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actually, if its 12 noon, it is the middle of the night somewhere. There are ways to argue almost every point.
While I agree that the Brooklyn eruv is very controversial, the Rabbi who gave me the psak didnt just make it up. He consulted with his poskim also.
They dont have to agree with the psak, but they shouldnt sabotage my psak, which is effectively what they are doing.
lgbg – if its plain beer, chances are it was kosher
intellegent, I understand! Many parents dont quite teach their kids that lesson so well. I’m thankful my mother did a good job.
MommyofTwo – if you are considering an all girls school, you might like Shulamit (or is it Shulamis? I dont know what they are officially) better. Its more modern, great education with a very diverse student body.
The only caveat I know with them is that they generally attract a crowd of immigrants. That is NOT a bad thing, just something I know people have pointed out to my sister when she was searching for schools.
Joseph, why not?
notpashut – it was clear. My sister was not allowed to invite anyone who held by the eruv even if they agreed not to carry. The only possible thought I could have is that he didnt trust that others wouldnt actually carry.
While I understand your analogy, there are SOME people who would probably argue that Dinkins was a great mayor (for whatever reason they have). You would vehemently disagree but should respect their right to the opinion. I recognize the psak for the eruv is very controversial (and most say its not acceptable), but it should be respected that there are some orthodox rabbis who say its ok.
I have no problem with accepting other people’s stricter psak. I have no problem abiding by it either, when necessary (I only use bodek spinach when my sister comes, per her request). But I do have a problem when people make it seem like my psak is totally wrong and halachically unacceptable.
intellegent – its hard, and you have to be willing to compromise. Are your spouse/kids (I dont remember if you had any) willing to try new things? That is step number one. The rule in my house (its me, my husband and a baby who doesnt eat much solid food yet) is we eat whatever one of us makes for dinner. You arent going to like/love everything, but we arent wasting it. Of course, we dont repeat the meals if its bad…but unless its REALLY foul, it doesnt go to waste.
If you like more traditional food, you can try things like tuna casserole, omelets for dinner, and soups. If you are willing to be more adventurous, try tofu, tempeh beans (there are so many different types). Beans are REALLY cheap, especially if you buy them in bags. You do need to soak them before cooking usually.
Would you eat wraps for dinner?
I’ll start a non-meat/chicken thread so people can post ideas there. Might make it easier. (I would call it vegetarian, but canned tuna/salmon is pretty cheap so its good to include)
The biggest problem is that sometimes when you go towards more vegetarian style, you use more vegetables which are more expensive.
Oh another cheaper trick – if you use a lot of grated cheese, buy blocks and shred it in a food processor.
As for the spouse that wont cut down – I would come up with your budget of absolute neccesities (like basic food, no eating out etc). Then add psuedo neccesities (whatever they are for you. For me, its organic produce for my son that I wont give up unless I absolutely have to in order to make other bills). Then put on “possible luxuries” and then “absolute luxuries.” Add up your salaries to get your maximum number per month. Then start subtracting – first the absolute neccesities, then the psuedo neccesities…when you get to possible luxuries, then discuss what to cut and what to keep.
Its also important to keep long term goals in mind. Do you own a house? Are you planning to buy one soon? Or in a while? You need to try to save for a down payment. Or you may just want to save an emergency fund in case on of you loses a job. Is cutting out your coffee budget of $10/week (or $520/year) worth it to you? Maybe, maybe not. That depends on you. For example, my coworkers invite me out to lunch about once a week to go to a kosher place. For a while I felt obligated (after all, they were going kosher for ME). But then I added up the $10/week and realized that at the end of the year, I dont want to spend $520 on lunch like that. I would rather go out once a month (for $120) and have the $400 for other purposes. That $400 can be put towards a couch (our living room is empty right now because we are saving up for one). Remember, that adding a few of these simple things together can add up to big bucks at the end of the year.
OK this is a megillah, I’ve got to go back to work!
Notpashut – the reason I think its disrespectful is that I was in no way shape or form making my sister use the eruv. I was choosing to follow my halachic psak regarding the eruv and the rabbi making a decree against my sister inviting me based on something that doesnt affect her at all is disrespectful in my opinion. What if I didnt live in her building? Then she would not have been able to invite me all for something that I hold is halachically acceptable! Its not like I was bringing something that was of questionable hechsher into her home that could possibly contaminate her pots or something…it only affected the person using the eruv.
tzippi, there are very few people who cannot cut down expenses. There is no need to eat expensive chicken/meat/fish. You can get good protein/nutrients from much cheaper sources (like beans). That saves a lot of money.
