The subject of kids at risk has long been a concern of the Frum community and this important issue has been highlighted in numerous articles, meetings, and other public forums. Because of this focus, some wonderful people have initiated various programs and institutions that successfully address this important issue. In efforts to reach and help these suffering children, they have utilized a wide variety of techniques both traditional and modern. Yet, there are still many outstanding questions about dynamics of this problem that we need answered in order to help those in need most effectively.
Key among these questions is what are the factors that encourage or discourage an individuals identification with our holy tradition? Yidishkiet is all-encompassing, and includes many components, some spiritual, such as Tefeilah, some intellectual, such as Talmud Torah, and the physical actions of Mitzvos. There are responsibilities toward Hashem, bien adom limukom, and other towards our fellow man, bein adom lichavro. By understanding the factors that lead to an appreciation of each aspect of Yiddishkiet, we will be able to encourage the development of a true appreciation of the entirety of Yidishkiet. This knowledge will be invaluable in our efforts to reach every one of our precious children.
To help answer some of these questions, an online study is being launched that will examine some of the connections between personality and the various aspects of Frumkiet. The goal of this study is to identify some the specific factors that can be fostered to help promote a meaningful understanding of Yidishkiet. The study is entirely online, completely anonymous, and takes only a few minutes to complete. Your participation is greatly appreciated.
More details about the study including instructions for participation are available by clicking HERE.
Tizku Limitzvos.
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25 Responses
The site linked to has exceeded it’s data transferring capacity. The study’s author needs to find another host for the study’s questionnaire file to download.
Unfortunately, this survey is on a Yahoo Geosite with has very limited bandwidth usage limits, and has already exceeded this limit. This makes it unavailable at the present. Best to move it to “regular” website hosting.
its all nice and good. but I have a neice and two nefews who are sitting home in lakewood because the heimishe schools don’t want to take them in, using the excuse eh we done have very good results with kids who come in during the year! ehem, ever think how much worse they will be the begining of next year!!!
I was unprepared for the enthusastic response. However, I have now added more bandwith. Thanks to anyone who participates.
The link is once again working (12:17PM EST).
Such a study exists already and was published in ’05 by a Mrs. Margolese under the title “Off the Derech, why obsevant Jews leave Judaism”.
It has approbations from Rabbi Abraham Twerski, Rabbi Hershel Schachter, Rabbi Ephraim Buchwald and ohers.
It is a total and absolut eye opener !!
The survey was conducted on the web and supplemented with a number of interviews, both of people “off the derech”, and several major right wing Mechanchim.
The survey showed totally wihout ambiguity that
the main reasons of going off the Derech are not
problems with Toras Hashem (meaning both Torah & Hashem) but with the ones who subscribe to it.
A synopsis of the questions asked :
If you had to attribute your not being observant to one thing, what would it be? 44% of the surveyed responded “Observant people”.
Have you ever been turned off by any of the following in the Ordodox community:
People who were smug or displayed an attitude of superiority? 62%
People who were hypocritical? 62%
People who ommitted Chillul Hashem? 51%
Peple who berated or marginalized othe observant communities? 63%
People who were intolerant of nonobservance? 68%
Do you belive these relationships/experiences contributed tp your move away from observance? yes 78%, no 22%
This book is a must read for any frum Yid.
It was published by Devora Publications.
It mentions following :”All author’s royalties donated to charity”.
How is this for a breath of fresh air !
this is a study from rutgers university?!
this is from where we expect an answer?
from a university?
using the “chuchmah?” of psychology??
anyone familiar with R’ Avigdor Miller zt”l will understand my amazement (and other emotions i do not want to make clear here)
Studies like this are generally useless.
It’s a simple thing. Bring up your children to enjoy shabbos, sing zmiros and make them feel like they are in Olam Haba and your children will remain frum and the boys will be attracted to Torah. (Based on memros of Rav Shach.)
“feivel” belongs to both “people
who are smug and display a sense of superiority” and “people who berate other observant communities”.
That book means YOU !!!
#8, I wish it were true, but it doesn’t work that way. Loshan Hara is a VERY BAD problem, and young children are not immune. Unfortunately, it is often their teachers and the parents are that passing it and our children are the victims. A child gets labeled early as “not a good kid,” even from one small period of time where they acted out, and then they can never break free of that label. Then everyone acts suprised when the thing they made happen turns out the way they always thought it would–the kid leaves religion behind and goes on with his life.
