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I continue to be amazed by PBA’s attitude (and some others, too). The mental health field has not been snake oil for many, many years. Yet, it is correct to note that it has been dominated by theory, with various efforts invested in proving things scientifically. Psychology remains a “soft” science, with a limited amount of the concepts proven beyond a shadow of doubt. But it is a science, and anything can be subjected to research to prove or disprove it. I will not entertain debate on the validity of scientific method.
The average mental health clinician is equipped with training that included background if not supervised experience in various therapeutic approaches. Traditional Freudian psychoanalysis still exists today, but has been basically abandoned by most of the mainstream clinicians. Still, most will accept many of the premises of psychoanalytic theory, even though they are not recognized as being relevant to applied psychology. Other therapies also abound. Most clinicians do what they were trained to do, many gaining additional skills through additional training after their degree and formally supervised work.
CBT is one of those approaches that has been subjected to massive research, and the reports of its efficacy cannot be justifiably dismissed. Having noted that, not every clinician is adept at it, and not every case is best treated with it. Often, elements of CBT are included in a therapy plan, and this is done because there are judgment calls by the clinician to use another approach as the main intervention. Still, efforts to dismiss it are simply irresponsible. It remains true that it is not the cure-all for every condition or for every client.
I will repeat my earlier assertion. When I want to seek an eitzah about therapy, I will pose my questions to trained experts in the field, not someone in the checkout line in Shoprite or Pathmark, nor someone on the internet whose credentials are unknown.
Now maybe that is not the answer you want to hear, but I will not be dishonest and lie to you to please your agenda.
It is improper, perhaps immoral to provide such advice here, unless one wishes to reveal their identity and credentials.
Meanwhile, if I question whether CBT or any other treatment approach is appropriate for me, I will ask an expert in the field and take direction from them.
And I stand by that 100%.
The OP implied that the yeshiva screaming “Lashon Horoh” was ignorance. I challenge that. The yeshiva knew, and probably lots more about specifics and the subject in general. The accurate word here is “DENIAL”. There was a conscious choice to disbelieve the claims and to dismiss them because that produced the desired outcome or prevented other projected negatives. Well, it backfired, as denial usually does when it ultimately fails.
I think the post should redirect itself to the concept of Denial, not Ignorance.
This may sound revolutionary, but here goes. I believe it is the absolute obligation of the school, if even to justify their very existence, to take these two children and work with them. There is greater danger to their future and that of Klal Yisroel by rejecting them.
Their iron clad rule about no TV access is frankly stupid, not that I have a favorable opinion about TV. Chas veshalom. If our yeshivos cannot work to be mekarev talmidim, then they have no right to purport to be institutions that promulgate learning of Torah. Rejecting a Jewish child is not Ratzon Hashem.
Our yeshivos today have excelled in creating stricter and dumber criteria about admissions. Together with that form of rejection, they have also expanded their criteria to help them throw talmidim out into the street at rates that are alarming. Yes, many hundreds of them. Such rejections are tantamount to spiritual murder, and are not excusable. I wonder when there will be mass rebellion to change the approach to chinuch to be inclusive. The exclusivity has not produced Gedolei Yisroel, nor has it attracted anyone to Derech Hashem. Moreover, those Gedolei Yisroel that have made their feelings about chinuch known have been 100% clear about how Kiruv is the mission that must be first and foremost in Torah chinuch. Trouble is, no one listens.
I marvel at the imbecility of some of the commenters here. CBT is a reputable therapy technique, and there is a huge body of evidence of its efficacy – both with formal scientific studies and with the anecdotal reports of thousands of practitioners. However, the saichel of the street wishes to proclaim it as “narishkeit”. Well, guess what? If I will feel the need to benefit from therapy, I will seek advice from a professional who is properly trained, not the mental midgets that opine about matters they have not studied and do not understand. I’m sorry about the name calling – it is not personal (can’t be with anonymous screen names). It is just troubling to hear the pronouncements coming from the position of ignorance.
There is one very important point that seems to have eluded nearly all prior comments. It is an unchallengeable fact about learning. Learning of “information” occurs didactically. It is best learned from a teacher (rebbe) who delivers that information via auditory or visual presentation. One might substitute recorded presentation (taped, video, or written material) if so inclined.
