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I think the expectation is to be treated fairly and equally. Helping one child financially and not another appears like favoritism.
Your reaction is very human. It sounds, though, like you’re making judgements about them.
When i read shmiras halashon, a lesson a day, i found that i was less upset with the behaviors of others. Somehow, it helped me be dan lekaf zechus. Maybe that would help you, if your ultimate goal is to accept and move beyond this.
I think if you have no choice you can go in that direction. I’m not so sure you can’t work this through, though.
If you want to try to understand it, I would ask yourself these questions:
What’s your husband’s “take” on the situation (is he equally as upset? Why or why not?)
Why do you think they give to the other siblings and not you and your husband?
Have you ever asked them for money or help? Maybe the others do, which would explain why they have been helped and you have not.
It sounds like your effort to be self reliant is breeding resentment.
Do you think you might be expecting them to realize you’re struggling when they might be completely unaware?
Be selective with jokes (nothing passive aggressive). I once went out with someone who quipped when I was a bit late coming down to greet him “do you want me to go back to Jersey and come back?” (meaning, you took forever). It was obnoxious and rude. I shouldn’t have kept him waiting, but his poor humor made an awful impression.
A lot depends on the type of seminary you are applying to. Some are very academically oriented, and therefore, will seek out students with top grades who they know can handle the curriculum. Others are more focused on hashkafah and molding their students and would more carefully consider girls with good reputations as well as the academic portion.
Sony wonderlab
Museum of technology. It’s free and really fun, but it’s best to reserve tickets in advance.
I think it would be an absolutely horrible mistake not to follow up with someone about this.
Life with a person with serious issues can be pretty horrible, and sometimes nearly impossible to extricate oneself from. Do not do nothing. Only someone who’s never suffered would say that.
You, because of your history with her, should not be the one to get involved directly if there’s an issue. However, if you suspect a problem, I’d suggest letting someone you truly trust who is an objective Halachik authority decide on the next move. The one exception to this is you might need to consider where you’ve gotten this information from and how reliable it is when you speak with a rav and give him that information.
Verify this information, ask a rav or the shmiras halashon hotline, and have someone else tell (not you/ it would look like you have an ulterior motive and might not be received).
Rebdoniel
Your feelings of distress only come from your lack of awareness of how beneficial it is. NCSY creates an atmosphere that encourages youth to see Yiddishkeit as something alive and promotes interest in spiritual growth. Why would you deny that to kids from a MO background?? They do not push a chareidi lifestyle, per say. They expose kids to excitement about being frum. It’s up to the kids to chart their own path. The advisors are merely available to provide information. They do not push their own hashkafah on the kids.
Murphy
Chalav stam is NOT “non kosher milk”.
Pigs milk is not kosher.
Chalav stam milk usually has a reliable hashgacha (OU, OK..)
If you don’t keep these that’s your choice, but to call kosher “non kosher” is just wrong and misleading.
I know the pipeline by the docks was damaged, but if a large shipment came in on a barge, why are they unable to deliver more of it by trucks the way they’ve been doing??
Do people need to be denigraded or their beliefs???
Shlishi
NCSY (answer to #2)
Of the three locations listed, coney island ave and ave v is only for police and first responders (all others turned away), coney and T has a line 2+ blocks long, (Stillwell and 86th I never checked).
Popa
Really?!?!
Have you EVER heard of a kid from a modern background looking at a chassidishe kid and ask “are you Jewish???”
Nonsense!
This thread reminds me of a story my father told about a visit he made to eretz yisrael.
My father is a clean shaven man. Once a young chassidishe boy came over to him and said “du bist a yid”?
My father was furious and outraged that a child could grow up thinking that despite wearing a yarmulke, a man might not even be Jewish without a beard.
And that, my friends, is closed mindedness at it’s best.
HaKatan
That’s pure nurishkeit.
No one here needs to know what is supposedly wrong in the mo perspective unless he/she is planning to join their community (which, I’m guessing not).
Why do you need to be educated about it if you’re not considering joining it? Have you already learned kol hatorah kula?
Gedolei hador need to know because they are the leaders who guide people WITH SHAILAHS from all walks of life.
It’s funny to me that those people who came from a mo background who worked on their Yiddishkeit don’t attribute the same evils to the community and way of life that those who came from a yeshivish background do. And please don’t raise the argument that it came from Rabbi Pruzansky who is from that community.
Frankly, any column with analysis that does not include hard scientific facts but observation is not worth it’s weight in water and shouldn’t even have been printed, let alone quoted here. That is just irresponsible journalism and creates sinas chinam.
It’s interesting that only Zeeskite and I posted that we made any changes.
Who else did??
This thread nauseates me to the pit of my stomach.
Please, tell me, those of you who feel the need to analyze the mo community, were you considering joining it?
Why would you feel the need to analyze it unless you were going to do something about it?
Furthermore, I ask sincerely, how many of you actually took the suggestions given to strengthen your Yiddishkeit to heart and actually did something about it?
I did. In numerous ways.
