Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Vogue- that sounds like a really good idea. I’d go for it.
Personally, I see yeshiva bochurim smoking a lot. It is assur because smoking is sakanas nefesh, plain and simple.
your 6 year old was mechaven to a bavusteh shaila! That’s a great story.
Boredom can either lead to behavior that’s comstructive, or destructive. If you’re at home with a baby, there are lots of things to do. Daven, learn, watch a movie, exercise, play with the baby, sing to the baby, write poetry, etc.
2smart: those are some good points. Im with you 100% that oftentimes the most yeshivish kids are the ones that go really OTD.
However, I disagree with your last sentence. you can definitely stop kids from doing things. Shabbos, kashrus, shomer negiah, they’re all halachos and mitzvos that stop people from doing things (such as touching, eating pork, or working on Shabbos)! Why is this different?
Oomis: Thank you for calling health out- I think (s)he really went way too far there in making incorrect assumptions and spreading sheker.
Health: Halacha is Halacha, you’re right. But in this case it seems like those that are noheg like rav health, and the mekoros you never quoted often times end up doing very poorly in life, per the study. And by the way, stick to ideas, and avoid personal attacks. Those are generally used by people that don’t have any good ideas.
A mamin: you know there is a shidduch crisis going on, right??
But chareidim want to live in eretz yisroel because of the kedushah- they just don’t want to live underJewish sovereignty with a state. Personally, I think the state is the package in which the gift of eretz yisroel has been given to us from Hashem. Many chareidim obviously disagree, and thus have no thankfulness or feel an obligation to the state.
It would be the same to them as in Russia, where Jews would trick the Czarist government by not paying taxes.
There was a study that came out 4 years ago from London university that baed on a sample of 17,000 people, men that went to same-gender schools are more likely to be divorced or never married by their 40s. Depression was also fairly hiigher than for co–Ed schools,
I’m not an advocate for mixed schools at all, but kal vachomer the situation would be even worse for guys if they NEVER talk to girls even outside of school in normalized settings. If you make conversing taboo, it will lead to either bored experimentation that’s definitely not halachic or awkwardness.
I don’t understand how you think the complexities of the male-female dynamic relationship can be worked out in a few dates, overcoming a lifetime of stigma and no prior experience.
Imagine if you threw me onto a baseball field and put me at shortstop, without me knowing the rules of the game, how to play, good strategy, or tips to get better. It sould be a disaster. This is what happens to guys who have never talked to girls. They’ve never played the game, don’t know the rules, and aren’t sure how to start.
Ben: the tzedukim were the ones who davka put tefillin on their hands and between their eyes, following the pasuk literally. They also didn’t light fires before Shabbos, per chazal’s interpretation but instead were cold and hungry on Shabbos. Tis is rejecting the Torah she’be’al peh.
YCT graduates wear tefillin, follow hilchos Shabbos, and generally care about Halacha- that’s why they have a semicha program that involves intense study of Halacha.
Its not that they don’t like Torah, or want to undermine frumkeit. They are struggling with being frum in this modern world we live in. That’s perfectly fine. Their ‘halachic’ conclusions might not be right, but their intentions are good and they want to live as frum Jews- otherwise they’d discard it all.
That’s not okay. They do follow most halachos and care. The only problems are womens issues, and a few other kulahs. Are they really as bad as Zoroastrians in your opinion? Wow. That’s quite sad you feel this way about other Jews that believe in God, learn Chumash and Gemara and are shomer mitzvos.
For the record, the Sadducees (tzedukim) did in fact reject Torah she’be’al pen, and only though Torah she’bichsav had authority.
Durthermore, YCT uses the same halachic process many Orthodox Jews do for 90% of the issues. For that they should be respected. This is a far cry from the reform who saw Halacha as primitive, and ignored it altogether. YCT clearly does not ignore Halacha, otherwise they’d serve pork, be mechalel Shabbos, and reject the Torah as being divinely authored. The fact that they don’t do ANY of those things shows they’re a lot closer to you than you think they are.
Broadly painting many Jews that care about their yiddishkeit and Halacha with the brush of avodah zarah is so offensive. Open orthodoxy will not stop keeping all the mitzvos, because for the most part, they ACTUALLY CARE.
Health: a few dates cannot instantly change 20 years of life experience! I’m not saying be matir issurim- just don’t add unnecessarily stringent regulations to further limit mixing. The formative years of ones life are the teen ones. If in those years one does not talk at all to girls one’s age, it can cause years of discomfort, anxiety, and social awkwardness.
Benignuman: a dating coach?? I don’t know from that. Most guys are just set up and expected to know what to do. They might get a word of advice from the mom before, but nothing serious or professional. That seems problematic to me.
Many guys I know that went to all-boys elementary, middle, and high schools, as well as camps now feel in their 20s very awkward around girls, since the only women they ever talked to were their mom, sisters, teachers, or occasional mixed event.
