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I too was weighing my options/responsibilities regarding this issue for a couple of days. I decided to act.
We learned by the story of ???? ?????, HaShem had a ????, He rebuked the Yidden in that generation, (if I remember the quote correctly) ?? ???? ???? ?? ????? ?? ???? ??? ??? ?????, when they were inactive by ??? ???? but got aroused for the pilegesh. How many times do we hear of abusers etc. and instantly get aroused, incensed, livid with righteous zeal, but remain calm and complacent in face of this most greatest chilul HaShem of the first degree. Some are even ‘understanding’!?!
??? ?????? ?’ ???? ????????? ??????. ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ??? ??. Sorry, an enemy of HaShem (such a rabid filthy one), is my enemy too. She’s Public Enemy #1, to anyone who truly loves HaShem. There nothing to talk about. Nothing to ‘understand’ about. She’s all-out against HaShem and His chosen people, anyone who is truly for HaShem must hate her ????? ????.
Her animalistic, debased urges and impulses, normally suppressed, subdued in ANY civil decent human being, is so openly exposed, exploited, reviled by her most filthy sewer system. SUCH DISGUST How many years did it take for her to wipe off any visage, residue of shamefulness that a NORMAL human is born with?
We learned there’s an opening by the (?), if one wants to leave, ?????? ??, let him go. (He’ll find his own way back through the small door) This one, however, crossed a boundary. She left and spat back. That’s a point of no return.
Can’t even write shame on you. She has no shame!
Do what I do. I eat skinny potato chips.
How does my computer know I’m a bad driver. It keeps giving me such impolite messages from time to time – “BAD DRIVER…”
Ctrl Alt Del:
Could you vouch for me too. PLEASE? Pretty please. I also need aa “Get out of hell free” card.
One more point, if I may.
Compare the two pictures, one of her happy, content life as a Jewess, and that of her now.
It speaks volumes! To say she feels “happier” now?!?
No. Not in this world. Definitely not in the next!!
What a massive unprecedented chilul HaShem (disgusting pictures too). One R”L leaves the fold, nu nu, there’e a kind Father Up There who is ???? ?? ?????, he made our inclinations (for our benefit), he certainly understands – ???? ????? ???.
It totally another thing to go all out against HaShem Himself, such vile, disgusting material. That is ???? ??????, no different that any of our meshumadim in the past. The only difference is she’s doing it on such a large scale.
??? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ???
If she had any marbles, she’d hurriedly retract and destroy any/all of her filth…
There this clip I heard:
Telemarketer calls. The guy picks up and hears who it is. He changes his voice to that of an official. Says he, “You’ve just reached the crime scene of the deceased xxx. Did you know this xxx? No, don’t hang up, we’ve already traced your number. How many times have you spoken to xxx?…” You hear this telemarketer REALLY getting frightened, trying to get his point across that he’s only a telemarketer, but this “official” doesn’t let up. “Let me have your first name…”
The guy got a run for his money.
The Great Bear of Creedmoor:
I’m sorry I caught your ire.
No, I’m not one to ‘darshen’. No. Not at all.
But I didn’t think it proper to mock or deride Yiddishe ‘inyanim’ with the wave of a hand.
As far as my attitude… well that’s another story.
The Great Bear of Creedmoor:
Interesting you should pick precisely this week for your rants.
(1) The source of Emunas Tzadikim, ??????? ??’ ????? ????.
(2) The source of Shirayim, ?????? ?? ?’ ?’ ???? ?? ???? (3.
(3) The source of mockery, scorn, derision – ???? ????!
No, we’re not a superstitious people. But it’s the way one puts to pen (keyboard) that shows… I have not learned much, but I suppose baalei mussar don’t take a liking to letzonus.
Let’s try again, Josh. I assume you didn’t read my previous posts.
