Yes! It’s painful to read through the comments. I’m not even saying that the postings have to be perfect but many of them are horrible.

It’s actually funny – I just gave a ride home to a very sweet chareidi man on my home from a wedding. He was tremping on the side of the road and was going to the same city as I was. Anyway, he’s a very nice guy and has 12 children. He works as a security guard in various areas and was lamenting about how hard it is to support his family with this kind of salary. You could tell that he works very hard (it was about 11pm when I picked him up and he’d been working all day). We talked about him getting another job but he acknowledged that he can’t find anything that would pay enough with his lack of a good secular education. I kid you not – it’s funny that I just met him tonight especially since I never give tremps to people anymore (too dangerous) but his security uniform somehow reassured me. Anyway, bottom line, this is a common story here – there are many chareidi people who work very hard and still can’t bring home a respectable salary. It’s not fair to them because the chareidi leadership and society creates this dilema for them. Yes, you could tell that he’s a happy person but he’s suffering and was upset that he can’t even afford to take off time from work to go to school in order to get a better job. This was an older man too (I’d say in his 50s or 60s).

I’ll repeat what I said a few days ago – I am not trying to put down anyone but I also think there are many good people who are being put into a horrible and unsustainable situation. Provide your kids and yourself with a basic secular education so that you can work at a decent job and be able to hold your head high, provide for your family and not have to resort to government handouts or tzedaka.

DaasYochid – I agree with you that there are intolerant people on all sides. However, we are the G-d fearing religious ones. That brings more responsibility on us. Interesting (and unbelievably beautiful) thing about Judaism: In Judaism we don’t hold by the concept that I have rights or “something that I deserve.” Instead, we talk about our obligations. In other words, you don’t have the right to be treated with respect. Instead, it’s my responsibility to treat you with respect. This concept is a game-changer. We must always think about our responsibilities toward others and toward Hashem, not about our rights. I have the responsibility NOT to take money that isn’t mine or meant for me. It’s NOT that I deserve the money and it’s just a matter of me taking it because it should have been mine anyways.

superme – yes, that’s the beauty of Hashem’s Torah world – we are all different and with different minhagim. Shiv’im panim laTorah. The problem is that when we close our minds so tightly, we become stubborn as a people to see another side to the story. As many people have noted – the chareidi society has developed this way as a way to protect the people and the Torah. From that standpoint it’s a good thing but there has been a cost that should not be ignored. Judaism does not advocate a life of poverty like the non-Jews believe with monks & nuns. Hashem gives us halachot on how to earn a respectful living and He also gives us economic rules in the world that we must follow. In other words, if Hashem tells us that these are the ways to earn a decent living for our families in 2013, then we need to take that to heart. We can see this from each of the Avot and Gedolim throughout our history – they all studied and worked. Again, this doesn’t mean we should just work and still live in poverty because our jobs don’t earn enough. It’s our mandatory hishtadlus to look into the facts of how to earn a respectable living and strive toward that.

EY Mom – you say “chareidim work!! I work, and so does my husband. But we still do not cross the threshold of having to pay income tax.”

That’s entirely my point – even when chareidim work, they still don’t (usually) pass the threshold for paying taxes. There’s a reason for that – because there’s a lack of basic secular education that is statistically proven to increase income. There’s a system and culture in place now that creates this problem and it’s a cyclical problem! The system needs to change in order for chareidi families to be able to work and support their families properly.

You can’t fairly say that I insist on getting a limited secular education, knowing full well that this means there’s a statistically proven likelihood that I won’t earn enough to properly support my family. I’ll then just claim that I’m doing the best I can and it’s the job of the government and all of the people around me to make up he difference. To me, that’s the same thing as a diabetic not taking his medication that is statistically proven to help. He then just claims that he’s doing the best he can & he’s learning Torah so it’s the government and everyone else’s job to make up the difference. This is an abuse of the safety net system that was set up to help poor & disabled people.