Forum Replies Created
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Posts
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To always
I agree with you that there are many wonderful Lubavitchers. The Rabbis of the shul I go to are terrific and we’ve been friends for years. However I heard the following from two of the congregants, “Everything we have in our lives comes from the Rebbe. To which the other said, “Of course, we live in the shadow of the Rebbe.,” These are Russian Jews who didn’t know Aleph Bes ten years ago. The Rabbis never mention Hashem. It’s a steady diet of the Rebbe and the people automatically become believers. I’m not telling you what to believe. I like that you have a mind of your own, but according to my observations the Rebbe is very much to blame.
To Seichel
I take about 25 hours for every blatt. I’ve been learning Shabbos for more than 12 years. I have a certain system. I’m answering you because I try to answer each question. Now you have an annoying habit of misquoting people. First you said that the Rabbis on Lichtenstein s program said that the Rebbe is Moshiach which was a total lie, now you accuse me of comparing Elokistim and Meshichistim. I didn’t say that. It was Rav Aharon Feldman. As far as I’m concerned every Lubavicher has the Din of an Elokistim because no one criticizes the maniacs like you and Cunin who claim that the Rebbe is god. As for your Midrash., I agree with it. My name is Yaakov and so you’ve convinced me that I’m god who created worlds. But seriously if you think that Midrashim must all be accepted literally then you obviously believe that Adam had relations with every creature in the universe on the day he was created.
To Yserbius
It sounds like you’re challenging me but we’re totally on the same page. Rabbi Feldman is courageous and has taken a public stand but I know many other mainstream Rabbis who are fully aware of the Chabad scourge but they don’t want to get involved. It’s amazing how these Lubavichers keep pitching. Menachem Shmei disappeared because he realized the futility of their cause. He can protest otherwise but no one is buying his nonsense. Boruch Hashem Lostspark and Seichel haven’t given up. The lunacy that they present does more to damage Chabadianity than anything we mainstream posters can say. It calls to mind the sage words of Mark Twain, “When you keep your mouth shut I only think you’re stupid, but when you open it all doubt is removed.”
To Yserbius
Rav Aharon is one of the few Rabbinic leaders who has spoken out against Chabad and he has done so for years. He said that the Meshichistim don’t bother him, it’s the Elokistim, those who believe that the Rebbe is god who worry him. It’s becoming more and more apparent that those Lubavitchers who think that the Rebbe is Moshiach also think that he’s god. If that sounds like Christianity it’s because it is the same. T he problem with Chabad is that if a Rabbi doesn’t publicly denounce them they announce that such Rabbi endorses them. Even those Rabbis who did endorse Chabad like Miller and Sacks would reject the idea that he’s Moshiach or god.
To always
Thank you for your comment. I don’t write to change Chabad’s “,mind ” They are idolaters and by definition they are no longer in charge of their senses. I write to reach people like you who aren’t convinced as to the depths of Chabad’s depravity. The more they respond the . more obvious it is that their religion is not Judaism. And don’t think that the Rebbe gets a pass. Unfortunately most Jews who’ve decided that Chabad is kosher will ignore the facts at all costs. But I’m glad that you see what a despicable liar Lostspark is. He’ll say anything to cover up for his fellow zombies.
To Lostspark
“Some nut jobs in 770 allegedly davening to the Rebbe.,” That would include Rabbi Cunin who stated that the Rebbe runs the world. That is clear-cut idolatry. He is in charge of thousands of Lubavitchers. So no this isn’t about a a few psychotics in CH. The Chazakah is that all Lubavitchers are idolaters.
To always
You’re a decent person so I’ll address your comments accordingly..I certainly agree that when there’s a pressing need innovation is called for. Sarah Shenirer is a prime example. But the Rebbe rejected open Gemaras. The Gemara says that there is no Nevuah until Moshiach. The Rebbe said that certain individuals did attain that status including his father-in-law. With that statement his followers assumed that he’s also a Navi. Therefore when he said that Moshiach’s arrival is imminent they accepted it as a Nevuah and so it can’t be challenged. There’s more but I want to respond to the other posters.