Every frum woman has a right to choose a husband who will go out to work. This may come as a shock to you & every else on your band wagon – they also have a right to choose a husband who will learn in kollel! Like I wrote before (over & over), it’s the couple’s choice. Not mine. Not even your’s. It’s their lifestyle & destiny they’re forging, they don’t necessarily have to follow your’s.
In my humble opinion, there’s nothing wrong with the wife deciding she wants more from life, a ‘derhoibene’, uplifting, accomplished, spiritual lifestyle, a Torah-dig home, a holy mikdash me’at, where Torah & mitzvohs rule. Where she knows he’s supporting fully with ruchnius and she’ll fill in the rest. No, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that arrangement.
-“Sorry, but I know shtus when I see it!”
Second time around. Did you peek at sam4321’s response?
Oh oh. Waxing on the profound again.
There’s something fascinating I heard in the name of the Gr”a. There’s a passuk about the Torah someting to the effect of ????? ???? ???, which is taken as face value to indicate that the Torah is longer than the world. Nu nu.
The Gr”a understands “midah” not to mean measurment, but ‘the measure’, the measuring stick.
Even the measuring stick, used to measure the Torah, is longer that the world.
Internalize the passuk ?? ?? ??? ???? ?’ ?????.
I was told of a certain oved HaShem in the hospital who, when overcome with pain would cry out “Ai”, when it subsided, he would exclaim “AH!”. He would be thanking HaShem for sending him his “pekeleh”! Of course one must be in that madreiga, to actually thank HaShem for it, but it’s worth knowing it’s essence, and that such people do exist.
It was actually this same person who someone once embarrassed b’rabbim, publicly. Someone else noticed this recipeint overcome with such true joy, elation. When asked he explained that all yesurim have a cleaning power, the more intense the greater “wiping” (?????? ??????). However most yesurin come with a downside, sickness, bitul Torah and minyan, business etc. The pain of embarrassment is the only anguish that has no lasting side effects. (If I remember correctly, he even went over to thank the generous bestower)
There’s a chosheve man I know who once got into an accident. His whole family made it out alive, minus one ever beloved, sweet, eherliche daughter. He made a seudas Hadaah for his family, some time later. During the seudah he said that it was also to thank HaShem for taking his daughter, ??? ???????, HE TOOK IT LITERALLY!! Yes there are such people around today.
There’s a passuk that says
????? ???? ???? ???? ?’ ?? ???? ?? (I think that’s how it goes), later on when all will be clear to us, we will all thank HaShem for all of his yisurim. Why not tune in now and start thanking already. A person must not be ???? ??? ???? but at times it’s proper to say ?????? ??????.
May you be yotzai already any yisurim destined for you to endure, by “kabalas yisurim”
??? ???? ??? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ?? ?? ??? ?????? ?????? ????.
To the great bear..
I don’t think it’s so wise to jump to such ridicule. There might just be a credible source to it. Things like this passed from mother to daughter…
By thinking. Really. Along the lines you so well put down.
The Skvere chasidim hold that the world is square!
They just want to know which threads here pull you.
(CR-ing too much ???)
I think to lie is to move away from HaShem. The seal of HaKodosh Boruch Hu is emes. The absolute truth. Any step towards falsehood his moving away from HaShem. That’s why it is the only aveira that says ???? – distance yourself from it.
We learned in Tanach about the spirit of Navos, who suggested to HaShem that he become a ??? ??? – a consciousness of falsehood in the mouths of the prophets. HaShem told him ??, go out, (get out of here) out of the ????? of the proximity of HaShem’s presence. It was an important job, however it cannot be in the ?????, closeness of HaShem.
(Any local CR Rabbi or Talmudician would be better equipped to answer..)
Dr. Middos overheard Sir Columbus on the boat talking to his men, “I told you men, the world, she’s not a flat, she’s rrrrround!”
Oomis, I made up in the Mechila thread. I thought I made myself clear.
