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Think first, that is totally true! Great poem. When the weather is nice, I go to the park and play basketball for a little while. I find it to be very relaxing, and can be quite a workout as well if anyone shows up and asks to play a game with me.
anonymisss and No One Mourns, thank you, I very much appreciate that.
I don’t like the idea that there are chores considered “not for men”. It is a husband’s job to do anything for his wife to make her happy, and that would include any chore considered “not for men”. Obviously, if someone’s wife doesn’t want him to do a certain chore, then he shouldn’t.
I play guitar by ear. Though I know that reading notes can help in terms of playing live and in coordination with a band, I really don’t need to for myself. If there’s a piece I really want to learn and not spend the time to figure it out by ear, I’ll look up the chords or tablature. Every musical composition I’ve came up with has been completely by just putting pieces together that sound good in my head. So if you are just playing for yourself, I don’t see a need a to learn notes, unless you really want to and have the time.
JustMe, that is really a fantastically written poem! And a genuinely excellent point you brought out. The metaphor with the curtain really is a good one. Thanks for posting it here, and I hope you can contribute more! And welcome to this thread.
Thank you Goq, have a great shabbos. I’m sorry I’ve been away from this thread for so long. Hope things are going well for you.
No One Mourns, that’s great you’re in the home stretch! I’ve still got at least another year and a half.
SaysMe, it’s all about prioritizing your time. Hope you’re able to get through everything smoothly!
Seems like this thread has been seeing less attention lately. blabla, PE, Think first, kapusta, s2021, hope all’s well.
Logician, yes, it’s so nice to have a respectful conversation with our different perspectives. I find it pleasantly enriching. And denial is never a good thing. I wouldn’t consider my perspective denial, though. Using my perspective, I am very much aware of the situation. I am just channeling my mind into realizing that it is for my good, and therefore, I may be able to get through it without suffering. I agree that being in denial of one’s emotional state in unhealthy. But if I really, emotionally, am not feeling pained, then I’m not denying it. I mean, I AM denying it entry into my being, but I am not denying that I am feeling it, because I’m not. So I think there is a difference there.
Hmm, so about missing the plane, I do see what you mean. You aren’t referring to the frustration, but to the possible effects of missing the plane, such as being late to a meeting, missing a wedding, etc. So for those types of things, yes, it is very possible, and likely, that G-d intends for us to feel the pain of missing these events, but at the same time, using my perspective works equally well on those. There was obviously a good reason why I had to miss that wedding, or be late to that meeting. I may not understand that reason, but I believe 100 percent that it’s there. It’s even possible that the reason was simply to make me feel the pain of missing such an event, and that pain was necessary. But, if I miss that wedding, and even so, understand that G-d had a good reason for me missing it, and it was for my best, that would greatly ease the pain, and possibly erase it. Does that mean that causing me pain couldn’t have been the reason? I don’t know. I may never know the reason. But I DO know that I eased my pain, and that helps greatly.
No One Mourns, I’m sorry too.
apushatayid, I usually don’t. I kinda block him out, and just try to listen to Randy Rhoads’ amazing guitar abilities.
Logician- “that sounds like making the situation positive, not DEALING with it positively. It’s a problematic situation, but you believe its for the good.”
That’s one way of seeing it. A second way is the following: Since I know that the situation really IS positive, because I know it really is for my good, I’ll be able to deal with it positively instead of being bogged down by seeing it as a problematic situation.
“And again – FOR THE EVENTUAL good. Which does not have to be in this world either. Seeing it as good, is not like “finding the silver lining” – that may help you deal, but its not totally facing the situation. It means its good for me to have this problem – period. Like missing the plane is good – not because it might blow up, but because I’m supposed to be inconvenienced.
That’s the reason I’m making a big deal about the terminology. If the plane will blow up, missing it is GOOD. If nothing like that will happen, then it was BAD. But it is FOR MY GOOD, that this BAD thing happens – because it was for some reason good for me to have some bad in my life.”
Here’s my issue with this: Since we know that everything is, as you said, “for the eventual good”, being in the “bad” situation now is really, in the long run, always good. So, when I miss the plane, even if it doesn’t blow up, it was still GOOD that I missed it, for any number of reasons that I may not see, even in this world (as you said). Of course, that doesn’t take away from the possible frustration of missing the plane. But that is just human nature. All I am saying is that since I know that missing the plane really is for my good, I will understand that it is good for me to miss it. And knowing that will relieve me of my frustration. Now, does that mean that because I’m not being frustrated by it, that I’m doing the wrong thing? And that G-d wants me to be frustrated? That, we can’t possibly know. But I think being frustrated is generally not as good as NOT being frustrated, and that it is far better, mentally, emotionally, and physically, to try to be calm, happy, and in peace rather than being upset, frustrated, and sad. No?
