starwolf

Well Sammygol, I know of hospitals that have pink, purple, green, etc.

But when we open that new hospital (Bet Chumra) we will only have white scrubs.

Don’t worry about the stains, because all the doctors (men only, of course) will have to wear black jackets over their scrubs.

Well, according to the fashion police here, I guess that precludes you from wearing jeans.

Now let’s talk about scrubs.

Halloween had its origins as a pagan holiday.

Valentine’s day, as currently celebrated, is an invention of the greeting-card companies–but it originally was yet another saint’s day in the church calender.

Thanksgiving is either of those–a truly secular, American holiday.

I guess I don’t.

And designer jeans are not my thing.

I do, by the way, work with designer genes.

One thing that we do is, immediately prior to candle-lighting, is call our daughters in to put money in the pushka. In addition to teaching them the importance of tzedaka, It also emphasizes that immediately after, we do not touch money. they like the idea of putting the money in themselves, of course, as it is an activity, rather than just a passive learning experience.

If indeed these men are innocent dupes, they should have no problem with providing the legal authorities with the information about those that duped them, and to provide testimony against them. there is no reason to protect these people. If the person who bought the ticket was also an innocent dupe–then who duped him?

EDITED

Someone planned for them to smuggle drugs. Whether or not that person is a member of the religious community–I do not care–he or she should receive the full punishment mandated by law.

Well, sammygol, this could really be a problem. Not the shiksa thing, but…..

Let us say that our nice Yeshiva boy goes to University to study, say chemistry.

He chooses a school that has mixed calsses–a strong Jewish community.

While his midot are such that scantily-clad shiksas hold no attraction for him, he cou8ld still meet a…….

…..modestly dressed religious girl who is there for her own education. This could be a real problem, since she is likely to regard her own education as important as his. Who knows, perhaps her subject of choice could be pre-med or Yiddish or even….dare I say it… Rabbinical Exegesis! This could even require actual Talmud study!! Who knows where that could lead?

He could marry her–and raise daughters whose education is as important as that of their sons.

I suspect that the above scenario is as treif to certain members of the Yeshiva community as the shiksa scenario.

As far as that goes, sammygol, there are University programs in which one can embark on a serious study of Yiddish as used in traditional writings.

It could still be a dangerous thing to do. One might end up wearing a colored shirt.

If, indeed, “They know how to act and behave”, then there should be no problem.

Otherwise, you have 2 solutions:

sequester them even more than you do now,

or subsidize alternative forms of transportation.

Take a bottle of dry red table wine. Nothing fancy. (Sweet wine will not work for this recipe.)

pour it into a pot & heat. Put in a cinnamon stick and some cloves.

Dissolve brown sugar or demarara sugar into the wine as it heats. Increase sugar till the mixture tastes sweet.

Let the mixture cool.

Slice several peaches or nectarines.

Pour the mixture over them and leave out for a couple of hours, then chill in fridge.

Serve.

No, Kasztner was not a tzaddik. And judging people who lived in those times, under those conditions, is, in my opinion, somewhat beyond our understanding. In any event, we have a Dayan Emet.

Many people made very bad decisions in those times. Kasztner has been singled out for vilification, especially by the Hareidi antiZionist community, who have consistently ignored the mistakes that their own leadership made during those times. Hypocritical, to say the least. Especially since they claim such wisdom (approaching infallibility) for those leaders that they may not be criticized. If they possessed such wisdom, why were their decisions not better?

This does not denigrate the wisdom that the Hareidi Rabbinical leaders do possess. But they were wrong on this occasion. People who believe that all Jews should be held accountable for all actions during the Shoah must include the Rabbinical leaders. Those of us who believe that we should not judge our fellow Jews for their actions and instead place all blame where it belongs–should include Kasztner in that accounting.

Well, bemused, you certainly bring up some interesting (and valid) points.

Certainly there should be no problem with a child who decides that he is more suited for cabinetmaking than medicine. However, professions like these still require instruction and training for the vast majority of people. These types of schools can be community colleges, state schools, vocational institutes, etc. Of course, it is very unlikely that they will be single-sex. And very unlikely that they will be primarily Jewish–especially if one lives outside of the NY area.

Personally, I think that the solution lies in education at the High school level. Sooner or later, our children will go out into the real world and interact with other people of both sexes, Jews and nonJews. (I realize that there are communities which are exceptions to this.) I personally think that the Orthodox world has carried the separation of the sexes too far–and when they are finally thrown together, many of our children have no idea of how to interact. Perhaps with a little exposure to people of the opposite sex–during high school–say, a mixed mathematics or history class–might be a good idea. They could learn that not every encounter between boys and girls at a social level need lead to an aveirah*. Perhaps then, they could attend a vocational school or college alongside members of the opposite sex, and still keep their eyes and minds on the job–that is, getting an education.