I find the internet saves me enough in coupons that it pays. It all depends on the family. My cable on the other hand is a luxury, but I can still pay my bills.
Also, its not just about stopping to buy – you can SELL your previous jewelry and other things amongst the house.
Some stay at home moms should consider getting jobs – perhaps pairing up with another SAHM and split the take home of the job. I know many people say daycare is too expensive and doesnt pay to work, but if one person works and the other watches the kids and they split the paycheck, everyone wins. Or swap babysitting – you get a job on Monday and Wednesday and they get a job on Tuesday and Thursday and neither pay for babysitting but are able to bring in more money.
I’m with luv2hack. There are ways to use Facebook inappropriataely, but there are ways to use EVERYTHING inappropriately. At some point you have to take personal responsibility and say “I can/cannot handle this.” Choose accordingly.
If facebook is bad for YOU, dont use it. If its not, go ahead and enjoy it.
Joseph – what about women’s pajamas? Are they allowed to wear pants then? Just curious what you hold by.
I personally have to wear pants for work many times. I work in power plants that are old and dangerous. Skirts are a hazard. I am constantly climbing over and under pipes, walking on grating – there are dangerous pieces of equipment that a skirt could get caught on. My rabbi allows it.
When I lived in Brooklyn I asked the Rabbi of the shul I davened at about the eruv. He said it was kosher so I used it (and still do when I go back). To me, it was important to have an eruv because I had never lived without one, so I wasnt so sensitive to making sure my pockets were empty. My sister on the other hand didnt hold by the eruv. Her Rabbi forbid her from inviting people who used the eruv because it might possibly cause them to carry. Since I lived in the building with her, it didnt affect me, but it affected my sister. I personally disagreed with her Rabbi because it was a lack of disrespect for other poskim. However, he isnt a Rabbi I hold in high regards for many reasons, so this didnt shock me.
Anon, selling a car worth $40,000 and buying a car worth $20,000 works. It obviously doesnt work in ALL situations, but does work for many. People wont want to do that though. Just curious if you agree about selling jewelry though – I would rather sell my engagement ring (which I love) than have to turn to tzedaka for food when there are so many people out there who dont even have jewelry to sell.
I was working at 14 – I worked on the weekends for my shul caterer. Luckily, my mother didnt need the money so it was all “play money” for me (which I saved a lot of), but if she had needed it, I would have forked it over in an instant.
I am not saying to overwork kids, but there is nothing wrong with having them help out. Its not a good idea in all situations, but in many (especially with older kids) it could work.
I highly recommend http://www.slickdeals.net to find savings. I use the drugstore brick and mortar area to save a ton of money at Shoprite, Target, CVS, Walgreens, Rite Aid, Stop and Shop and others. Each store has its own thread (or its own thread per week for the drugstores) so its easy to find what the deals are and where the coupons came from.
Before turning to organizations like Tomchei Shabbos for food, people should start selling things that they have – jewelry, furs, expensive cars. They should downgrade. They should not buy new clothing or shoes unless absolutely neccesary. Every expense should be looked at as *essential for living* or *non-essential* and budgeted accordingly. Find cheaper alternatives to eating healthy (such as eating beans for protein instead of meat/chicken/fish). Dont make weddings you cannot afford and dont buy things you cannot afford. Save the little you can. Make your kids get jobs to help out if they are old enough – they should understand that the economy is tough on everyone and if they want to eat, the families need money.
OK, I could rant and rant for a while…
Itzik, Judaism is about choice and freedom. You choose your posek. You choose your lifestyle. There is plenty out there that is kosher, but not neccesarily recommended. We are not a nation of robots who follow blindly. Many times there are multiple acceptable paths, and we have to teach everyone how to choose for themselves. Perhaps we are arguing semantics more than anything?
All the coed schools I know of in Brooklyn are mostly sephardic.
Are you willing to send your kids to Manhattan? Ramaz is an excellent school education wise.
Itzik, I didnt mean playing outside = TV. I meant that these kids dont get a chance to be kids. Everything is a NO including more time to run about and have fun. When I was a kid, my friends and I would spend hours on a weeknight playing ball. Now, kids seem to have school from 7-6 and then mishmar and homework. So, they dont watch TV, they cant use the internet and they have no time to have fun in other ways. Does that make sense? Its so hard to be clear via the internet.
I think facebook is a wonderful thing for some people. I love facebook – I can see pictures of my friends and what they are up to, keep in touch with many people on the quick until I have time to really speak to them. Its great.
