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@Health I didn’t remember Lindell’s name, but I knew him as “The MyPillow Guy”. He immediately started screaming “Fraud!” almost as soon as the elections started, and changed the story every time an allegation he made was proven false. That’s why I don’t trust him. And I certainly won’t waste my time watching a video he put together. If there are hard and convincing pieces of evidence in the video, then by all means say them. But you can’t win an argument by saying “Well you didn’t watch these three hours of video I linked to, so you have no case”.
@n0mesorah I think a better question would be which health department did not insist on masks. The US national DOH and all fifty states mandated masks as did the Misrad HaBriyut in Israel. If you’re going to say that you don’t need to wear a mask when around other people during a pandemic, you have to have some form of massive amounts of documentation to defend your position.
My point about the speeding moshol was to counter the idea that the government cannot mandate something against “personal liberties” (a concept I have issue with within itself). The government can and does mandate things like that all the time, especially when your expression of your “personal liberties” puts others at risk.
I am not sure if you are aware of this, but your stance has been repeatedly questioned. Now I wonder if you have a real position on the matter.
By whom? Three or four members of the CR? A couple nutters on YouTube? Some retired holistic medicine doctor dredged up from the depths of wherever? Like I’ve said before, the overwhelming vast majority of people who know what they are talking about have said that during a COVID-19 pandemic in an unvaccinated population, masks must be worn when around other people.
@torahvaluesoverparty You’re basically setting an extremely high bar for disproving fraud charges while setting an extremely low bar for proving them. There’s no way they would have had “full unobstructed access” to everything to your satisfaction, but what they have should be enough.
@Health I had to search a little to figure out what “The Lindel Documentary” even is. It’s something called “Absolute Proof” by a guy named Mike Lindell. Anyway, I don’t really trust Lindell. He’s changed his story multiple times about the alleged election fraud, I highly doubt his “documentary” has anything new to offer. And if he does offer some massive damning evidence, why didn’t you mention it as opposed to being hyper focused on Jessy Jacob? I’m not going to post a 500 page point-by-point rebuttal of the documentary (others have already and they are pretty good), so why don’t you just pick what claim you think is strongest and we’ll discuss that?@ujm There’s a Gemara in Nashim (I think Kesuvos or Gittin) regarding an amah m’shuchreres (freed maidservant). The Gemara asks about how she can get married right after receiving her shtar shichrur (freedom) when if she would become pregnant immediately it would be unclear if the baby was her husbands or one of the men she was with when she was allowed to as an amah. The Gemara answers that if she knew she would be free, she would use contraception.
That’s one place. I don’t recall anywhere where Chazal criticize goyim for choosing not to have a lot of children.
@n0mesorah By not wearing a mask during a pandemic you put others in danger since you could be contagious and spreading disease without your knowledge. That’s what the health departments have been saying since May 2020. Similarly, by speeding in a residential zone, you are putting others in danger as no one is crossing the street expecting someone to be doing 80 around the corner.
Dear @torahvaluesoverparty sigh I really thought you would live up to your username. I had a feeling that no matter how the audit would go, you would find something to nitpick at, like one or two inconsistencies that you will use as some sort of leverage to say the whole thing must be bad. There’s never a major investigation without a few hiccups and inconsistencies. If the whole thing came out clean as a whistle it would be even more suspicious.
It looks like, despite your comments about restoring confidence in the election, you had your mind made up before the votes were even in. Either Trump won, or the election was stolen. Like I said to @Health, to say that the election was stolen is an extraordinary claim and it would require extraordinary evidence for me to believe it. So far I haven’t even seen ordinary evidence. There isn’t even anything substantial enough to cast suspicion on the election, never mind actual evidence of fraud.
And I’m not sure what you’ve been reading, but even the Trump worshippers over at NewsMax haven’t reported much about the audit other than the few minor issues I hinted to earlier. Pretty much every other news source is either ignoring it (like FoxNews and other right wing sites) or laughing at the incompetence of the Cyber Ninjas.
@n0mesorah You don’t have to jump on cultural ideas, you merely have to look at the numbers. Fertility is down, but populations are growing at a faster rate than ever before. Because people are living longer and children aren’t dying as much as they used to.
@ujm People practicing birth control was very much a thing. It’s mentioned in several places in Shas and Rishonim. The difference today is that people don’t feel compelled to have 10-12 children as they can be sure that it’s unlikely to have so many children die before adulthood.@n0mesorah The sevara that @MadeAliyah is using is that you can’t force people to do things that have a chance of saving someone’s life because almost everything we do has a potential to harm another person. I disagree with his logic because not wearing masks presents a clear and present danger, like speeding in a residential zone.