To Lostspark
When the subject of Lubavitchers davening to the Rebbe came up you dismissed it like Kotlarsky. Now you change your tune and say it’s just a few nut jobs. In fact it’s a significant percentage and since the leadership refuses to say anything it becomes Shtika Kihoda. Nice try to shift the focus to YU but that’s not the subject of this thread. As for why the Gedolim haven’t ruled that Chabad is illegitimate. That was a major topic in Dr. Berger’s book. He said that all the Gedolim he spoke to agreed with him but said they didn’t want to get involved. It’s not my place to challenge them.
To Seichel
I learn Avodah Zarah, Berachos and Shabbos..Most of the time is on Berachos. I try to make a Siyum every year for my Chabad shul on Erev Pesach. By the way I take about 25 hours to learn a blatt, because I write questions and answers. I have haskama from R Dovid Feinstein’s son-in-law so I could care less what you think. As for your statement that the Rebbe declared himself the Bore Olam in the sixties and Rav Moshe didn’t protest. Real Jews don’t believe that their Rabbis are prophets. Rav Moshe didn’t have spies reporting to him as to what was going on in CH.
To skripka
The reason I asked Seichel to answer my questions is because I wanted his answers There are mainstream Jews who still refuse to accept that Chabadianity is nothing but insanity. The more that these lunatics express their views the clearer this truth becomes.
To yankel berel
Hashem will decide if they’re Tinkos Shenishba. Since they know enough to lie and cover up for their dead god I’m not so sure.
To Lostspark
Congratulations you bear me lol. Until the Gedolim pasken that davening in a Chabad minyan is Assur I’ll continue to do so. Nice try.
OO no
To always
I see. So according to you when there’s a pressing need one is allowed to change the Torah. Thank you for agreeing with with me that the Rebbe was a reformed Rabbi.
To Lostspark
I will reiterate what I said. Ruba Druba of Lubavitchers are liars. But each has his own style. Rabbi Schachter didn’t say “a rumored small contingent in Chabad who may or may not be davening to the Rebbe.” Those are your words the words of a liar. What the Rosh Yeshiva said is that some Lubavitchers daven to the Rebbe and this is idolatry. He was very clear. I don’t lie because my G-d hates liars. But your dead god was a liar so Kal VChomer his followers. As for Lichtenstein having the din of an idolater that’s for Hashem to decide.
To yankel berel
Your post is well taken. Too many of the posters are afraid to acknowledge that the Rebbe is to blame for Chabadianity. One of Rav Moshe’s grandsons told me that I was completely correct about Chabad but not about the Rebbe. I asked him why he said this and he told me that a number of people he trusts told him that the Rebbe was beyond reproach .I told him to give me those Rabbis phone numbers and I’ll set them straight. In the Yeshiva world too much emphasis is put on Torah knowledge. Yes the Rebbe was a gaon in Torah, but he rejected open Gemaras that didn’t jibe with his agenda.
To Seichel
I wake up at 4:30 in the morning and I learn for 2 and a half hours, until Shachris at 7:00. Then I learn for an hour on the train while going to work that’s 3.5 hours. I learn about 2 hours a day at my office between patients. That’s 5.5 hours. Another hour on the train going home. Finally I learn for a half hour between Mincha and Maariv. Some days it’s more than 7 some days it’s less depending on how busy I am at work. Don’t you dare call me a liar. By the way learn how to spell liar and nonsense you numb-skull. As the Gemara says, if you accuse someone of something it’s what you’re guilty of. Q.E.D you are a liar as are Ruba Druba of Lubavichers.
To Lostspark
No one said that Rabbi Shachter or any of the Rabbis on that show offered a blanket condemnation of Chabad. Rabbi Shachter said that some Lubavichers daven to the Rebbe and that’s Avodah Zarah. Then Kotlarsky had the nerve to deny that “any” Lubavicher davens to the Rebbe. I guess he wasn’t aware of the psycho Cunin who stated on YouTube that the Rebbe runs the world. Since it’s the Rebbe and not Hashem, who’s in charge, Cunin obviously davens to him. Since Krinsky and Kotlarsky refused to criticize Cunin it means they endorse him and according to Rabbi Akiva anyone who supports idolatry is an Idolater. So let’s hear you write to the group that Cunin is an idolater and should be removed from his position.