*Yes, I am also aware that there are those who believe that simple conversation between a boy and a girl is an aveirah.

I do not understand this obsession with clothing–I never have.

I remember one time during a late night experiment many years ago. Present were myself, the laboratory chief, and a student who came from a very Preppie background. All male.

After a long period without conversation, the graduate student asks “should your socks match your shirt or your pants?”

The lab chief and I (longtime friends) looked at each other in astonishment. The student pressed me for an answer. All I could do was reply “I think I’m doing pretty well if my socks match each other.”

It still holds true. People no longer ask me “who was that guy in shul with the purple shirt” questions. They are likely to get a response of “there was a guy in shul with a purple shirt?”

People who “automedicate” can be making a horrible mistake.

Consider that a physician relies on courses in anatomy, physiology, organic chemistry, biochemistry, pathology, immunology, virology, parasitology, and others to get his basic knowledge of the human body and its associate workings, as well as courses in pharmacology to get a knowledge of drugs.

Replacing those basics, as well as years of experience, with a few bits of knowledge gleaned form the internet, or what was told you by your “interlaws” does not make sense. Just as there are good, logical reasons that we get piskei halacha from Rabbanim, we get medical opinions from doctors. While they do not know everything, their knowledge is better than that of those who have not acquired it.

Regarding all the “herbal” remedies mentioned above, a word of caution. Many people feel that these, since they are not “drugs”, need not be approached with caution. This is a misconception. They are not regulated by agencies such as the FDA. This, however, is a legal issue, not a medical one. Just because these substances occur in nature does not mean that they do not pose any dangers. Many natural substances can kill, be addictive, cause uterine contractions or abortions, and have many other side effects.

Be careful, amass information from reliable sources (usually academic)and consult a physician that knows you. If you don’t have one, get one.

And so Joseph believes that all he need do is quote people who casually dismiss the advice of the leaders of the Hareidi community not to emigrate and it all goes away? Especially when, given unique opportunity, some of those leaders did escape–and left their flocks to the gas chambers?

Shall I really name names here?

Shall we name Hareidi leaders who–after being rescued by efforts of all streams of American Jewry–made no efforts to lend their names to further rescue efforts–especially if they were not Hareidi?

For decades, Zionists leaders had been encouraging Aliyah. This, after all is what Zionism is all about. A great many (by no means all) of the Rabbinical leaders of the time opposed leaving Europe. Joseph indeed has cited decisions that “better a physical death in Europe than a possible spiritual death elsewhere”. Joseph has also implied that those decisions were correct. In that case, it is difficult to blame the Zionists.

Perhaps the definition of those with Joseph’s viewpoint is that, aft4er ignoring the advice of the Zionist movement, they then blame the Zionists for not doing enough to rescue them. We certainly can observe that in the case of one famous anti-Zionist Rebbe–he was not rescued by any Hareidi organization, but rather by the same people that he spent a goodly portion of his life besmirching. Need we name names?

While nobody accuses the Rabbanim of cooperation with the Nazis, bad judgment on their part was rampant. Furthermore, because of the way that Hareidi society is built, discussion of such topics is basically suppressed. However, this does not hold true for the society outside of Hareidi purview–which describes most of Jewry–and even most of religious Jewry. Plenty of research on the topic is available. Plenty of eyewitness accounts are available–having been transcribed by organizations such as Yad Vashem. Including eyewitness accounts of people who heard these psakim directly from Rabbanim.

In any event, perhaps Joseph can continue to use the issue to deligitimize Zionism and Modern Orthodoxy. Maybe he can even convince a few people who will not accept any source besides the ones that he brings.

I was not going to reply to this thread until other men jumped in. If the women feel that I am hijacking the thread, I am sorry.

I must say that I am amazed by the common sense shown by the women posters on this thread. Perhaps the gene for common sense is on the X chromosome–and women get a double dose? (Nerdy joke–I do realize how genetics works.)

The necessity for women working in many families (including my own) is unquestionable. This is especially true if the man learns and does not bring in any money to help the family. Now, mind you, if a family chooses to live in this manner–it is their choice–and if any of the rest of us have an objection to the lifestyle, tough. As far as the need for others to support that lifestyle–well, that is a matter for another thread.

One of my basic questions for those families living that lifestyle is–how much do the men help around the house? If your wife works and takes care of the children, do you share in the latter duties–or any of the housework? Does the man do the laundry? Putting in a load takes about 5 minutes, as does a transfer to the dryer. What about cooking? Cooking an average meal takes 10 minutes. How about the weekly shopping? How about the homework?