Values, among which Hashkofoh is a huge one, are best taught by example. Emunoh can be described, and intellectually absorbed. But until a student is exposed to the role of emunoh being implemented in one’s life, true learning will not occur. Such information being bounced back on a written test (bechinah) is virtually useless, and has no benefit to anyone except the teacher (rebbe) who considers it a gauge of accomplishment. In reality, it is a flat zero – unless the mission was to provide bits or bytes of data that are as emotionally important as the binary gibberish that are not interpreted or implemented.
Many of the baalei mussar speak openly about the way to teach Yir’as Shomayim as by example, even the relating of stories of tzaddikim (that kindle the imagery of the listener). As precious as the writings of the great Chachomim, many mentioned in earlier comments, might be, they do not result in maaminim, until there has been a more relevant way of absorbing that into one’s very essence. That, teach us the baalei mussar, is by example.
I’m straining to avoid spraining my tongue which is stuck deep in my cheek.
Actually, this bochur is being taught quite a valuable lesson. This “baal haboss” now has to use his income to feed others. If had stayed in yeshiva, he would be the one sponging off others, or having his parents/in-laws paying his expenses.
There is a widely known and oft used quite offensive line by yeshivos who send their talmidim (of all ages) to collect tzedokoh for them, “We’re being mechanech these children on the mitzvah of tzedokoh.” The cognitive flaw is that true chinuch should be to GIVE, not to TAKE.
To relate to the scenario posed in the OP, the bochur is being trained to take, and exposed to the poor fortune of the bloke that left the walls of the beis hamedrash who now has to give. Now take that to its logical conclusion.
Heard from a surgeon who is a baal teshuvah:
“I refrain from performing elective plastic surgery because I feel that I am tampering with Hashem’s creation. Hashem granted us the scientific advances that allow us to treat illness and injury. But to alter the existing because of preference is outside of my domain due to my belief in Hashem.”
Following this logic, past generations that lacked the ability to identify recessive genes required only bitachon in Hashem. Today, we must do the hishtadlus for which He gave us the capability.
I think refraining from testing is foolish, and entering those shidduchim with known incompatibility is not bitachon but sheer idiocy.
No clue – I didn’t say it.
Just wondering, what do you do if someone tells you, “I’m a pathological liar.” Should you believe them?
It is wonderful to get to see Gedolei Yisroel. Their brochos are certainly desirable. But, please, pretty please, do NOT make them into tourist attractions. These are tzaddikim who are busy learning Torah and fulfilling many aspects of Avodas Hashem. They are not background for pictures of your vacation.
I believe that they would be happier that you spend your time in your own Torah and Mitzvos, rather than coming to be a foreign spectator.
000646:
If I wasn’t busy, I’d present a full array of scientific references to challenge you. To you and any other readers who might believe your position for a second, all I say is – do some research.
000646:
Good question about alcohol.
Alcohol, if used moderately, can be completely harmless. In small amounts, it is not toxic and has no ill effects. I will note that far more people have issues with alcohol than we care to believe. The incidence of alcohol problems in our community is much greater than many believe. We still soothe ourselves with the saying, “Shikker is a goy.” Unfortunately, it is easy to abuse alcohol, and its legal access does make sure that abuse is still easy and largely inexpensive. But the limited use, such as has been prescribed by Torah is not problematic (except for those with increased sensitivities).
Nothing of the sort can be said of marijuana. It is always toxic, and causes damage with each and every puff. The greatest noted dangers of marijuana are associated with long term use, which is not paralleled with alcohol, for which limited long term use has no effect on health.
I am repulsed by the notion that the existence of anything in creation suggests that it is permissible. Before excusing smoking weed, perhaps you should try smoking poison ivy which also seems to lack any other purpose for existing.
oomis:
There is plenty that is legal to say no about.
“Marijuana is a bad thing and we should have the right to choose on our own to avoid it. Its illegality makes it more appealing to people who don’t like the government.”
This statement is fundamentally ridiculous. Firstly, the banning of dangers is universal to western societies. All the law would do is keep it as a controlled substance. Should cocaine, ecstasy, LSD, and methamphetamine not be controlled substances? Secondly, we already have the right to choose to avoid it or to indulge in it. Just who do you think the drug users and potheads are – aliens, robots, animals? They are people who are choosing to ingest the junk, who later to turn to the public and expect the support to rehabilitate them, to provide them with the resources for sustenance, finances, etc., and the medical care to treat all the medical conditions they brought upon themselves. The choice to self destruct always existed. The issue is whether we need to render that choice legal. I feel that laws should not coddle and support self-destruction. Same goes for the bailouts of other addictions.