#7,
I contacted the author. The study is not affiliated with Rutgers- the addressee was simply using an existing email address he maintains.
This is a different study than the one mentioned above. This study tries to understand the *personality* behind the frum and not-so-frum people. Looks like the results will be interesting.
to #6 yidelmitnfidel l2/14/08.. its interesting when talking about children off derech all blame yeshivhs,mechanchim etc etc, i havent come anywhere across what is stated in gemmorah ,musser sforim repeatedly to have holy children one has to “fier zich holy bien kiosel baiso’, “v’lo yiyah be’cho ervas dovor v’shov mayachracho” the gemmorah mentions why she had such holy children because the 4 walls did’t see etc,etc etc. now can all parents of ..attest they were not guilty of neglegting a major part of these yesodsdig principles of chinich habonim,… did they watch not to bring house ,these mag..eg.good housekeeoing or worse . i have seen plenty yiden bnei torah with lets say new york post or daily news in hand .we know what indecent pictures mamesh like plyaboy… etc,one can see plenty women from bnaei torah if wouldn’t have child with payos woudln’t anfal she’s bas yisroel, or talk with “eishes ish” like friend with first names etc (see egrah d’kalaleh breishis 17 posik 15 on sorai istacho lo cikrah shemo soreh)by calling eishes ish with first name bring kiruv hadas, when one has to have t’haras hamchsovos to beget holy children they are ongesapt with immoral goishe shmutz from all these shmutz newspaers and magazines that fills the home. now i’m not sying this is exclusive reason but why dont we read or hear this major part of chinich by droshos, the gemmorah mentions this ..”why did she have this child (a rosho) because she had impure thought when was supposd to have holy though (v’hamaskil yovin)..so can go on and on..
It must be noted that their own excuses may not be the most accurate gauge of what causes them to act as they do. It normally makes sense to make sure your children’s schooling is fully arranged before moving to a different town.
thank you Sarah
#14 mt medhi
The rabbi explained that his son did not follow in his footsteps precisely because he did not sing enough by his Shabbos table because he rushed to get back to learning Torah.He learned from his mistake and taught others that not everyone can feel the geshmak in learning like himself and most people need it from singing zemiros by a Shabbos table and the like.
Personally, I don’t see how this study will help. Ask anyone who is involved with kids-at-risk & they will all tell you the same thing: these Yiddishe Neshomos come from Yishivisha & modern homes, from Chassidish & Litvish, rich & poor, strict & lenient, ffb & bt, with TV’s & internet & without, etc. etc.
There is no rule! All of Klal Yisroel has R”L been affected.
What can a study help?
What we really need to do is to Daven to HKB”H to rip up this Gezeira Raah!
to pasehete yid #19..PS.. can you point out which prat we mentioned in #16 is extreme? if anything mentioned there is according to your haskofe “extreme” so, again, you dont belong on this torah site.,those yesodos of having elevated neshomos are not our personal opinion as we pointed out
I’m glad I read the comments before I posted. I agree with #21, but with a caveat: we need to “destroy” the Yeshiva system & create a “kid-friendly” system that is in tune with what kids need TODAY, 2008, not 1708.
Added to that, many Rebbeim, Morahs, & teachers should be fired. You know who they are; we shouldn’t care about their Parnassah, we should care about the Neshamas they are systematically destroying through their vindictiveness and unprofessionalism.
Most kids who are at risk, off the derech, whatever you call them, will blame the Yeshivas. True, some have lousy home lives, but most don’t. Parents must seek out the best school/Yeshiva for their children, not the most prestgious or the ones that follow their Shita if they are not the right ones for these kids!
I just wish I could win the mega-millions lottery & open up a free Yeshiva for these kids, employing caring professionals. Now that’s a real dream.
Forget the study, make real changes that make a difference!
Having been there, everyone is right, there is NO ONE REASON, and it is a combination of many.
These studies are in it self useless, HOWEVER, doing these studies is important because it wakes every one up, and it brings out the danger that lies out there.
“TIME”
Parents have got to be spending more time with their children especially when they are young this is a must!!!! Parents need to build a strong relationship with their kids and they need to be in contact with the Rebbe or teacher (NO IFS or BUTS)!!!!!!!!!!!