Birth rates are a statistical misdirection. You need to look at population growth rates. And I believe that the population growth rate is growing. Like someone said earlier, back in the day most pregnancies would not result in an individual surviving until adulthood. So families these days have less babies simply because they aren’t afraid of them all dying.
Dear @torahvaluesoverparty Don’t start hocking with a different audit. You said very clearly that if the Maricopa audit doesn’t turn up anything substantial you will admit that there’s nothing to the claims of election fraud.
@MadeAliyah You literally addressed none of my comment. Why are speed limits not attacking your personal liberties? Why should masks have not be required? You just keep harping on this flu narischkeit, pretending that it’s as dangerous and infectious as COVID like it’s some sort of massive shtuch on the whole masking requirement. While you admit that masks saved lives, you still are dismissive of it and claim that it shouldn’t be required because of “personal liberties”. You can’t just ignore the pandemic, it actually happened and masks really worked to slow it down. What is “default position” anyway? Some dream where people can do whatever they want? Like drive over the speed limit?
the need to save lives does not always require me to take action
So let me get this straight. You admit that masks directly saved lives, perhaps even many lives. You admit that you wore a mask when required and it wasn’t that big of a deal. And that far less people would have died had everyone listened to the governments when they were requiring masks. And yet you still think that some nonsense called your “personal liberties” takes precedence? Where are your “personal liberties” when the Shiltoin HaKoifrim demands you pay taxes? Or those chauvanist Rabbis insist that women wear long sleeves in the summer?
@Health So what you are saying is that you have no evidence of voting fraud and nobody saw any fraud happening. So what is it exactly that has you so convinced that it happened? Because as far as I can tell, Biden won the election like 99% of the world has been saying. So unless you have some really strong evidence to suggest otherwise, I’m going to stick with what the evidence shows.
If you think Yeshiva Bachurim have never tried to find creative and ethically questionable ways to make money, you never knew any Yeshiva Bachurim.
Artscroll is for the hamon am, for people who aren’t necessarily talmidei chachamim and for light reading. Many years ago I used this example to differentiate Artscroll from Feldheim. The number one best selling Feldheim book was a five volume comprehensive guide to the 39 melachos of Shabbos in this day and age full of footnotes, references, and detailed examples. The best selling Artscroll book was a fancy cookbook.
How many people under the payroll of Republican leaning news organizations were found to have Neo-Nazi connections? Mr. Lauren Southern? Brietbart? FoxNews?
@MadeAliyah The “default position” flew out the window when there was something called a “global pandemic” and “millions literally dying”. At that point the “default position” became “whatever experts said that would help mitigate the situation”. The experts were near-unanimously saying that if most people wear masks, the deaths would drop significantly. So to contradict that, you would need a very VERY good reason.
You keep getting back to the flu and I keep having to explain myself again. I actually did a lot of thinking back when your first made your comparison and looked up some details and statistics. You’re right, there’s no good number for “acceptable losses”. Especially when something as simple as wearing a mask can prevent it.
But, and I repeat myself, according to the experts, (unless there’s a flu epidemic going around) wearing a mask is just overkill. You can prevent people from dying from the flu by just using some seichel. Like don’t go to the supermarket when you’re running a fever. Or don’t bring your sniffling sneezing kids to visit Saba at the nursing home.
So we’re getting back to our speed limit analogy. Experts have determined safe speeds on the streets. That will not prevent all vehicle deaths, because bad mazal will still happen. Changing the speed limit to 5 KPH (nimshol: wearing masks for the flu) everywhere won’t stop people from ramming their bikes into buses, or falling under a car wheel. So we have safe speed limits and I think we are both in agreement that those are there for a reason and it’s a darned good one. But then we get to your logic of “personal liberties” (a concept completely foreign to Yiddishkeit) which sounds like taking Libertarianism to the extreme (Randism?). The concept of a society that cannot prevent people from doing things that is a danger to others is just broken and wrong. So Israel, the US, and almost every non-Somalian country in the world saying that people have to drive the speed limit (nimshol: wear masks during the worst pandemic in a century) is the right thing to do.
What I don’t get is this. Rabbonim and Rebbetzins have been standing up in front of their kehal for generations and telling people how to dress. Especially women. Often that way of dress is extremely difficult and uncomfortable. So why when it came to telling kehillos to wear masks did a lot of people balk and say “You can’t tell me what to do!”.
