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1) Inappropriate for a Ben Torah/Bas Yisroel
2) Inappropriate for a Ben Torah/Bas Yisroel
3) Inappropriate for a Ben Torah/Bas Yisroel
4) Inappropriate for a Ben Torah/Bas Yisroel
5) Inappropriate for a Ben Torah/Bas Yisroel
Its a confusing world out there.
cherrybim,
My sincere apologies that you find the Chofetz Chaim’s take on tznius objectionable.
milchig,
Because if they say koiferdik things about the Torah, or say loshon hora, or attack Rabbonim, or a whole host of reasons it may be not allowed to even hear what they say.
This topic should be made sticky/pinned.
I agree wholeheartedly!
Everyone on these forums should such a Sefer.
Fighting pritzus is where there is a problem? No one can fight it since someone calls it untzniusdik?? Fighting pritzus is a mitzvah for every man AND woman.
rabbi yanky, google the following sentence and look at the first result:
One of the questions we are asked frequently is whether a comma should go before the conjunction “and” in a series of three or more items.
rabbi, it took mariner as long as it takes to hit CTRL-C (copy) from getitwriteonline.com and CTRL-V (paste) to TheYeshivaWorld.com.
cantor, that must be a rare case indeed.
Glad you feel better. Now back to your pritzus. Advising you that its wrong is the right thing to do.
As repeatedly pointed out and discussed multiple times on this thread, the cited Mishna Berura is very clear that a JACKET is needed when davening in Shul. cherrybim may not like this and try to fardrei Mishna Berura as being “too complex too understand” since it is not to his liking, but it remains what it says in black and white.
mariner:
1. Yeshiva Chaim Berlin, Rav Hutner ZTV’L, and Rav Ahron are no Chasidim. They are Litvaks.
2. If you can pasken that hand-holding post-Chupa is not only permissable but mandatory, like some Litvaks do (and Chaim Berlin isn’t the only Litvish Roshei Yeshivos that hold this), then you have no taaina on the Mitzva Tantz. Arguing one is a “bigger madreiga” assur, is like arguing something is “partially Jewish.” Its all the same concept. Bottom line is, both are not only kosher but minhug k’halacha, so mandatory. So you lose. Period.
3. The Machzor Vitri IS where the minhug of the mitzvah tantz, as practiced today, comes from. It is based on Keitzad as specified in the machzor and includes alle minhugim as practiced byom hazeh.
4. At least most of those minhugim you mentioned, LONG LONG precede the Besht.
5. And these customs ARE from CHAZAL ZTV’L.
Finally, I’m not sure which mon and pop MT you’ve been to, but any true MT does not include making choizek. Indeed its all about holiness that the badchan talks about at the MT.
And if a Shul has a MINHUG to wear a Gartel, they have EVERY RIGHT to insist that any Shliach Tzibur in the Shul wears one.
cherryboy, For you unfortunately all doubt has long been removed regarding your tipshish.
cherrybim, “preys” on whom? His ex-son, the convert? If he preys on Jews I would tend to think anyone should keep away from him, not just his ex-son. In fact, preying on Jews would be one of the worries regarding a coverts EX-parents.
CHERRYBIM, alleviate your amaratzus I’ll re-point to you the Mishna Berura that requires a JACKET during davening that has been mentioned previously on this thread:
S’O Orach Chaim Hilchos Tefiloh, siman 91, sk 12 (megulah) [sk 4, mb 12 ?]
Mishnah Berurah 8:4, citing the Ba”ch, requires two head coverings. (Shulchan Aruch O”Ch 282:2)
Please learn it and report back!
CHERRYBIM, alleviate your amaratzus I’ll re-point to you the Mishna Berura that requires a JACKET during davening that has been mentioned previously on this thread:
Shulchan Orach chaim Hilchos Tefiloh, siman 91, sk 12 (megulah) [sk 4, mb 12 ?]
Mishnah Berurah 8:4, citing the Ba”ch, requires two head coverings
rabbiofberlin,
What kind of Rabbi are you? Pulpit? Or did you just use the title as a nice screen name??
Also, r u from the TIDE school of thought (as in kaj)? Is that what the Berlin (i.e. Yekkish) signifies?
As discussed here previously, the Mishna Berura is quite clear that a Jacket is REQUIRED by davening, talis or no talis. Those here trying to fardrei an excuse why they don’t do what they are supposed to, may justify it in their mind, but certainly have no excuse al pi din AND altz Kavod HaTorah.
cherrybim, The Torah makes quite clear (aside from the issue of Geirim) that we Yidden must keep our distance from the goyim. This point seems to give you heartburn and indigestion. I suggest you re-evaluate your priorities.
Pashuteh, Your logic in that is so faulty in that comment, it is unworthy of a respectable response.
And pashuteh, you then wonder why people don’t respect your comments, when you use subtle language to attack others? This is a constant theme of yours.
I submit that Jesse Jackson, the punk you refer to, is in your league.
Bowzer,
And if you admit you are doing something wrong it becomes okay? (Hey I kill people… but I never deny it! ) Bowzer, please take a step back, close your browser and keep it that way.
I don’t expect to see any response.
What makes someone a Chareidi? But of course – one must be approved by the Chareidi Board of Governors as a Jew-in-good-standing! Otherwise the person becomes a mere modern orthodox.