Since we elected a president who has rarely, if ever, spoken the truth, or legislated anything of benefit to this country, I have zero faith in government. Yet, I choose to obey its laws to the best of my ability. I don’t like government, and actually hate it. But I have not ever contemplated smoking marijuana because of my political opinions. In reality, people who choose to fry their intellect and otherwise self destruct with drugs, including marijuana, are doing so because of their personal choice to engage in their preference to an altered state of mind rather than allowing themselves to remain creatures with saichel who can improve their world. They are sick and need help. Your average pothead does not pledge allegiance to their political ideology before taking a drag on a blunt.
There is probably no approach in the CR to stop a pothead from continuing to use, abuse, and push smoking marijuana. The purpose in responding to disagree is to insure that the readers here are not bulldozed by the erroneous information that is common to users of cannabis, who, understandably, wish to believe that their abuse of mind altering substances is actually healthy. In the addiction field, that is known as denial, though that particular defense mechanism is a chameleon, presenting itself in many colors.
THC, the main mind altering ingredient of marijuana is neither a sedative (though it has such a side effect), not stimulant. Rather, it is hallucinogenic. Generally, such effect is experienced only when used in high volume, and it is not experienced after a single joint or blunt. Regardless, it has known and documented toxicity (fancy word for poisoning) in smaller amounts, and has long term damaging effects on many organ systems. It lacks the drama of overdose common to many other drugs, but is no less dangerous and toxic. The effect of most other drugs is limited, as they are water soluble, are metabolized in several hours, and are absent from the body within several days. Not true for cannabis. A single joint of MJ is still detected in drug screening a week later, and regular use guarantees the detection for up to 6-8 weeks. THC is absorbed in cell nuclei, and the damage can continue weeks after last use. THC has profound effects on many parts of the body. Brain damage, impairment of all glands and glandular systems (thyroid, pituitary, adrenal, reproductive, etc.) are all documented, and are not uncommon. When used as “medical marijuana”, it is much like medications that each has its benefits and risks, and are applied by a medical professional who weighs these and reaches an educated conclusion.
Marijuana is not benign, and it is misleading to consider it safe. It should be illegal in all forms, and should not even be treated differently from the other “more serious” drugs. Use of makes people dumb and stupid, hence the justifications that are inconsistent with scientific fact. It makes its users lazy, killing motivation to do anything. My personal preference when I wish to be lazy is to do it without chemical inducement. Thus I am no longer impaired when I choose to get up and return to action.
I simply tell these tzedokoh collectors that they are welcome to send me mail. I tell them that I have a neder that I will NEVER pledge donations over the phone, and that my credit card will never be used for such purposes. B”H I give generously, beyond my capability, and I have done much tzedokoh by giving my time for free to those unable to reimburse me. I’m not against tzedokoh, but the disruption to my work by these calls has crossed all boundaries. If you do not know me personally, please do not call. You will never get a penny.
Next, with all the due respect to Gedolei Yisroel, our Roshei Yeshiva (with few exceptions) have not dedicated their lives to the experience of paskening the shailos that become the subjects of Kol Korehs, etc. Just recall the heated volley of Kol Korehs about the Boro Park eruv. Without taking a side, the messages bearing signatures of big talmidei chachomim who have great expertise in much but not dinei Torah.
Dayanim can easily take sides, but should not. Partiality has become more of a rule than an exception. I am choosing to ignore the commonly stated accusations that shochad affects most every dayan. Many are also not responsive to the challenges (such as non-compliance with visitation or child support), and often redirect the bickering to family court.
There are certain piskei din that, while having halacha status, deserve to be questioned. This is an entire subject of its own. I have often called dayanim to get explanation for a psak din that was inconsistent with the facts as I could understand them. I will note that there were times that my discussion led them to reconsider their psak. So I realize that the psak din is halacha, but it is needed to question them to be sure that it is either factually correct or otherwise. It is not guaranteed that listening to everything a dayan pronounces is for the ultimate good. But I wish that were the case.
Edited to be safe. You make excellent points but we are not experts in these issues and are concerned about opening certain lines of discussion.
The sequence that needs to exist universally is agreement, get, civil divorce. If anyone gives the get without settling the affairs, he is foolish and so is she for accepting it. Batei din also want this sequence to be followed, though there are times when matters are peaceful enough that settlement is expected without requiring it up front.
