An organization in Boro Park is sending signs to frum-owned shoe stores in New York and beyond which requests that customers of the shops be mindful of what they do when being fitted for shoes.
The organization, named Kol Kevudah, has been sending out beautiful posters with a message “from the man who fits your child for shoes.”
The poster, written as a poem, states that while the store owner does his best to provide customers with a nice pair of shoes, “but something’s on my mind, I struggle too… I struggle daily with Shmiras Einayim.”
“The view that I have as I crouch on the floor, As I fit your child with one pair of shoes or more. When you cross your legs, the truth I do say, If you knew how it looks you wouldn’t sit that way!”
“Please help me out and sit with care, And I’ll fit your child with the very best pair.”
The posters can be requested by calling Kol Kevudah at 718-633-6002.
(YWN World Headquarters – NYC)
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47 Responses
THIS LETTER IS THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF KOL KEVUDAH!
Someone that struggles with Shemiras Einayim can find help in many places, but to write such a in-sensitive and explicit letter detailing the positions etc??
And we are proud to publicize it? Wow. Im shocked.
Mi ke’amcha Yisrael
perhaps if he was more focused on fitting the child’s shoes than looking elsewhere, this would be a non issue
BH this is being addressed finally, the number of stories and people that are being nikshul because of the lack of tznius in boy shoe stores is practically endemic and finally, we have Kol Kevudoh stepping up and leading the defense on this, most dire of issues.
Hopefully, they will now start writing letters to shuls about the inadequate mechizahs that some shuls use for the sukkos season, mechizahs where you can see the fingers of ladies and which is also causing people and especially bachurim with unpure thoughts.
ugh… I’m sorry but this poem is quite idiotic.
Make it very clear to everyone (especially the women) coming in to your store that they must dress, act, and behave tzniusly at all times; there is no need for such a shy subtle and partly ambiguous poem. Be more direct.
this poem is not tznius
This is just so pathetic that it needs to be said… sad.
Kol hakavod
I’ve seen it posted in a few shoe stores already. May it be a zchus for Etka Bas Moshe, as indicated on the bottom of the poster was sponsored for the cost of spreading this holy Mitzvah.
And, by the way, this vital issue of Tznius isn’t just limited to shoe stores. When getting into and out of a car/minivan, which is visible to the public, when sitting in a car/minivan on the seat, which is visible to the driver, passengers as well as the public through the window, as well as when going up stairs and down stairs, bending down, running and many other positions, this same critical point of insuring she doesn’t chas v’shalom make herself more visible than permissible is of upmost importance.
How is it not obvious to anyone that public discussion of this is grossly immodest?
I wish the individual dealing with these addictions and challenges a refuah shleimah. A well trained psychotherapist can help this person. If the customer he is referring to is an under-age minor, then I’d suggest rabbinical help ASAP (in coordination with a clinician), before this becomes a legal issue.
The store should hire a woman saleslady for children’s shoes and not ask that mothers tell their daughters to cross their legs. If the salesman can’t continue, he should look for another job.
Um..wow
Please tell me this is a joke?!!!???
Can we guess that this was a Purim joke? What next…
Just in case anyone plans to criticize, pretend that it’s a letter about child abuse or some other hot topic that is considered acceptable to many even when it contains ‘sensitive content’.
And if she wouldn’t cross her legs, It might be much worse. I would have written that the women should come with longer dresses.
By the way, working in a children’s shoe store is Isko im hanashim. Some Poskim (Rishonim) even hold that that makes the person considered a ‘parutz’. So if he really wants to be an ‘Ehrlich Yid – a Yerai Shamayim’ as the poster says, he should change to an umnus nekia which isn’t isko im hanashim.
The store should hire a woman saleslady for children’s shoes and not ask that mothers tell their daughters to uncross their legs. If the salesman can’t continue, he should look for another job.
Keep your personal issues personal, not the public square. What an embarrassment
Wow so disturbing! This person is sick in the head. Why all this time he has been looking up skirts when he should of hired a lady to do the fitting. When people sit down low there is a certain inevitable position that they get into. Stop blaming women for crouching down between their legs when they are seated.
This poem is terribly inaproriate for children to read. How could you post it in a children’s shoe store? Children can read- what will they begin to think after they read such a thing? Terrible. If the salesman is unable to be appropriate in this line of work, he can find another job. Don’t expose young children to such thoughts. Or at least have the decency to word something in a more tznius way.
mordy: the man clearly says he is talking about the moms, not the kids. in any event, the shoe store should post this publicly and allow the chips to fall as they may. personally, if i saw this in a shoe store, i would not shop there anymore but everyone is free to do as they please. there may be customers who have different views than mine.