And btw pleasure is almost always derived from conversations, unless its an argument or just hurling insults…
Interacting at Shabbos meals is awkward and you never know what to say. Mot parents also intentionally separate kids of the same age, if they’re teens.
My main point is that separation is good for maintaining tznius, preventing pre-marital bia, and keeping things clean. At the same time it can also make regular conversations and scenarios awkward, as well as preventing one from having good dates.
I dint think these concerns are overblown because I’ve seen what happens to guys who just left the freezer, and literally never talked to girls their age before. It can feel intimidating and downright scary.
Measures such as this only add to to the tension.
Surprising as it may sound, I find talking in learning can be fun. So is finding shared interests/hobbies, and making jokes (if that comes easily). The key is confidence and listening to them talk too, as swell as talking yourself.
Platonic, shomer conversations and friendships can exist between genders. Many non-Jews are “just friends” with people of different genders and nothing scandalous happens.
If boys and girls aren’t allowed to talk or “hang out”, they won’t have the skills that are necessary for shidduchim, college, and the workplace (if applicable).
Torahlishmah- talking and hanging out with the opposite gender- especially in crowded settings can easily lead to more halachicallly questionable situations, especially if they are unsupervised and there is loud music and alcohol involved or nearby.
Tzaddiq- still, you shouldn’t mess with mamon yisroel. Perhaps just tell store owners to keep an eye out, or even have rebbeim swing by to make sure everything is kosher.
Water features, seeing the ocean for the first time, fire trucks, going up and looking over my dad’s shoulder as he leined- there were so many letters, and the smell of parchment.
And WIY- good call. Laundry is one of those things that I thought was universally hated. It’s interesting to see that’s not the case.
That seems unfair. Motzai Shabbos is prime business time for pizza stores in Brooklyn, and they cater to everyone, not just teens.
Come and see how the melech hamelachim is different than a basar v’dam melech! God is merciful, we should be as well (imitatio dei). If they really sincerely follow 95% of Halacha, I think I can honestly be mochel them even though they’re wrong.
And Comparing them to heterodox movements is just wrong, as you admit.
I never said its because of “darned chareidim-” I’m just noting a religious trend that you refuse to believe exists.
I’m not sure why you told the buss story, but I’m sorry that happened to you today. Ahavas yisroel does not mean I have to accept every chumra and psak as correct- it means I have to respect people. I attack ideas with ideas, which is completely mutar and encouraged as part of milchamta d’torah -something folks around here could learn from, based on all the ad hominems going around.
The part of chareidi society I know from is the one that I greatly respect for their commitment to Torah and halachah, but also have some issues with in terms of rigidity, isolation from the world and disregard of secular studies. I’ve been stared at in certain places for wearing a blue shirt, even with a hat and enough Yiddish to fit in! There are shortcomings in every community- that’s just life. What makes the difference to Hashem is whether we acknowledge the bad parts and change, or ignore them. Chumros aren’t bad, but there is a culture around them of elitism and exclusion of dissidents.
And you should look at the last 100 years, because Judaism is mimetic- based down from parent to child, so I look at how recently it was practiced- not how it was many years ago because the experiential mesorah is only from those that are alive.
I’ve told you. They keep Shabbos, kashrus, go to shul, fast on tzomim, some women cover their hair, teach Gemara, daven, wear kippahs and tzitzis, and many do taharas hamishpachah. Does that sound like non-religious Judaism to you?
Charliehall, that is the kind of small thinking I’m arguing with. In every generation, rabbanim have had to be creative to solve current problems. There was no mesorah about electricity on Shabbos, the state of Israel (for good or bad), and a host of other contemporary issues . Halacha leaves a lot of room for interpretation. Of course it’s all grounded in a system but even so its pretty remarkable.
In terms of having a kiddush club yes.
Chumros becoming mainstream aren’t a problem- it’s simply a radical cultural shift that’s happened in the past hundred years, especially post-holocaust. Chareidi society is obsessed with chumros, seeing the kol korehs, bans, and cherems these days.
I don’t like your tone. Have you learned the Sugyos relating to shmiras haloshon, ahavas yisroel, and hocheach tocheach? You have an attitude I despise- one that cares about Halacha superficially, while still managing to be mean-spirited and insulting.
Mesorah doesn’t begin and end 100 years ago, that’s just the last line in the mesorah before us, so I care what used to happen.
I did sloppily use the word minhagim, However, most of the things I mentioned WERE NOT mainstream Halacha, as I proved and you acknowledged.
All I’m saying is that the romanticizing of Europe, and the claim that Halacha today is the same as it was before is inaccurate.
And by the way, when the daughter of the minchas Elazar married rav Baruch Rabinowitz, it was attended by thousands and televised. You can find the video online!
I don’t think you’re being dan l’kaf zechus. I have no idea what their motivations are, but overall they observe Halacha much more than non-frum do- it shows they care.
