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*Round of applause.* Yes, PAA, it was quite a well placed ???? ????!
You opened it, didn’t you?
Nope. Comlink-X Was the OP of this thread. I just disagreed.
Neutiquam Ero – I couldn’t have put it better myself. Thanks.
(For future reference, name the thread about the main topic of discussion to attract interest; like this, nobody is going to open the thread!)
Comlink-X – I don’t mean to offend anyone, but if the ‘source’ is Rebbetzin Anybody, then it is not likely to contain an inkling of truth. If she quotes a reliable source, I’ll accept it. Otherwise… Let’s phrase it like this. There is nobody in our generation who has a right to come up with this on his own – and ?? ????? ?? ??? ?? ?? ????? a woman, who has pretty much zero ??? ???? (obviously excluding Devorah etc, who did have ?????).
Its like saying that R’ Peysach Krohn told you when Moshiach is coming.
You discussed something similar once, with a fascinating psak from R’ Yackov zt”l [which you somehow decided we don’t hold of]. (If your subtitle isn’t just a joke)
I’ll post a link.
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/weirdness-factor-in-books#post-529113
Perhaps say fakert? Ossur until a posek confirms it muttar?
I am sure it isn’t his primary email address
39 threads in one hour is exponentially worse than one day! !
So what do you recommend? Just posting on the CR fits under the same category of the speeches and events you mentioned above. What do you think could be done to help the singles, and how do you think it should be done? What is possible to do which isn’t being done already?
Your right – we don’t actually know the policy of the shul in question. But four very valid possibilities leads one to remember to be ?? ??? ???? – there could be endless possible reasons, and we’ve guessed four without thinking too much. I could probably come up with a couple more if I would spend the time thinking.
So what started off as a complaint against the ‘achdus of klal yisroel’ actually sounds perfectly legitimate. Of course, the ‘victim’ can’t see it like that, because when you are in the story, you understandably that you are wronged. But when somebody with an outside view without the blurred perspective of a person involved looks, you realize that it actually makes quite a bit of sense.
Not judging is a very important policy.
I’ll check my posts again, but I definitely didn’t mean to tell the poster to leave – just to stop the fit of opening new threads. I can live and let live – if the poster writes all new posts – as much nonsense as you want – on a thread called “Gogogogogo”, which we can all ignore if we want to. But to push all normal threads down to replace with a zillion threads of one post each – sorry, it’s not on. He is welcome to come back, as long as posting is done in a civilized manner.
CA – I gave only four seconds of thought to it, but then I decided that I don’t want to know who it was, because it would give me an intense dislike for whoever else it was, and I don’t need that. I am happier without the knowledge!! One frightening thought that Poppa was behind it passed through my head, but I immediately banished it, because that reality would be too much to cope with. And anyway, if it was Poppa, he would have have managed to cause a lot more chaos!!
Just a disclaimer – for those who felt I shouldn’t have been so harsh last night – I normally try not to be sharp on the CR, because most posters have already somewhat created an identity, and therefore even though technically it is an anonymous online forum, it still may constitute Loshon Horo to those familiar with the poster. But I don’t have such reservations regarding a new anonymous poster before people start to familiarize themselves with him.
Well… Not exactly blindingly obvious, now that you come to look at it. Let’s have a look:
“ Everyone calls it that, and, seeing how it more accurately describes our game than yours, and that we got there first… We still invented it, developed it…”
Firstly, the sport Football was actually invented in China centuries before England started playing it. It was called “cuju”, or “Tsu-Chu”. I haven’t done much research on the topic. but a cursory glance at my references seem to show this much. Which would lead one to think your were Chinese. And, even predating the Chinese – I once chanced upon one of the Rishonim Al HaTorah in Parshas Shemos/Vaeyra who speaks about the Egyptians playing ball games by the River Bank, and I am quite sure I decided that football was the most accurately described sport. So you could actually be Egyptian, as far as that post is concerned. [I’ll try find the source for the Rishon!]
And then the matter of “[We]are, right now, by far the best at using it” – there may be a problem with my computers calendar, but I highly doubt this post was written in 1966.
And whilst we are on the topic anyways – “You still call a sport involving very little foot action ‘football’. And no-ones answered that one yet.”
I don’t like doing this to you, but actually, the term “football” was not coined because of the foot-to-ball relationship which it quite accurately connotes, but because it is a game played with a ball while on foot. It was coming ?????? horseback, which is what many sports were played on once upon a time. Football doesn’t reference the action of kicking the ball, but rather the playing of ball while standing.
I hope this gaga – sorry, gogogo – wasn’t your idea of a joke!