Divorce is based on hate, just as marriage is based on love. Strong emotion overcomes logic, and often pushes someone to commit violations of well accepted and recognized standards of morality. All these crises, agunah, children, visitation, etc. are immoral, but justified by the passion driven hatred that fuels most divorces. Yes, we have some really nasty people among us, and it is an embarrassment for all that they dwell among us.
Cherrybim:
But that’s what they do. Therapists working with these cases complain that their work to manage affairs of divorce peacefully are undermined by these untrained outsiders. Rabbonim are less aware of this outside source on interference, but are slowly beginning to recognize it.
cherrybim:
Your comment carries a tempting emotional twang, and I hope to restore a bot of logic to the discussion.
1. Both according to halacha and secular law, child support and visitation are completely exclusive of each other. Mothers denying visitation to deadbeat dads is illegal. Courts have been used for that many times. So have courts been used to go after the deadbeat dads, whose refusal to support their children is illegal.
2. As I have cautioned before (comments above), support groups need to have proper focus in order to be beneficial. My displeasure with existing support groups for divorced or separated women was obvious in my earlier comments. Why so bitter? Because I have observed way too many instances of these networks becoming wellsprings of advice that guide women to engage in combat. No, I do not have a single nice word for a deadbeat dad. But nor do I have any positive thought about the readiness to make false allegations just to take revenge. The support groups I know (not by direction of the group itself, but by the suffering and imperfect members) shower women with empowerment to fight.
If I knew that the support groups would keep their focus on the real issue that require support, I would encourage and endorse them. The experience is quite upsetting, and those I know are providing the community a terrible disservice.
justsayin:
Sorry to tell you, but your comment was one of the more ridiculous ones here. There are plenty of people casting blame, usually without the detailed knowledge of the situation, nor the understanding how to assess it. As far as preventing divorce just as in the maintaining the conflict that brings the marriage to that brink, both parties are always responsible. Yes, it takes one party to refuse help or change, which dooms the marriage. But, having worked with hundreds of couples, neither women nor men are the more guilty party. It’s a tie score (as if statistics have any bearing on an individual case.
As someone famous once said, the chief cause for divorce is marriage. I guess it takes two.
I’m not sure the assumption of many is that women are the fault behind divorces. However, I have heard people say that, and I have also heard people say that it is the men’s fault. Both statements are ridiculous. The factors that are responsible for divorce are many, and any pronouncing of a single issue or a particular direction is baseless and unprovable.
It is a fundamental human frailty to generalize. It makes life so much simpler to understand. But making these statements has never impacted the reality on the ground.
It also deserves to be added that anyone on the outside of the marital conflict cannot possibly know all the issues that are the dividers in a relationship. So even if you know of a particular couple who are getting divorced or already did, it is worse than presumptuous to believe you know anything about what really happened.
There are many different reasons for failed marriages. To add here all those I have observed would be quite long and still not exhaustive.
For one, people today are poorly prepared for marriage. Living with someone of opposite gender is a challenge, and this is not being addressed by yeshivos or Bais Yaakovs at all. No skills in communication, no understanding of the obstacles, no guidance in setting up homes, no training on how to assume and share the tasks of managing a home or family.
Secondly, the guidance that young couples seek is fraught with problems. Some seek guidance and direction from roshei yeshivos or kolellim, others from sundry other rabbanim, chosson and kallah teachers, most with great intentions but zero understanding about how to assist a struggling relationship. Others approach family members whose biases cannot be excluded. Such people, again with the best intentions, tend to make a bigger mess of things.
Thirdly, no one is prepared to deal with conflict. Yes, husbands will argue with their wives. But nearly any issue can be resolved if the two want it. But many take conflict as basis for battle, and engage in countless ways to destroy the other. Once this begins, it becomes almost impossible to reverse it and create a harmonious relationship.
Next, there is often a huge difference in personal beliefs and the importance of various issues. For example, some young people will consider their “right” to be by their parents for Yom Tov sacrosanct, being violated if the spouse insists on different. Some girls have been taught to be their husband’s mashgiach, and they are offended deeply if he sleeps late in the morning.
On and on, this list can go. We can introduce the uses and abuses of technology, incessant phone use, secrets, etc. Some of these are introductions of the current generation.
Meanwhile, there is an alarming increase in failed marriages. Maybe we need to address the ways in which we can prepare young people for marriage, and then help them maintain them.
