You go over and ask how he/she is doing the same way you would to anyone you know. If you spent 4 hours shmoozing with someone and then ignored him on the street that would be very impolite. It’s not like you are in two alternate universes- datinng and the rest of your life. You actually know this person in your normal life once you’ve met dated them.

my rebbi will usually have a bottle of scotch on the table when we come over for a seuda. The rebitzin keeps an eye and when she feels we have had enough she takes away the bottle.

I disagree looks come before money. For me personally, I don’t want a girl who grew up in a very rich lifestyle (it doesn’t matter how rich the father is) because I don’t want to have to support that lifestyle. I would like to spoil my wife but I don’t want unrealistic demands put on me.

Everyone keeps talking about lessons. I still think that lessons are pointless if you have someone to teach you. It all comes down to experience which you get after you get your license.

EDITED

I wouldn’t say something like that to someone in person. However this is an anonymous forum; it helps get any nastiness out of my system. You don’t know I am who I say I am and I don’t know you are who you say you are. If you can’t take a little abuse don’t post on these forums. Whatever you post is fair game to comment on.

they have internet in Iraq. It sounds like you have a picture in your mind that he is running from trench to trench dodging enemy fire to say shema with dying jewish soldiers.

Sacrilege the person meant that the girl is a bigger catch not a better person. She is a girl with x internals and a 10 is a bigger catch than a girl who is x internals and a 3; it’s simple math

koachshtika well said

umm you are a woman.; woman can look deeper than looks. if a guy had a wife whose looks he hated as much as you hate your husbands looks (which sounds more than a little dysfunctional if you ask me) he would soon be looking elsewhere (if you know what I mean). That’s assuming he marries her in the first place which has to mean he seriously suppressed his instincts.

Point I’ve been trying to make: men think differently than woman do about the opposite gender.

mischiefmaker I understand why people say um when they are talking; it’s a natural sound they make when they are thinking of the next word but why would you write it randomly

I didn’t say it’s a priority just that it has to the attraction to her looks has to exist. not just that he won’t throw up looking at her. Of course her middos etc. are the most important criteria but attraction is also a necessary criteria. I remember a shmuz by a well known rosh yeshiva in my old yeshiva ( a very shtark one) where he cautioned guys from thinking that a ben torah shouldn’t worry about looks. he said that if he isn’t attracted to her he should not marry her.

I apologize for making you uncomfortable with the phrase “checking her out” but that is the most accurate way of describing it. I guess a different way to say it would be “seeing if you find her chitzonius attractive”

My friends don’t really date through shadchanim so theydon’t really need a photo they can tell when they look at her if they want to ask her out.

I use it once in a while it has some useful info

helpful, yes it goes up but the point I am trying to make is that the parent may have to pay extra now but at least the kid won’t get hit with astronomical insurance bills when he gets married. (though assuming the parents pay the bills then also it won’t make much of a difference to him)

BP totty why do you need driving lessons. My father taught me to drive and he taught my brother to drive. I still remember driving him around on my days off. The only real excuse for driving lessons is if you don’t have the time.

Keep in mind that insurance is higher for new drivers. If you wait until dating he will have a very high insurance bill the first few years of marriage. Additionally, many states have provisional driving laws that severely restrict driving in the first year or so. In New jersey, provisional drivers can’t drive past 11 or have more than one non family member as a passenger. Even though most of these restrictions fall off over 21, it is better to get a license earlier. The sooner you can get past those restrictions the better. Besides, having a license makes your job opportunities much greater. I was able to get high paying summer jobs because I had a license.

whatrutalkingabt- you’re right it’s moving more to machal but I was just generalizing in the neighborhoods; I meant the general area. I have a cellcom internet piece.

new2thescene I couldn’t agree more. I am having a much more productive zman now that I am doing college at night. I can’t learn a full day (12-13 hours) and there is too much free time. Therefore I end up being unproductive which leads to feelings of lethargy which makes it hard to learn even the 6-7 hours I can usually do. Not to mention the extra time often leads to watching movies which further diminish me from being able to shteig. Now that I am in college at night I have classes and homework and papers to write and I end up being much more productive and therefore end up learning better.

