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voos- are you really starting up again? I would like to give you an insight into how the people you disagree so much with view people life you:
I grew up in that community so I see it first hand.
They think you are close minded and that you think you are so frum but you just hate them for loving Israel.
My opinion in this matter is completly irrelevant, I just wanted to let you know theirs. They think you don’t love them, and Im sure you think they don’t love you either. That is completly wrong. Put aside your differences and recognize they are a Jew first and foremost.
You want to make Hashem proud, work on your Derech Eretz bein adam lechaveyro before you go and be machmir on hating Israel. And the same should go for the passionate zionists. You both take extreme approaches. You must take a balanced approach, emphasizing one mitzva at the sake of 100 others is a huge problem.
hi 29!!
Thanks daasyachid and little froggie!
I appreciate ur clarification.
Voos- Israel has made tons of kiddish Hashem in this world:
– sending advanced medical teams to natural disasters world wide
– treating all citizens in hospitals equally
– when three boys were kidnapped and the mothers stayed strong and showed that publically and showed am yisroel was united and together.
little froggie- i totally understand everything you are saying, and you are correct. but my question for you is how do you come about interacting with NK then? am i supposed to be having a yelling match?
To me they are a bunch of brain washed cult memebers who don’t know any better, and if we don’t approach them in a respectful way, how could they ever understand what they are doing is very very harmful? It is the same way we need to talk to reform people, conservative etc.
Yes we can hate someone, but yelling will not get us anywhere.
voos- haha thats interesting
shopping- nice to see you to my friend! hope your smiling and life is treating you well!
Show Joe- you’re a real mentchse I agree with just that
thanks show joe 🙂
dont worry froggie- im defintily not soft spoken in real life! im quite loud lol
thanks oomis!
voos- have you ever thought of it this way:
some people do not agree with zionists and say that they are not focused on the torah so much because they r focusing on their mitzva of “yishuv haaretz” that everything else dort of becomes meikil. They say they are not real frumma yidden because they don’t focus on the rest of the torah?
Did it ever occur to you that you might be doing that as well- focusing so much on the mitzva you have stated that everything else sort of gets thrown on the back burner and does not get the attention it might need?
I know you might say “but yishuv haaretz is not a mitzva”- try not to bring that point up, as that is not the point of what I am trying to say!
letakin- its been an extremly challanging road (i totally made it sounds super smooth and easy), but I have had alot of oposition to who I have become and somewhat aleination from people in my community who now think I am “too frum”. But showing them I still respect them and that they are valid no matter what hashkafa they are because Hashem loves all His children, no matter what. I know everyone has their struggles. My best advice to you on this topic is to shrug off your personal edge. It is very hard, and when I get the “oh its 100 degrees in here and your wearing stockings, I am sweating for you” comments, I say don’t worry I am sweating for you too 😉
Just saying, your amazing too! and it is amazing of you to recognize something within you that you want to change! so shkoyach and I hope I have helped!
At the end of the day, those people who are truly firm in their beliefs do not feel the need to push their personal agenda on others. I Baruch Hashem try to grow and learn more, but I accept the person I am in the moment and I do what I do because I think it is right and I try not to push that on others u know?
Letakin Girl- Wow! Thats so nice of you to notice!
I personally went through an extremly eye opening life experiance where I changed hashkafa from a more modern perspective to a more yeshvish perspective. I realize that when I was more modern it did not occur to me that the charedi perspective could be right, they were simply “more frum” than I was and I was ok with that. But then I learned about their perspective, I learned about Chassidish people, Open orthodox people, non relgious people. I realized that where I was religiously was not where I wanted to be, but not because Modern Orthodoxy is incorrect. Rather MO had a few irks that I found solved in the hashkafa I now hold. I have taken with me the beautiful values I grew up with as a member of the MO community, but have infused it with lots of new halachos I learned.
I try to see each person I encounter as someone who can teach me something and will help me grow.I realize we are all born into different families with different views on Torah and the world. And as we get older we usually grow into our own niche, but most people fail to realize other niches exist out there, whether they are correct or incorrect.
But me going and yelling at someone that they are not following torah propoly, or the way I see as proper is not going to get me anywhere. I realize that they might not be at the level I am or vice versa.How will yelling solve anything. I respect every Jew because I give them the benefit of the doubt that they are striving for better, but this is where they are. They were born a certain way, have grown up with certain values and I probably will not change them. But if I can hopefully get a message across that I have respect for them, but I disagree with them, or have a different opinion I try to do it that way. People respond respectfully and we have a meaningful conversation.
