New York – The two Commack, L.I. butchers who in 2000 successfully brought down the state’s century-old kosher laws are at it again. They are challenging the new law, which was designed to be a disclosure model, because they were upset when a state inspector last October inspected their place to assure that all the ingredients they were using were kosher.
In their new suit, the Yarmeisch brothers challenge the implementation of the law. They say that they followed the dictates of their kosher supervisor, William Berman, a Conservative rabbi. When the new law was introduced, constitutional experts were certain that the law passed constitutional muster. The state has not yet responded to that suit, according to the Yarmeisch’s lawyer, Robert Dinerstein of Commack, L.I. As one of the leading markets for kosher foods, say kosher food industry sources, there is a need to protect kosher consumers in New York state just as there is tp protect any other consumer from fraud. “The customer has the right to expect that what is advertised as kosher is kosher,” said one rabbi of a major kosher certifying agency.
The original suit was filed before Brooklyn Federal Judge Nina Gershon, who had issued the August 2000 decision overturning the state’s kosher laws. It asks her to issue a preliminary injunction to prevent the state from continuing to enforce the contested sections of the state’s Agriculture and Markets Law. In her earlier ruling, Gershon found that the state had violated the First Amendment because “the entanglements involved here between religion and the state are not only excessive in themselves, but they have the unconstitutional effect of endorsing and advancing religion.”
According to the Jewish Week, Mr. Yarmeisch said that although their suit challenging the kosher laws was ultimately successful, their business has not fully recovered from the state’s actions against them. Three years ago, Yarmeisch said, they calculated that they had suffered damages in excess of $7 million. The brothers have cut back on staff and moved to a store in the same shopping center that has about half the space of their old store. And in an attempt to rebuild their business, they changed their name from Commack Self-Service Kosher Meats to Commack Deli and Market, focusing on their deli and prepared food operation instead of butchered meat and poultry.
(Source: Kosher Today)
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16 Responses
Reshoyim trying to pass their tarfus as Kosher.
Hmm… This is one of those stories that really makes you think- Subjective or objective?
As a matter of law, the plaintiff’s are correct. The state cannot prefer Orthodoxy over other Jewish denominations. All the state can and shuold do is protect the public from fraud.
The kosher laws are an outrageous breach of the separation of church and state. It is not for the government to decide what is or is not kosher. I hope they get struck down again. Kashrus is determined by the Rav Hamachshir. Each person has to decide whether or not trust a particular hechsher. The government should not be involved in any way.
can this site do its own journalism, especially on matters in its own back yard. how about interviewing the main characters in this story…
Conservative Rabbi = OXYMORON
Is there really any need for us to have the state involved in Kashrus? We all know what hashgachas and what mashgichim we trust. If a product or a food establishment has such supervision we trust it. If it doesn’t, we don’t. Why do we need the state involved?
The law was changed and is not as shtark as it once was. NY Kosher Law Enforcment does what it can. I know b/c I have had to speak to them on occasion. Its not fool proof but it works. NJ has a similar program in force.
The bottom line here is that these clowns from LI have box seats waiting for them in g’henim for all they have done to ruin kosher.
Not everyone who eats kosher knows all the intricacies of different hashgochos. Some people who really would like to keep kosher may think that if something says kosher or kosher style then it’s kosher. For people like these, laws are needed to ensure that they get kosher food.
To berelshain, I believe you are mistaken as to what the current kosher law is. The government in no way determine what is and is not kosher. What the law requires is raedily availabe documentation as to the kosher claim. If a store says they are kosher, they are required to fill out a one page form that is filed with NY State saying under whose supervision they are (they could even put “none” or “self supervised”), as well as some other basic information. This information must also be posted to be seen by customers. This doesn’t sound to me like an issue that violates the separation of church and state. Where the owners of that store claim inspectors came to see if they were kosher, I doubt they did little more than ensure that the form was properly postend and did not contain false information.
