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LU
I dont think its for you,
Back to my original question, Is it OK to speak Loshon Harah about it?
The Chosen was written in 1967 during Rav Moshe’s Lifetime. I am sure someone at some time asked him about it. I would not call it Kefira unless Rav Moshe said this book was Kefira
Jewish Literature and frum literature are not nessasarily the same thing
Obviosuly Reb Saunders is not a real person. Its a novel.
This was the original post where I brought it up
Warning – According to halacha, it is assur to say anything negative about a book, so posters should be careful about their responses.
Do you same that as well for the Chosen and Portonoys Complaint?
I dont think I praised Portnoys complaint in that statement, I did say it was a classic in the secular world. But those 2 statement are not against either other.
Randomex is referring to Portonoys Complaint by Philip Roth
Most people have not read the original Tevye the Milkman. I am reading it now, but its a bit tough as it doesnt translate well into english (Tevye is always quoting some biblical quotes and its doesnt work so well in english). I do not read Yiddish so I must use the english translation
When I quoted Fiddler on the Roof I was refering to the musical, but the thread was about books so I sort of interchanged them.
I never advocated reading them, I only brought up Chaim Potak and Philip roth because you said we cannot say lashon harah about a book. I made an assumption you would not like either one of them (Or for that matter Fiddler on the Roof which is the most famous portrayal of frum life which i didnt think you would like either)
I was posting all day and it went up immediately
I had to make extra careful what I said to make sure wrong things werent said
LU
Some people think change of Lvush is the road to OTD
Fiddler on the Roof is a show based on a Series of Short Stories by Sholoem Alchem called Tevye the Milkman.
The whole wedding scene is not in the Book. The section on Tzeitel ends when Goldie agrees to let her marry The Tailor Motel Kamzoil instead of Lazer Wolf whom the Matchmaker suggests.
Shalom Alechem came from that world (Of the Shtel) and he wrote Satire of it.
The problem as I see it , in the general world nothing is sacred and you can pretty much say what you want. You can portray any character any way you want. You can also portray people as complex individiduals . for example In the chosen Reb Saunders has a dark side. A frum book would never show a dark side to a Rav (I didnt say a sinning side, just a darker side)
Yes you can post without moderation
a serious bachur wearing a sweater is no doubt the greatest threat facing the klall. There should be mandatory attendance asifas to address it. Community resources must be committed to resolve it.
+1
That is where there is a similar idea
Read the Hebrew Mishpacha Magazine Obituary of Rav Elyashiv
Many frum people consider Fiddler on the Roof (Tevye the Milkman) a negative portrayl, however most people think of it as very lovingly
is there are secular jewish work you approve of?
I never said you had to like the book, I gave my opinion, you are entitled to your own opinion.
I was aware you were a BT which is why I had said earlier that I suspected you had already read it (I also suspect SY might have read it as well)
Like Ive seen, ive read “Frum” Books and you see things like how the father spent all his time learning (and not spend with the son)
You are also spending all your energy on this one aspect of “The Pain and the widsom of the silence” There is alot more to the book than that.
You dont seem to mention how the Rebbe really took a liking to the Less relgious boy and invited him over regulary (Except during the Zionist phase)
We are not going to agree on this topic .
Ive read enought Art Scroll “Histories” to know how to write such a book. Anything remotely seeming to be negative towards Rebbes is rarely put in them. If you are not used to a more general light then the Chosen is not for you.
Ive read books from frum authors saying similar things.
The problem is it came from a Non-frum author
Just curious Avram and SY
Did you read the actual book, or just read some synpapsis? (Its very possible you did read the book)
I think it is, but I am not the last word on this topic.
And just because there might be some things that might look negative, it doesnt make the whole story.
If you want to say the Chassic Boy cutting off his peyos and going to Columbia to study Freud is a terrible thing, there isnt much we can discuss , no matter what is in the rest of the book (I realize for many that is all that matters)
I think its positive towards the frum community, However I do understand and know that people disagree with me and think its negative towards the frum community. Alot of those people might not have read the book, just have heard a Synapsis of it .
I did read the book
I’m not sure those in chassidic frum communities would agree.