I wonder whether this is a situation in which the ideal and the actual are different, considering the deterioration of the generations (??????? ??????). One should be able to overcome the constraints and limitations of the physical world through the connection to Hashem. However, in today’s times, it is hardly possible to achieve that. Even the greatest gedolim of our recent generations who have sometimes accomplished the “impossible” have been clear that this is not something on which we can rely.
It might be worthwhile to review the writings about the statement by Chazal – ???? ???? ???? ????? ??????. We repeat the recognition that all healing is directly from Hashem. We say it in ??? ??? and in ?????. Yet, the obligation to utilize doctors is in no way a shortcoming in ?????. The ?????? discuss this, and there is also ample discussion about it in the works of ???????. So Rav Brody’s statement is academically accurate, but is not the halacha we must follow. References available.
May I add one tidbit of Torah insight that is truly appropriate?
We are told that the creation of Chava was premised upon ???? ?? ??? ?????. By way of simple translation, what is precisely meant by ????
I propose the following. We recite in davening three times a day, ??? ???? ?????? ????. These three descriptors of Hashem refer to different roles that He takes when we seek His help. ??? is when we can do something ourselves to get out of trouble, but require assistance from outside ourselves. ????? is the salvation we need when we are completely powerless ourselves, where Divine intervention is all that will work. ??? refers to the prevention and ongoing protection so that we do not get into the troubles in the first place.
Now we might understand ??? ????? a bit differently. Chava was created to “assist” Odom, not to serve him. The husband who expects his wife’s service is not actualizing the will of Hashem, who intended to have Chava serve as an assistant to Odom.
The practical message here is that one who wants his wife to chip in more to the household chores should invite her to join him n the process. Making it a team effort is far more conducive to a healthy relationship than watching from the sofa how she washes the floor.
JF02:
“Recently I came back, then left, then came back again.”
Your story was getting interesting. Why’d you end the paragraph?
mewho commented that anything can be addictive. True. So can writing comments in the CR. But let’s examine the casino thing again. All business establishments are based on making money. Everyone wants to get paid for their product or service. But in the normal business world, the idea is generating revenue by offering something in exchange, either product or service. Not casinos. Casinos are an exception. It is a (legitimate) business that has the goal to take your money from you while offering you nothing but the fantasy that you are winning something or might be. It is conclusive that the entire industry built on gambling is “legalized” thievery.
Don’t fantasize that it will ever be declared illegal by any level of government. The governments are in the business themselves, whether by running lotteries, or by regulating casinos to collect taxes on the winnings.
rebdoniel:
Who is this Ron Lieber, what qualifications does this person possess (academic degrees, research, and experience within the frum community), and what makes you think you can present an argument from the cursed NYT?
I have worked with virtually hundreds of couples, and have a great familiarity with the range of problems presenting. It is not arguable that money issues enter the picture. But the origins of the problems and the core issues are about control, etc. Finances is just one of the arenas where the games are played.
Let me throw another twist into this discussion. A great percentage of all cases appearing before a professional (therapist, counselor, coach, etc.) where a couple is struggling involve the goal of at least one party seeking to describe the other as abusive. The preponderance is that the wife tries to claim the husband is abusive, but the other direction is far from uncommon. One way in which this is described concretely is the control or denial of money. It is simply an easy way to portray the nature of the relationship. Ask any of the professionals who deal with couples whether the issues that are presented at the opening sessions are actually core issues or are just manifestations that are acted out frequently. I rest my case.
I haven’t an idea how to react to an adult bully. But the only method of dealing with bullies in school involves severe consequences, with the only two options I know as using police/court, or expelling the bully. Bear in mind that it is considerably easier for the school disciplinary system to deal with the victim who fights back than with the bully who is really to blame.
There is moderate improvement in schools addressing bullying, but this is no consolation for those victims who still get bullied, and then revictimized by the school.
Rebdoniel:
You wrote, “Finances are the number one cause of shalom bayit issues.”
Absolutely not true. You cannot back that up with a single source. A valid statement might be that finances become an issue in nearly every struggling marriage. It represents an area in which there are control issues, as well as the need to partner to create and follow a budget. Most often, both parties have considerable activity involving shopping and spending in which they are alone, and these actions lend themselves to conflict. Often a couple in conflict will begin withholding money from each other, and using the incoming or outgoing monies in manners that are divisive. It is just one of the areas where conflict gets played out.
Zdad:
You wrote, “How many lives are ruined from Alcohol?