@Health Clearly Republicans can be fooled easily else we wouldn’t be having this conversation. Like you’re still convinced of something despite there being a near-total lack of evidence for it.
I’ve said it before, out of all the election judges, workers, watchers, etc. the strongest evidence is witnesses are a woman who was literally drunk and belligerent when testifying under oath and Jessy Jacob who couldn’t even give a time and date for what she thinks she saw. If that’s enough to convince you, then I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn.
I think it’s only a matter of time before the Republican base also turns against Israel. I think we should stop relying on the government for our protection and go back to having emunah and bitachon while we remember that we are still in galus and this gift that Hashem gave us of the State of Israel can be ripped away from us at any time.
@MadeAliyah We’ve already been through this. The speed limit should be low enough that the only way to cause loss of life is by sheer recklessness or extremely unlikely situations which no amount of laws (except those saying no leaving the home no matter what) can prevent. Getting rid of the speed limit because of “personal rights” would cause a massive increase in hospitalizations and deaths.
And no, the burden of proof is still on you since pretty much everyone who is knowledgeable about the subject says that wearing masks saved lives when COVID is rampant and people are unvaccinated. I can’t post links on YWN, but you can check the CDC or Misrad HaBriyut website yourself for proof.
So nu? Why didn’t you wear a mask before you were vaccinated (assuming you were vaccinated)? After all, the evidence and proof does say that it protects people?
@Health The specific thing you mentioned about changing ballot dates was her not understanding how the system works and ignorance of what she was being asked to do. So again, extraordinary claims, extraordinary evidence. A claim that can’t even be admissible to court isn’t even ordinary evidence, it’s literally nothing.
@Health You’re just posting the same Jessy Jacob article that we’ve already discussed. Turns out, not only could she not identify a single specific example of voter intimidation, but she was also clueless about how the balloting system even worked and a lot of her claims were her not understanding what was happening.
That’s why I don’t trust the NewsMax version of this story. Their only mentions of Ms. Jacob was her initial accusations from December 2020. They never posted any followups, like her ignorance, or how she couldn’t state any specifics. They’re currently trying to bury the story by pretending that it never happened. Fortunately, a quick Google search brings up dozens of articles about her.
@Health I have one screen name on this site, I think? Maybe I accidentally created another? I dunno.
Anyhoo, none of what you said is evidence. The lawsuits, as I mentioned, all just said vague statements that there may have been tampering, but no one can confirm. Not one shred of evidence strong enough to even be admissible to court has been proven.
@coffee-addict I believe those two fringe anti-evolution scientists not because they are the smartest or have the greatest reasoning, but because I have emunah in Hashem and His Torah. Are you saying that you believe NewsMax only because you have emunah in Trump?@Health Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. And your claims are pretty extraordinary. And your evidence is pretty… let’s say… less than extraordinary.
Liz Cheney and her father have been some of the most conservative, right-wing, voices in DC. She’s been an adamant and unwavering supporter of Israel her whole career. She’s staunchly conservative on all the family values issues that much of the frum oilom holds dear.
But she doesn’t like Trump.
Her ouster is disappointing. The GOP has moved from being the part of conservatives to the party of “Trump no matter what”.
@MadeAliyah With that sort of logic you can apply it to the police stopping people from speeding. What right do they have to prevent you from exercising your democratic right to drive as fast as you want?
@MadeAliya The proof is the CDC, the Misrad Habriyut, my local doctor, all the doctors I’ve spoken with, my Rov, my local Va’ad HaRabbonim, and about a thousand published papers all saying that wearing a mask should not be a choice as it saves lives. Not necessarily the lives of people wearing the mask, but people they are around.
Now, with that in mind, can you please defend your position that wearing a mask is a personal choice and if it makes you uncomfortable you can just not wear it?
@syag-lchochma I never said I am pro-death! Stop LYING!!!!!Do you deny that every year people die of the flu and that if everyone wore masks there were would be fewer deaths from flu?
In a word, yes. I explained my position in earlier comments, I’m not going to repeat myself.
At least the Carter Administration brokered one of the biggest peace deals (and financial compensation deals) in Israeli history. Biden is trying to be modern ex-president Carter, just shouting about how evil Israel is without doing anything substantial about it.
@daas-yochid Let me explain this in the same mature and level-headed manner in which you responded to most of my comments.
LIAR! I NEVER SAID THAT! WHY DO YOU ALWAYS LIE ABOUT EVERYTHING?!