Spend more time with your kids when they are young (before the teenage years) and you will save your selves the agony that some parents go through.
“DISCIPLINE”
Today we went to the extreme, parents stop with the spanking and are scared to tell their children boo, we took a 360 degree turn from 25 years ago when the Rebbes beet the hell out of us for no good reason.
“SPANKING”
We need to spank them some times, but not out of anger, and the spanking should come with an explanation and your warm love towards your child should show out. Your not out to kill him/her, I ask my children what should I do to you so you will remember not to do it again, Kiss, spank or a time out they can choose, this allows them to understand that I’m not trying to hurt them only to work with them so they can become better (however don’t spoil them by buying them everything they want, they need to earn it, that’s not love its killing the child).
“POISON”
Parents should NEVER allow their children on the INTERNET, even with so called filters (I’m a technician, and I know what I’m talking about). This is a killer!!!!!!!!!!!
Don’t bring in Movies, Magazines or Newspapers in your house they are a danger to your child. (Parents being that they are in the business world become immune to these magazines and therefore think it’s KOSHER, but to the child it is pure POISON.
“TASTE”
We need to give the children a taste of Yiddishkeit,
1. Never talk about the negatives of any yid (if you have nothing good to say, don’t say it). Negative parents turn children off big time!!!!!!
2. The children should not be pressured, not from school or home. Torah is sweet let them learn less but they should feel that they have it in their pocket, and make them ask questions about their learning (help them ask and pretend as if they came up with the entire question)
3. Watch (from a distance) 24/7 who your kids are playing with and be careful when sending them to friends houses.
4. Shabbos with the family especially by the meals should be pleasurable prepare stories d’var torahs (don’t give speeches! when you are saying a d’var torah get the kids involved, let them try to figure out the Kasheh/question or the Teretz/answer they will enjoy it (if need be, reward them with prizes)
5. Shabbos needs to stay in their minds for ever, the memories should be sweet ones (even if Chas V’sholom they do go off, eventually they will see there is NOTHING on the other side, and they won’t kill them selves feeling there is nothing to live for (like so many do, unfortunately) because they will remember the enjoyment of a shabbos and the yiddisher family life, this will give them hope and it will bring them back to being a good Jew).
Lets Daaven to Hashem that out children should grow up and have true yiras shomayim and become Talmidei Chachomim, and may we all be blessed with Torah UgDula B’mokom Echod.
Dear Mr. Pirutinsky,
I wish you much hatzlacha with your survey and report. However, many of the questions in the last section are really only for men (davening in a minyin, selichos, etc.) since ladies are not required to do these things. Perhaps separate men/women sections would be more useful. Also, the study is naturally skewed since those answering are only those “on the net”! (unless you plan to take it around) Since most “yeshiveshe” people do their best to avoid the internet, your responses won’t come from a fair representation of yidden.
to #27, Pashuteh Yid,
I hear your concerns regarding our kids. There are so many thing we need to say “no” to in this world. However, there are many, many kosher DVD’s – concerts, stories, adventures, etc. Not everyone wants their kids staring at a screen, but there are lots of choices if they do want/need to. There’s even a tziusdik ballerina video! So enjoy!
This is also why I believe overnight summer camp is important, despite the costs. Especially for boys, summer can be a very hard time for frum kids. Our view is, work one month (counsellor, moom’s helper) go to camp the other.
Good luck!
Hi charliehall ,
Details about the study and the “informed consent” form are available through the website at http://www.geocities.com/tovagellis/Personality_Judaism.html.
Download the actual survey as it contains a complete disclosure about the purpose and goal of the research.
Thank you for your interest.
TO “WHO SAID WHAT”- you mentioned you had relatives out of school at this time of year, i am involved in some schools and i would like to help them so they can grow and not fall.
let me know how we can get in touch, they need need to be in a Yeshiva and have a schedule.
#24, you’re right. But you left one thing out, children are the reflection of the parent to everyone who sees that child, so raise him or her the way you would want to be represented in public. I see many screaming children, who whine about not getting what they want, and that reflects on the parent because people look at that child and think about how they could turn out OK if the parent puts a little more discepline into their life. Also you should teach your children not to talk or run around in shul, and to love HASHEM forever G-D willing.