Ever see the pieces of cloth that Misaskim gives for the ladies to cover their legs when sitting shiva?
Perhaps the shoe stores can keep such coverings in their stores and offer it to the lades/girls when they are to be served or as they sit down
It is very easy for someone to tell someone else to give up their parnossa and “go find another job”.
Menshlechkeit and Yiddishkeit (i.e. tznius) require that the issue be mentioned and resolved.
Kudos to the letter writer who surely had the best intentions
And what would be so bad if people put on the shoes by themselves? What do these children or mothers do when there is no “professional shoe try-on technician” in the morning? Go outside barefoot?
It seemed to me that having the shoe salesman help you put on your shoes is a shtick that they do in order to charge higher prices than what you can get online or in a regular department store.
this is sooooooooo sad, if the man has issues then he should not work in a shoe store, and the person who gave out the poster needs help ASAP
To all critical and cynical posters of this very serious issue:
A man doesn’t have to be ‘sick’ or have psychological problems when it comes to this issue. It’s a metzius, the reality of a man’s condition.
The women who don’t understand this, don’t have to understand it. But please be sensitive to us men who have male urges and hormones that naturally attract us to the opposite gender. Why on earth do you think there is an inyan of Shemiras Einayim for men in the first place? Why isn’t there ear-splitting applause and praise to these individuals trying to work on their kedusha and purity, as opposed to the average ‘joe’ out there who doesn’t work on this area and who’s wandering eyes scan and objectify every woman?
Let it be known: no healthy man is free from this nisayon.
And please stop posting stupidity that he shouldn’t be working in such a store. By any standard, for thousands of years, this is a noble, normal and honorable job- ask any Rav. Let’s call a spade a spade. The frum women customers should act like frum women customers. That’s all this store salesman is asking
Starting with the first commentor on this post Mordechai Hatzadik I hate to say it, we have some self righteous idiots commenting here. There is nothing wrong with pointing out that a woman should be mindful of how she looks in front of other men. I once worked in a boy’s yeshiva the younger grades had female teachers. One of the secretaries was the one that would speak to a teacher who wasn’t up to the yeshiva’s standard of tzinius. Obviously it must be done with tact.
This guy should quit his day job to write poetry. I think he’ll make it.
It sounds like this is a cry for help. He needs a yeshua now, or else he might be the Honoree at the next Guard Your Eyes Dinner.
To those who are telling the letter-writer to find another job, it would seem that the letter is not the product of salesman asking for consideration, but the invention of a tznius-obsessed woman’s fertile imagination, projecting her obsessions onto an imaginary salesman.
this can be an issue in ANY work environment. We need to make our Torah learning more real so that we are connected to kedusha wherever we are.
Maybe if they had started this campaign a few weeks ago in Bnei Brak instead of in golus, Rav Chaim would still have been with us and there would have not been a terrorist attack in the city today. Just saying, just thinking. Those who consider this a shtus need to seriously consider their attitude to real Yiddishkeit.
cant u just hire hunter biden for this position.
What a bunch of knee-jerk reactions!
and by that, yes, I also mean a bunch of jerks commenting on knees!
Anyone who thinks that there is something wrong with a man who senses this as a nisayon is definitely missing the very basic understanding of this sugya. Those that are woman, go get educated. Those that are men – YOU should be seeing a doctor if you DON’T understand! But I suppose today we consider ourselves greater than Abaya and all the other Amoraim mentioned in this regard…
However, the public display is disturbing. No, there is noting wrong with a public discussion about tznius, Geolim have done this all the time. But the type of specifics mentioned are NOT what anyone should want their young son reading, and are completely unnecessary to make the point.
This person is what gives all men a bad name.I want to let all the women out there know that we are not all perverts.I hope this man gets the help that he so desperately needs.
The only men who don’t have such a nisoyon, are those that suffer from homosexual feelings.
I can’t believe some of the comments. Someone wants a to have Shmiras einayom and there are those who take him to task for it. For shame. There may be some woman who will say I’ll dress the way I want I will sit the way I want and it’s your problem. But I’m sure most responsible frum woman will say” thank you for pointing this out I didn’t realize it was a problem for the men I’ll try to be mindful of this.”