And yes, it is definitely possible to control our emotions by altering our perspective. But that is something usually very difficult to do. It took me years to change my perspective on my family situation. Now, am I wrong for the way I deal with it? Am I supposed to be in pain from it my entire life? Did I end the pain too early? I can’t possibly know that, but I must say, it is easier to have faith in G-d and follow his commandments when I’m not in pain, and therefore, I think that whenever I can relieve myself of pain, I should. And that would apply to everyone else as well.
I personally prefer the Blizzard of Ozz.
Logician, thanks. No apologies necessary, it’s okay. Yes, it isn’t good to deny the pain, if we are experiencing it, because it is there for a reason. One can use it to grow. Hence the expression “growing pains”. At the same time, if one is able to go through a seemingly troubling experience knowing that it is for their good, the pain may be much lessened, or even not exist altogether. And even then, one can use the experience to grow. Feeling pain isn’t really a choice, it’s an emotion, and usually non-controllable.So however we react, G-d wants us to use that reaction to grow. What the reaction is depends on the particular experience and on the individual’s perspective.
yitayningwut, you got it.
Sam2, agreed.
I really do understand what you’re saying. Here’s the story: I don’t know how much you know about me and my family and my father, but needless to say, you can find it all here: http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/life-as-the-son-of-a-child-molester-my-story
After you’ve read that, you will see that yes, I was extremely hurt and in incredible emotional pain for years. That is something that, I think I’m safe in saying, most people would not be able to go through and come out normal. So yes, I grew from that pain, became a better person, used it for my benefit, which is of course of G-d wanted.
Now, because I’m basically past all that pain, I, personally, can’t really think of anything that would happen to me that I wouldn’t be able to see the good in. So perhaps I am unique and I’m the only person to think like that. But that is where I’m coming from. Understand?
I’m not sure what sources you are referring to which I am ignoring. I just told you how one can interpret the word “bad” in that gemara, based on my understanding. You ignored it. If you have a different interpretation, wonderful.
And not necessarily is it G-d’s intention for us to have a negative reaction. That is OUR choice. I believe that G-d hopes that we use every experience to help us grow. I CHOOSE to have a positive reaction to the things in my life. If that makes me a person who “ignores halacha”, so be it. You will never convince to start having negative reactions to the things that go on in my life. I’m waaaaaaaaaay past that.
Of course G-d realizes that it is entirely possible we will have a painful reaction to the nisayon, because G-d understands that we are human. All I am saying is that we don’t have to have a painful reaction to these things if we were fully aware of the truth, and the reality, which is that it is for our good.
I haven’t seen that gemarah, but I’d assume that when it speaks of “good” and “bad”, it is speaking in terms of how people talk and think, which is a concept we find in many gemaros, and that when it says “bad”, it is referring to things that we would naturally, because of our initial emotions, view as bad. But again, those emotions blind us from the reality of everything REALLY being good.
I see that you won’t agree with my point, and that really does not bother me. Many people don’t. All I know is that my viewpoint greatly helps me move ahead in life, and I know that it has also helped others who are going through difficulties.
Sure, I’ll explain myself. It is a blessing, because G-d knows exactly what situation will provide every single person the ability to grow to their full potential. So G-d gives each person unique things that they must go through, and hopefully they come out of it with growth, with being one step closer to their potential. Sure, it’s natural to see these things and say “Wow, these are really bad things I’m going through.. why was I given such a difficult nisayon?” Well, the answer is that we don’t know exactly why we were given these specific nisyonos. But we DO know that they are “custom-tailored” to help us become the best people we can be. Therefore, they are ALL blessings. There isn’t one difficulty that G-d gives that isn’t done for our good.
Now, of course, we have emotions and instincts, and they will sometimes control our minds and make us suffer through these situations. But those are just our natural, human reactions. The REALITY is that it is all for our good, and hopefully, eventually, when we overcome our initial emotions, we see it that way. But we can even see it that way from the onset, if we are able to.
And no, I’ve never studied those subjects, and no, I don’t know at all how G-d runs the world. None of us do. But I do have a way of dealing with whatever may happen to me in life based on my beliefs in an extremely positive way, and that’s much better than many people have.
msseeker, thank you so much, I very much appreciate it.