@Health You only mentioned and quoted from two sources so that’s what I stuck with. Apparently, you consider sources such as Fox News, Jerusalem Post, and DailyWire too liberal and therefore completely untrustworthy. So I suggest you take a second look at your own opinions.
@madealiyah We can sit down and have an honest discussion right now, if you want. You admit that wearing a mask will protect other people from COVID-19, yet you refuse to wear a mask because it’s a minor inconvenience. That’s your position in a nutshell. Please defend that position without veering into tangents and attacking me.
@madealiyah I’m making an addendum to my previous post. There are definitely chesboinos people need to make when it comes to saving lives. An extreme example I just heard today was “Should a hospital bankrupt itself to save the life of one child?”. When it comes to the flu, the cheshbon isn’t so difficult since so few people die from the flue. When it comes to pre-vaccine COVID, it’s actually very likely to kill someone by not wearing a mask. To add to that, the cheshbon needed to protect others from the flu is minimal and doesn’t require much. It’s not that I don’t “care” about people dying from the flu, it’s that the link between me not wearing a mask and people dying from the flu is tenuous at best (as opposed to COVID where there’s a very strong link and correlation between mask wearing and dying).
I am not being unreasonable, nor taking your words out of context. You have made it absolutely clear on multiple occasions that your convenience is more important than keeping other people safe in some sort of bizarre perversion of “Im ein ani li mi li?” I can sit hear quoting your comments all day, but I think this one:
@MadeAliya: How can anybody demand that people should wear a mask to protect others?
really drives the point home.
@Health and @coffee-addict If literally every single news organization except two fringe ones are too “liberal” and “fake” for you, maybe the issue isn’t the media but what you are choosing to believe.
@Health Then don’t debate! If you don’t want to accept my word and the value of my sources, then look up the sources yourself. Start by ignoring fake news like Russia Today, NewsMax, OAN, and DonaldJTrump dotcom. See what media from opposing sides have to say (i.e. FoxNews and CNN). If you read a story that was written when the event was still ongoing (i.e. “A polling judge is going to court over the fraud she saw”) find a follow up story to see what happened with it (“Polling judge who alleges fraud could not give a single concrete example and demonstrated a lack of knowledge of how polling works”). An easy way to research is to look at the bottom of a Wikipedia page and read the sources. There’s a few dozen pertaining to the fraud allegations on the page “2020 United States Presidential Elections” alone.
Good luck!
@madealiyah The reason that the flu spreads is because people who are showing symptoms of the flu aren’t careful and infect others. If everyone is careful about the flu, no one will die from it. COVID is different, since it much more often can infect others without symptoms. So the level of effort needed to be careful with COVID is much more chamor, hence the masks.
For the upteenth time at what point does “more” make a difference?
The point where it makes a difference, in this context, is where it lowers the infection rate to below one. The flu has an infection rate of about 1.4 mostly because people aren’t careful and do things like interact with others while they have a fever, or send their kids to school when they may not be feeling well and the flu is going around. Taking the same care with COVID as most people do with the flu will give COVID an infection rate of about 3. So again, there is a much higher level of effort needed to stop people from dying from COVID than to stop people from dying from the flu. And that includes wearing masks.
So if you care about people dying from the flu, don’t send your sick kids to their friends house. If you care about people dying from COVID, wear a mask. (This last sentence may not be applicable if most of your community is vaccinated). I do both.
Woe is to me, for I have been found guilty of being inconvenienced by wearing a face diaper, and losing a job!
I’m glad you finally admit it. Your convenience is more important than the lives and health of others.
You do not want to “demand that people should mask to protect others” from the flu,
I think we covered that. Wearing a mask is pointless if you’re doing the minimal needed to protect others from the flu.
Far vos nisht? There’s a well known and chasiv Rebbetzin who runs a seminary whose husband is a huge talmid chacham, but worked as a banker and I don’t believe ever got semicha.
@Health I’m sorry, but for my and your own mental health I think I’m going to have to stop you here. You are not sounding like a reasonable person. You’re repeating half-truths while ignoring whole-truths. You’re not being calm and rational, you’re just using exclamation points everywhere and calling everyone who doesn’t agree with you 100% as “Liberal” or “Leftist”.
Please take things down a notch or ten and stick to facts. Then maybe we can talk.
Like what @meir-g said, it depends. If the shidduch is between two 30 year old people that are having a hard time finding shidduchim, I don’t think any checking is necessary before the first date. If it’s between two 21 year olds through a shadchan that met each of them once, you absolutely must call at least one reference before the date.