It seems that somebody misunderstood NeutiquamErro and thought your meant ‘Keep The CR Moving’.
I propose s/he is banned under the First Decree of the Keep The Coffee Room Interesting Movement!!
Thank you, Mods
Mods – can you bump all the threads that were pushed down because of gogogogo attack?
For those who are wondering, I am sure sirvoddmort wrote explicitly that he is a Brit on his football rant against the American copy of the game. Can somebody verify that?
In my days, when somebody opened 30 almost senseless threads in their first hour, they were blocked.
I’m with you on that one . . .
There’s nothing brilliant in US? And how do you spell favour there?
A collector once came to the Satmar Rov zt”l, complaining about his 10 children, all who had medical problems; two chasunas he had to make while in crazy debt, and a long list of tzoros. The Satmar Rov gave him $10,000.
After the man left, the gabbaim came in and informed the Rebbe that he was a fraudster. The Rebbe beamed. “Boruch Hashem! His children don’t have medical problems; he has enough money for his family!”
sirvoddmort are u british?
Was there anything in this thread that made you think so, or is it a general observation?
<groan> How did I know that 147 will be getting excited here before I even clicked on the thread?
Who is this ‘person Rabbi’?
And please clarify your position: Are you (a) denying the Chiyuv to be ???? a Talmid Chochom; (b) Denying that a choshuve title comes under the category of ‘kovod’ or (c) denying that the Rabbi is choshuv?
Yes, you are not mechuyev to be mechabed somebody you hold doesn’t deserve it. This is both in and out of his office. You are mechuyev, however, to be mechabed a real Talmid Chochom. And this applies both inside and outside his official capacity. There is no difference (i) what setting you are in or (ii) whether it suits you or not.
And what is considered kovod is determined by social norms, as I wrote earlier. And for a high caliber Talmid Chochom, being called Rabbi is part of the social norm. At least in civilized countries like US, Europe, Israel.
Spending money on simchas – that is something that Rabbanim have addressed; it sets standards that are increasingly difficult to follow. Spending money on food? I don’t see why that would hit the list at all, never mind the top.
But hotels for Pesach? This doesn’t set standards, for dozens of people will be proud to announce they don’t want to go away for Pesach; they ENJOY making Pesach at home, etc. etc. It isn’t embarrassing in any way not to be in a hotel for Pesach.
What could be wrong with it enough to ban? And what does it have to do with your ‘rabbis’ food and simchas? Surely they are a different problem?
Newbee – http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/going-to-hotels-for-pesach#post-562245.
5 Bad Habits of Orthodox Jews. Now there’s a good idea for a new thread.
I am afraid we are partially to blame for the hijacking of the Harry Potter thread. But that thread had already died down from its original conversation; continuing it in a different vein wasn’t so terrible. In the middle of an ongoing conversation, however, it is wrong to change the subject.
newbee – I wasn’t referring to somebody who doesn’t have the necessary qualities to define himself as a Talmid Chochom. Such a person, even in an official capacity there is no binding reason to call him ‘Rabbi’. I am talking about somebody who does suit the description. And your ‘chiyuv’ to call him by a suitable title is dependant on the social norm. If it is the accepted thing to call a Rabbi that, then it shows a lack of respect if you do not. And because of your chiyuv to respect a Talmid Chochom, it makes no difference if it suits you or not.
Your second point – that ??????? there is no chiyuv to respect a Talmid Chochom – is incorrect. The Mishne in Avos says that even somebody who teaches you ???? ??? must be given the Titles of Honour when you address him. (Now your obvious retort is going to be that this is only to somebody who taught you; but a Talmid Chochom who isn’t your Rebbe doesn’t command that respect. I am just bringing out the point that one doesn’t have to hit a certain level in order to command respect.)
???? ?? ??? ???? ??????.
It is highly unprofessional that Dementors turning over to Voldemort allows the Death Eaters to escape Azkaban. Although the Ministry believed the Dementors to be under their control, what sort of prison only relies on guards? Surely there were other charms, curses and spells ensuring the continued imprisonment of the Death Eaters?
A Yekke cannot perform the Patronus Charm; Happy thoughts only depress us…
Just a thought to start the thread up again – does anybody find it interesting that wizards use broomsticks to fly? Could they not find a more convenient item to bewitch with a Flying Charm than a kitchen appliance used to clean floors?
Another ‘issue’ is the tendency some posters have to hijack threads. One or two off topic posts won’t ruin the thread, but a subconversation will. So if you have a discussion which isn’t directly related to the thread at hand, but does have a connection, simply start a new thread and post a link.