I hope that makes sense!
voos- i am not looking to insult you, you are my fellow jew. I am looking to understand you and hope that you understand me too and maybe get a point across to you.
Jews have been persecuted by arabs just like someone said before recalling the “dhimmi”. I commend you for trying to mend ties and spread “truth” about Judaism to the goyim, but honestly I think it is selfish not keeping in mind the rest of the Jewish world.
So maybe your correct that the state should not exist. Maybe I’m correct that whatever happened happened and we need to simply believe Hashem will do what is best for the Jewish people. Maybe the zionists are correct for upkeeping the state. Maybe none of us are correct. But to go out and ecourage people who call for the destruction of the state of israel, even you can admit it, they want to throw the jews into the water with it. And that is putting goyim before your brothers and sisters. Just cuz you disagree politically with them does not make them or you better. You are both Jews and you need to have each others back.
That is the main point I do not understand about NK. I get you have good intentions, you have a belief and you want people to see it. but I don’t get how you can go to sleep at night and not feel badly that you are encouraging the destruction of your own people.
Voos- did it ever occur to you that the war of 1967 was a pure flat out miracle that no one in the world can describe other than a miracle straight from Hashem. If Hashem was truly so angry at the state why would he be making clear miracles there every day for the world to see?
Also the Arabs hated the Jews way before the war in 1967- in the Koran it says “kill the infidel” – the Jews R the infidels they have been after us since they existed.
You actualy believe there would be a lack of turmoil in the middle east if Israel didn’t exist and the Arabs had control over the state? I think there is enough proof that they hate America and the west enough to start a world wide jihad without Israel. Israel is simply an excuse and its Becuase the Jews are in control and they don’t like the Jews
voos- arabs DO NOT care. if they are peaceful arabs you can reason with them, if they are not there is simply no point- they do not care. they use you guys as propoganda tools syaing- look the jews dont even like themselves.
They only “like you” because you guys go along with their agenda- the minute they chas veshalom get into power you will be in the same boat as any other jew.
I simply do not understand why NK thinks that supporitng terrorists is any more “torahdig” than hating the state of israel. Hashem tells us to destroy our enemies Israel afterall is a mere political name for what is really underneath, Eretz Yisroel.
voos- really think about this one, don’t just shun it away. I ask you nicely, because I have not shunned anything you said, I am simply curious into the minds of NK.
According to NK then, you believe that anti semitism and anti zionism are completly seperate.
This is where you are incorrect. People who call for the destruction of the land of israel, call for the destruction of the people who live in it- that is your nation. Anti zionism is only a cover up for anti semitism. Thats the truth.
Yes you can say “but I simply am anti zionist, I wish the state of israel never existed”- but it does. Hashem made it exist, it was part of Hashem’s plan. ntohing in this world happens without a reason, and you can pray all you want for it’s destruction, but many good things have happened because of it. Now am I cheering on the secular government and not running our dear eretz yisroel according to Torah values? No, i’m not running to applud it, I also wish it were different. But that doesnt mean I go and start to propogate hate towards it from within the jewish community.
The reason the two are linked is because as a JEW, when you go out to the world and be “Or lagoyim”, and you show that you literally hate the state of israel publically, to people who call for it’s destruction, they see that as ” a jew doesn’t care about their land that they were promised”. That is simply how they see it. They hate us for living in it already, they hate us simply because we are not them, don’t add other reasons for them to hate us. If you don’t believe in the state, don’t go yelling it to the presidant of iran. The world needs to see that the jewish people are united and that they cannot crush us.
voos- thank you for that excerpt. I appreciate your time to show me that excerpt.
I understand the efforts of NK to try to mend ties with people who hate us so much, but why is it at the expense of being a true Toradig Jew.
Hashem first and foremost loves the Jewish people, and we must emulate Hashem, why then do they alienate themselves from the rest of us and make everyone look bad in their eyes.
I go to secular collage. I am in school with thousands of non jews from every spectrum. I don’t need to go hug them to make a kiddush Hashem. I don’t need to empathize with terrorsits who kill my brothers and sisters and call for their destruction.
