Pashuteh Yid

Thanks to Josh for putting it into perspective.

What kind of mishugeneh dimyon to the mafia. The mafia are a bunch of criminals trying to selflishly enrich themselves and steal. The Zionists were devoted to a noble purpose that of saving Jewish lives who had nowhere to go and were suffering one tragedy after another in the lands of their hosts. They wanted to do binyan haaretz and establish Jewish rule in EY after 2000 years of golus. What could be a nobler purpose than that? They were willing to go to war and give up their own lives and many did pay the ultimate price. In their minds if one can kill a British or Arab solider who was in their way (which they usually gae ample warning to clear out first), why should a Jewish traitor be any different.

Today the NK are harmless and only make silly rallies. But what if chas vshalom one of them would decide to spill state secrets to a foreign govt like Vanunu did? Then they would no longer be harmless demonstrators, and would be subject to far more severe repercussions. The entire nation would be calling for their heads, and there might be halachic justification for it. Again. I am not paskening anything. But when you act as a traitor to your people you put yourself in harms way.

Dehaan was trying to prevent the formation of the State of Israel, nothing less. He would have preferred British or Arab rule, which was totally unacceptable to many at that time. The Zionists were not out to change his life in any way. They do not supress chareidim any more than any foreign govt ever did throughout history. They were not endangering his lifestyle in any way.

Think about it, what is the worst they say about the Zionists? On one occasion they cut off the payos of Yemenite kids. That is the worst they ever did. Ashrei hador sheavonosov sefurim. Compare that to life under Chmielnicki, the Crusaders, the Nazis, etc. When the Nazis used their scissors on beards and payos, it was a lot more painful.

Give me a break already. How in the world would the Zionists have made life in the Old Yishuv worse than under the Turks or British or Arabs. They did a lot of good, in fact. For one thing, I don’t think anybody starved to death since they came into power, as happened in the Old Yishuv. Reb Aryeh lost a child to starvation. Let us be honest once and for all. How in the world can any rational person think we would be better off under foreign rule. One literally would have to be mishugeneh or a total fabricator of history to think otherwise. It is this nonstop chareidi propaganda and brainwashing which has literally destroyed the minds of thousands of kinderlach and poisoned them with hate. All the Zionists wanted to do was to establish a Jewish state with complete freedom of religion.

One last point, this parking garage business is of course a terrible example of Zionist undermining of Torah in the eyes of many here. But let’s step back a minute. Even if the garage was kept open as originally planned, was anybody forced to be mechalel Shabbos? It is only for those who choose to drive. Not one chareidi was being asked or forced to drive. The govt even asked a shaila, and was told by chareidi parties it was ok. So let’s assume it was wrong, but did they force chilul shabbos on anybody, as did the Russians who drafted the Steipler and made him do rifle practice on Shabbos. Are the Zionists worse than the Russians? That is only the smallest example. So what in the world did Dehaan have to lose by having the Zionists running the state as compared to any other foreign power. Absolutely nothing. His life and that of the chareidim would not have been impacted in any way, and they still are left alone.

Finally, Kilobear mentioned the recent tshuvah movement. Well what in the world do you attribute that to? It is because so many Jewish kids take a year off and go to learn in Israel before college, or go for a summer or a trip, and are inspired to learn more about their roots and yiddishkeit. And when they come back, they tell their friends and set up shuls and schools, etc. Do you seriously believe that with the Arabs in charge of EY we would see this renewal? It is such total sheker that even with all the flaws and imperfections of the current govt, that any other foreign govt would be better. Say you disagree with the lack of Jewish education in the Israeli schools which is definitely a problem. Well how much Jewish education would the British or Arabs offer in the public schools? So no matter how much you complain, you are no worse off under the Zionists, but if you make a little effort, you can probably count a hundred ways in which you are better off.

Chaverim, you know I am not condoning it. I said I am not paskening anything. I am just laying out the shayla. During wartime or the conquest of a land bad things happen. You know that in Tanach, bad things happened during war as well. All I am saying is that this one mayseh does not speak for all Zionists.

During the holocaust, there was this frum Jewish fellow (possibly named Rumkowski) who had assisted the Nazis in meeting their quotas. While the gemara says we cannot turn over any Jew, and better if they all die, this fellow decided he would placate the Nazis by turning over the elderly and unfit to work (I think children also), to show “good faith” that the others would work and in turn be saved. He figured otherwise they would all be killed, as the Nazis threatened.