To Seichel 83
There were five questions. They are all addressed to you I only want your opinion.1. Do you believe the Rebbe was, is or will be Moshiach?
2. Do you believe that the Rebbe runs the world?
3. Do you believe that the Rebbe is physically alive or dead?
4. Do you believe that the Rebbe was/is a Novi?
5. Do you believe the Rebbe is/was god clothed in human form?To Lostspark
It’s Lichtenstein Headlines 102 1/28/17 Revisiting Chabad.
To Pekak
I study Gemara about seven hours a day and that sharpens the mind. Your expression is very strange, “I’ve never in my life been a Lubavicher.” If you’re not Chabad just say, “I’m not Chabad.” The fact they you gave such a wordy response calls to mind the Bard, “Methinks thou doth protest too much.” Yes, I’m pretty sure you’re lying. And even if you aren’t Chabad, you’re lying about Chabad not telling people to remove their shoes at the Ohel. I know because it was personally said to me and my credentials for honesty are well established.
To Lostspark
As Seichel 83 said it’s Number 102 But put in 1/28/17 and the name of the program was Revisiting our Relationship with Chabad. That should work.
To pekak
So why do you use deceit to defend them?
To Lostspark
The Rebbe’s bones are interred in 770, So what’s buried in Queens. Rav Schachter is holding pretty ignorantly if he said this. You said that you would stand for a Litvish godol. Now you call such a Godol stupid.
To Lostspark
Right. And there’s no such thing as a Lubavicher who believes that the Rebbe is god clothed in human form. This discussion has been going on for several weeks. So now you’ll listen to the podcast? I heard it when it aired. Rabbi Schachter said that many Lubavitchers daven to the Rebbe and not Hashem and that’s idolatry..Then Lichtenstein put on Kotlarsky who denied that any Lubavicher davens to the Rebbe. There used to be a commercial,”You don’t have to be Jewish to love Levy’s( bread) You don’t have to be a liar to be Chabad but it sure helps.
To Pekak
I went to the Ohel years ago and was told to remove my shoes. One of us is lying. I wonder if that’s a real Jew like me or a Lubavicher.
To skripka
They have already incorporated Islam into their religion. They lie to the infidels who don’t accept the Rebbe as their savior.
To Lostspark
Right. And there’s no such thing as a Lubavicher who believes that the Rebbe is god clothed in human form. This discussion has been going on for several weeks. So now you’ll listen to the podcast? I heard it when it aired. Rabbi Schachter said that many Lubavitchers daven to the Rebbe and not Hashem and that’s idolatry..Then Lichtenstein put on Kotlarsky who denied that any Lubavicher davens to the Rebbe. There used to be a commercial,”You don’t have to be Jewish to love Levy’s( bread) You don’t have to be a liar to be Chabad but it sure helps.
To Pekak
I went to the Ohel years ago and was told to remove my shoes. One of us is lying. I wonder if that’s a real Jew like me or a Lubavicher.
To Lostspark
So do you agree that many Lubavichers are idolaters as Rav Herschel Schachter said on the Lichtenstein program? The Rosh Yeshiva said that many Lubavichers daven to the Rebbe instead of Hashem.
To Pekak
Name one non-Chabad Jewish cemetery where one is asked to remove his shoes. Checkmate.
To Pekak
The Ohel is the only cemetery that “asks” people to remove their shoes. But I’ll accept that it’s only a Chabad minhag just like it’s only a Chabad minhag to think that your Rebbe is god. The reason Chabad wants people to take off their shoes at the Ohel is that they equate the Rebbe with Moshe Rabbeinu(R”L) Just as Moshe had to take off his boots at the Sneh so too we must follow suit.
To skripka
He was a genius, but calling him holy is highly questionable.
To Lostspark
The answer to your question is no. There’s nothing wrong with davening at the kever of a Tzaddik. But going to the Ohel is a problem because Chabad considers the Rebbe god clothed in human form. As proof people who come there must take off their shoes because it’s holy ground.