Frankly, my guess is that pretty much most of you didn’t do anything different than you did last shabbos.
This thread has done little to help anyone, sadly.
A website that caters to people who considers themselves oh so frum but can’t elicit improved middos or kiyum shabbos, needs reflection.
I knew once the OP was read, people would leap on it and use it to put down MO.
The MO world is so complex that any attempt to summarize it would fail to provide an absolute truth.
Kol hakavod to those of you who highlighted the strengths of (some streams of) the community.
Those of you who are thinking of leaving, I would hope you would not.
You can see how much we need people to give a balanced perspective here.
The only part of the OP that I appreciated was the information listing suggestions of how we can improve ourselves to strengthen the yiddishkeit in our homes.
I wonder how many of those who posted here considered which of those suggestions they’d like to work on???
Shlishi
I’m going to try a different stance. Seek first to understand, then to be understood:
Ok. So, what you and health are saying is that you find many women apply their superficial values to their lifestyles and marriages and when they can’t keep up with the Jones’ or have their foolish whims satisfied , they cry abuse and demand a divorce. Is that right?
I’m talking wives wanting divorce because of husbands who make unilateral decisions without consideration to their wives regarding choices that are life determining in a much more basic way (like the ability to pay basic bills). I am not talking about people leaving their spouses because of a depressed Economy that they have no control over (which just shows a lack of loyalty and maturity). I’m talking about the exact attitude you quoted here which is “I can do what I want and she has no say in the matter”. Why get married if you want to think Unilaterally?
I’m not a vengeful person, but let me tell you, that kind of an attitude can make her a very miserable person to live with. He might very well wind up wishing for divorce in the end.
And we wonder why people leave yiddishkeit?!?
Sure, he can act like a jerk and there’s nothing she can do about it. She has no grounds for divorce.
Now, let’s all discuss the shidduch crisis.
Yeah, right.
We’re not talking about earning enough money.
We’re talking about making unilateral decisions that affect everyone and then not caring how the other person feels.
I don’t know such women who would walk out simply because they don’t get what they want, or because they are poor.
Most couples I know are not wealthy. They live in rented apartments. Need tuition scholarships. Who have to choose between rent, tuition, clothing, and food bills.
Some of them (not all) are in relationships with either very controlling or irresponsible men. Men who work for years on end in dead end jobs that don’t bring home sufficient income to cover basic needs despite the wife working also. Men who independently choose to stay in their beloved carreer because they’re convinced that despite a decade or more of struggle and tears that their next dollar is just around the corner. Men who withhold money to get what they want.
No, idon’t mean a woman should walk out if they’re poor. What I do mean is that I know couples who don’t even have the chance to improve their lot because the husband remains in his reckless irresponsible lifestyle.
The “death” of the relationship is then, not, because they are poor, but because of serious communication issues and a lack of team effort, deciding as a couple how to proceed. It’s like being married to a gambler who refuses to change his ways.
I think any man who chooses to force his wife to remain married to him when she has reached the point of wanting out (after reasonably trying to resolve the differences) is truly pathetic.
Health
You really seem to have such a negative view of women. Granted there are some who walk into marriage with unreasonably high expectations. However, when I say “well” I mean common basic courtesy. If a man is wonderful to a woman, speaks lovingly, kindly, considerately, she won’t be so quick to leave knowing what’s out there may not be better. We’re not talking about extremes here of life with a kind man living in horrendous poverty or a so called JAP who expects the unreasonable. We’re talking about regular people with typical life hopes and expectations of basic commitment to frumkeit, overall kind behavior, and general responsible attitude towards life. Perhaps I don’t know common expectations, but the women I know would never leave a man who offers the above. They might lament not having more, but they would never leave.
He may feel more at ease with someone who projects confidence or he may be concerned that this is a part of your overall personality. His discussing his concern with the shadchan might be a way of attempting to find out more about your personality.
Frankly, I think it’s a mistake on the part of the shadchan to express it to you in a way that describes it as a negative rather than the inquiry being an attempt on his part to get to know you better.
She clearly hopes that her telling you will somehow influence your behavior on your next date. I think a comment that comes out like a criticism only serves to increase your anxiety about how you will be perceived on your next date (and, by the way, the right guy would probably be intrigued enough to continue to want to get to know you despite your anxiety, unless it’s excessive, in which case maybe the following will help):
My prior post was about the thoughts you are thinking and how they influence your behavior.
You might also want to try noticing what you do when you are anxious. Do you fidget, avoid eye contact, hold your breath, speak softly? Different people engage in different behaviors. When you can identify your own it will allow you to try to find alternative behaviors to counteract those habits.
I tend to hold my breath when I’m nervous, so I find being more aware of that and consciously taking slow deep breaths at least allows me to begin calming physically. I also “jabber on and on” so I have to really make a conscious effort to notice the other person. It can become a vicious cycle, where I talk when I’m nervous, notice the person I’m conversing with is very quiet (which might make me more nervous, because of my own internal self talk and doubts about myself, not the other person) and so I’ll talk on and on to fill the silence, only to exponentially increase my anxiety by just not tuning into my emotions and accepting them instead of trying to fix them. That is just an example from my life. You need to figure out what your behaviors are and what you typically do to “remedy” them that may not be working.