At the end of the war, other frum Jews took him and beat him to death. There was no beis din or protocol or psak din followed. They simply beat him with their bare hands. During difficult times, abnormal things happen.

Regarding the Dehaan affair. What I know about it is from Guardian of Jerusalem, the Artscroll biography of Reb Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld ZTL. Even in a book obviously written from an anti-zionist perspective, you can clearly see that he was very possibly a mored bmalchus and a traitor and would have sabotaged the entire state.

While the Zionist leaders were going around the world speaking with all kinds of dignitaries and governments trying to get a state set up and making all the zillions of arrangements that needed to be made (remember my mashal about the shul dinner multiplied by 10 million for the difficulty in creating a state), Dehaan was about to go abroad and tell certain govts that they should not pay attention to the Zionist representatives. He could literally have destroyed any chance for getting recognition and assistance.

I am not saying one way or another whether the murder was halachically correct (if in fact it was committed by Jews), but you can certainly see how he was a thorn in their eyes, and how serious a threat his meddling was.

Regarding the Altalena, I always thought the since Yitzchak Rabin was (I believe) one of those who fired on the ship of fellow Jews, midah kneged midah, he was murdered by a fellow Jew. However, I now understand better why this happened. Before the state, the Haganah and Irgun and other groups all were fighting the British in their own ways. It was like the wild west with no chain of command. However, once the state was set up, it was agreed that there would be one Tzahal and everybody would follow orders and subordinate themselves to the Tzahal. However, this ship was bringing in private heavy weapons to one of the groups (Irgun?) and they were planning to do whatever they felt like with those arms and not necessarily follow orders from the new IDF.

This was intolerable to the Haganah that it would be a free-for-all, without discipline, so they sank the ship to show that now there were rules for weapons. (I am not justifying this, just presenting the rationale.)

Lhavdil elef havdalos, it might be roughly like the situation in Lebanon, where Hezbollah has their own private arms and rockets, totally separate from the Lebanese army. They on their own started the second Lebanon war in 2006. One cannot have a state within a state without causing chaos. Again, I am not saying what was right, as I was not there and am not a historian, I am just presenting a point of view.

Jothar, regarding your valid questions about college, I don’t believe most YU students encounter any problems in their day to day classes. You are not going to hear any apikursis in accounting, or business law, or math, or the vast majority of courses.

I have heard that they require Bible courses and I don’t know exactly what goes on there. I would think and hope that if Biblical criticism is mentioned, that the teacher uses it to defend the Torah against apikursim, but I do not have knowledge of the subject matter or course structure.

I seem to remember some issues with improper art in required art classes either because of looking at places of worship of other religions, or improperly clothed women, and I believe one was allowed to be exempted and write a paper instead.

But these are beside the point. While time is short, briefly, the main objection was to any college period. Many gedolim were against all secular knowledge. This is true to day in EY where even high school is off limits to chareidim, and schools like Maarava which is an American style high school ran into tremendous opposition, and had to agree to go outside Yerushalayim. In America, the Mir doesn’t allow college at all, and ends seder at 8 pm to make it impossible. (I love Reb Shmuel Berenbaum ZTL, and he was at my chasuna. Nevertheless, I do not subsribe to that worldview.) My point is that gedolim shried eish lehava against college. They always stressed full time learning and bitachon for parnasa. While one might have thought they would be maskim to YU, many were not, and since just about nobody would be able to find fault with a school which is separate, shomer shabbos, kosher food and half a day learning, and seemed to be a great way to get around all the problems of college, they went overboard to try to find any fault possible and constantly put it down so nobody would go. But again, the reason was because they held it was bitul Torah.

However, today, people have become so confused about things, because of all the harsh words, that there are many yeshivishe people who actually believe YU is worse than a goyishe college. Anybody who believes so really needs a checkup. The gedolim of the previous generation of course knew that YU was far better than any goyishe college, and if one was going to go full time (not just to night school) that was the best place without any shaila. However, because of all the loshon hora, todays generation of kannaim, many of whom don’t know miyminom lsmolam except how to scream, have invented this total mishigas that YU is worse than a goyishe college campus.