@Health Right now, what we’re arguing is whether or not a statement given by an individual alleging fraud has any truthiness if they refuse to name names, places, or times under oath. Myself (and pretty much every lawyer on the planet) says no. You say otherwise. Let’s move on.
You are continuing to ignore the specific cases and rebuttals I brought down in favor of this NewsMax non-story about a woman alleging fraud. Nu?
Overnight kugel of course, kept warm in the crock pot with the cholent! What’s wrong with you people that this can even be a shaylo?!
@torahvaluesoverparty I meant that the Democrats failed to stop the audit.
@Health Apparently she was a temp that was there for a few days. She never gave any details to what she saw beyond what you’ve already wrote. She didn’t say what day it happened on, what time, the words that were spoken, how many times she saw it happen, or any details that could have lead to any legal action. All she said was what some of other Trump supporting poll watchers said: “There was shady stuff going on, pretty sure about that, but I can’t give specifics”. Literally thousands of people watching polling sites for the slightest wrong move, and the strongest witness testimonies all seem to be these vague statements like “We were told to leave the room so there may have been fraud then” or “There was voter intimidation but I don’t know who, how, where, or when”.@torahvaluesoverparty Welp, it looks like the Maricopa County audit is going on anyway. I’ll hold you to your word if they don’t find anything substantial.
@Health You can’t have a constructive dialog if you keep adding things to talk about. You have to focus on a few specific things at once, otherwise you get what’s called a “Gish Gallop”. So let’s take a few things one at a time. Second, let’s stick to somewhat reliable sources. YWN counts, so does Fox News, PBS, and Daily Wire. OAN, Facebook, NewsMax, and Twitter do not count as reliable sources.
Jessy Jacob Testimony: The (Republican) judge threw out her testimony because
“It asserts behavior with no date, location or frequency or names of employees.
“In addition, [she] offers no indication of whether she took steps to address the alleged misconduct or to [alert] any supervisor about the alleged voter fraud. Ms. Jacob only came forward after the unofficial results of the voting indicated former Vice President Biden was the winner in the state of Michigan.”
In other words, she was willing to testify on the generalities but refused to name any names, times, or places. So her testimony was worthless and not at all indicative of fraud. In all likelihood, her hesitancy was because she misinterpreted something that she saw or maybe just outright lied about it.
So you insist I just comment on your Post about Georgia!
Lucky for you – I found Fraud there too!You did not address the specific claim I brought up, Google “Georgia votes one in quadrillion”. As for the video you mentioned, I actually addressed that in one of my previous comments.
@Health Let’s not keep moving the goalposts and talking about each new claim of fraud each time one gets debunked. If you want to discuss my comment, then let’s stick to one claim at a time. How about the first one I mentioned, where Guiliani’s team claimed that for the Georgia votes to swing towards Biden is a one in a septillion chance, while in reality it was just a question of Blue districts and mail-in ballots getting counted last.
@torahvaluesoverparty But why? There’s no evidence to support the idea that a full audit will turn up anything substantial. Georgia had two hand recounts, multiple Republican governors and judges contested claims of fraud, etc. It’s just a smokescreen, a waste of time, and a way to give some ammunition to Trump’s dwindling support base (even if nothing is found).Does this mean that you are against any socialist policies? Like libraries, government funding for Yeshivos, Social Security, FAFSA, Section 8/HUD, and welfare?
@Health You didn’t address a single one of the debunkings I posted. And every one of your claims wasn’t “There was fraud and here’s proof” but “If you tilt your head and squint your eyes at the numbers, you can see where fraud may have occurred”.
@torahvaluesoverparty I was initially on the fence over the election fraud claims. But after looking in to who is making the claims, what they are claiming, and what the responses were, I concluded that there’s no evidence of fraud. I don’t see the purpose of examining every individual claim for fraud, especially if the evidence for some of the biggest claims is faulty or non-existent.I still don’t get why Maricopa County in particular has you hung up. One county isn’t nearly enough to change the national votes to Red. You say that all claims from here on will have less credibility, if you read the details about the original claims, there wasn’t much credibility to begin with!
I think it’s all a distraction. Those few remaining Trump supporters know that no one wants to spend the time and energy auditing the Maricopa votes when there’s no evidence of wrongdoing. So they use that to their advantage. “Oh you don’t want an audit, huh? Must be because you have something to hide!”