There is a diference between trying to mend a relationship, and taking it too far. NK have simply taken it too far.
voos- if you do claim you are part of NK/ support it/ take pictures for it, then can you please explain to me one thing:
Why do you think it is a Torahdig thing to run and hug deiners of the holocaust? Why do you run and hug people who call for the destruction of YOU?
I simply cannot understand this behaviour. If Hitler YEMACH SHEMO was alive today you would be the first one gone. You think sticking up for their little lies and games is getting you anywhere? They hate you just as much as they hate all of us. Why is running to them productive?
no offence bp yid, but neturai karta should not be focusing building relationships with the goyim. While being or lagoyim is important, attending conferences about denying the holocuast and hugging families of terrorists who kill our dear brothers and sisters is flat out disgusting and wrong.
It is completly offensive what they do, and if they were real jews, they would start by loving their own people first.
So fun imnconsidered an old timer- thanks streek 😉 hope life is amazing by you!
simcha leiner!!!!!!
you have to earn it
29!!!!!- do you remeber me?
C.I boy- or as I want to now call you “Boy with C.I”. I think your first step is changing your attitude towards yourself. I work with speical needs children and we never call them “Downs kids” or “Cerebral Palsy kids”. first and formost, your are a 20 year old yid. You clearly have a neshama unique and holier than most of us “everyday” people. But honestly, your lacking of hearing should not define you. It is a part of you. I think when anyone has something they identify as a flaw within themselves they must not let it define who they are. Hashem created each of us with specific kochos and specific maailos. Take a moment to think about the things in this world you enjoy, your hobbies, talents and capabilites.
“the only diability in this world is a bad attitude”- you are clearly going through something challenging, but always remeber, Hashem created you this way for a reason. Try your best to learn about the things your great at, or love and focus on that. When you show people you are confident within your own skin, you should have less of a problem amking friends.
I wish you much hatzlacha, as I know for the kids I work with how challenging it is to have limitations. But everyone does, and for those boys that just “dropped you”, Hashem will deal with the way people treated you. Just focus on your tafkid. You seem like a smart boy. We are rooting for you!!
mod 29 gave me a subtitle- since then, We have been best friends!!!
sm29- if i knew u in person i think wed be best friends!
gefen- THANK YOU!!! Its so easy to point fingers at others and say they are the reason for Hashem’s actions. It’s wrong! We are the reason for it! Us judging others is the reason for it. Yes it is sad to see chilul Hashem, but often times we don’t realize we ourselves are making chilul Hashem as well!
May we be zoche to work on ourselves and that Hashem should help us along this journey as well!
Golfer- Sorry I read it wrong- I thot he said he liked science and math and just didnt want to do pharmacy. Thank you for pointing that out
Dhl- dont let time be a factor. People start school when they are 40, 50 etc. You need ti do what you love and its going to come with alot of effort and hard work. If science is not what you like you are not going to like working in the medical field. Or if it is what you like but you arent doing well, consider trying a new work ethic or working harder. Many people do badly simply cuz they get lazy and have poor time managment skills. Anything you are going to do will need time patience and alot of effort! Hatzlacha rabbah!
dhl- the options are endless: Occupational therapy, Physical therapy, Physicains assistant, Doctor, Nurse, Nurse practitoner, social work, psychologist, psychotherapist etc.
look up all these jobs, try to shadow people or call them and see what they do.
dhl- Don’t try to get the easy way out. Soceity might tell you that doing the fastest program is the “frum” thing to do. You need to do what makes you happy and where you think your strengths lie. If you love interacting with people then consider not doing a behind the desk job. If you want to heal people and help reduce their pain consider a job in the health field.
At the end of the day, you want to come home with a smile on your face, and feel accomplished. Don’t let soceity tell you what to do, don’t let us tell you what to do. Don’t take the frum way out. Even if its a longer program, or more money, if you will be amazing at it, Hashem will help you. Have emunah, and really looking into yor own kochos. Hatzlacha rabbah
morahmom- what about why shud we start threads that will cause loshon hora EVER?
gefen- couldnt have said it more beautifully! Mi cheamcha yisroel!!! may they be reteunred safly very soon!!
I think ur being pretty general. But I guess if your asking genrally you are correct. You are not pinpointing the main problem tho: schools are lacking the ahavas Hashem nessciary for a wholesome yid. Children today are not excited about judaism and if they are its because they are getting it at home. Why do we spend so much money on tuition if they arent helping us in the process of raising our kids???
