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Lior:
It depends what you mean by “Rabbi”. If you are already granting them heter hora’ah then the title of Rabbi is purely semantics. What I am referring to and what R’ Riskin wanted to avoid is a woman having an official Rabbinic position e.g being the Rabbi of a shul. In that case there might be actual halachic considerations which would prevent it. So if someone or some group thinks there are halachic obstacles to having a woman serve as the Rabbi of a shul then let them say that it is assur for a woman to be a rabbi of a shul. They don’t need to make a gezeira on semicha atu being a rabbi of a shul.
The case that I’m making from R’ Moshe has nothing to do with feminism. There is a difference between having semicha and being a Rabbi. R’ Riskin ordained women but he didn’t make them Rabbis; he just gave them a heter hora’ah. I haven’t heard of backlash coming anywhere near what R’ Weiss got. Because it seems that R’ Weiss is pushing for equality whereas R’ Riskin is pushing to certify learned women to answer halachic questions. I am talking about a R’ Riskin style semicha not a R’ Weiss style semicha. I’m not here to push feminist equality (maybe some other time I will). I am pointing out that I don’t see any halachic objections to certifying women as knowledgeable in halacha. Then I brought in R’ Moshe to show that there would be an important benefit for women to ask their questions to women as opposed to men.
“as far as I am concerned, if one has forgotten a mishnah in Ohalot, he cannot be regarded as a lamdan.”
– R’ Eliyahu Feinstein
“but technically, the odds of a person being harmed in a terrorism attack in Israel are lower than the odds of being harmed in a car accident there, and the odds of being harmed in a car accident there are very similar to the odds of the same thing happening here.”
While it may not be significant, if both America and Israel have similar rates of harm via car accidents and Israel additionally has terrorism then Israel would be less safe. Now obviously the preceding sentence doesn’t take into account other possible harms which might be more prevalent in America. Also, it is possible that the existence of rocket attacks actually minimizes the amount of car-related accidents because people are afraid to drive when a rocket might land at any moment.
Halacha Pesuka Choshen Mishpat 7:4:
????? ????? ???? ????? ???? ???? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ????? ???? ???? ??? ??????? ?????? ??? ?????? ??????? ????? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ????? ?????
I checked. It wasn’t the Tzlach.
???? ????? ???? ??????? ???????? ?????? ???????? ????? ????? ???????
In fact I recall that one of the mefarshim pointed this out but I can’t find it now (it might have been the Tzlach which I don’t have now but I’ll try to check tonight.)
Ok so what about institutionalized semicha which doesn’t have it’s basis in being equal to men? Or even not institutionalized? A learned woman should be able to make an appointment with a granter of semicha – one who has nothing to do with equality – and be tested and be certified.
Ha’amek Shealah 58:37:
???? ????? ????”? ???? ?? ?????? ???????? ???’ ??? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ???? ???”? ???? ???? ??”? ?????
Another reason to give women semicha:
Igros Moshe O.C. 1:40:
??? ????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ?????? ??????
??? ????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ?????? ?”? ??????
Sorry. For some reason I missed the last sentence when I read his post. But my point still stands albeit not directed at you.
DaasYochid:
Ther is a difference between not being taught the truth and being taught something false.
PAA’s always-in-context Coffee Room Report Card Comments
lol
Randomex:
From watching the video it definitely did not seem like a mistake. Also should I trust your translation over the subtitles provided?
It doesn’t say that in the pasuk.
By the way Haleivi, not really anything to do with gilgulim, but about pshat in the Gemara of Moshe’s questions, the Benayahu has an interesting pshat in R’ Meir.
He explains that there were three questions. (He assumes that the questions were already assuming that we are dealing with a tzadik gamur.)
1)Why is there tzadik v’tov lo? Getting rewarded in this world is bad for him. The answer to that was ?????? ?? ??? ???? ??”? ????? ???? – the reward in this world is a complete gift and it doesn’t come out of his share in the next world.