Everything on the internet is a potential waste of time (YW included). I do find it a little ludicrous when people who use the internet decry others for things that they dont use (so long as they dont violate halacha). We all have to make choices in life and learning to make good choices is better than cutting off everything.
That being said, my step-nieces use facebook in a non-kosher way. They are young teenagers who would benefit from not having access. At this time, there is no real way to keep it away from them (they have no internet at home anyway – its used at the library or other peoples houses). It would be better if their parents would allow them access and monitor them.
I think many people forget this generation is MUCH more tech savy than most of their parents…
Gitty I just want to add that I understand where you are coming from. I understand why you came to your conclusion.
Lakewoodbubby – I think there is a very serious problem is the Jewish community today. The communities preach so much about being perfect on the outside – Whats not nice we dont show! And then many Jews cheat on their taxes or do cash busineses…the Jewish people are not living as Jews. Many people are living as hypocrites as their children see this. Being a talmid chacham is only great if you PRACTICE what you are learning. You could know shas by heart and know NOTHING.
Also, we are raising a generation where everything is more forbidden then ever before. Kids are not allowed TVs, computers, time to run outside and be kids! Everything is NO. Instead of showing them that there are more and less stringent opinions, they go with the “everything to the left is NO” philosophy. Sometimes kids do better with options – Judaism rarely is unified on psak halacha. It doesnt mean someone is a bad person for following a less stringent psak more than someone following a more stringent psak is a better person. Kids need to understand that Judaism is about choice and freedom, within limits.
I understand where Gitty and all the others who are off the derech are coming from. Although I never considered leaving Judaism, there are many aspects that just dont feel comfortable to me and keep me disconnected. Organized prayer for one – saying the words written by others does not make me feel connected to Hashem. Praying in my OWN words really does. I’m thankful I am not a man and obligated to daven 3 times a day with a minyan because I wouldnt gain anything from that and just resent it. Shabbos is particularly restrictive when you want to do other things. Its taken me to working a full time job that would require weekend work (that I luckily get out of saturday duty) to really appreciate the break in reality so to speak.
This is somewhat of a ramble…I hope I am being clear.
Joseph, out of curiosity – do you speak this absolute in person? Or is just the nature of web forums?
I can only try – when I meant “her psak” I meant her following her halachic source, not her making up her own psak. There are poskim who agree that pants are ok (whether or not you hold by it) so you should respect her right to follow her posek. After all, “Asei L’chah rav.” If you are following an orthodox rabbi then yes “all opinions are equal” in terms of following halacha. Just because you (the general you) choose to be more machmir does not mean I (the general I) am not following halacha.
Does that make sense? Its so hard to be clear on the internet.
I guess I dont see feminism as anti-torah. Where does it say that women are inferior? We have diffefrent tasks in life, but that doesnt mean women are LESS. Yes, radical feminism does conflict with Torah, but not all branches of feminism do.
In fact, kollel society has created a really feminist base without meaning to. The WOMEN are the ones supporting the family. Sounds feminist to me 🙂
Anyway – jfem has always been polite and thoughtful and unless she says something that is anti-halacha (and I mean clearly like “Pig is kosher” not like “pants are halachically ok” which is a debate by various poskim), there is no need to jump down her throat. You can respectfully diagree with her, but remember, her halachic psak is just as valid as yours.
Joseph, “clever” but you avoid the point.
Unless, you want me to be your posek?
Pashuteh Yid, its not so simple. Would you exclude a handicapped person who cannot serve from running for president?
That aside, I am very proud of my grandfather and step father for serving and of my civilian brother in law who works for the army. And thankful to all the other (Jewish and non-Jewish) veterans.
Joseph…but how would you recognize if he turned into a Shabtai Tzvi?? You wouldstill just follow blindly? I find that hard to believe…
Will, actually, all the “tznius”related things seemed subjective.
Besides, if a stranger came to me and told me I was acting in a way that wasnt tznius, I would get very upset…especially if it were subjective.
Jfem, abortions are not usually performed in the first 40 days. I think they are actually performed in the 12-15 week range.
As to late term abortions (AKA partial birth abortions) its just sick. They stick a rod into a baby’s brain to kill it. If for some reason the baby lives and is delivered, they put the baby on the side to die without any help.
There are cases where Rabbis make exceptions for abortions, but its a heter, not the norm.
I never asked, but I would assume l’halacha, the morning after pill wouldnt be a problem.
Will, if the tznius issue are subjective (as most are), she should stay away. Eating treif cheese is clear…wearing something that someone else might percieve as a lack of tznius, when her halachic opinion says its ok is another thing.