Ask yourself what you’re nervous about.
We tend to have expectations and a mental image of events prior to their occurring.
Try to play through your expectations in your mind. You may be catastrophizing and you need to recognize that you’ll be ok even if those events were to occur.
Now imagine playing it out with smooth and positive results. Try to form a mental image, with relaxed body language and confident voice. If that’s hard for you, try to call to mind someone you know who speaks and acts with confidence, and try to mimic their body language and voice on your own to make it more a part of yourself.
When you are on the date, work on making the other person comfortable. This might take your focus off of yourself and help you to loosen up.
Rav Aviner said that for some (who have better self control) an iPhone would be ok, but each person has to know themselves and be honest if they can or can’t handle having one.
Wow
Lucky you that you never used it!
Englishman
Yes
That’s probably true too.
I think marriage is a real test of maturity.
While I do agree that some men and women may give up on marriages prematurely (and others should never have married) I also agree with my mother’s opinion that women don’t leave good looking men who treat them well.
Torah613
Do you actually believe that the thousands upon thousands of men and women who are single for years on end have no yiras shamayim??
If only it were so simple.
The first thing I thought of when I saw the title of your post was who will join us (become frum) vs who will leave (yiddishkeit, c”v).
How could he even have kavanah with all the honking going on behind him?
We have a similar disagreement about paper plates in our house.
I explained that I do not want to wash a huge amount of dishes, and, so, my mil suggested she’d wash the dishes in lieu of paper plates. It ended the conflict right there.
What does that mean “a cut in the sidewalk”??
I’ve seen people designate a regular area of a curb as their private entrance to a non official driveway (front of a home) and always wondered if I’m allowed to park there. Is that what you consider “cut sidewalk”?
Popa
You’re hysterical 🙂
I guess I don’t understand the Halachik implications (if he is never considered divorced, how that matters).
What is the status of a twice widowed woman?
Even if the husband divorces his wife (as opposed to her divorcing him), wouldn’t he, after the fact, be considered/deemed by Halacha as ‘divorced’??
Shmoel
“a man cannot be ‘divorced’ under Jewish law”
What does THAT mean?!?
I really don’t like the term “older single”.
Who defines what “older” is? (a rhetorical question).
I know someone who is happily married, third time.
First marriage was a poor match. Second was a rebound. Third, a charm.
You never know…
It merits investigation.
More 2
I wonder if your “friend” called a rav or the shmiras halashon hotline to check if she was even allowed to tell you this.
On second thought, maybe your job isn’t really to check him out.
I think now that you heard this information, you should ask what to do with it (if anything). I have a feeling asking a rav will be more to get you to stop questioning the shidduch than to stop the shidduch itself.
More 2,
You’re questioning his morals and who he is as a person when you admit openly to making up stories without informing the reader (isn’t that the same as LYING?).
It’s great that you care about your cousin enough to want to protect her, and possibly lucky that this guy is coming to your house.
I think you need to approach him with a really open non-judgemental attitude. If you approach the idea of meeting him as wanting to confirm your beliefs then you’ll probably be able to. People see what they look for. Look at him with an ayin tov and you might see positive things.
You have a hard job ahead of you: clearing your pre-conceived notions about him out of your head.
I know a number of people who have had broken engagements and went on to have wonderful marriages with their right match.
He was not meant to be with that other girl or else he would be.
It is her parents job (and hers) to check him out thoroughly. She will not thank you if he goes on to marry someone else and they are happy.
Unless you know something truly egregious about him, like he is c”v taking drugs, stealing, nasty, it would be uncalled for to get involved.
All you criticize is a matter of perspective and opinion about him. She knows his level of education. They can ask about his level of learning.
I was very weak after the fast. I ate but probably didn’t drink enough and didn’t have enough of a sugary drink.
I think I’m going to try to have more soups with grains (barley, ministrone) and drink more orange juice afterwards.
Could it be that you ate too quickly??
How about “The Hobbit”? It’s one of my personal favorites and talks about adventure, which they might enjoy.
If a person is chronically falling behind in her responsibilities at work, that might be a clue. Ask her about her job. Is there a lot of paperwork? Pay attention to what she complains about and try to explore further.
Notice her house when you pick her up. Is it in a complete disarray? People usually try to clean up before. It may point more to her mother’s habits, but you might get a clue how she was raised. If it’s really clean, you can complement her and her mom’s ability to handle it all on her own. If the girl contributes help and she wants you to know, she’ll be sure to mention it.
You might also want to just verbally own up on a date to what you think you need. If it sounds like a poor match to who the girl is, she just might tell you (but you run the risk of having her run for the hills that you’re starting out with such specific expectations). People don’t like to feel pressure to live up to someone else’s dreams.