2)Why is there tzadik v’ra lo? If he didn’t do any aveiros why is he getting punished? This question was not answered.
3)Why is there Rasha v’tov lo? The obvious answer would be that there’s no one who hasn’t done any mitzvos, so he is getting his reward in this world. But that would beg the question – why is there rasha v’ra lo? He should have it good in olam hazeh in order to use up all his reward. The answer to this question was ??????? ?? ??? ???? ??”? ????? ???? – H’ is merciful when he gives the rasha his reward. Some people when they have it good, it causes them to do more bad. For such a person H’ won’t give him a good life in this world because that will cause him to be even worse which will make the next world even worse for him.
Although I’m not sure why he didn’t just say that tzadik v’ra lo is because even a tzadik does some aveiros, just like he says that even a rash does some mitzvos.
“And therefore the chiyuv to know Torah could override a man’s chiyuv to learn Torah”
The chiyuv to know Torah combined with the fact that knowing Torah enables one to observe the Torah.
I forgot one of my main points in my list of problems with the system of girls not learning Gemara:
4)There is no goal within Judaism for girls to strive for. Once they come back from seminary it’s basically over. They spend the rest of their lives helping other people accomplish things but never have a chance to accomplish something real themselves. For some, this can be very disenchanting. Boys on the other hand, constantly have something to aspire to – mastering the ever growing corpus of shas and poskim. Every masechta they finish is a real accomplishment. Girls won’t ever really get that feeling.
On a similar note, when girls need something to do they have very few options and will often end up wasting a day watching movies or something. If they learned Gemara, they would always have something to do. (Obviously this doesn’t mean that they would use all their spare time to learn; it means that in the overall scheme of things they will spend more time learning and less time doing things that can get them into trouble.)
“PAA: What all of those basically come down to is what people FEEL, not what’s actually true.”
I completely agree. However people often make decisions based on how they feel. Even if they are factually/statistically incorrect these people are coming from somewhere. When Awaitingdawn’s parents hear that a rocketlanded in Yerushalayim (or whatever city her seminary is in) they will immediately freak out and worry that their daughter was killed. They will probably immediately call her to make sure she is ok. If she doesn’t answer her phone, the panic will increase exponentially. For whatever reason, this will not happen when they hear that there was a car accident. People are generally more nervous about having their kids in a war-zone than in a peace-zone, regardless of the respective likelihoods of danger. In fact we can do an experiment. Your father seems to understand that you are in no greater danger. Ask him what his gut reaction would be if he heard that a rocket landed in your area. I think it will be different than if he heard that there was a car accident. Now he might recover in a matter of seconds by forcing his intellect to overcome his emotions. But not everyone is as capable of doing that. Again, I am not arguing with you at all; I am just pointing out why parents might be worried.
The Medrash that I quoted earlier actually says ???? ????? ????? ??? ??? ????? ??? ????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ?? ???? ???? ????? ??? ????? ???? which lichora means that they shevatim married their full sisters. The Mateh Efraim in fact asks this as a kashya on those who explained that the shevatim married each other’s twins.
Writersoul:
While it may be true that statistically you are more likely to be harmed in a car accident than in a terrorist attack, most people don’t spend their days worrying about car accidents, but they do worry when rockets are landing around them. There could be several reasons for that. It might be because people feel like they have some amount of control when it comes to cars whereas rockets are completely out of their control. That might also be why people are generally more afraid of flying than driving. It could also be that driving is part of daily life whereas terrorist attacks are not. Conceivably then it is possible to “get used to” terrorist attacks as well. Another difference is that rockets inspire fear. You here a siren and you have some amount of time warning and during that time you are terrified that you might die/get harmed. By a car, you either get into an accident or you don’t. Everything else aside, you are probably safer in Israel because the Gemara in Berachos (8a) says ???? ??? ???? ????? ???? ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ???? ????? ?? ????? ???? ??? ????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ??? ????? ????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ?????? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ???
which would indicate (notwithstanding perhaps some interpretations of later acharonim) that Israel is better for long life. But you might have to factor in other things such as putting yourself in a dangerous situation.