@coffee-addict @torahvaluesoverparty The clerical error was only in what was reported, the actual vote count was never affected. So even all the clerical errors in the world wouldn’t have changed the outcome.
I can see I’m not convincing anyone. Then let’s pick apart some other issues. I’m going to ignore the Republican election officials who were adamant that there was no fraud, and also the fact that all proven cases of fraud only totaled to a few dozen votes scattered across multiple states, and instead focus on specific claims
In Georgia there was a video showing a room full of ballot counters that empties out at the end of the day, then two people pull out suitcases from under a table, open them up, and add the contents to the ballot stacks. OAN purported that the video was showing secret ballot stuffing. In reality, according to people familiar with procedures, and the people who left the room in the video, the workers were opening ballots, not counting them, and the suitcases were full of already opened ballots that were added to the piles of open ballots waiting to be counted by another group.
A Trump attorney claimed that in Nevada, 42,000 people voted twice. In court, the evidence to back up that claim was slim to none and relied on a compilation of incomplete records obtained from the DMV matching up with names of people who voted.
99.9% of the other claims had little to no evidence to back themselves up. I specifically picked claims that on the surface were solid enough to even bring to court and/or have the President specifically address them. As you can see, even a cursory examination reveals the claims to be bogus.
I can bring up claim debunkings from here until Moshiach comes, but you can keep saying “But what about the other claims!”. If debunks on four of the strongest claims weren’t enough to make you skeptical, then what will?
@torahvaluesoverparty I’ll focus on two debunked claims.
In Georgia, the state was leaning slightly in Trumps favor. Then a few counties were counted and they all leaned heavily Biden. Guiliani and Trumps legal team claimed that there was a one in a quadrillion chance of that happening. Since the state was showing mostly Trump votes, for it to suddenly switch and start turning Blue must be because of fraud. The real story is that the Atlanta district and the mail-in ballots were counted last. Since the Republicans had spent the last year telling people to vote in person (while the Democrats were saying the opposite), the main-ins were heavily favoring Biden. And Atlanta has been extremely blue for decades.
A second claim was that 134,000 votes suddenly appeared for Biden late one night in Michigan. That actually did happen, but it was a clerical error and corrected within a few hours. Biden still won the district even once those votes were corrected.
These were two of the bigger, more evidence based, claims that Trump was touting last year. I would hope that you will read the information and evidence yourself and if you’re not at convinced, to at least be a little more skeptical of the 2020 fraud hysteria.
@madealiyah I absolutely did not agree with that statement as you can see yourself by my next comment in that very thread. The discussion about the flu was you comparing apples to oranges and accusing me of being as callous and uncaring as you are. The truth is, to protect others from the flu you don’t need to wear a mask all the time. You just have to be careful not to go out in public with a fever, or to be extra careful when the flu is going around. Unfortunately, COVID is much more contagious so that’s not good enough. You have to wear a mask.
Your statement shows your true intentions. You are inconvenienced by being forced to wear a mask. Kal V’Chomer you are inconvenienced by lockdowns, no minyamin, washing hands, etc. The only possible maskono is that you care more about your own convenience than the lives of others. Therefore, pro-death.
why is Biden allowing only 200 some people at the state of the union address, stating it is because of COVID?
What does Shmittah have to do with Parshas Har Sinai? Biden loves putting on a show about how careful he is about COVID (l’afukei the last president who didn’t give to hoots about how many people it killed) and when he has to do something public, he goes above and beyond recommendations and guidelines. Obviously, in private he has no qualms about violating his own rules. You can’t bring a raya from what Biden does to what people are supposed to be doing. Just listen to your doctor and listen to the CDC.
@torahvaluesoverparty Sorry, but I don’t believe you. You don’t have to be a fanatic or radical to have your mind made up. It’s pretty standard human nature and Newton’s Law, you need a lot of force to change the inertia of someone’s mind once it reaches a place it’s comfortable with.
There have already been countless debunks on the claims of voter fraud and zero proof that there was ever any fraud significant enough to change the election. Are you trying to tell me that all of that has nearly changed your mind and this one last thing will finally push you over the edge to admitting that there was no fraud?
@torahvaluesoverparty Never, in the history of the human race, has an investigation into a matter where charged emotions have their minds already made up, changed the minds of anyone. An audit will not “reassure most of those tens of millions”.
Hundreds of millions of Americans believe that a man who lived 2000 years ago was Moshiach and a god. Just because a lot of people believe in something doesn’t make it true.