Let me try again. Besides of what Toi shlit”a wrote, (read it twice, at least see someone else’s opinion), let me try to stress one point here.
There’s an Ohr HaChayim somewhere I believe that speaks about someone denigrating Torah, or Torah study. Not that good. However minute, it still is belittling HaShem’s Torah. Now hear this – we too face reality, (someone here’s providing..), not everything should be aired freely. Gemarah, too, writes about earning a livelihood. I believe it is dealt with a length. (Gemarah techies can maybe back me up on this.) A couple’s commitment, choice of lifestyle etc. is up to them. They and we all know reality. It’s your blanket statements that are not ‘Torah-dig’, they certainly don’t belong on a ‘Yeshiva World’.
WHY LOOK DOWN ON LEARNING BOYS?? Oh, because you think they’re not productive! They lack ‘self-respect and satisfaction…’ Well then, I guess that’s a part of ??? ???? ??? ????.
In case anyone missed my previous post:
Most controversial opinion here – there’s nothing wrong with learning HaShem’s Torah!!
In my humble opinion it’s EVERY Jewish man’s privilege and obligation. For all men. Not only great promising minds and personalities. Not just to develop to become a Rabbi or Rosh HaYeshiva. To learn HaShem’s Holy Torah as HE INTENDED IT TO BE LEARNED.
How can one not versed in all of Torah DARE GIVE AN OPINION?!? One who doesn’t fully comprehend the value of Torah, its holiness. Would a man wander into the ladies’ domain giving his opinion about female issues right and left?!? Would one give a precious stone to a butcher for appraisal?
One must tread EXTREMELY CAREFULLY regarding this topic. Overstepping borders on Apikorsus – ??? ???? ??? ????. Yes, even here on an open (anonymous) forum. A chilul HaShem generated by some careless remark, is not regarded lightly upstairs. If we were zoche to a generation that has some sort of system, Torah & Kollel families where Torah rules supreme and the primary focus is on the Ruchnius, who is going to be to Letz, the Amalek, to laugh it off?!?
Messages went wireless – pigeons. Sometime by airwaves – smoke.
The OP was lying about how to spell it.
To the ones so worried about the over-worked wives.
Its their choice. They truly were looking for such a fulfilling, rewarding, HAPPY lifestyle! Yes. Look around. Walk around the streets of Kollel families (true ones, one whose husband learns enough to share home). See the inner bliss, simchas hachayim radiating off the faces of these overworked wives and mothers. They truly know where they’re headed. ????? ???? ?????, is said of these ??? ???. They know they’re the first to get the Tal of Techiya. – ??? ???? ?? ?????…
Are they complaining to you?? Ha. I bet some of them feel bad for you!!
Let me try again (?? ??? ????)
Most controversial opinion here – there’s nothing wrong with learning HaShem’s Torah!!
In my humble opinion it’s EVERY Jewish man’s privilege and obligation. For all men. Not only great promising minds and personalities. Not just to develop to become a Rabbi or Rosh HaYeshiva. To learn HaShem’s Holy Torah as HE INTENDED IT TO BE LEARNED.
How can one not versed in all of Torah DARE GIVE AN OPINION?!? One who doesn’t fully comprehend the value of Torah, its holiness. Would a man wander into the ladies’ domain giving his opinion about female issues right and left?!? Would one give a precious stone to a butcher for appraisal?
One must tread EXTREMELY CAREFULLY regarding this topic. Overstepping borders on Apikorsus – ??? ???? ??? ????. Yes, even here on an open (anonymous) forum. A chilul HaShem generated by some careless remark, is not regarded lightly upstairs. If we were zoche to a generation that has some sort of system, Torah & Kollel families where Torah rules supreme and the primary focus is on the Ruchnius, who is going to be to Letz, the Amalek, to laugh it off?!?
Syag, again, I don’t have time now to go through reading and posting. Just peeking in to clear my head from some demanding brain-work.