While there may be problems with certain courses, that is not why gedolim opposed it. They did it because they opposed any secular studies, period. Had they not fought against it, but instead sat down with the hanhala and said we understand you are tyring to make a frum place where one can learn and make a parnasa as well, and we will totally support you, except we have issues XYZ with courses ABC, there would have easily been compromises made and we would have achdus in the klal. But they didn’t want to hear of secular studies at all. Read Reb Moshe about college (atzas reshaim)medical school (no mitzvah), and even studying secular studies during bein hazmanim, etc. Read about Reb Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld who would not allow it. Do a search on Rav Tzvei and Touro, and you will find a long essay where he screams against Touro for either men or women! The European Roshei Yeshiva simply felt there was no heter not to learn full time; and also possibly in Europe, college was mainly philosophy, not for parnasa. Rav Volbe writes in Alei Shur vol. 1 that theoretically Torah and Mada is a good idea for an institution, but we don’t have a mesorah or leaders who went that route who can guide us on how to do it and build such an institution where everything is totally OK. Whatever the case may be, I firmly believe that any of the emesdig gedolim and poskim if asked whether to go to a secular campus which is mixed and has far worse problems or to YU would never in a moment say a secular college is better. It is only the terrible sinas chinam which is caused by screaming and hysterics and people who don’t understand, but just jump on a bandwagon of excitement of a good fight who would ever be crazy enough to say YU is worse than a secular college. It goes against any drop of sechel. Whatever problems exist at YU will exist 1,000 fold on a goyishe campus.

I don’t have all the answers on how to run a college at the highest Torah levels and the highest academic levels simultaneously, but if people wanted to, I am sure they would find a way. Instead, because fighting and bad feelings have gotten involved (what else is new) the two sides are not speaking. Agudah could have sat down and worked with the YU administration many years ago. Did this ever happen? No, they just blacklisted and banned.

Bizman hazeh, just about everybody sees that the economic matzav and the increasingly high tech world necessitates a college education, unless one wants to become a mechanech or a Rov, and has the ability to do so. It would be nice if the Agudah would say, yes, you were right years ago in trying to establish a top-notch place in both Torah and Mada to the best of your ability, even if it wasn’t perfect, and you weren’t out “to destroy and uproot Torah and Yiddishkeit” and all the other hysterics. It is because of this fighting that the frum world has split into two camps, the modern and frum. Doesn’t YU deserve any credit for the fact that it is not mixed (a huge expense of duplication of buildings and resources), and serves kosher and no problems with Shabbos and Yontof and a half day learning and a full Beis Medrash every night and minyanim 3 times a day? It is a pathology of kannaim that repeats itself over and over of only being able to see the flaws, and not the tremendous good in something.

Jothar, the yeshivishe world has very similar ideas except they don’t call it meshichism, they call it daas torah. They also go to gedolim for brachos and tefilos. Each believes his leaders are infallible and have a special connection with the RBSH.

One only needs to read the literature of various tzedaka mailings which claim that special cures will come from donating to that particular tzedaka because such and such a gadol has donated in the past or will give a bracha to people who donate to that one tzedaka. They never say that it is the zchus of the mitzvah of tzedakah, because every tzedaka has that power. It is because it is the tzedaka of so and so that gives it magical powers. All chasidim believe that eating the Rebbe’s fish, or soup or schnaps has special segulos.

At any rate, I feel bad for Chabad because they miss their Rebbe terribly, and haven’t adjusted well. As far as “the Rebbe helps”, there is a klal of tzaddik gozer vHKBH mekayem. And the seichel is called chelek eloka mimaal. All groups belive in meilitz yosher, etc. True, some chabadniks take it to an extreme, but as far as I am concerned, fighting among groups is far worse than anything Chabad does. We all saw the beauty of the movement with the Holtzbergs HYD.

What I am saying is that if we all stopped fighting, I am willing to bet the RBSH would overlook just about all of our flaws.

Chaverim, is the shalosh shevuos a halacha or an aggadeta? Hint, try to find it in the Rif, Rosh, Ran, Mordechai, Rambam, Tur or Shulchan Oruch. (You can’t.) But you can find it in the chiddushei *aggados* of the Maharsha. Incidentally, Reb Meir Simcha paskened that they became null and void with the Balfour Declaration, since we were not rebelling against the Umos. Many say that even without that they became null and void with the holocaust, since the last is a shevua on the Umos shelo yishtabdu bahem byisroel yoser midai, and they did not keep their end of the deal.