We all know about Kiddish Clubs, Drunkenness on Simchat Torah and Purim
Should we ban Alcohol too? “
Big difference, and it is one that matters. Alcohol can be used appropriately, and can be part of simchos and mitzvos. When used properly, there are no incursions into areas of issurim. We need to e careful to set up the proper and healthy undaries and gedorim to insure that alcohol remains a brocho, not the opposite ch”v. That fact does not exist with gambling. It is assur anyway whch you may study by examining the sugya of mesachek bekuvya in Sanhedrin, which you should review with the meforshim and poskim. Yes, casual gambling is also assur. Yes, the establishments that offer mini-casinos within the frum community during Chanukah are committing a grave issur, being machshil every one of their customers (besides being evil in their pursuit of everyone else’s money).
Just for your information, the Chinese auctions that are held as fund raisers for various tzedoko are actually relying on a flimsy technicality of halacha. These organizations know quite well that they can procure more of your money by making an auction, than they could by ordinary soliciting.
Those with propensities to gambling should not even buy the $1 ruboffs from the kids raising tzedokoh for their yeshivos. Donate – yes. Gamble – no.
Tefilo and mitzvos are zechusim, and can certainly help someone in need. However, we know from our tefilos of selichos and Yomim Noraim that we approach Hashem as “dalim” and “roshim”, empty handed, not flaunting our mitzvos as the basis to receive anything in return. Regardless, HKB”H is His infinite kindness to us grants us whatever He feels is for our good. HKB”H answers every tefilo, just that sometimes the answer is “No”.
It is quite upsetting to see the collection of tzedokoh for the poor, the sick, or the support of Torah being marketed n ways that parallel the selling of merchandise. The enticements, the advertising, the flaunting of promises, the claims of how the value is guaranteed, and worst of all is the exploitation of Jewish guilt – all have denigrated the great mitzvoh of tzedokoh.
Are we fully conscious that the Vilna Gaon, Reb Chaim Brisker, Besh”t, Reb Elimelech, etc. never donated a single penny to Kupat Ha’ir or to the Vaad Horabbonim? There are many worthy tzedokos, and none of these organizations own the monopoly on the mitzvah, your money, or the schar that HKB”H gives to those who fulfill this great mitzvah.
You have never met a compulsive gambler. Nor have you watched the complete destruction that is inflicted on the gambler, his/her immediate family, the extended families, and countless others. You certainly have not witnessed the futile efforts to bail out the gambler from crushing debt. And you are clearly unfamiliar with the ease of developing a gambling problem, far more insidious than other addictions.
P.S. Gambling addiction is rampant among Jews. The membership of GA (Gamblers Anonymous) has an extremely high percentage of Jews.
The answers (comments) here are mostly unfair. I’m well aware of what halacha says. But there is a “fifth” Shulchan Aruch. This one dictates that husbands trust their wives with many things (several of which are enunciated in the other four sections of the Shulchan Aruch). Women are to be trusted with calculating their own cycles, etc., and to ask shailos only when they feel the need to do so. Women are trusted in checking vegetables, and in running the affairs of the kitchen. The concept of treating a wife like a slave is foreign to Torah. To those who doubt this, revisit Aishes Chayil, in your zmiros, siddur, or in its source in Mishlei.
There are situations in which women are spenders that need outside controls, or have difficulty in managing budgets. The ideal responsibility for the husbands is not to control but to help. Marriage is a partnership, and it is not Torah consistent to treat it differently.
To restrict a wife from having money to spend is, in most cases, abusive, cruel, and demeaning. And if anyone feels that they are entitled to this, help is direly necessary. There cannot be shalom bayis in an environment where there is a slave and a master.
Keepitcoming:
When someone is single, especially after having failed at marriage, life can become lonely and depressing. There are multiple issues to handle, none of them being easy ones. It makes zero difference whether men are to blame or women are to blame. Everyone suffers, and everyone should be able to find access to resources to help them manage. It is not for us outsiders to make assumptions about who was at fault in the marriage. Just because someone could have been to blame for a failure at marriage is not reason to sentence them to the misery that becomes a daily suffering.
From my perspective (lots of experience), the generalizations about the men being more at fault, or the women are untrue. The truth is somewhere really close to 50-50.
A word of caution is appropriate here. Support groups are great and precious. Especially so with situations that are not subject matter for discussion in every environment. Divorce and being single are painful issues, where support is needed. However, together with the pain and suffering that so many experience (both divorced men and divorced women), there is also anger and a natural desire to seek revenge. Many who go through this issue are apt to express that anger, often toward their ex, and just as often by advising peers regarding their own issues. Such advice is coming from people in pain, not people experienced with helping others through tough times. This creates the possibility or likelihood of much additional bitterness, through guidance and peer pressure to take negative actions.
