Put on Country Yossi’s “Mitzva Tantz” and get ready for years of taking care of grandchildren!

Who cares if you’re “old”? When did you officially become “an adult”? When you got married? Bought your first home? Had your first child? Married your first child? Age is just a number. (Unless it comes to medical issues, then getting old starts when the doctors start telling you “at your age you can expect…”)

Although we try to be Dan L’Kaf Zechus on everyone, I don’t donate to a cause unless there are at least some reputable Rabbonim signed on. Who is her families Rov? Maybe he can start a fundraising campaign.

Joseph: We’ve been through this before. Lev Tahor’s <i>only</i> defender is Frankfurter from Ami magazine. And in that article, he confirms nearly every major allegation made against the cult but tries to play it off like there’s nothing wrong with taking kids away from their parents or marrying off 14 year olds. I don’t know why you are so insistent on defending them. Do you think it’s normal for a guy with a minimal Yeshiva education to declare himself an Admor, become a huge kiruv macher, but insist that everyone live in extreme seclusion from the rest of the frum world and hold of an invented chumradicke standard of tznius and halacha?

What about if you wear contacts on a shidduch date, but never wear them otherwise?

I used to like Variations when it was one of two tapes in my bunk at Camp Rayim (the other was MBD’s “Yerushalayim We Will Never Leave You”). I tried to go back to it when I was older and couldn’t stomache the music. Partially because it’s just not as good as Abie Rottenberg, partially because it’s all goyishe songs with a few lyrics changed around to sound a little more Yiddish.

A BTL is only worthless for careers. It’s very useful for academics. You can forgo “filler” classes that many colleges require you to take, and it’s also much easier to get accepted in certain programs if you already have a degree.

And the story is true. He would tell bachurim in Ohr HaChaim and Shaarei Chaim that when he hears that the Yankees won, he would still get a little feeling of thrill.

Can we go full bore PC and change Hebrew too? From now on instead of saying “בן אדם” or even “בן אנוש” in any conjugation, you have to specify “בת חוה” if it refers to women or “בן אדם/בת חוה” if it could be either. So when you want to say in Hebrew “Look at all those people there!” you would say instead of “תסתכל על כל בני אדם שמה” rather “תסתכל על כל בני אדם בנות חוה שמה”. That would simplify matter greatly I feel.

Stupid question, but where are you ordering from? 2002? I haven’t seen packing peanuts in years. Most companies either use cardboard supports or inflated plastic bags.

Will he be “neutral” in between the Israelis and Palestinians?

Yes. A huge part of his campaign has been about isolationism. He will state his vocal support of Israel, but work very hard to stop the aid and to not get involved in any peace treaties or what have you.

Can Encyclopedia Brittanica elaborate on the different algorithms for Bayesian networks and have links to various implementations?

Ainay udway ereeway uchmay ikelay otay eepday riefay ehthay adioray andnay andhay itnay utay ehthay ostmanpay.

Rav Moshe Heineman SHLITA of the Star K has a minhag to eat half a raisin and a piece of celery to “have a raise in salary”.

SayIDidIt: Nazis also used the reverse swastika (which the tumedika internet tells me is called a sauwistika). But it’s more prominently displayed at a 45 degree angle, like on the Third Reich flag. In Eastern cultures it’s almost always lying flat.

Joseph: First off, you still didn’t address all the issues I pointed out very clearly. Namely, those issues where you don’t need a magazine article to verify are true.

The kidnapping charge was 25 years ago and there were Rabbonim then that stood behind him. More recently, around 10 years ago, New York authorities like Child Protective Services leveraged accusations and investigations against the cult which responded by moving to Canada. And in that case, no one stood behind him.

The accusations stem from far more than just “two non-frum people”, there have been multiple articles based on interviews with cult members and people who went into their compounds to investigate, including one by Ami the very magazine you source to defend them! Let’s focus on one: The Mishpacha. Was that by a, ahem, “bitter youngster” or was that by a frum person who dealt with them and spoke with current members?