A kollel life means that one is attuned to the Jewish clock. If the wife has a heavy schedule, why can’t the kollel man cook for Shabbat? What–the Rebbeim won’t understand that time is short on winter Fridays when the wife has to work? Many recipes are quick and easy. A good chicken dish takes 10 minutes to prepare, and a cholent about the same. Doing all of that ensures that your wife has a little time for other things.

SJSinNYC posted: “Which means to me that the father is required to work to pay tuition. After all, he is supposed to provide a teacher for his son’s potential (unknown as a child, so you should assume he could be a talmid chacham). “

While I agree, allow me to add a qualifier: We should provide teachers for our daughters’ potential, as well as that of our sons. Not only do we not know for where will come our next Rita Levi-Montalcini, Rosalyn Yalow, or Ada Yonath–we do not know for where will come our next Bruria or Nechama Leibovitz. The potential is there, just as with our sons.

Well, if you don’t like those classes, don’t take them.

Either prepare a course of study yourself, or wait for the Yeshivot to do it.

If the latter, don’t hold your breath. Bears don’t look so good in that shade of blue.

Of course, one would think that in this day and age, if we feel that we need another language besides Hebrew, we should pick one equaly common to all of Clal Yisrael.

However, it is all a moot point. You want to speak Yiddish? Go right ahead. You can communicate with those who also speak the language. Of course, that means that for most day-to-day activities, you will not be communicating, as you certainly will have some trouble conducting your business in Yiddish, if it outside of Brookly, Lakewood, Bnei Brak, or certain neighborhoods of Yerushalayim.

So Joseph, you are saying that my post is wrong?

Counterexamples were brought to your main points, and your points were shown to be nonsense. If that is a little too direct for you, maybe you should emphasize those subtleties a tad more. Or shorten your posts.

I do think, that for some, studying the natural sciences is a way of studying the work of HKB”H. Certainly for myself, this is the case.

However, this does not mean that a study of the natural or any other sciences is itself enough.

I feel that learning (Torah) is too important to be left to those in Kollel. It is something required of everyone–but even without the requirement, it is the essential component of understanding the purpose of our existence, and what is required of us.

Learning any subject alone, with no context, no relations to any other subject, give a view of the subject akin to tunnel vision. While tunnel vision excludes anything outside the tunnel, it does not increase the clarity of view inside the tunnel. It only subtracts, it does not add.

Every language has made-up words in it. New words for new things are a requirement of language if it is to have any use; the only alternative is to use words from foreign sources.

Where do you think that the word “bentchen” (pardon my Yiddish spelling ignorance) comes from?

Like it or not, lashon kodesh is the language of the Torah and Mishna. It was also the only correct alternative for the language of the State; as has been noted here, a very large percentage of the Jews have no connection to Yiddish whatsoever.

Is it good to keep Yiddish alive? As with any kind of knowledge, of course. It enables us to read literature that would otherwise be forgotten (at least in the original). Is it a priority of the “utmost madrega”? Not to me. First I would like an explanation of why it is holy, and I have not yet seen a convincing one.

The world was created in a certain way. If you want medical doctors, if you want engineers to build bridges and sewer systems, if you want computer scientists (to create computerized responsa projects among others), if you want soldiers to defend you from those who would kill you, if you want HVAC people to kewep thoses Yeshivas warm throughout the New York winter, if you want qualified people to take care of our invalids—etc etc–

then you need professionals who must train for their jobs, keep up with the current knowledge, and then be available when you need them. This was the case since Eden, and certainly has been so as long as there was a Jewish people. The interdependence of society is simply the way that the world was made.

One can wish that things were otherwise–but consider it insane?

These are as much the “real things” in life as Torah–Torah does not exist in a vacuum. This is the way that the world was created.

To YW Mod-80–shavua tov

“once had a whiskey that was the least horrible of all whiskeys I’ve tried.

It was about $75, came in an oval shaped bottle. It was called something like “Rodes”

Anyone know what it was? “

You may be referring to Glenrothes. It is a very good single malt, and is bottled at several ages.

If you wish, you can email me and I will tell you where to get it at very good prices if you live in the NYC area.

I have been collecting and drinking single malt for a very long time.

I have heard from many Rabbanim their opinions about the kashrut of the ones matured in wine casks. There are a variety of opinions, and the answer is clear (just as it always is)–ask your own Rav.

(There is no question about the malts that were not preserved in wine casks. This is also why there is no question about the kashrut of bourbon. It is illegal for bourbon to be matured in any cask that has been previously used).