Practically speaking, where in the world did you expect the Jews to go at the time of the holocaust and the survivors when nobody was letting them in anywhere. When it is pikuach nefesh, you don’t ask shailos.

Chaverim and Squeak, if you would like to debate anything I said, consider this a warm invitation to do so. But to sit on the sidelines and make half-sentence pronouncements without one iota of backing behind them, is totally counterproductive.

Squeak, if you dislike YU, kindly begin by comparing the seder hayom at YU vs Touro, and show me the radical differences that make one kosher and the other not. I am not saying that all courses at YU are 100% proper, but neither are they at any secular college which you don’t seem to have any problem with. YU has many non-Jewish professors. A college tries to get the best in each field. Now if one has a choice between a frum professor who is mediocre and doesn’t know his field well and a non-Jew who happens to be on top of his field, which do you think a college will choose. Yes, the non-Jewish professor may have some opinions which run counter to Torah. The definition of a college is freedom of expression. No professor of any stature will stand for having his words censored. However, the eitza is that the students should be sufficiently grounded in Torah and secular knowledge and would know how to refute and debate the professor based on the most advanced knowledge available i.e., on the professor’s home turf, not by quoting religious slogans. If what the student is saying is emes, he should be able to prove his point any number of ways. You simply can’t run a top-quality college any other way. Freedom of research and freedom of ideas is crucial. BTW, I believe that if any student feels that a given course at YU goes against halacha or his religious beliefs he can get out of it, and write a paper instead, on a topic of interest.

There is plenty more we can discuss, but unless you are seriously willing to debate, rather than throwing out one or two word comments from the sidelines, I will assume shtika k’hodaa.

Agudah does a lot of good.

Nevertheless, as I have mentioned here, many times, they are on the wrong side of the Zionism issue. The fact that they declared the state illegitimate 25 years before it was founded, and have never come to grips with it, shows a confusion in dealing with current reality. They never acknowledge the good that it has done, and do not show hakaras hatov to the soldiers who are constantly being moser nefesh for the klal. They are allergic to any mention of the medinah in tefilos, such as a misheberach for the medinah or the misheberach for the chayalim.

In addition, there are at least as many non-Agudah gedolim who supported Zionism, but they are never acknowledged.

They have consistently opposed YU on the grounds that it is Torah Umada, and opposed all college for that matter until recently. They are now waking up to the fact that it is necessary for parnasa, but will never admit that the YU approach was right all along. (Touro is basically a carbon-copy of YU, but they make it seem like it is a tremendous new innovation which is somehow kosher now. It is because they will not retract or apologize for their old position against YU, that they grasp at straws to find differences between Touro and YU. Touro was actually started by YU people.)

They have always opposed Chabad and the Lubavitcher Rebbe, not just in shita, and not because of the meshichism, but beginning for many years before that and possibly from the days of the previous Rebbe. They constantly launched vehement personal attacks against them. This despite the fact that the last and the previous Rebbes (and all the rest of the Chabad rebbes) were unquestionably from the greatest gedolim of the generation. (The Rebbe has over 100 sefarim of his sichos and writings on all areas of nigleh and nistar.)

They have done much good in polishing the image of Torah and making it available to the masses, and encouraging a rebuilding of advanced Torah learning since the holocaust and the building of many yeshivos. However, the primary problem is that they do not give proper respect to other equally valid views. Remember that the halacha is like Beis Hillel, because “Shonim divreihem vdivrei Bais Shammai.” Beis Hillel always first cited and explained the views of Beis Shammai, and only then would respectfully disagree. Agudah is not goreis any other opinions.

PS. Regarding the mixed seating issue, I have heard that all Reb Moshe’s children’s weddings were mixed. But I just now heard a mayseh about someone who was invited to a mixed simcha and asked Reb Shmuel Kaminetsky if he can go. Reb Shmuel told him that Reb Aharon Kotler made 3 weddings for his kids, and all were mixed, as well. It seems like it is basically a chassidishe custom which has crept into the heimisher world recently. (I personally think that it is because anytime anybody has a new chumra, he can very easily make anybody who doesn’t hold of it seem like a kofer and a rasha, while the person who does what was always the minhag has no strong argument and is always made to feel guilty. So the biggest chumra always wins. This is despite the fact that Chazal say koach dhetera adif.)