The were only in Quebec because they had the same issues in Monsey! No Rabbonim or askonim stood up for them and several were very outspoken against them. Unless the “notoriously anti-Semitic Monseyites” were out to get them too? Explain that contradiction: How come Monsey has no problem with the thousands of Chassidim that live within its borders but gave endless tzores to this small group of a few dozen? Why does Montreal not treat Tosh the same way they treated LT?

You are ignoring most of my objections and comments instead repeating the same falsehoods and half-truths over and over again.

I repeat myself. Most of the articles written against LT came from frum authors in frum news sources who actually went and spoke with LT members themselves. Although there were some off the derech frum-hating people that accused them, they were the minority.

I repeat again. One of the reasons I stopped reading Ami magazine was because of how they addressed two of the major allegations against Lev Tahor. The teen marriages and taking kids from their parents. Both were brushed aside. My memory isn’t perfect, but it sure isn’t that faulty. If you have the article in front of you (as you claim) then read those parts again and explain them.

I repeat noch veiter. There is no Da’as Torah in the LT cult. Everything is dictated by their guru who is a Ba’al Teshuva that spent less time in Yeshiva than most people in CR. The members grow up barely knowing how to read a gemara, yet they spend all day reciting the words of this mans books.

I repeat for the last time. They have no support of gedolim. Only a small handful of Rabbonim have spoken in support of them. And said support usually consists of “Don’t be so harsh to them, you don’t know all the details.” But that’s eclipsed by all the Rabbonim who have publicly spoken out against them.

If you could answer those objections, I will see your argument as having merit. As it stands, all you’ve been doing is repeating the same thing: that my sources can’t be trusted as you don’t think that they are frum enough.

Hotel lobby. Pretty boring in retrospect. I came to her house 10 minutes late due to being lost. Her mother answered the door and we exchanged pleasantries. We drove to a hotel, sat down, ordered a coke for me and water for her. We talked. I brought her home and said good night.

I one time had to travel to the Far East for business. There were swastikas and reverse swastikas everywhere. It’s an old symbol for luck. The Nazi swastika is sort of at a 45 degree angle which is how it differs from the Eastern symbol.

Joseph: Every frum magazine and website from our own YWN, the Aguda affiliated Cross Currents, to Mishpacha. Better yet, what Rav or gadol supports them, because they clearly have no da’as Torah.

I did not speak with them and my only interactions was occasionally running into frum naqib-clad women in Rockland Kosher 10 years ago. But virtually everyone who’s last name isn’t “Frankfurter” that had any interaction with them confirms the allegations. I don’t have the Ami article in front of me, but you clearly do. Frankfurter asks him about the teenage marriages and children being taken from their homes. Can you post what the LT guru responds to that?

And again, Ami didn’t address a lot of the accusations, like members not being allowed to work outside the commune, or the schools teaching only the stuff that the guru wrote, or the guru not actually having much experience in terms of learning. And, like I said, even Ami had at one point written an article attacking them.

In general we say that the burden of proof is on the accuser, but in this case there are about a dozen or so accusers (some frum some secular) and one very shakey defense. So I’m going to ignore the ??? ???? on this one. You’re more than welcome to keep defending them, but so long as your defense consists of “Come on guys! Be dan l’kaf z’chus!” I’m going to ask you to extend that to all Jews, including Meyer Lansky, Lepke Buchalter, Madoff, Gilad Atzmon, the entirety of the Israeli government, and all those horrific college going working people.

Joseph: I honestly cannot believe that you are defending them. There have been multiple investigations, both by secular authorities and frum organizations. Almost all of them substantiate each other, with the sole exception of the Ami article. And even the Ami article never contradicts some of the more major accusations, as I mentioned in my previous comment. Even Frankfurter later begrudgingly acknowledged that the accusations need to be seriously looked in to. Oh, and Ami had also previously published an article bashing Lev Tahor like everyone else did.