LOL at Oomis 🙂
To be honest, nowadays, smicha is more of a degree (like a bachelors) than anything else. I know plenty of women who are really shtark and can learn many people with smicha under the table.
Not that we would offer women the smicha title nowadays, but it wouldnt really matter because its a degree.
Teenager, the reason for that is because the jewish communities in general have a “whats not nice, we dont show” attitude. So as long as you can hide something (DELETED BY YW MODERATOR) its not a problem. Eating non-kosher in public is in their face and people dont like that.
I have to jump in here! Devorah, if it bothers you so much, next time you see someone who looks like they care about kashrut, go up to the and say “I don’t know if you realize this, but the grilled cheese and baked goods here arent kosher.”
Leave it at that. You’ve “done your job” and you dont have to embarras them. e
I would personally leave it alone because I believe everyone has to make their own decisions. I dont like when other people tell me what to do (unasked, I give my Rabbi and certain other people permission to guide me according to halacha) but I would be very pissed off if someone tried telling me what was ok and what wasnt. Then again, if I didnt realize it wasnt kosher, I would be very happy if someone told me. So just go easy on them if you decide to speak to them.
squeak, if its on the roof, it can gravity drain.
Itzik, I understand and respect your point about television.
I do have a problem with people who watch tv shows online and they say they “dont have a TV.” By choosing to watch via the internet you have turned your computer into a television. True, you have different options in terms of how fast you watch something, but it is a TV. This is especially true for people who love to brag that they dont have a TV (and then watch more online than anyone else!)
I voted. I got to the polls at 6:07 am.
I think the “Good Shabbos” thing is rude, not a halachik thing. Where I grew up in Monsey, everyone said good shabbos to each other. We had a nice mix of people (though mainly MO) and everyone joined in. As the community got more and more right wing, people started ignoring others. In my opinion, sort of going against the “minhag hamakom.”
I really try not to say good shabbos to people who look like they dont want to answer me, but sometimes I “slip up” and when they dont answer, it does bother me. You dont even have to look at me, but please, do not ignore me.
Also, please do not cross to the other side of the street. I will avoid touching you. I will not reach out to grab you. I will make sure you have plenty of room not to touch me. Please dont make me feel like a leper though.
Cantoresq – I’m not much of a musical type person, so I lack a lot of the understanding of why chazzanut is so nice. Although, I do have to say, a well chanted Kol Nidre really stars my Yom Kippur off well.
GMAB very cute 🙂
I would be less afraid of Biden being president than Obama. I personally dont like any of the candidates…I feel like I’m voting on South Park.
I think Obama will win, but I voted for McCain!
I think its naive to assume that people cannot be truly happy unless they are orthodox (pick your sect). Any lifestyle choice you make excludes something else. As an orthodox Jew, I choose to forgo a lot of things to remain observant, but that doesnt mean I am not missing out. I am just choosing a different path.
Here is a (stupid) example: My boss put me on an emergency job just before Yom Kippur. It meant working 16 hour days/7 days a week. Of course, I couldnt work on Shabbos, Yom Kippur or Succos. My coworker was working all 7 days and 16 hours each day. While he was struggling and exhausted, I used those days to rest up. So while yes, sometimes keeping Shabbos means restrictions, it also means much more.
About modern orthodoxy: Chalish, I think you must not have much experience with modern orthodox people. I think Itzik said it best. I went to a MO high school, and I would say 95% of the girls now cover their hair (if they are married). Of those 95%, I would say maybe 20% of their mothers cover their hair. Its a different generation.
I am personally modern orthodox. I dont believe in cutting out the outside world for no reason. To me, television is not a problem – its what I choose to watch that is. I like watching sports on TV, or the history channel…not everything has women improperly dressed. Same thing with the internet – I can self screen. I choose what is right for me and what is not. I dont need someone else (like yeshivanet or anything like that) to tell me otherwise. I will teach my son to do the same, just as I teach him to keep kosher and shabbos and everything else. I think personal responsibility is very important.
Teach them to drive as soon as they are ready. Drive with them for the first year or so, until both your children and you are comfortable that they can drive well.
I personally started driving when I was 16, but was not comfortable with it. I didnt really start driving until I was 20.
He wouldnt bankrupt the coal industry – he would just restrict its growth. There are plenty of coal plants out there right now and they would continue to use the product. Older plants are also grandfathered in for environmental purposes. You only have to meet the standards that were put out at the time you built the plant or if you increase the capacity of the plant.