Logician: “Are you so biased by your own situation that you can’t imagine that there’s someone otherwise compatible for you, who unfortunately is turned off by your situation, and that is causing you difficulty ? And that you are meant to have this difficulty, and grow from it ?”
Oh, I’m sure there are plenty of people who may be compatible, yet are turned off by my situation, but I don’t consider that a difficulty. I used to consider it a difficulty, but not any more. I’ve become aware of the reality that it is really a blessing. And instead of it being a difficulty that I can use to grow from, I see it as a blessing from G-d that I can also use to grow from, by showing my appreciation to Him for giving me such a blessing.
Why is it that the person who is in yeshiva most of the year, gaining G-d’s knowledge, hopefully learning how to emulate G-d, and only comes here when he is on break, the person who openly and constantly insults others? I don’t care if it’s for a joke. To the average outsider, it seems that being in yeshiva turns someone into a horrible person.
Logician, see my above post. And I mean it in the second way you stated it. So if you don’t like that argument, fine. It works for me. By the way, I’m a guy.
No, my attitude is not a way of escaping reality. It is a way of dealing with whatever you are dealing with in a positive way. Everything in my life I can honestly say is for my good. Was it at times difficult? Yes. But only when this positive attitude escaped my consciousness.
The difference between our opinions is that you are saying that the reality is that the current situation someone is in, is bad, and that saying that it’s really good is escaping from reality. Whereas I am saying that the reality is that the current situation someone is in, is really good, and it’s only one’s natural instinct to see it as bad, which blinds us from the reality.
No One Mourns, I’m doing alright, thank G-d. Very busy with school, which is a good thing. How are you?
“But the (very normal) reality of the world is that these things cause difficulties.
If a girl doesn’t look good, that’s a nisayon – no different than if she would have any other physical condition. But there’s no excuse for someone in shidduchim not to try to look good.”
Logician, I understand your point. However, I don’t completely agree with it, if I am understanding it correctly. You say if a girl doesn’t look good, that’s a nisayon. Not really. If she is putting in effort, and happens to not look good, that isn’t a nisayon. For example, my parents are divorced. Is that a nisayon for my dating prospects? I used to think so, but it’s actually not. It’s a blessing, because it weeds out the ones that are turned off by it, thereby saving me time and energy for the ones that are okay with it. And looks are no different. Now, it could be I’m not understanding you fully, and that when you wrote “doesn’t look good”, you meant “not presentable”, and that is a different story, because that would be a lack of effort. But anything beyond our control is NOT a nisayon, it is a blessing, whether we see it that way or not.
puppy, glad you are doing okay.
s2021, wow, that must be very stressful for you, to be seeing him everywhere, but I am gladdened by your last line. It so great that you see your ability to move on and overcome those previous feelings. You are a very strong person. I sometimes have a similar experience, with my dad.. sometimes I see him in places, and just want to run away. Thankfully it doesn’t happen that much. May things continue to get better and better for you.
Syag, I miss you around here.
computer777, actually, I think it DOES apply here. Obviously, we must do our best to try to have a positive influence on other religious Jews to make them want to stay religious, but if someone DOES become non-religious, we still should consider them Jews, and never treat them as second class.
Thanks, QB. And nice to see you back here! Also, great post.
mikehall, oomis, you’ve got it right. It’s too bad so many Jews don’t look at it that way. What connects us is far stronger than what separates us.
While I did not read the article, I am not surprised at all. Many people unfortunately have a distorted sense of what’s important and what isn’t.
What bothers me more is that these girls are meeting boys’ mothers, and not the boys themselves.
Here are the answers you are likely to get:
1) It’s a perfectly fine movie for children.
2) There’s nothing really wrong with it, but ask your rav.
3) I think there’s something wrong with it, but ask your rav.
4) I don’t think it is a good movie to show children.
5) Movies are assur.
I may have missed a few answers, so others can feel free to add their own.
kapusta, thanks. Keeping it on hold for now is fine. And I’m really glad you’re doing better!
SaysMe, thanks so much, and your poem is really lovely, it has a wonderful message.
Think first, those are all excellent things to keep in mind for a marriage, thanks for sharing. If I may, I’d like to add something else: One should realize that the biggest gift he can receive is the act of giving to the other, because that gives back the gift of love and appreciation. Always be on the lookout to do things for the other person that will make them happy, because that in turn will make you happy.
s2021, thanks!
PE, hi! I’m doing alright, thank G-d, thanks for asking. How are you?
blabla, I don’t think PE meant what she said in a negative way at all, I think she just meant to state how far you’ve come over the past months. It really is incredible how far you’ve come, you are an amazing person.