It shouldn’t take a genius to realize that there’s something seriously seriously wrong with Lev Tahor. Their guru never received smicha and determines everything about their lives. The kids only learn chumash and books written by the guru. Their manner of dress and adherence to kashrus goes far beyond what would even be considered machmir to the point where it may be k’negged halacha. There is no possibility for a member to have an independent income, all money is handled by the guru. Interviews with former members and families of members confirm most of the accusations. Members are almost exclusively either lieutenants of the guru chosen from his family, or new ba’alei teshuva or people from broken homes who don’t have a complete understanding of Yiddishkeit and need an authority figure as they’ve lost the connection to their family.

How can you possibly defend them?

BenK: Please write in a calm and coherent manner. I have difficulty reading your posts.

The super frum neighborhoods of Yerushalayim have a history of hating on the army. While I cannot agree with the actions of these people, I certainly am not surprised. This is the same neighborhood which pamphlets, petchkvilim, and graffiti are regularly being motzei shem ra on gedolei yisroel who have the audacity to say that joining the army is better than going off the derech.

Joseph: Read it again. He was specifically asked about taking children away from parents and teen arranged marriages. Read his responses.

I mean, if we are arguing as to whether or not to believe the authorities, we can just take the word of their guru in his interview with Ami. Mind you, Rabbi Frankfurter tried really hard to paint Lev Tahor in a positive light but there were certain things that there’s just no good way of saying it. Like when asked about the allegations that kids are taken away from their parents, the guru openly admitted that it happened and gave a hand-wavey non response basically saying “We admit that there may be better ways to do chinuch”. When inquiring about the arranged marriages of 13 year olds, the response was “Well, they are gedolim according to halacha!”.

And it’s not anti-Semitism either. There are a thousand thousand different Chassidishe groups out there, and you don’t see the frum oilom unilaterally forming against them. Nor do you see authorities swooping into New Square to declare the parents negligent.

Emmanuel was a single instance and resulted in a huge backlash against the medina stating rules for Yeshivos and Bais Yaakovs. There have only been a handful of similar incidents over the last few decades, such as the recent attempt at a ruling for the Misrad HaChinuch to define Bais Yaakov curriculum. It’s a song and dance that the government and Chareidim go through every few years. The government makes some decision, the Chareidim protest, and everything returns to normal.

I’d also like to get back to the thing I brought up earlier. These mythical people who somehow manage to spend their lives in ??? ???? without taking money from the government working for institutions that also take no Zionist money. Let me get this straight: They exist, but they probably number less than 100. I mean, when I was in Eretz Yisroel I heard of the idea. So did nearly every Israeli born Chareidi I knew. But when pressed, few of them could think of a single person who actually followed it.

There’s the Soleveitchik family, who support each other due to the fact that they have a lot of big American donors. Most of the money goes to one or two Yeshivas, which goes to the families as salaries. When they need medical attention, they fly to Europe and go to hospitals there so as not to have to rely on ???? ?????. I believe the Tannenbaums in Satmar B’nei Brak have a similar situation, but that’s about it. The vast majority of Chareidim, no matter how anti-medina/pro-Badatz they are, simply cannot live without government support.

And for that matter, Satmar and many other Chareidishe groups are pro-Palestinian rule. They aren’t all Neturei Karta, but they don’t exactly oppose their ????? either. How else do you interpret the words “?????? ??????? ??? ??? ???????”? Or setting clocks to “Islamic time” (12:00 is shekia) so as to not acknowledge “medina time”?

Joseph: Patently false. Both Satmar and Brisk have no problem accepting state funding for their shuls and Yeshivos (with the exception of the big ones that are funded by American dollars). And I’ve never heard of a sick person or pregnant woman pulling out a wad of cash at Bikur Cholim or Shaare Tzedek because they refuse to accept the state medical care.