I have also discussed the process of distilling, maturing, and bottling with several distillers as well. Each whisky is matured and finished in one or more casks, some of which may have held wine of some type (including sherry or port). These days, it is very much in style to drink these whiskies that are preserved in wine casks. Therefore, many distilleries say outright on their bottles which kind of casks have held that whisky.

However, not all do. Again: Not all whiskies state the types of casks that they use for maturation and finishing. If they do make such a statement, one may rely upon it. The laws about this in Scotland are extremely strict. However, they are not required to make the statement at all. These days, most distillers and bottler that use casks that have previously contained wine put it on their label. Since these are popular these days, it increases the desirability of the bottle. It is to the bottler’s advantage to label it as such.

However, many brands have been using these wine casks for decades, long before anyone imagined the value of advertising them as such. Their labels have not changed over the years, and make no statements.

If you hold that it does not matter, then no problem. However, if you hold that it does matter, you must be careful. An example: My brother-in-law’s Rav holds that it does matter. When he bought a bottle of single malt for a simcha, he was very makpid that it did not state that it was matured in sherry or port, and he purchased the whisky that was recommended by that Rav. When I got to his house, I noticed that, regardless, it was a bottle that I personally know was matured in a sherry cask. It put me in an uncomfortable social situation, halachically–as the bottle was half gone.

Back to topic: Yes, the sherries, ports and other wines really do change the taste of the whisky.

Now, for those of you who hold that you should not drink something that has been in a cask that previously contained wine but are nevertheless wondering about this taste, I have a solution. There are now a series of malts that are matured in casks that previously contained wine (not sherry). The casks were purchased from the Carmel Wine company in Israel–and the wine inside was kosher. If requested, I can provide the distillery name and suggest places that it can be purchased (It is not that common of a label). Several caveats: 1) The wine in the casks was kosher, and produced under Rabbinical supervision. The whisky–like other single malts–is not produced under Rabbinical supervision. If you only eat or drink product that are–well, this will not help you. 2) This whisky, being a specialty item, is not cheap. 3) Although I had something to do with this process, I am not associated with the company other than being friends with the distiller.

Joseph posted:”

I will take a Godol’s idea of when a spiritual danger exceeds a physical benefit any day over yours. Regardless of the circumstances, in your humble opinion.

“the advice was not to emigrate”

Even taking into account what I said above, this point of yours was the case in relatively few cases.”

Nevertheless, the advice was given. The advice prevented some from emigrating, and others form attempting, Like it or not, that advice cot the lives of Jews–and no matter how you try to shrug it off or whitewash it–those Rabbanim were wrong. The results proves them so. This is not slander.

“And like I keep pointing out, indeed it was very very few who even ever had this opportunity. It surely was never available in any large numbers, no matter the definition.

And it was never even desired amongst the populace (to emigrate) in large numbers. So lets quit slandering Rabbonim ZT’L with false implications if not claims. “

This does not make the advice correct. And what do we say about saving a single life? A number of these counsels weere given to people who specifically asked. That means that they were considering emigration. Whether or not they would have succeeded is moot–you do not know the answer. Mir got out–because they tried. Others did not even try-some because of this.

” Harav Hagoan” posted: starwolf: “the spiritual dangers most definitely did not exceed the physical benefit. Those people died in horrible circumstances.” i couldn’t have asked for a better summary of your weltenshaung. how can you possibly weigh a spiritual tradegy against a physical

one.

“There was no way to predict how they would have lived their lives had they emigrated.” why was the trend set by the first wave of zionist initiated immigration not an accurate prediction? “

That comparison of spiritual dangers against physical ones was not mine. It was done by the Rabbanim of the time, as Joseph put it: “the Rabbi may have correctly decided that someone would better risk dieing a Yid in Europe than a shaigets in America (or wherever.) ” Needless to say, the word “correctly is Joseph’ opinion, not my own.

As far as the accuracy of the prediction, many Jews had emigrated to the US, and led perfectly Halachic lives. There was not necessarily spiritual death there. The same held true for Palestinine. Yes, in Israel relatively few Jews at the time were observant, yet there were still some. And the reason for the lack of many observant Jews in Palestine is that they did not come; they listened to the Rabbanim. Too bad. Perhaps if things had been different, they might have survived, and the State of Israel would have had the benefit of their Torah learning.

Could all the Jews have gotten out? No.

Those that did try–some made it. Some became irreligious–as the Rabbanim feared. Others established Torah institutions that endure to this day.

Was it better to stay in Europe? We know the answer. The advice to do so was bad advice, and it does not matter who gave it.