So the bottom line is that Agudah has played an important role in rebuilding Torah, but their acrimonious attitudes to other groups has cause terrible sinas chinam and major rifts in klal yisroel in place of what should be shalom and ahavah for all yidden. A generation ago, one would find the finest children were from chareidi homes. They were sweet, friendly, sincere, devoted to learning and always looking to do chesed. Now unfortunately, some of them spend a lot of energy snickering at other Jews and groups and telling loshon hora. This developed because they heard their leaders putting down other Jews. I firmly believe that if all charedim stopped loshon hora completely against all other groups and the state of Israel, no kids would ever go off the derech. They would see such fine midos at home and at school that they would never think of leaving such a gan eden.

Oomis, I do not know if anybody holds this way today, but the first book on Reb Aryeh Levin says that he did not want to buy insurance, because then if he did something wrong C”V, and was chayav misah, the beis din shel maalah would say, look, his family is well-provided for, so he can be given what he deserves. However, if he had no insurnace, then the beis din shel maalah would not only be punishing him, but punishing his family as well by taking away their source of income, if he were to be given a capital sentence, and the RBSH would not allow that, because it says Hatzur tamim poalo…Kel emunah v’ain ovel… There can be no avlah in the RBSH’s judgement. If his innocent children and his wife would also suffer poverty because of his aveirah, then the RBSH would have to cancel the sentence on their account. He thought this way he would be assured of living longer.

This is probably only for people of extremely high madreigos and bitachon.

Areivim, I hear your concerns. As I mentioned before, I never believed that evolution was mathematically possible. However, the issue you raise of kids with shailas can go two ways. On one hand we don’t want to raise questions in the mind of children. But on the other hand, the reality is that many kids have questions on their own. If we stifle all talk of evolution, then some kids who can’t get answers may leave the fold. Most kids these days are too sophisticated to simply listen to someone telling them they are not allowed to ask, or that all scientists are fools and liars. For those kids, I think that R. Slifkin’s approach is a life-saver. For other kids, it may be detrimental. I think the key is we must be honest with our kids. If they have questions, then we can tell them that there are Torah approaches to dealing with these matters which do not involve negating current scientific thought in any way.

As an aside, my own hashkafa is that the RBSH gave us the Torah for only one reason which is to teach us how to live in shalom with each other and appreciate every yid. All the other details are secondary (as per Hillel). So it matters not a hoot whether there were dinosaurs or not. Teach the kids to appreciate the warmth and kindness of the Torah, and the friendship and fun of having so many relatives (extended family). They will not want to stray if this message is constantly reinforced. You can tell them that in public school, there can be the most vicious taunting by classmates of any random child. It happens all the time. It does not generally happen in any yeshiva in which midos are the core. It is one big happy family. Most yeshiva kids have happy memories of school, which I have read is not at all the case in public school.

When a child is made to understand that this is the ikar of yiddishkeit, he will realize how fortunate he is to have teachers and classmates that care about him, because they learned that from Avraham Avinu. Similarly, if it is stressed that the discipline of learning Torah has led to Jewish success in many other areas as well, he will develop a sense of pride in his religion. All this positive is what keeps kids on the derech. I don’t believe that taking a negative, sarcastic approach to the outside world or to scientists is the approach that is most likely to lead to a lifelong commitment. This is why I always say the RBSH gave us the Torah for our sake, not for his ego.

I always used to believe that the fossils don’t show anything, because they would find a small bone fragment, and construct a model 100 feet tall. However, I am indebted to R. Slifkin for alerting me to the possibility that we should consider the evidence honestly and unbiased, because it doesn’t contradict the Torah either way. If there are enough bones to really piece together a dinosaur, then fine; if there seem to be too few, and too much personal creativity on the part of the modeler, then that’s also fine. Let us just look for the emes.

Just to elaborate, I personally don’t believe in the theory of evolution for a different reason which is the self-assembly issue. There are so many intricate parts which are needed for even the simplest cell, and they are interdependent. One needs DNA to encode proteins, but one needs proteins to run the transcription and translation apparatus. The proteins which are needed (in the first cell) would have to have been there by coincidence, but also encoded for in the same DNA in order for the cell to have a chance of replicating and passing on its abilities. What are the chances that a random sequence of amino acids is functional (when even a single substituted amino acid can be detrimental, like I believe occurs in sickle cell anemia)? But furthermore, what are the chances that the corresponding sequence by chance happens to be found in the DNA or RNA of such a primordial cell?