The same question and answer is brought in Moshav Zekeinim
http://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=20791&st=&pgnum=106
Regarding halacha l’maaseh, R’ Moshe Shternbuch writes that he has seen Dinah brought as a raya the other way – that despite being conceived by Rachel, she is called “Bas Leah”. He then says that you can’t bring a raya from ma’aseh nissim. http://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=20026&st=&pgnum=545
Sam2:
The Sefer is called Tosafos Hashalem. It is a many-volumed set arranged according to the parshiyos. It is a likut of Ba’alei Tosafos. The piece I quoted is in Parshas Vayigash 46:10 Ose 2 and seems to be from the Riva (if I understand their sourcing). I couldn’t find it on hebrewbooks so here is the exact quote:
????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ????? ??? ????? ??? ?? ??? ??? ??? ??”? ????? ????? ??? ???? ???
“Rashi brings down a shita that Dina married Shimon (with whom she shared both father and mother).”
The Ba’alei (A Ba’al) Tosafos (brought in Tosafos Hashalem Otzar Peirushei Ba’alei HaTosafos) ask how Shimon could marry Dinah who was his full sister, and answers ????? ????? ??? ???? ???
Sefer Hachinuch 77:
?????? ???? ?? ?????? ??? ?? ????? ????? ???? ??? ?????? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ????? ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ?? ????? ????? ??? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ?????? ??????? ??? ????? ?????? ?? ????? ????? ?????? ?? ?? ???? ???? ???? ??? ????? ?? ????? ?? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ???? ????? ??????? ?? ??? ???? ?? ??? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ?? ?? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ???? ??? ??????? ????? ???????? ??? ???? ?? ????? ??? ???? ??? ?? ??????? ????? ?? ???? ????? ?? ???? ??? ??? ????? (?)??? ????? ??? ????? ???????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ???? ??? ???? ????? ???? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ????? ?? ?????? ?????? ?? ?????? ??? ????? ????? ????? ??? ?????? ???????? ??????? ??? ????? ??? ??????
The Sefer Hachinuch clearly acknowledges that if the people are mekabel her then she can be a dayan and he also acknowledges that there are those who hold that a woman can stam be a dayan. Granted the Birchei Yosef (Choshen Mishpat 7:11) writes ??????? ?? ??? ??? ?? ????? ????? ????? ???? ???? ???”? ??????? ?? ????? ?? ???? ??? ???????.
Anyway the Birchei Yosef then says ?? ???? ????? ???? ??? ???? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ???????? ??? ??????? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ?????? ?”? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ??”? ????? ???? ??? ??”? ?????? ??????? ???’ ??? ???? ???? ?????? ?????? ???’ ?”? which should allow for semicha if not for dayanus.
And the part where the man is commanded to listen to everything his wife tells him.
“The Maharal explains that they only kept ????? ??? and not ????? ?? ????. But that was about Yaakov. I don’t recall, as of now, a reference to the Shvatim keeping the Mitzvos.”
The Maharal discusses the Shevatim as well. http://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14210&st=&pgnum=234
Pirkei D’Rabbi Eliezer says that they married their sisters specifically to avoid having to marry women from other nations:
????? ??????? ?? ???? ?? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?? ???? ???? ???????? ???? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???
As to how they could marry their sisters if they kept the Torah, the Daas Zekeinim asks this (which I guess is a source benignuman, that they kept the Torah) and answers ??”? ?? ???? ??? ????? ?? ????? ??”? ?????? ????”? ?? ???? ????? ??? ??????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ??? ?????? i.e. they kept whichever parts they wanted. Interestingly, the Daas Zekeinim concludes that based on the Gemara (Pesachim 119b) which says that Yaakov will decline to do the ??? ?? ???? because he married two sisters, apparently there is ??? ???? since in the future there will be a Torah, and Yaakov knowingly married them anyway because it was the only way he could marry Tidkanios that would produce all 12 of his sons.