DY says they wouldn’t attract members if they wer blatantly non-halachic- what about the non religious?? They don’t associate with those movements for a reason- they have some principles.
lol I have no idea how wikipedia works, but according to recent studies it’s nearly as accurate as encyclopedia britannica. I guess they crack down on subjectivity in articles, especially in this extreme case.
… so your shitah is that they did not keep all the mitzvos, unlike what the midrash says.
My question to you then is, what is the midrash trying to teach us? If it is not giving over historical fact about maaseh avos, what is it trying to show? That the avos were good people- we already knew that?!
“If someone needs internet for parnassah or school, they should use it for that and no more.”
Easier said than done. This is the entire argument of the anti-internet rabbonim- that some access will lead to temptation and addiction.
People that use the internet for parnassah often need to be on it for long periods of time answering emails, writing documents or doing whatever. However, they also have some amount of free time where they can do what they want. This timeframe is what emunas yisrael is marketing to.
I don’t think the Rav would ask those who are directly ignoring the peak not to- wouldn’t he think they’ve already gone too far off to be helped? It makes more sense that the site is aimed at people who have a heter to use it, since that would make the Rav more comfortable that only they are on it, I assume.
Democrat, except about Israel. Then I’m very right-wing.
That’s not being fair. They know their views are unpopular, and they would be welcomed a lot more in non-orthodox communities. However, they don’t do that because they still care about most of Halacha.
Rav Kook said that bayit sheini was destroyed because of sines chinam, and the third will be built because of ahavas chinam. He added we don’t really even need ahavas chinam to explain loving a fellow Jew- the fact that they’re Jewish is reason enough!
I haven’t heard of this yeshiva, but it sounds really interesting. Is Belz into Kiruv now?
And Torah- yours is the best way to really answer the question, however, many people can’t afford it. A trip to Israel these days is a small fortune.
Those are all excellent ideas, yytz.
Personally when I’m feeling down I love to play guitar. Davening with a lot of kavanah also helps- focus on every word and don’t be afraid to fall behind. Sleep is also very important, as is taking a walk or exercising every day.
Recently, I’ve taken on a minhag by the arizal of making a declaration every morning to perform the mitzvah dioraisa of ve’ahavta le’reiecha Kamocha. This gets me in the right state of mind, and focused to really love my all jews i interact with, and help them out, in any way possible, be it a kind word or tzedakah.
Another good thing is to find a hobby, like learning a language, knitting, or playing an instrument to make your time more fulfilling.
! here are a few I use regularly: torah.org, revach.net, Torah.net, yutorah.org, halachapedia.com. Chabad.org, shasilluminated.org.
I don’t think this is hypocritical. The rav is saying he personally discourages Internet use. However, if one is already in a position where they need to use the Internet, (for parnassah or school, for example) they might as well use it for good by listening to shiurim.
That seems very creative and is also being mekadesh shem shomayim by using a potentially dangerous kli for good. Shkoyach to this group!
Great answers. However I have a few questions.
Why would the avos have had a reason to shake a lulav, or sit in a sukkah- did he wander for 40 years in the desert? Many mitzvos in the Torah are experiential, or at least performed based on previous experiences- e.x. Sukkah, the Seder, etc. many mitzvos asei are given because bnei yisroel were avadim in mitzrayim. How could the avos have performed those in the way they’re intended with proper kavanah?
So fine. They are fairly traditional, but willing to make halachic changes and be maikil, as well as misusing halachic concepts like kavod briyos and kavod tzibbur. That doesn’t mean they’re hypocritical though- I don’t think they claim to be completely liberal, or open to everything.
The very fact that they have mechitzahs, oppose same-sex marriage, and keep Shabbos shows they do have some boundaries and generally care about Judaism and Halacha in general. Otherwise, they’d be reform or conservative, without marketing themselves as orthodox at
All they claim is that they’re more egalitarian than most frum Jews, and that is true.
1. He’s a rav as well. That comes first in my book.
2. I’ve been in a yeshiva environment, and am proficient in Yiddish, but i have never heard that word used. I assumed it was demeaning, my bad. And about the beards, where I’m from a lot of kollel yungeleit and even some guys in 2nd year beis midrash have beards.
3. “3. For the record, here is his Wikipedia bio. I’ll let the audience judge you.”
Cool down your rhetoric. I’m not a chassid of Chaim Solovetchik- I think he wrote one really great, seminal article on frumkeit. That doesn’t mean I’ve read his other work or even think learning history is worthwhile. You’ve made quite a few assumptions.
4. I haven’t. I don’t need to, this article is just very famous in certain circles I occasionally float in. I never said you had to talk about him in “hushed tones” (assumption alert), just not to demean the work, which I now realize was a misunderstanding based on vernacular.
“My religion is that I follow the rabbonim of my generation”
That’s great, but mesorah is just as important. Yiddishkeit is absorbed through active participation and following good examples just as much as it’s learned from books and rabbonim.
Just like I wouldn’t call a psak by rav shteinman “cute” same here. They’re both talmidei chachamim that should be respected.