There are so many atoms and molecules which can interact in so many random ways, that even if the right ingredients are there, what is the chance they will bind in a way that is operative in even the simplest cell? Think of it this way. You want to save money on automobile factory workers. So you cleverly design a car that self-assembles. You attach magnets to special places on each component and part of the vehicle so that part 1 will automatically come together with part 2, and then with part 3, and so on. You dump the whole pile on the floor, and miraculously a car emerges. Actually, not so simple. What will direct part 1’s magnet to lock up with part 2, and not part 8 which happens to be lying next to it? There are an enormous number of permutations that could clump together, and an enormous number of orientations, most of which would yield nonsense. And that assumes that the right parts are all present. I do not think any factories have been able to produce anything useful using self-assembly to date.

But what many don’t understand about Rabbi Slifkin is that he shows that even if one would demonstrate that things can self-assemble, the contribution of the RBSH is in the fact that he designed the laws of nature which allow such a system to be built. There are many constants in nature which are just too fortunate to have the value they do. He shows that if evolution were proven true in a lab, this would not negate the existence of the RBSH. It is a shame that many have misunderstood his intent, and think he is trying to uproot yiddishkeit, when in fact he is trying to show that even the most sopshisticated science has a need for a borei.

He appeals to those who work and have studied science on an advanced level who get annoyed when simplistic statements are made such as the scientists are fools or deliberately looking to falsify. In fact Darwin was no slouch. I saw an exhibit at the Harvard Museum of Natural History in which a new flower was discovered that had an extremely deep and narrow access to where the pollen was located. No known bug could fit into it. Darwin said there must be a moth of such and such a size with a long tongue of such and such dimension that does the pollenation. Sure enough, after a long search, such a moth was discovered, and it did indeed pollenate that flower.

The brilliance of Rabbi Slifkin is that he tries to be meyashev the highest levels of science with the highest levels of Torah learning. Not the simplistic dismissals of “they are all reshaim and fools” which doesn’t go over to well with a trained scientist. Scientists have learned how to harness electromagnetism and send satellites to space which guide your own car. Biologists have learned to work with DNA and genes and have quite a good understanding of major cellular processes. DOn’t frum people go to Dor Yesharim to get tested? Don’t they go to doctors who have studied germs and so on? To call them fools is rude, but worse, is pure sheker.

Of course there is so much more to learn, and we can’t visualize the movement of proteins in real-time, which would open up entire new worlds of research and we don’t understand how proteins fold up automatically, and which interact with which others without much painstaking trial and error. We don’t know how to regenerate many types of damaged cells, and this is being actively pursued in thousands of labs. However, calling these people fools and liars really doesn’t reflect well on the intelligence of the one using those phrases. It makes one sound like a boor, and certainly doesn’t do anything for the honor of Torah, as intelligent scientists will simply dismiss such noisemakers, and go home with the opinion that religious people really are from the dark ages.

In order to enter into a dialogue with scientists, one must evidence some understanding of how deep science really is, and how hard these scientists work to uncover its mysteries. Rabbi Slifkin has done a remarkable job in trying to do that and show how the Torah can be understood even by educated scientists, and even if certain facets of evolution are found to be true.

One anecdote that R. SLifkin mentioned somewhere is that one Rov once told him that evolution is obviously false because the fossil record doesn’t show enough evidence. So R. Slifkin answered back, well, exactly how many fossils would you need to believe that it was true. Obviously the Rov did not answer. The point is that the Rov went in to the subject with a preconceived notion, and not with an objective desire to study the merits of the theory. Rabbi Slifkin has ways of showing that even if the theory is 100 percent true, it can still be totally in accordance with the Torah. Let us give him a little credit for the brilliant work he has done, even if we do not agree with his conclusions.

I agree with Wolf that Naaseh Odom was not put there for no purpose other than to trick people. It was put there to teach the lesson of anivus (humility).

Similarly, all the issurim in the Torah were put there for a reason, not to be machsil. Kol mah shebara HKBH b’olamo, lo bara davar echad levatalah. For example, the shratzim are a crucial part of the food chain, although we may not eat them. The tayvah of arayos is necessary for kiyum haolam. We don’t find anything which is totally useless other than as a stumbling block. And if takeh the RBSH did put in a stumbling block, then after meah vesrim, one could claim he was an onus. (I.e., if a miracle happened that every statue of yoshka suddenly came to life, do you think the RBSH would hold it against the masses if they thought he was telling them to convert to christianity? Ein lo ldayan ella mah sh’enav ro’os.)