To the group
Do any Lubavitchers still keep my the 9 days? I think that the Rebbe encouraged Siyumim so that his Chasidim would imagine themselves as having already been redeemed. BTW how many of those Siyumim are Halachially valid?To Always
About 35 years ago Rabbi Dovid Hollander told me something very powerful, “Don’t try to understand a Rosho because you’re not a Rosho.” The point is that we think that all people have certain common beliefs and values, and so it’s pointless to lie, especially in an anonymous forum. You’re right that it makes no sense, but Lubavitchers are idolaters. Their entire existence revolves convincing themselves and others of their lies. So don’t be surprised by any tactic they use. Last year Menachem Shmei started a thread intended as an “open discussion” with non-Lubavichers but he ultimately realized he couldn’t convince real Jews of the Chabad garbage so he disappeared. Our mission is to speak forcefully against this scourge because too many great Rabbis make the mistake of giving Chabad tacit and sometimes outright acceptance.
To seichel
You still refuse to answer my questions. I never said that Chabad is the closest religion to Judaism.. Chabad is Christianity with some meaningless rituals thrown in
To DaMoshe
Thanks for the support. Aside from the basic insanity of being a Lubavicher Lostspark is obsessed with me. I don’t know why but frankly I don’t care.
To always
I’m surprised that you think it’s a Chiddush that Lubavitchers would lie. Their entire religion is a lie. But you’re right. To blatantly lie and think you can fool others as well as Hashem is, perhaps, worse than idolatry. I heard the program when it first aired and none of the Rabbis endorsed the idea that the Rebbe is Moshiach. I, unlike Chabad, don’t lie.To Lostspark
As I wrote earlier for the past few months I was on VIN as the whole tooth. Why that name? Because I’m a successful dentist. As for the name qwerty my son thought of it. Yes I’m also happily married. And I’ve been writing for the JP for the past 40 years. I could go on but I’m from the LES and it’s not our Mehalech to brag. It’s sad that you think that by putting me down you can justify your empty existence.As for your statement that I would stand for the Rebbe. Yes I would. Rabbi Miller said that if Eisav came into the Bes Midrash we’d all stand up for him. The Rebbe was a gaon but also a heretic and I’ll prove that with your own words. You clearly accept the Gemara as evidenced by the fact that you quoted the story about Rebbe Hakodosh. Therefore you would be forced to agree that the Rebbe is a Kofer because he rejected open teachings of the Gemara.
To the group
I recently returned to the group, but for the past several months I was doing battle on VIN. Interestingly there I had to fight Lubavitchers and mainstream Jews. The former engage in mindless name calling, but its the latter who really irk me. They refuse to accept that Lubavitchers believe the Rebbe is Moshiach and certainly the Rebbe is god clothed in human form. They maintain that there are a handful of crazies but Ruba Druba of Lubavitchers are normal.
To Lostspark
No one called the Rebbe an idolater although the Gadol Hador did call him insane. We, in this and other sites, are calling Lubavitchers who worship the Rebbe
and impute to him godlike qualifies idolaters.To Seichel
You still haven’t answered my questions. The real G-d will ask them to you at 120. If you refuse to answer you’ll get a one way ticket to spend eternity with your Rebbe.
To Yserbius
You’re absolutely right. I don’t understand why such brilliant Rabbis have anything to do with Chabad. If you shake hands with a Lubavicher he takes it as an acceptance of the Rebbe as your savior. Rav Moshe accepted Rabbeinu Tam Tefilin from Chabad. He looked at it as a Mitzvah opportunity. They brag that this constituted Rav Moshe’s acknowledgment of the Rebbe’s superiority.
To Lostspark
Right. He became Moshiach before he died, but no one knows about it.