BUMP! #ktcoim
Not necessarily, I could be arguing in my spare time!
Abie Rotenberg has a song called “The Wedding Song”, with an in depth descriptive discussion of exactly what you need.
These are the lyrics:
<phone call>
“Katz’s wedding consultant Agency”
“Hello Katz, this is Hershkoivitz”
“Ya ya Hershkoivitz, Feivel”
“Feivel Hershkoivitz, how are you Feivel”
“Boruch Hashem, vismachester reb yid”
“I’m fine, what can I do for you”
“I tell you the truth, I called because I get a big mazel tov, my daughter chanie became a kallah
“Ah mazel tov, that’s wonderful news , what can I do to help you”
“Well I tell you the the truth, I never made a chasunah before, and I need some advice for what I should I do”
“You came to the right person, come here boys, Mr. Hershkoivitz wants to know how to make a chasunah. Hit it!”
Well the first thing I must say is you’re going on display
And what will people think if the wedding isn’t nice
None of the neighbors on your block have to know you’re in hock
So no matter what it costs it’s worth the price
It’s worth the price, it’s worth the price
Now the kallah’s wedding gown should be the talk of the town
Designed from top to bottom just for her
And although it will be June when the heat can make you swoon
Make sure you buy your wife a real nice fur
No your guests will not be bored when they see that smorgasbord,
With chopped liver piled up to the sky.
And the band that you bring in should have 16 violins,
Each one in a white tuxedo and black tie.
The wine I’m sure know it has to be French Bordeaux,
Brought in on a shining silver tray.
And the flowers don’t forget should be Holland’s very best,
Flown in on the Concorde that same day.
The main course I wont fib must be succulent prime rib
Thick and juicy filling up the plate
Never mind the calories bring on the table Viennese,
The next morning they can starve to watch their weight
The photographer should know how to shoot a video
Everyone invited gets their very own cassette
And no bentchers – that’s old hat you can do better than that
Why not give a brand new shas to every guest
<phone interruption>
You’re a mishiga Katz, that’s not what I had in mind”
“So what did you have in mind Mr. Hershkoivitz?”
“I wanted something a little little bit more modest”
“I can’t hear you”
“I said I wanted something a little bit more modest”
“Oh, you want modest? That’s ok, no problem.”
So on the invitation write, in a ways that’s real polite,
That the women should dress tznius, “if you pelase”,
Because we’re dealing with a crowd, that is also very proud,
Of how it keeps the laws of modesty.
<phone hangs up>
“So Hershkoivitz what do you say, we got a deal
It would make me very happy if people specified the ‘several rabbonim’ they keep quoting by name!
I disagree. Calling somebody a respectful title isn’t just a recognition of his job, it is a gesture of respect. If somebody is a Talmid Chochom, then you have an obligation to respect him. That applies both in and out of a professional environment, whether it suits you or not. Life isn’t about psychological power struggle to
use manipulative behavior to discomfit another person or gain an advantage over them. Your chiyuv of respect is regardless of the situation or context of reception.
If this will cause you a monetary loss, ask your LOR. Otherwise, the satisfaction of winning a mind game isn’t worth sacrificing halacha.
To quote the same eminent scholars:
“An Argument is an intellectual process; contradiction is just the automatic gainsay of anything the other person says…”
I haven’t heard that in years! Thanks for bringing it up!
we should find as little as possible (outside of torah) to argue about
That is the intended outcome – after you hear what I have to say, you delete all your arguments out of sheer embarrassment as you come to understand the true logical and rationalistic explanation of whatever topic you are talking about. It is a lot of fun.
Especially on an online forum, where you know that what a person writes isn’t necessarily what they think. In fact, one of the posters here told me that he enjoys taking a side in any discussion/argument – whether he agrees with that side or not, depending on his mood – to take the intellectual challenge of arguing your point until the bitter/sweet end.
They aren’t real Machloikes (not including the MO/Zionist etc.), merely exchange of opinions in an intellectual discourse.
I think it’ll be a good idea just to find an old argument and restart it.
I always get frustrated when (in real life experience) conversations become arguments instead of discussions. As a general rule, arguments end up with repeating the same thing over and over again and continue to getting personal, and a lot of fighting over what I meant and what I said and who was right.
Discussions [in real life] are much more constructive. It’s not about me and you; it’s not about whose write or wrong. I wonder what is more interesting on an online blog?
So instead of taking on a kabala, they should take on the mitzvah.