Yes, I have observed this occurring many times. As much as I feel that support groups and systems are critical, I find the damage they can cause alarming. Buyer beware.
I might take an issue with the knocking of an individual, even someone who violates halacha. We have specific guidance on how to address those who commit aveiros. For many, we have the mitzvah of ???? ?????. Even here, I have been appalled with the public statements that are often made by persons of stature and in the media. But the ideologies that are being advanced and publicized that counter halacha richly deserve the distinction and challenge by the leadership of the frum community. We desperately need to call a spade a spade. If this leadership recognizes these “movements” as inconsistent with Torah value and halacha, then they have the obligation to say so.
???? ????? ??? ??????.
Veltz Meshugener:
Great story. One minor correction. The child was the Beis Halevi.
” A real beis din cannot convene a session without both parties present.”
That is indeed the halachah. But in addition to this example, beit dins in Israel have pasuled conversions without the convert being present. This is worse than the stuff the Conservative movement does.
This was charliehall’s comment above. There is a comparison here that is wholly inaccurate. On matters that are of a din Torah between two litigants (??? ??? ??????), there is a distinct obligation of ???? ??? ????? which requires that both litigants be present before any of the dayanim hear any of the complaints. If the matter is an individual psak, such as the validity of the ?????, there is no such requirement. Such a matter does not involve a litigant, but rather a halachic process that is being evaluated as valid or not. Nice try.
Rabbi Bender is truly a pioneer in the field, and he is unfortunately an exception to the rule. There are several programs to train mechanchim. However, there is nary a yeshiva or girls school that requires such training as a qualification for the job. The nearly universal feature of today’s chinuch is that it is geared to the slightly better than average student, and those students who struggle are left to their own to somehow manage. Most schools put the responsibility on the parents to provide additional tutoring or services.
One of the telling signs that a mechanech is good is whether former talmidim maintain connection years later. I have noticed an increase in responsible chinuch, with training and expenditure of effort to build skills, plus the individual connection between rebbe and talmid. But this still remains the minority, and that is shameful and dangerous.
Teaching is a tough job. Managing a classroom with the types of behavioral and attitudinal patterns that are common these days is no easy feat. And doing all that while actually teaching something is even harder. Now, who should be teaching such classes. The relative of the Menahel/Rosh Yeshiva, or someone that has been trained in the field of teaching? Now you know……the rest of the story.
A good teacher can manage the difficult and challenging student. More often than not, this doesn’t happen, since most teachers lack training. Additionally, the teacher who needs to reach the tough student may need to expend a little energy and time to make the connection outside of the classroom. Who wants to do that? The teacher who just needs a job because they exhausted their time in kollel, or someone who is dedicated to the mission of educating young people regardless of their degree of challenge?
The answers to the questions posed here are also solid replies to the OP.
Unfortunately, today’s batei din are more of a circus than ever before in our history. It is commonplace for dayanim to deal with one side only, and to issue a psak that imposes on the other, without having ever made contact with the other baal din or a representative. I know this from first hand experience. Once this occurs, the dayanim themselves have distinguished themselves as low lifes, who do not follow the Torah dictate, and who use the “Torah” to carry out their will which is against it.
This case points to many wrongs, but the one I highlighted here exists in countless cases that lack the drama to get into the media. As long as we continue to respect dayanim who violate basic halachos, we will keep getting incidents in which the fairness the Torah demands is nowhere to be found.
As critical as it is to make sure the molester is apprehended and imprisoned, it is equally critical to be sure the victim/survivor gets the help and resources needed to deal with the trauma. An earlier commenter warned against connecting with NR. I can only endorse it. His (NR) agenda has nothing whatsoever to do with helping children who are victimized. He is dedicated to making sure that there is chilul Hashem. Pursue the directions of therapy and appropriate yeshiva placement. If you manage to discover the molester, do what is needed to protect Klal Yisroel. Don’t be fooled by useless statements about his having undergone therapy or doing teshuvah.
This is an old favorite.