Bemused, you know exactly what I mean. You attacked my post, but did not even bring up a single specific point which bothered you, and a single proof that that point was wrong.

Chaverim, I did not attack or slander chareidim. I was referring to a small sector of the chareidi world who are kannaim. It is also a bit odd that one who is a recent BT would find it necessary to adopt the levush. People who try to go too far too fast usually fall off the wagon and leave the fold. It makes me suspect that this person has gotten involved with extremist groups (and in addition he has basically expressed such views in past posts on other topics). I was trying to let him know that there are other forms of yiddishkeit which are more mellow, including many chareidim I know who disdain all politics and are eidel, sweet people who are totally focused on their learning and chesed.

All my posts on YW are targeted to those who are driven by arrogance and sinas chinam. (Unfortunately, the nature of blogs is that these types of characters are disproportionately represented, while many of the sincere types are busy in the beis medrash.)

fivestrpharm: One of my rebbeim once said that forgetting your past mistakes is the mitzvah of shikcha. We only use charata as a tool for changing gears but we then move forward and forget the past. We look only for what we can accomplish in the future. Probably the best eitzah is to dream how productive and successful you can be in whatever is the area of our talents. Maybe a successful businessman, professional or scientist. Enroll in classes and work towards a goal. That is the best medicine. Simply sitting in a room and trying to overcome the yeitzer hara or dwelling on how difficult things are will not work. The yeitzer hara will take you down again and again. You need to have a plan and long-term goal and keep your eyes on it 24/7. You won’t have time for the yetzer hara to work his mischief. You’ll have an exam in two days and a report due tonight and a 3 hour lab the day after, and each day your chavruisa will be yelling at you that you are not giving him enough time, either. Terrible stress is a very healthy thing.

Just curious about this: Reb Moshe said that the only hanaah of toevah is the fact that it is asur (i.e., the fun of breaking the rules). This is from a response to someone who asked how to do tshuvah for it. It seems that he feels that it has nothing to do with the biological make up of an individual. How does that fit with the science and the many people who claim that they wish they could be attracted to the opposite gender, but never were and cannot?

Chaverim and Bemused, you have every right to disagree with anything I say. But you might kindly state what it was that you disagree with, and bring a proof that backs up your point. Otherwise, you are simply turning yiddishkeit into whatever feels good to you at the moment.

The answer is very simple. When the Yenta is coming you use china, of course. When the Yenta is not there, you use plastic.

Daniel, I am glad you explained who you are, because in the past you posted extreme kannaish views, but then recently told a mayseh about a bus which seemed the exact opposite, and I was wondering what was going on.

In my opinion, the fact that you have attached yourself to some extreme people like Moshe Hirsch and have looked down on others, seems to tell me that you have a preconception that G-d is an angry being and the way to serve him is to get angry at others. Avodas Hashem is based not on what we accomplish, but on how far down we can put others. This is unfortunately not uncommon in the yeshivah world, but even more so in the Baal Tshuvah world, where people have no prior experience to go by. The gemara says kol mitzvah shecheziku bah kusim harbeh medakdekin bo yoser mayisroel. Any miyzvah which the Kusi group adopted they keep with much more exactitude than the Jews. My friend Rabbi Dovid Fendel asks how is that possible, and isn’t that a bad commentary on the frum Jews? He answers that for the Kusim mitzvah observance was unnatural. It was so foreign to them that they went crazy over things. For a Jew is is natural. He doesn’t get all crazy over putting on his tefilin, he just goes to shul and very relaxed he puts them on and starts davening cheerfully and with feeling. The Kusi gets all worked up into a frenzy because it is unnatural to him.

Reb Moshe Feinstein says the key is to be normal. One can tell jokes and have a nice job and dress normally and be a true oveid hashem. One amora was told by Eliyahu Hanavi that these two comedians in the marketplace were bnei olam haba, because their jokes cheered the depressed. Yiddishkeit is not about anger and serving an angry G-d. It is about having a beautiful and happy life. Do you really think G-d gets personally insulted and a bruised ego when we don’t keep mitzvos? He gave them as a gift to us, not to himself. They enhance life.