I dont doubt it, which is why I was suprised so many had heard of it.
SY
I went to a MO High School and I read it there. Because its controversial it wasnt madatory and the teacher was forced to give people a choice either the Chosen or some other book (I forgot the name)
Did you read the book or are you just qutoting people who may or might not have read the book and just decided it was bad.
You also forget the other part of the book, while it is true the Chassidic boy did become more modern. The More modern boy became more relgious, again maybe not what his father wanted
The creators of Superman were jewish and the early Superman comics were somewhat taken from the Jewish experience at that time
Maybe he didnt want to become Rosh Yeshiva.
Portonys Complaint is not by Chaim Potak, its by Philip Roth
The reason I am shocked that so many frum people heard of the chosen is because many are not happy that the chassidish boy at the end becomes more modern and goes to college (The book never says he goes OTD from yiddishkeite, just doesnt want to be chassidish anymore) but I think for many it seems like he went OTD
I should have said English Literature, not Jewish Literature as Kafka was better than Philip Roth, but Kafka wrote in German
It does shock me the in the frum commnity almost everyone has heard of the Chosen (Its actally is quite positive towards the frum community) but in the general secular world Portonys Complaint is one of the most famous books of Jewish Literature
Anne Frank is probably the most famous jewish literature book
Superman was actually has jewish roots
Warning – According to halacha, it is assur to say anything negative about a book, so posters should be careful about their responses.
Do you same that as well for the Chosen and Portonoys Complaint?
The market for Seforim is very small. I really doubt many seforim even sell 1000 copies
I had a close relative who had a book published by Art Scroll (or Feldheim, I forgot which) and thats how I found out he didnt get paid and even his own father had to buy his own copy of the book
I have never heard this Lvush story before, so what I am just saying here is conjecture.
Sometimes stories are told over and people dont convey the facts correctly.
There was no IDF in Rav Kook’s time, but there was paramilitary groups and paramilitary uniforms. He could have been wearing a Paramilitary uniform of a precursor to the IDF and when the story has been repeated, someone mistook the paramilitary uniform of a pre-cursor to the IDF as and actual IDF uniform
YWN’s obituary of Dr Ephraim Shach (Notice the Z’L)
Most Seforim are Self-Published today and even if you get someone like Art-Scroll to publish it, they dont pay you (And you even have to buy the books for yourself and close family members)
I got my car pretty quickly from the dealer and I got exactly what I wanted at the best possible price (You have to negotiate tough with car dealers)
I dont lease cars, i only purchase them
I just got my car from the dealer directly. Much easier
42
This is not a place to ask such a question
Most people prefer to live in the NYC Area (Includes Monsey, Lakewood etc) , Baltimore or South Florida with a smattering in other places like LA pr Chicago area
They prefer places with lots of other jews
LB
Actually City names DO change
Some examples
Lemberg is now called Lviv
Vlina is now called Villinus
Pressberg is now called Bratislava
Rav Shachs Grandchildren including his grandaughters were in the IDF.
I heard when they came to visit him in the yeshiva in their uniforms, He treated them like any Zaidy would
There is nothing wrong with the Rebecca Rubin doll other than it costs $100
I got one for the kids (I got a $50 off coupon) and its very appropirate as its describes life when their ancestors came to NY and the struggles of their grandparents when they first came her.
And the fact of the matter is , we did change tradtions. We do not speak Yiddish, we speak American (English).
the problem isnt the Tzdekah, its the driving around in a limosine and the boys are usually Drunk.
It is not kavod for the yeshiva to send a bunch of Drunk Talmidim to collect Tzdekah
American Girl has a Jewish Doll, Rebecca Rubin
I need to move to Amsterdam….
Someone explained it to me as this.
Alot of people are blaming Trump for increasing Anti-Semitism , which Turx did not know. When Turx asked the question, Trump took it differnetly thinking Turx was blaming him for Anti-Semitism, which is not what Turx meant
That question was not antagonistic at all. It was a normal question
It is perfectly OK to get benefit from non-kosher animals, otherwise you could not wear leather (Even if the leather comes from a Kosher Animal, it wasnt properly schected) and Streimels are made from fur