“The directors further believe that almost all lessees support the installation of movement sensor lighting controls in the hallways and have no personal problems with their installation.”
The couple taking the action has also circulated information to other residents outlining the facts as they see them.
They said they found the rejection of their compromise proposal “very upsetting” and added: “Faced with a situation where we could never again have full use of our flat, we were left with no alternative but to seek legal advice.
“We consulted solicitors and a caseworker at the Equality and Human Rights Commission and were advised that we had a strong claim.”
They have reiterated their willingness to drop the legal action if an override switch was installed and the management company paid their legal costs and compensation.
(Source: Daily Echo)
Join the official YWN WhatsApp status
15 Responses
What halacha authority advised them that you cannot go where you know there are motion sensors. I know of one case where a well respected steble rabbi permits walking past a motion sensor since it is not your intention for the lights to go on.
I believe that there is a tshuvah on this issue from Rav Vosner Shlit”a.
G-d bless them for the mesiros Nefesh. A rav I know had a similar problem while doing Kiruv in Russia. He had to come through the window and sleep on Hotels on Shabbes. Just after a new Jewish couple start living there (since at least it was near the Kollel) one day the Goy became drunk and decided to accept the money they offered him to accept the change of switches on Shabbes. So HaKol Mim HaShamayim Hashem Yazor…
“We consulted solicitors and a caseworker…”
But did they consult a Posek? They might be surprised at the psak, which might save them a lot of time, money, and agmas nefesh.
Hello there have been several teshuvos on this subject. Read up on them, speak to a rav and make a decision. Most of us who walk thru residental areas on shabbos have this issue to deal with (security/motion lights that go on and off).
This could never happen in the United States; it is an example of what can occur even in a democracy that does not share the particular history and quirks of this country.
For historical and cultural reasons going back to colonial days, freedom of religious expression, and tolerance of other peoples, religious expression, are deeply ingrained in our society. A proposal to put sensored lighting in an apartment house with shomer Shabbos residents would be stopped before it ever got off the ground.
Another reason to appreciate being an American living in America.
It is indefensible that their very reasonable request for an override switch was rejected. The expense involved would clearly be minimal.
Addition to no. 2
The tshuva from Rav Wosner is in Chelek/Volume 9 Chapter/Siman 69. His opinion is that it is not a problem on Shabbos.
I would not call it indefensible, but it certainly seems like they could and should work something out with the owners.
As others said, I am fairly sure that in the United States, the American way would prevail and they would find a mutually acceptable resolution.
As far as halacha, I would assume and hope they spoke to their own local Orthodox Rabbi before going to these lengths, and were told that it was not acceptable as is.
I would speculate (and please do not take this to contain any halachic authority whatsoever) that when you pass someone’s house and the light turns on, even though you benefit from that light, you are not interested in it, per se, and therefore it is easier to be lenient than where your own house outside hallway light turns on.
Firstly, be “dan l’kaf z’chus”; assume that they have already spoken to a posek. It is not unreasonable to allow for the fact that this situation is dissimilar enough from the ones addressed in the above cited teshuvos to warrant a different psak.
Here’s one possible explanation: there may be a difference in halacha between walking past a sensor that one does not want or need (“p’sik reisha d’LO nicha lei”) and walking past a sensor that one DOES need (“p’sik reisha d’nicha lei”). In the latter case, it may be a “p’sik reisha” because they cannot avoid the sensor turning on the light but it may be considerd “nicha lei” because they would not be able to leave their apartment and walk in the hallways without the light, so the want or need the light.
Secondly, what about the option of another solution, in this “dochuk” case, of putting in a “grama sensor” i.e., a sensor that would turn on the light with a random delay built in — similar to the “grama switches” that I hear are in hospitals and elsewhere in Israel. That would remove the d’oraisa aspect of the melacha on Shabbos and leave it as only a d’Rabbanan.
Now, I realize that normally we don’t allow people to be “over” d’rabbanans on purpose (i.e., l’chatchila”) but this might qualify as a “sh’as hadchak” or something else similar to a b’dieved situation in which it may be “mutar”.
To all the Am HoAratzim here,
There is NO heter whatsoever if you need the light!!! All the Teshuvos are refering to cases that you don’t need it & you don’t care!
Next time YOU ask a Shailah, before you attack other!
As for any device of Shas Hadchak, that will only help if they have an important reason to leave, but they won’t be allowed to leave for pleasure.
why dont they pay for the additional cost that would leave them with no objections???
All the poskim here that want to matir, there is a huge difference between this motion sensor and the ones that gedolim are maikel by:
Those are a psik reisha sh’lo nicha lei that makes a light go on over the garage that he does not need because he has a street light anyway, but this is the etsem light in the hallway that he needs in order to walk.
Could very well be issur d’oraisa.
#6 – it could never happen in EY either.
why didn’t anyone think of installing the same system as in EY. You walk into the hallway or the stairwells and push a botton on the wall that turns the light on for 1 or 2 minutes (whatever you set it to). Those that want to push the button will push, those that don’t, won’t! Just like chareidim here make their way upstairs in the dark sometimes, so be it – at least no chilul shabbos or no safek either.
The couple in question had offered to pay for an override switch to disable lights during shabbos. This would suggest that they would have no requirement for illumination to enter, exit or walk in the entrance to their appartment.
If this is the case, there is no sofek as to whether psik raisa would apply.
It is likley, and common, that the installed lights may already have a delay between trigger and response