This is an excerpt from what I intended to pen back to Oomis. I abandoned, it was taking too much time (I can’t write English that well), and stored it.
(b) I did that for dramatic effect.
(d) I apologize.
Oomis:
I don’t have the time to again answer. I understand English. I do understand where you’re coming from.
PLEASE. Don’t mitigate Torah study IN ANY WAY. For my sake. For YOUR SAKE. You don’t need that on your head. Read what I wrote about ??? ?????? ??????? ?? ????. Please. We all here know what parnasa, husbands and wives are. Not all know what Torah is. From your writing alone I detect that.
For one: Torah study is not only for Eluyim, great thinkers, sharp minds. It is for everyone. Everyone who studies brings the shechina to this world.
Two: A wife who consents, is not doing chesed. She’s doing TORAH. And it’s the couple’s decision, NOT YOUR’S.
I have so much more to write on this, I just don’t have the time. I just had to STICK UP FOR HASHEM’S TORAH.
Again don’t attack something until you really understand it’s true value. YOU DON’T.
One more thing, sister. Am Yisroel, HaShem and His Torah are one.
Thank you. It is encouraging to know someone else too is on his team.
Toi: No, let’s have it here. That was a point I believe Rabbi Miller Zatzal made too. People were beginning to doubt Gedolim. Enlightment, refomism, modernism. So HaShem took away for some time the ability of true gedolim to guide at that most crucial hour. If one does a bit of research he/she will find that many chosheve Rabbonim were not able to give clear answers at that terrible era, clearly a divine intervention. Midah kneged midah. ????? ???? ?????, it was said about that time. Again caused BECAUSE of what mockers here are trying again..
Feif:
Indeed – straight out of Rabbi Miller’s book. I don’t have it in front of me now so I can’t quote it verbatim, I’ll try as best as my memory allows.
“So this Rabbi, whose hair reaches to his naval, gets up and says, ‘Should we follow our Rabbanim like BLIND SHEEP…?’ Indeed, blind sheep. A Jewish nation without its Torah-true Gedolim as its eyes, are truly like blind sheep.” Read on. It’s in English. I think it’s in ‘Awake My Glory’.
In my Torah (Bible, for the uneducated) it says ‘????? ?? ?? ???? ??? ????? ??…?? ???? ?? ???? ??? ????? ?? ???? ?????. Then there’s the famous Rashi (I think quoting Medrash) even if they say of the right that it’s left. Excuse me, that’s the holy Torah I just quoted. (I think even the king james version has it too). Yes, people make mistakes. All humans. Do you think a proud modern orthodox is best equipped to discern those of our cherished true Gedolim?? Is that all MO has to offer – ??? ???? ?? ???????? It takes true Jewish humility and Yiddishe sechel to know HOW to have true Emunah. Dasan & co., Korach & co., did not. Wanna join??
I don’t have to put all my cards down on the table here, suffice it to say I’m brilliant enough to know how to use a computer. (obviously). I am truly blessed with a Torah – true upbringing to know how to channel my sechel into Emunah in HaShem and His Gedolim. Thank you Mommy.
..And one more thing:
Isn’t it interesting that precisely this week of Parshas HaMan, folks here are worried about parnassa, how HaShem will provide for those learning.
Rashi in Chumash this week’s parsha says “Jews in the future, in times of Yirmiyahu, will ask ‘Should we leaave our work and occupy ourselves with Torah?’ The Navi will then show them the man. Look how HaShem provided for your fathers. ???? ?????? ?? ?? ????? ????? ???? ??????.”
>>Occupy Torah<<
HaLeiVi:
Your second point of Rashi, when the heavenly orbs were set in, it was night of Wednesday in Eretz Yisroel. Over here in “the States” it did not shine yet, so what’s the problem? Besides, maybe HaShem gave the world “a spin” only after Wednesday?