To the “kol kevuda” organization:
You do realize that you have just ensured that every single person, man and woman alike, entering a shoe store and reading this sign, is now picturing in their head exactly the view that this man might have from the floor.
As a mother, I would feel highly uncomfortable and exposed walking into a store with this sign.
I guess I will be ordering my children’s shoes online this season.
If they grow up to have foot deformities due to running around all summer with ill-fitting shoes, please know that it will be your fault.
None of this would be a problem if women could wear pants. Why can’t they? It’s hardly a beged ish at this point, women have been wearing pants for years. And there are plenty of tznius pants styles.
Women shouldn’t have to worry about tznius every waking moment. Either let them choose from a wider selection of clothes, (eg. pants), or place more responsibility on the men. If you can’t control what you look at, don’t place yourself in a position where you will be tempted to look. The women already give so much time and effort into being tznius, it’s time for the men to make a similar effort.
Mrs Simi Batsheva, Actually – If Rav Chaim z”l would still be with us, we may have had the zechyos that such an immodest letter would not go public (although it may have its place for women only, as you are).
Ask 2 men that you know, or your Rav / Dayan / Mashpia / Moreh Derech – not one of them would have okay’ed this in a public ostensibly heimish website, and I heard that the letter writer did not authorize to publicize it like this – give them a call.
Best Heter to keep my computer & buy my shoes over internet:- It works best for “Kol Kevudah” purposes and surely for Corona purposes, as well as not wasting my money on sleepy joe gas prices to get to store.
Lemaiseh, the details in the letter were inappropriate. Sometimes you just gotta let the details go. We get the point. Can’t believe Yeshiva World would let this through it’s censorship committee. Lemaiseh Reb Al Bundysberg would be proud.
Relax everyone. All the poster is saying that women should be careful to sit in a tznius’dige manner nothing more nothing less.
I love the way posters here support learning about drugs and alcohol, are very passionate and vocal about discussing sexual abuse but a simple sign about tznius and shemiras einayim now that’s terrible.
What a ridiculous discussion in a public forum..we are not goim.. there is not even sensitivity to how totally inappropriate this discussion is, as is the “poem” inappropriate too.. frum women should act like frum women…men should guard their eyes… and there is no need for anyone to help you try on your shoes..obviously no man should put himself in a situation where he can easily see what is assur… Hshem have mercy on yidden in chu’l. the odds are stacked up against them.
Re:
Shlomo 2
March 29, 2022 3:42 pm at 3:42 pm
To those who are telling the letter-writer to find another job, it would seem that the letter is not the product of salesman asking for consideration, but the invention of a tznius-obsessed woman’s fertile imagination, projecting her obsessions onto an imaginary salesman.
I think this is spot on. For a number of reasons, l think the poem, the idea, & the org. are the product of a woman, who while waiting her turn (>2 hours at times), was uncomfortable with what SHE saw. Being a woman, she has no idea what she’s actually talking about.
I think if it were a man, he would have gone about this quite differently.
The whole thing is embarrassing, lacking tznius, and will probably cause more problems than existed. This discussion alone is a problem!
The guy who said ok about hanging it up in his store probably didn’t even read it! He prob thinks it’s some women thing, exhorting women to be tzniusdik – who can be against that?!
I simply do not believe any guy would publicly announce this problem for himself.
The laws of tznius apply everywhere, so of course it’s “true”. It does not need special undivided attention!
This is not the same thing as publicizing “sensitive” – dangers to & crimes against -children, to prevent life altering abuses, future suicides, or fear of getting help.
This is more like a “what’s on the menu today” for the yetzer hora! I hope it soon dies a natural death from lack of attention
It might be a nisayon… BUT to write a poem that is tooo explicit on whats going on in your head and every 8 yr. old kid is gonna read that hes gonna think all men (or at least shoe store workers) are insane!!!!
A poem from the “man who fits your child for shoes”? This should be more correctly labeled as being written by the “man who is a registered sex offender” or as being written by the “man who should stay 2 blocks away from any elementary school”.
To the shoe store worker who fits children with shoes
And can’t help but leer at the ensuing views
Of modestly dressed mothers in long skirts and tights
And shirts with long sleeves that cover just right
Who find it more comfortable to cross their legs as they sit
As they wait for their children to find the right fit
TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR TAIYVOS, YOU PIG
You’re the one staring at tznius women in wigs
If you are so aroused by such a mundane situation
Perhaps it is time to change your vocation
No one is responsible for your urges but you
Blaming others doesn’t make you a good Jew