To Menachem Shmei
I figured checkmate would bring you out of the closet. I guess CS won’t be far behind. Seichel is busy trying to decide which lie you tell.To the real Jews
I think you’ll find this interesting. When I got married I inherited my wife’s friends. One was a Chabad couple featuring a real nut job husband. They invited us for a Shabbos. It was 1991 and I knew nothing about Chabad. The guy told me that the Rebbe is Moshiach. I figured he was a crazy BT so I said that’s nice. A year later, post stroke, we were invited again. Again the host tells me the Rebbe is Moshiach. So I told him that he told me that the last time. We met at some event in 95 and he tells me the following, “The Rebbe is Moshiach. It doesn’t matter that he’s dead, because the Gemara says Moshiach can come from the dead. The Chofetz Chaim paskened otherwise, but who cares what he says.” I spoke to one of my Rabbis and he confirmed that the Chofetz Chaim did say that. A year ago I was fighting Chabad on line and I bought this point up. One psycho. Chabad answered, The Rebbe became Moshiach before he died so it’s not a contradiction to the Chofetz Chaim ‘s Psak.
To seichel
Hold your horses. Whoever says that Moshiach can come from the dead is relying on a Gemara so obviously he’s not an Apikorus. But it’s quite a jump to say that these Rabbis completely accept the Chabad belief. Even you admitted that Rav Herschel Schachter said on that show that many Lubavitchers are idolaters. Now when are you going to answer my questions you coward? I’ve got you trapped and so it’s time to say checkmate. Remember how I drove Menachem Shmei crazy with that word?
To Lostspark
Enjoy your attempts at humor. Korach also used the mocking route. Didn’t work out too well. I do not need to go to church. The Chabad shul I attend has a nice breakfast after davening on Sunday. Again. It’s not exactly a Chabad shul. The Rabbis are Chabad and the congregants are Russians who know little to nothing about Judaism. Last week one of the Russians approached me and said that Chabad is idolatry. I told him he was right and directed him to this site. Of course, I keep my mouth shut in shul for Shalom Bayis.
To seichel
What’s taking you so long to answer? No matter what lies you tell I’ll catch you. And you know it.
To DaMoshe
We can add a point to what you said. One of the reasons Shabbetai Zvi captured so many followers is that conditions were horrific for Jews at the time.e.g. Tach V’Tat
. But today we live in a goldene medina for Jews. We can live well and keep the Torah. And what does Chabad do? They threw Hashem under the bus in favor of a snake-oil salesman. Rabbi Miller said that Gehinnom is the world of regret. That’s where Korach realized he was wrong but there was nothing they could do about it. Chabad Chassidus is potentially wonderful. All they have to do is take the Rebbe out of the equationTo square _root
There’s a new phenomenon developing in CH. Lubavitchers are now saying that Rambam ‘s criteria for Moshiach no longer apply. When Lubavitchers come to the next world they’ll brag about making a yearly Siyum Rambam. They’ll discover that they get no schar for this learning because they didn’t believe in it. In addition they’ll receive no reward for any other Mitzvah because they were obeying the Rebbe and not Hashem.To Lostspark
It wasn’t Sinas Chinam when Rabbi Yaakov Sasportas spoke out against Shabbetai Zvi. And it isn’t Sinas Chinam to speak out against Chabad which is far worse.
To Seichel
Let’s put aside Lichtenstein s program. I want to know what you think. 1. Is the Rebbe physically alive? 2. Is he Moshiach? 3. Is he god clothed in human form? 4. Does he run the world? 5. Is/was he a Novi?To coffee addict
You’re absolutely right.
To Seichel
Chabad resembles Judaism in that you keep Jewish rituals. Chabad resembles Christianity because your focus is on a dead Jew rather than a Living God. Look how you twist yourself like a pretzel to try to convince yourself tand others that Rabbis outside of Chabad think that the Rebbe is Moshiach. I’ll quote one of my Rabbeinu who never criticizes Chabad or anyone because he’s a Talmid of Rav Pam. “The belief that the Rebbe is Moshiach is not part of normative Judaism.” As far your statement that distinguished Rabbis say that the Rebbe is Moshiach. There are Rabbis who will say that Moshiach can come from the dead, although the Chofetz Chaim paskened otherwise. However those Rabbis have never said the Rebbe is the dead person that the Gemara is referring to.To Lostspark
Your obsession with me is very flattering. You seem to have convinced yourself that I alone stand in the way of the Rebbe ruling the world. Halevai that a nobody like me would have such power. Take a look at the other posters. They’re all saying exactly the same things as me and many of them have been on this site for years. Yet you only focus on me. Maybe you should look at yourself and recognize that you’ve become a full fledged idolater. All the times you’ve put Tefilin on atheists will not buy Hashem ‘s forgiveness.To skripka
They’ve already advanced past the breaking point. There was someone on YWN last year who claimed to know the inner workings of Chabad(I forgot his handle.) So he said that before Gimmel Tammuz there was no suggestion in CH that Moshiach could come from the dead. Immediately after he died Chabad invented new rules. I spoke to a Lubavicher with whom I’m friendly and he confirmed what that poster said. Why can’t Chabad see how lost they are? They are idolaters. The Gemara in Avodah Zarah says that an idolater is completely consumed with his idol and so they lose all rationality.