Read the book holy woman- Rebetzin chaya Sara Kramer. It is a story about her challanges and gives practical tips on how to face challenges with adversity.
Im confused why people are questioning why women werrent pictured. According to the YWN it is not tznious to post picture of women. If you have a problem with rthat than dont read it because if youbwere expecting to open he article seeing women knowing you werent, thats wrong.
29 ur the bomb!!!!!!
This happens a few times a week. My classmates always go you went for a year to sudy abroad and go credits for touring. I wanna go to your collage!!!
sam- thanks for explaing. I clearly didnt understand the job of a yoetzet before. It is somthing quite new and i have to ingest the idea, but I can definitly see why it can be good
sam- your right, i could be wrong about a yoetzet. please tell me what it is!
oomis- yes I agree, but that is us changing to the economical society, not the political society. Women today feel second class because no one explains to them their real role in judiasm. We have a different purpose than men do, and I really think women today see that as a threat more than a blessing.
Ever since the suffrigates and ladies beginning to have power in the world, we as jews have also decided to take a stand and say “they did that, so can we”
Its another way of us being sucked into societys sheker and pitfalls.
Dont take sheker the wrong way, women should be empowered (i am currently in a university going for BH a good degree). but the concept of women needing to be in a position of power, where her abilities to do things she acctualy needs to as diminished, just makes no sense to me.
“However, this is probably a good program because otherwise many of these feminists would completely abandon taharas hamishpacha. Desperate times call for desperate measures.”
It bothers me alot that we have to come to these conclusions. Jews should not be making their own kulos to force their rebeim to produce real kulos for them. Its just not right. Obviously we want them to keep taharas hamishpacha, but whats going to be next “oh because all these kids text on shabbos, so well make it a maykil thing to text on shabbos, but at least they are keeping shabbos!”
Yeah they are doing whatever they want, not keeping shabbos.
I dont undertsnad, this takes the whole JEW out of JUDASIM!?!?
I have learned that there are many people just like me out there who really want to help the brining of the geulah. So many people who love Torah and care about helping their fellow Yid!
Im not gonna bring up the political agenda here although popa fid state it pretty clearly.
I dont understand why so many people today have to try to change the purpose of jewish women. We as women have a beautiful and purposeful job, to keep the jewish nation going. It was never in our mesorah to be people who paskan halacha and people who try to become mashgichim. Im not saying we arent good enough, im saying were too good and that isnt our purpose. That being said, hats not to say every lady needs to be home having a new kid every year. Some ladies should work, and they should do something to bring in parnassa or to use their talents Hashem blessed them with. But we also shouldnt focus so much on not doing what we should be as jewish women, which is tryig to do things against our mesorah. We should try to be like sarah imeinu and rivka imeinu and rebetzin kanievsky and other moros gedolos in our mesorah. Obviously we are not meant to be them, we live in a different time with a different tafkid, but if iur goals are to try to become men, where are the women!?!?!?!? Who are the female role models for our future girls?! We need women, not more men!!!
gavra- but also while alot of it is peer pressure, most people just dont care. its not important to them and that is a bad middah. Before I had any exposure to real halacha, I literally didnt care. It didnt bother me that I wasnt dressing properly, and it wasnt even that i was trying to impress boys, i simply didnt care.
gavra at work- also thank you! it was a huge mountain to conquer, but Hashem gave me the parnassa to buy the new skirts and shells and was clearly with me every step of the way!
Daas Yochid- thank you! It definitly till this day is a minor struggle becuase people make comments, but in a way Hashem blessed me because it has only made me stronger!
I think the matters of tznious obviously arent simple, but I think if they were expressed differently to young girls when they have to start dressing in a tzanua fashion, to show them that it comes along with alot of benefits and its not just for the sake of fitting into a mould and having a specific look. I think the only way to teach it is without forcing it, but showing that along with the middah of tznious comes a life filled not only with brachos, but with higher self esteem, self growth and a stronger connection to Hakadosh Baruch Hu!
Thank you for your posts Daas Yochid!
Vogue- why dont you try looking for an office/administrative job? Otherwise go to collage and get a degree if you cant afford it, you can always get loans and pay them back when acctualy making real money! Im sorry things sound pretty tough for you but just remeber that everything your doig is for the best and for your benefit.