I don’t know why you started right away with levush, but that is irrelevant. You need to first find out who you really are inside. Then you need to find a normal, easygoing, kind, warm Rav who is a first-rate talmid chochom. Unfortunately, this is not so easy to find. I am so thankful that all my life I have had these type of Rebbeim. I would have no clue as to proper avodas hashem if not for living role-models of kindness and first-rate learning.

You see, there are many gemaros which may seem to indicate that G-d is really angry, and this seems to mislead many people including many rabbonim. In truth, these are only there to make us aware of how important mitzvos are to our happiness and having a good life, so we don’t abandon them. It is, however, all about us, not about some angry G-d.

There is much more to say, but you need to know that the ikar of the ikkarim is that the Jewish religion is darchei noam, ways of pleasantness and sweetness.

People who think it is about anger at other Jews or people, are themselves angry people, and would be just as angry and just as big social misfits if they weren’t religious at all.

If you are in the Har Nof area, you might look up Rabbi Meyer Fendel (the father of Rabbi Dovid Fendel) for a kind warm role model who has been mekarev many and was a talmid of Rav Scheinberg.

On a T-shirt: Gravity, it’s not just a good idea, it’s the law.

Another shirt: 99% of lawyers give the other 1% a bad name.

Just wanted to clarify that my limud zchus only applies if the contact was nothing more than a friendly or polite hug with no derech chiba involved. If there was anything more, or if it was in any way unwelcome, then what I wrote would obviously not apply.

One other point, obviously there is nothing wrong with short sleeves over long sleeves, and the whole discussion is pretty silly. Even the issue of tightness is not so clear to me. Could somebody knowledgeable here provide a primary source that tightness is a factor in tznius? I mean a gemara or chazal, or even a secondary source, such as a rishon, or even up till the shulchan oruch or the nosei keilim.

I believe that in older times, heavier was considered more attractive than skinny, and for them tightness would even have been a negative factor in one’s appearance, and not a cause for attention. (Don’t all the older statues and paintings depict heavy-set women? Any art experts out there?) But at any rate, please provide a source for tightness.

I wanted to conclude the Shvuos mayseh with Reb Aharon by saying that at that point Reb Aharon kissed Shlomo and said he was destined for greatness.

As far as depression goes, I doubt Reb Shlomo was depressed all the time, but the Holocaust weighed on him heavily, as did any tzara experienced by any Jew, anywhere. He literally died of a broken heart, as was said at his levaya. (I think six Israeli soldiers died that week.)

When it came time to prepare for kvura, the family had to take up a collection to pay for the levaya. The richest and most successful Jewish singer of all time died completely broke. He had given every last penny he had to the less fortunate, as he did his entire life. According to Rabbi Abraham Twerski, that was the biggest shevach of all, and summed up his whole life.

Goody613, Shlomo was Reb Aharon’s biggest talmid. He once excitedly told Reb Moshe how he has a boy who is on the level with the very best in Europe. Reb Moshe was beaming ear to ear.

Just one mayseh told over by Joey Greenblatt in honor of Shavuos. Once the second night of Shavuos in the Lakewood Beis Medrash Shlomo was learning all night as he had the night before. At some point in walked Reb Aharon. He asked Shlomo why he was still there, as it is the second night. Shlomo answered that the gemara says Moshe Rabbeinu was mosif yom echad midaato (added one day voluntarily). It must be that one needs an extra day on Shavuos to catch every last drop.

Not that Reb Shlomo needs my limud zchus, but to answer the question of chilul shabbos for kiruv, isn’t it a halacha in shulchan oruch that if non-Jews are trying to be maavir somebody al hadas, you are allowed to be mechalel shabbos, evenn though there is no physical danger, only spiritual danger? Correct me if I’m wrong, as don’t have access now to SH”O.

Secondly, regarding issue of negiah, doesn’t gemara say certain tannaim or amoraim used to dance with the kallah. The students asked aren’t you afraid of the yetzer hara? They answered, domeh alay k’kaki chivri (she is to me like a white dove, i.e., no yetzer hara, only a cheftza shel mitzva). The point is that negiah is only asur bderech chiba, and if they felt there was no chiba, then they were allowed. Perhaps Reb Shlomo felt it was lshem shamayim and not derech chiba, here, as well. Who are we to judge someone who did so much good, and brought so much light into the world?

Mod-72: I didn’t know I was that famous, but thanks for the compliment.