I halve a spelling chequer
It came with my pea sea
It plane lee marques four my revue
Miss steaks aye ken knot sea
Eye ran this poem threw it
Your sure reel glad two no
It’s vary polished in it’s weigh
My chequer tolled me sew
A chequer is a bless sing
It freeze yew lodes of thyme
It helps me awl stiles two reed
And aides mi when aye rime
To rite with care is quite a feet
Of witch won should be proud
And wee mussed dew the best wee can
Sew flaws are knot aloud
And now bee cause my spelling
is checked with such grate flare
Their are know faults with in my cite
Of nun eye am a wear
Each frays come posed up on my screen
Eye trussed to be a joule
The chequer poured o’er every word
To cheque sum spelling rule
That’s why aye brake in two averse
My righting wants too pleas
Sow now ewe sea wye aye dew prays
Such soft wear for pea seas
There is certainly a problem of double standards, but it is not the media. It is appropriate for certain people to have expensive furniture, and it is wonderful for certain people to go to hotels in obscure places for Yomim Tovim. Yes, these things are costly, and those who have the money are certainly entitled to evaluate whether such expenses are fitting for them. It is not for us to judge. I can’t so I don’t. But I cannot blame those who do.
This question arises when luxuries are prioritized over such staples as tuition for yeshivos. And here is where conflict begins. Can one justify the cost of a summer in the Catskills while failing to pay schar limud? Can one justify extravagant simchos and trips to Eretz Yisroel while defaulting or demanding huge discounts on tuition?
Poskim have spoken. Now, it is for people to prioritize properly. But their decisions are frankly not any of my business. I must keep myself squeaky clean. I was not placed here to run anyone else’s life.
Don’t blame the media.
Advisor? Just what qualifies this individual to dispense advice? Having been married for several years and went through engagement makes someone expert to assume responsibility to make someone’s life decisions for him?
These questions are truly ???? ?????, and need someone with a good bit of experience and training to answer.
I fear that we will view some comments here about ??? ????. You would not approach a ???? who reviews ????? ????? monthly and masters this with questions relevant to ????? ???? and finance related halachos. I am not denigrating ??? ????, just noting that not every ????? ??? is qualified in everything. That goes for issues in people’s personal lives.
So, I may be redirecting the discussion in this thread to: What qualifies someone to give advice about life decisions?
In Skver, the minhag is that the chosson’s father does NOT attend the aufruf at all. If he happens to daven at the same shul, he may be there. If he does not but lives in the proximity, he may attend the Kiddush. But is he lives elsewhere, the minhag is that he does not attend at all.
If one reviews the practicality of it, it is rather challenging to get up and travel a distance while leaving the kallah at home, presumably alone, for her Shabbos kallah.
One of the bonding factors in marriage is the presence of the ????? as is represented by the Yud in ish and the Hay in isho. When things happen to exclude the ?????, it creates further deterioration of the bond, and the home eventually falls apart. This includes matters of tznius as well as many others. One of the obligations of marriage is to enhance the spiritual dimension of the relationship and the home. This does not refer to empty chumros that are adopted for the image, but rather the conduct of the home being based on kedusha. People need to be striving to improve their avodas Hashem, not looking for ways to trim the corners.
Perhaps we do not need to remove this thread. We might have someone in the know present the statistics of overdoses within the frum community for just this year alone. Then we add the numbers of those who have encountered other medical problems but survived. Next the number of arrests for driving under the influence of alcohol or drugs. We might also include the emergency room admissions for alcohol or drug intoxication (Hatzoloh would have some records of this though there are plenty of cases that avoid Hatzoloh and call other ambulances). Lastly, we should list the number of frum clients/patients in inpatient and outpatient treatment for addiction.
We are not talking of an epidemic, but addiction is far from scarce. It is very far from a laughing matter.
The making of a gadol is not by medication anyway. Gedolim are self made, though countless yeshivos dream of taking credit for one of their talmidim achieving such distinction. Some of the commenters are perfectly accurate when noting that even Talmudic brilliance will not be the deciding factor in becoming a “gadol”. There are multiple other variables. Some ride on the laurels of their ancestors, in-laws, others on their having gotten into positions of leadership and popularity. Throughout our generations, Klal Yisroel had incredible geniuses in Torah learning who never achieved the public roles as “gedolim”, and (dare I say) others who achieved status without having the true credentials to qualify.
Will a child with learning difficulties ultimately fare better if allowed to overcome them through will, determination, and behavioral help, or will helping the child have successful years of schooling with the aid of medication prescribed and used responsibly do better? I don’t know, but it is certain that yeshivos and schools cannot answer that either. I vote to turn this over to the experts.