As to your general contention, I believe there was some obstinate Rabbi long ago who got lost and thought Friday to be Shabbos. Until he was a guest at the home of a sharp minded Rabbi, who straightened things out..
Let me try once more.
If I let this without rebuttal I’m afraid of ??? ?????? ??????? ?? ????.
Oomis, Feif, and anyone else who’s against Torah study.
There’s a big difference between one who must go to work, while being truly ????? Torah, and those of you with attitudes like “what’s he doing for the world anyway..”, “obligated to work at least half, presumably more..” etc. Again as I wrote, “where the wife consents”.. there is nothing greater. Obviously, it’s not for the wife your sticking up for, it’s the Torah learning you’re against. I’m truly sorry for having been brought up with Torah – true values.
And Simcha613, I’m, too, referring to to real Torah study. One enough to share with the wife and supporters.
Again this is all when feasible. When not, we apply the ruling ???? ????? ??????. (hey, did that come from some Talmud somewhere?) But an all out “KOLLEL LIFE IS TERRIBLE”, “say no to learning” sounds like pre-Chanuka days. Let me be a Modern Day MACABI. Whoever is for HaShem and His Torah, let’s hear it.
Again?
As I wrote before – Rabbi Avigdor Miller Zatzal. He was so knowledgeable in all fields. All of Torah. All, like in “all”. Tanach, gemarah, medrashim, seforim… Sciences, world histories, secular writings.. All!
What a personality!
I remember thinking at one shiur, how we have to “chap arein”, to hear from such a (then) living Godol. His mussar. How he explained how things in the world work. How he interpreted modern day events with Torah eyes. A real inspiration.
OK, you pushed me. I think (uh oh, thinking again) MO and TTJ are not the same.
Feif:
1) What in the world is so bad about learning. Hey that’s what the world was invented for. Ever said Tefillas HaShela? As I wrote before, if partner consents there is no greater cause.
2) Just in time for our parsha – ??????? ??’ ????? ????. (Dasan & Co. had your views)
3) Could you care to elaborate what exactly is Da’as Torah.
4) What is a “ketubah”? Why should a husband fulfill what it says there? Oh! It says about it in talmud? So, let’s learn about it first. Which brings us back to #1. I don’t think its the “supporting” that you’re for, it’s something else you’re against. And writing about it in a “YESHIVA world”.
OK, this is REALLY controversial:
Someone in the “counselling industry” should not take so much to heart.
gavra, aimhabonim; thanks.
It really should be normative, sadly a lot of these points are greatly contested (as evidenced on this thread alone!).
Mine:
1) Boys and girls (not from one family) should be kept apart – as per halachah.
2) Hilchos bein Adam L’makom are as important as bein Adam L’chaveiro.
3) Young men learning full time at the say-so from their partners – are indeed upholding the world. Someone to question that is in the category of ????? ??? ???? ??? ????. Schar a partner gets is immeasurable.
4) Middos tovos are derived from the Torah and based on Chazal, not modern day etiquette and (debased) morals.
5) A Torah Jew performing mitzvohs to its fullest creates a Kiddush HaShem – that’s how we are “a light to the nations”. No need for any extras. Also no need to worry that doing HaShem’s ratzon will cause a chilul HaShem.
6) Tznius issues of women should not be taken lightly. If one causes a man to have improper thoughts (or worse), it’s on the woman’s shoulders. Every man, another sin. In Olam HaEmes, there’s a Great Judge, with a great computer… The line “well, they shouldn’t look” does not stand AT ALL.
7) Our heroes are our Gedolim, not politicians or (so called) Jewish singers.
.. so far. MORE TO COME
(you asked for it)
Does anyone know where this came from, I had this a long time ago, a children’s something or other…
1) Who’s gonna sleep on the top…
2) My mommy loves me..
3) Balabusta (?) book store
4) Children talking Torah in the street
Hi Rezdy
Long time no see.
Need something to do? Hang out over here!!!