The issue in this case is the store is making prepared foods using some products with no hashgacha which are approved by their “conservative” “rav hamachshir” However the purpose of this suit to challenge the State’s oversight of kashrus claims. Who better to do it than a mechalel Shabbos butcher under the supervision of a “conservative” “rabbi”
To JasonD: Even so, the word “kosher” is an inherently religious term. The government should not be involved. Period.
The US is very strict about what people call food. If something is called ketchup, it must contain certain ingredients or else it is catsup, milk mean cow’s milk, and the list goes on. Therefore the precidence (sp?) is set that if you call it something, it has to be what you call it. The real question is why we must include goyim in halachic discussions. I maintain that we should always keep them out of it. It reminds me of how the misnagdim would report about the chasidim to the goyish gov’t . We always act like we need their approval for thinks that we do. For such a resilient nation, we consistently show such weakness.
berel shain – why not get rid of insurance companies using the term ‘acts of g-d’, which they do? you want to have an atheistic government, or what? why is your new torah the constitution? with it’s navi sheker, thomas jefferson – who said that man has certain g-d given rights, which he made up, hence he fancied himself a navi.
The constitution is a religious document. Its ideas and american law as a whole are based almost entirely on gemora and rishonim, without many exceptions – it says not to mi religion and state, but that, is in itself mixing atheism, a religion, with the state. It’s a contradiction in terms, and a mistake of the goyim – so why do you buy it? stop looking at it ‘letzadeihem’ and use your yiddishe kup. The country claims to be against enfrcing religous laws..yet it enforces many. It allows women to dress as the goddess-wroshipping cults used to dress their women, it embraces toeva relationships as found in mitzrayim, sdom and yovon, all based on tuimahdikge avodah zara, and you’re telling me this is a secular document? the word secular is a mistakr the goyim contrvied – you see goyim began to hate chistianity – who could blame them, so they came up with this idea called secularism, which means, an abandonment of christianity(in their minds they think it means religion, but they dont know what religion means). Religion means a set of morals and values – their consitition says that it is WRONG to mi state and religion! an inherently religious idea! in their so-called irreligious document. Anyway, the goyim assumed that every religion was as messed up as christianity, so they enforced their laws regarifng christianity on every religion – even that which their legal system is founded on.
I dont think goyim should be acting like mashgichim; there’s no need for it, however there should be a breech of law called false advertising, where a company says something is kosher and it in fact is not. Conservative, as can be shown in a courtroom – MADE UP new halachos, thus breaing the definition in the dictionary as what constitutes ‘kosher’ (which means corresponding to jewish dietary laws), which re found in the shulchan aruch – in a courtroom, the apikorsim could say that this is their interpretation – however unlike other religions, we would be able to shw in a courtroom that they are false, and that they are not kashrus laws at all but rather the invention of a bunch of am haratzim – it’s not kosher if it goes against the torah, plain and simple. There are no other ‘denominatons’ and this can be understood even by goyim – a cursory understanding of the difference between frumme yidden and the apikorsim would shw that to any bar sechel.
#14 – Misnagdim would report about the chasidim to the goyish government??
do you have proof, or it it bubba meisos you’re am haaretz ancestors passed on due to jealousy of the misnagdium knowing how to learn torah, and not just read from a siddur? dont you dear start trash talking misnagdim. you are way out of your league, and clearly know nothing about history.
the people who snitched were usually relatives of the rebbes themselves, which still fgoes on in america, and if not relatives, tehn other chasidim of other rebbes. or they were maskilim, never the less, early chassidim were paskened to be dangerous, as the baal shem was one of hundreds of baalei shem, most of whom went off the derech, converting to both islam and christianity. hence baal shem TOV. dont for one second disparage misnagdim. the litvish communities of europe ran rings around chassidic courts as far as limud hatorah goes, and that is fact. just look at all the famous yeshivos, and the onely chassidic one that is famous is chachmei lublin, misnagdim have:
mir, ponevich, kamenitz, brisk, telz, slabodka, volozhin, kelm, baranovich, novordhok, etc.
would someone explain what are the guidelines uaed by not shoimrei torah umtzvos as kosher or not kosher?if one doesn’t adhere to s’u yorah deyah etc..?