To lostspark
Tell Schneersohn to contact me. I have a job so I can’t waste my time. Since he’s dead, he has plenty of free time on his hands.
To Lostspark
You want substance. As expressed in this and other sites, the Chabad belief system clarifies that your religion is closer to Christianity than Judaism. Can I be more blunt? BTW you’re obviously obsessed with me so maybe you should consult with your live/dead Rebbe.
To Lostspark
Send me his email address and I’ll drop him a line.To Yserbius 123
I’d like to add to your point. While there are many non-Chabad Rabbis who like Chabad, none of them accept any of Chabad ‘s claims. They don’t hold that the Rebbe is Moshiach, god clothed in human form, runs the world, is/was a Novi. Seichel says they do because they don’t criticize Chabad. Rabbi Bronstein who wrote Engaging the Essence was interviewed by Rabbi Bashevkin. He was asked about the Rebbe being Moshiach and he didn’t answer the question saying that he has no opinion on the subject, because his book is about the Rebbe’s Torah and Hashgafah.
To Lostspark
Would it be too much to ask you to say something substantive? Since you can’t you’re essentially conceding that I along with the other great posters on YWN and other sites have successfully demonstrated that Chabad is null and void as a valid representation of Judaism
To seichel
You just wrote that the Rabbis on Lichtenstein ‘s program consider those who believe that the Rebbe is god clothed in human form minim. A week ago you wrote to rightjew and told him to study Engaging the Essence so that he can understand that the Rebbe is god clothed in human form. Since you endorse the book, according to those Rabbis whom you call great you are a Min And obviously according to Hashem, G-d of the Jewish people to exclude Lubavitchers, you are an outright idolater.
To Lemayseh.
Let’s not forget what Lichtenstein did to Dr. Berger. He has Torah but his money made him forget Hashem. He can celebrate the fact that Chabad let him speak at their Kinnus Shluchim.
To seichel 83
You don’t know how they came to the conclusion that Lubavitchers daven to the Rebbe. Well maybe it’s because Lubavitchers like you say that the Rebbe is god clothed in human form. As for your insinuation that real Jews daven to Rav Aharon Kotler. That’s like the psychos who grudgingly agree that the perpetrators of 10/ 7 were terrorists and then immediately add that Netanyahu and the army are worse. As for your statement that none of the Rabbis rejected the possibility that the Rebbe is Moshiach, to the best of my recollection that question never came up. Lichtenstein just asked each Rabbi for his opinion about Chabad.
To yankel berel.
Great to have you back. When I was pilloried to last year for the crime of watching TV you came to my defense. BTW I no longer have the TV.To echadHaemes
You’re right that there’s an otherworldly quality to the Rebbe’s Torah. Clearly he wasn’t a mortal. About twenty years ago I davened in a YI which had a Chabad Rabbi. I innocently said that when I was growing up in the sixties we were told that there are 3 great Rabbis. Rav Moshe for the Yeshiva world, the Rebbe for Chasidim and Rav Soloveitchik for MO. The Rabbi heard this and went ballistic, “No Rabbi can be compared to the Rebbe. He can only be compared to other Tannaim and Neviim.” One Shabbos his son in law spoke, “People call the Rebbe the Moshe Rabbeinu of this generation but the Rebbe was much greater. Moshe had a bad temper but the Rebbe never got angry.”