(Watch as Feif, Pashuteh, and lesschumras take this seriously and get all offended.)
Feif – Btw, if someone dresses like a traditional jew as opposed to dressing modernly, that is better dressed. Apologies in advance if such things offend you.
So mdlevine, you are neither pro-freikeit nor pro-frumkeit? A middle of the roader you say?
You know what happens to those in “middle of the road”? They get hit from both sides!
Look at YW’s archives. There were 2 asifas. Both men and women. Both have audio copies.
And whats the excuse for those lacking a JACKET by davening? NONE.
And this is especially problematic during SHACHRIS when some yodles put on a talis without any jacket.
If only people had listened to the Gedolim…
If only people had listened to the Gedolim…
All these troubles could’ve been avoided…
History has proven the Brisker Rav, the Satmar Rebbe… right…
FWIW, Reb Ahron Schecter holds the Choson & Kallah hold hands from the chupa to the yichud room (even though Reb Ahron doesn’t hold from the Mitzva Tantz.)
feifun, the comment mentioned examples of modern views i.e. hallel on israel independence, no jackets and hats, etc.
Whats the heter for not wearing a jacket and hat during davening, as required by mishna berura?
The government in Israel takes more money from frum Jews than it gives to frum Yeshivas. Break the relationship like Brisk (and Satmar and others) does. Don’t take their dirty money and don’t pay them taxes. We’ll be better off.
cherry,
Sorry if SHULCHAN ORACH offends you. But that is plain black and white Jewish law. Now sometimes a Rav may for extenuating circumstances make an EXCEPTION. But the rule is a Gers former-life family no longer has shaichos to the Ger except as any other Goy – mere acquanintances.
A Yirei Shmayim wears a hat and jacket.
A Yirei Shmayim doesn’t seek excuses, its too hot, etc. too daven without kavod i.e. by not wearing a hat and jacket.
Pashut:
No hat is needed in shul because you don’t need it for the President, and no jacket is needed in shul because you do need it for the President!? Very smart.
Can you conjure up any other methods to throw out minhugim?
mosherose, is that the name of the same person who made the comment here?
I don’t mind so much that Obama shtams from a Muslim father, but the jerk is a neophyte and inexperienced. He has nothing in his resume to position him as President and Commander-in-Chief.
He has no track record on major positions. And he keeps flip-flopping on the positions he has taken.
Pushut, Who are YOU to go against SHULCHAN ORACH and call anyone in your way kanaim? What azus! What chutzpa! What rishus!
(Yes, if you want to know where you went against shulchan orach reread your words in this section. Any reasonable ben torah can see it.)
Pushut Yid, Neither Rav Shmuel Kamenetzky, nor Rav Ephraim Wachsman, nor Rav Mattisyahu Solomon said anything of the like. So who are you to spit in Rav Shmuel Kamenetzky, Rav Ephraim Wachsman, AND Rav Mattisyahu Solomon faces?
Answer this:
How can you stand opposed to Rav Shmuel Kamenetzky, Rav Ephraim Wachsman, AND Rav Mattisyahu Solomon on your own two legs? WHO ARE YOU TO STAND AGAINST THEM?
Stealing your neighbors lady!? Gevalt! How could you even ask…
Poshit, You just worry about getting your own wife and daughters dressed appropriately instead of trying to make sure everyone elses wives and daughters are dressed inappropriately for your benefit.
nameless, tsuz shver tsu zain ah yid. Yes, its hard to be a Jew. But one must persevere and succeed nevertheless.
Tznius MUST be enforced by ALL means available as the crime is not victimless. The victims of the purveyors of pritzus are the innocent men in her path. Yes, INNOCENT men who will undoubtable see it unwillingly and to their great constenation. And the farce about the goyim are dressed like that anyway is boneheaded, as people stick to and notice their kind.
Mr. Poshit Yid, Why are you soo allergic and antogonistic to the truth that Yidden are superior?
blogs are used by several reshoyim to malign and attack the Torah and its servants – Rabbonim and Talmidei Chachomim.
Baruch Hashem for the great display of Ahavas Yisroel and intellectual honesty by YW that they even allow posts by Jews so far off the derech that they openly and brazenly congratulate each other on who is the biggest (self) Sonei Yisroel!
(Now no one can say that the (self) anti-semites are denied a forum in the Yeshivish community where they can make their boneheaded arguments and be disproven on the merits.)
Thank you so much. This is a beautiful message to all of Klal Yisroel!
I have already printed out many copies and posted it for public consumption.
Hey Pashuteyid, don’t sneer. torahis1 is a charter member of the YW apikursus club. I remember still from before your time when he and the old (now long gone) Moshe Fox would wave their banner against the YW masses!
torahis1 – WE Yidden are the CHOSEN NATION. We are incomparably better than the umos haolam. We have kedusha. They have tuma.
yoshi, so it truly is purely coincidental that you “and” yossiesiegal:
1) both purportedly live in lakewood
2) yossie pops up for the first time on yw backing yoshi up
3) remarkably similar screen names
4) both accounts registered on the exact same day
you didn’t “put him up” now, did you?
Like new york lotto says, hey you never know – anything is possible!
Is it merely “coincidental” that besides yossisiegel having a strikingly similar name to yoshi and they registered their yw account the exact same day as each other, that one is highly complimenting the other?