Any form of strengthening your Avoidas Hashem, whether by enhancing your performance in one area, or by accepting to be better in other ways, is equivalent of a “Kabbalah”. Saying a brachah on food with more kavanah; being nicer to somebody who needs friends… or anything that you weren’t doing as well yesterday – that is a Kabbalah.
I had the same thought today, when I was browsing through some of the older threads, but I didn’t think the posters here would appreciate the comment! A lot of the topics which 3 or 4 years ago were allowed to take place would be closed much quicker these days (possibly because the Moderators are getting more strict, but also possibly because lots of the posters here are far too sensitive and don’t understand jokes, and take things not intended so as personal insults), and there are arguably less controversial/funny/bored posters than there used to be. The fighting that went on here some time ago was legendary!
When someone is in pain and you cannot do something you feel helpless and GUILTY. So, to push away the guilt, we do something
You are right. You feel guilty when you cannot help. But ‘doing something’ doesn’t push away the guilt; it is a form of helping!
(any better say,2 months later- you are in the same place, back to square one. Maybe it will take 6 months..but ya)
There are two responses to that comment.
(a) The only reason why your Kabbalah falls out the window after 2/6 months is because you start to big. If a person takes on a madreigah which is too hard for them to commit to, then they will obviously fall – and like you said, perhaps fall lower than they were until then. But a Kabbalah doesn’t have to be something big. Don’t decide to stop speaking Loshon Horo at all, but take upon yourself not to talk Loshon Horo over the lunch table. Something small – but something that will make an infinite difference. Too many people make the mistake of accepting things that are too much. You’ve just got to find the right thing – something not too easy, but something manageable that will give you a sense of satisfaction when you do it.
(b) I mentioned before that ‘A good shmuz lasts until maa’riv’. Well; I once mentioned it to my Mashgiach – I came out of every shmuz with the intention to be a better person, to be perfect; it never lasted. He told me a story about R’ Yisroel Salanter (I think it was him; It might have been R’ Yerucham Lebovitz…) – a bochur came and told him exactly that complaint, and said that his inspiration fizzled out extremely quickly. R’ Yerucham told him that the single maariv he davened better – the whole shmuz was worth it for that.
The point was that those two months of your Kabbalah, or the six months, is not at all a waste of time; it was 2 months!
The point in my case was that a person who is fired up – he just witnessed a gilui Hashem (Revelation of G-d) – must make some sort of ???? to anchor that inspiration.
The first reaction to every tragedy – especially the ones that effect somebody you know personally, somebody you know well – is inspiration. You want to be a better person. Yes, it isn’t a happy-fuzzy good feeling; it’s a sad feeling of incompetence. But in order for inspiration to mean anything in the future, you need a ????.
There is a famous moshol – There was a man stuck in the top floor of a skyscraper for hours, and he had no phone. Nobody knew he was up there. He some coins out the window, hoping somebody would see them and look up. People walked past, bent down to pick up the coins, continued walking. He threw out a $10 bill. Somebody walked past, picked it up and smiled, and continued walking. He tried a $50 bill – nobody looked up. Eventually, he grabbed a large vase, and threw it out the window. Suddenly, everybody looked up to see where it came from.
The nimshal is pretty obvious. All our lives, HKB”H showers us with perfect lives; happiness, parnassah, family, friends. If we don’t ‘look up’ to see where they come from, He smashes a vase. Then we realize where everything comes from. Sometimes we need that reminder.
After every tragedy, if you look at it in the right way, you will be on a spiritual high. Like a said; not in a happy way, but it is a brutal reminder to How the World Works. HKB”H is suddenly back in your conscious mind. In order to keep that going long term, you must attempt to anchor it.
I think the ???? ???? say exactly the opposite, Shopping613. The Posuk speaks about a Nozir directly after the Parsha of Soitah. The Gemara (brought down in Rashi Al HaTorah) says that ?? ????? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ?? ???? – One who sees a Sotah as she ‘explodes’ should become a Nozir and forbid himself from wine, for wine leads to immorality. The question is posed – one who sees the punishment of a ???? just witnessed an astounding open miracle where the Yad Hashem is totally recognizable. Surely that is the biggest Chizuk possible? Why would this person of all people have to make a Kabbolo on himself not to touch wine? He is at less risk than anybody else!
The answer is given that Chizuk – ‘inspiration’ – fizzles out extremely quickly. In Yeshiva they used to say ‘A good shmuz (Mussar drosho) lasts till supper – if you’re lucky, till Ma’ariv’. The only way to channel the inspiration to making you a better person is if during the time when you are fired up, you make a ???? that you can keep, which will continue the inspiration every time you do the ????.
There are many Raiyos to this.