whatrutalkingabt, I was talking about honeymoon villages like ramat Eshkol. It’s filled with couples who come have a kid or two and then go back In the mean time they party it up. They go to first seder if they are not too tired. Or better yet they join one of these yedidim programs where they “learn” with weak bochurim. Another way of saying pure battala “but you’re helping the kids they need someone to shmuz with them in the bais medrash or they would never walk inside.” Walk through Ramat Eshkol how many of the american couples are planning (seriously) to stay. They are here to party and (maybe?) learn. You should hear them talk about their sacrifices, “the meat in Israel is not as good so when we have the weekly bbq the steaks don’t taste the same.” “my father only flies us in Pesach, the summer and midwinter vacation it’s so hard being away for so long” Its a pity the (two year) honeymoon is not perfect. Whether the whole thing is right or not is a different question but don’t start talking about mesiras nefesh. Mesiras nefesh are those american families that I see all the time with a bunch of kids and they live extremely simply and they all wear hand me downs and somehow they make it work with no money from their parents.

I can go on about this but it’s getting late

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The newcomers guide is different from the yeshiva/seminary guide. (from what I hear there is politics between the creators)

On the mehadrin buses there is usually a hole puncher for the kartisya hanging on a chain by the back door. The problems start when a girl needs a transfer or wants to pay cash. She has to make a difficult decision and decide which is worse, whether to walk to the front or ask a guy to get get it for her. I personally feel that it is all in her mind and if she didn’t make herself uncomfortable she wouldn’t be.

Keep in mind that in order to conform in the yeshiva world you can’t go out and work. You are basically asking for a guy who learned at least up to three years bais medrash (to be a ben torah) but then tore himself out of that world to go work. How many guys who are not cut out actually last that long and if he did pull himself out after that point you have to wonder why. It’s not common for a good bochur in yeshiva to leave and go work. Now that is not saying that there aren’t good ehrlich boys working but in my experience they have usually been through alot as teenagers and may not be suitable for that innocent bais yaakov girl who just wants to perform her proper role in life (take care of her kids). Even the rare good bochurim who go to college/work I have yet to meet one who doesn’t watch movies at least occasionally. If it were to become more accepted for bachurim not to only “learn fulltime” there might be many healthy well adjusted bochurim who would sit down and make rational decision to go to work/college. These are the bochurim everyone is looking for.

genoi – exactly as in “I’m not sure genoi”

My yeshiva took us to eilat. We rented a boat and had all the water activities (scuba diving parasailing etc.) brought out to us (and pizza for lunch).

Regarding bochurim going wild in my yeshiva we have guys who for the most part have been with girls (take it as you will), have experimented with drugs alcohol. When they come to Israel it’s their chance to make a fresh start away from everybody. In the beginning they go a bit wild, they go to town a lot get drunk but then by chanuka they realize that its all a waste of time. If they don’t, they usually don’t make it back after pesach.

The real problem is with the good bochurim who get messed over. I personally know a shtark bochur from a choshuve yeshiva in america who told me that he hadn’t learned in months. The entire time he had been hanging around in dance clubs, bars with girls watching movies all night getting drunk doing drugs. He left Israel to BMG because it was time to get married. Another bochur I know personally came from a shtark yeshiva and left no longer frum. I know many similar cases. I realize that this isn’t the majority; most bochurim shtaig in Israel, but some can be really harmed. As previous posters have mentioned everything is much more accessible than in america (and it isn’t the zonas who are the problem it is the huge amount of girls from weak backgrounds in yerushalayim for seminary)

I feel that Israel can do wonders for growth but if a yeshivish guy is starting to “look around the world” Israel is not the place to send him.

And that’s why I love it. I can’t stand Israeli culture.

was this in the last year or two? I picked up some talk from some guys I know about some kind of incident like this that they were involved in. (again, its not 100 percent clear what happpened to you)

It just means that you will know where they are coming from. If a girl posts on a topic that she knows nothing about you know to take it with a grain of salt (eg. shmiras enayim for men). Same thing vice versa.