No One Mourns, I’m glad you’re back! That’s great you had a nice weekend.
Just a short message from ayc: ayc is an ainekel of him, and says that the correct name is R Elimelech ben Elazar Lipman.
HaKatan, I understand completely where you coming from. About blockhead’s post, I found it in line with some valid opinions. He actually did not say that a “T” for “Saf” is correct, rather that such is just what happens to be used in some circles.
I agree that “T” is not accurate for the “Saf”, but neither is an “S”. Also, everything you’ve said about how certain Hebrew letters are closer to a specific English letter than another are all a matter of opinion, and all valid opinions. I happen to think that the proper sound of the “Saf”, which is a “TH”, is not any closer to an “S” than a “T”. It would appear to me that it’s actually closer to a “T”, since a “Saf” with a dagesh is a “Taf”, which is definitely a “T”, and not an “S”, and the dagesh is there to strengthen the sound of the letter.
And yes, the Sefardim do have an issue with cholom, as well as kamatz, and don’t pronounce them accurately. So every sect has some things that are more accurate than others.
With the Spanish “J”, again, I don’t think it is any closer to a “Chof” than a “Hey”, and therefore, the “Ches” is simply in between, and writing is as a “CH” is no more correct than writing it with a “H”. It should actually be written as a “J” with a footnote that says “Spanish pronunciation”, if you really want to do it right.
I agree that most pronunciations of the Ashkenaz are very close, but the Ashkenaz seem to have most of their issues with stressing the correct syllable of words. The Sefardim are much more accurate with that.
puppy, glad to see you back here! How are you?
SaysMe, I wondered about observanteen for a while as well, I was under the impression that she left the CR completely a couple months ago. I don’t know about the others.
hershi, I’m unsure if you were referring to me or 147 with your reply. And it’s wonderful that you have a different opinion, just please state it, so I can understand what your opinion is instead of just saying that others are incorrect.
And from what I’ve learned, the “oi” sound for a cholom is, actually, wrong. Granted, many people pronounce as such anyway, and just don’t place a lot of emphasis on Hebrew dikduk in general, which I really don’t have a problem with. I only have a problem with it when the pronunciation actually changes the meaning of the word.
“I know plenty of people who learn in kollel even though they have no geshmak but do so only because that’s what Hashem wants them to do.”
In my opinion, people like that should not be in kollel. G-d doesn’t want you to be miserable.
always runs, that is wonderful news, and thanks for sharing that with us! May things only get better and better.
HaKatan and Hershi, I am very aware that there are many, many different opinions on this, and I am simply stating my opinion, which I got from a few biblical Hebrew and Composition classes taught by a master in the Hebrew language. And yes, it’s true that the letter “Ches” doesn’t completely transliterate as “H”, it is closer to how the Spanish pronounce “J”, as in “Guadalajara”. The letter “Kuf” does, however, transliterate as a “Q”, and the letter “Saf” should be a “TH”.
blabla, I’m sorry about what you’re going through with your friends. The bottom line is, no one can ever really know how much you go through without being in your shoes, and therefore, they just can’t fully understand, no matter how much they think they do. So it’s wrong for them to judge you in any way and expect something of you just because they do it. If there was a way you can communicate this to them, maybe they’d begin to understand that they really can’t fully understand what you go through, and therefore, shouldn’t judge you.
s2021, thanks. And I hope you continue to stick around this thread, you have really wonderful things to say!
They’re actually the ones that are doing it right. As blockhead pointed out, all those things are the correct transliteration. The rest of us do it wrong.
SaysMe, no problem!
Goq, agreed.
s2021, wow, those sure are a mix of emotions. But everyone has those emotions, to a degree. The difference is how we channel those emotions, and how we deal with them. It is all in our grasp to to use them for our benefit, and when we do, marriage can be a truly wonderful thing. May G-d give you the strength to find the way toward a new beginning, and channel every emotion for good.
PE, blabla, how are you both?
Look at what the Kohen Gadol wore. Colorful garments, strings of gold, a breastplate with a dazzling array of gems. And he was definitely a Jew of the highest stature. I don’t want to change any “mesorah” and I don’t care to. I’ll keep wearing my colored shirts, and if anyone else wants to wear black and white, good for you.
s2021, thanks, and glad to see you here!
kapusta, I’d love to, but I’d rather not give out that information in public. You can always contact me through my email at Soundcloud.
SaysMe, what an emotionally packed poem. It is so hard to deal with anything when we don’t have someone close to talk to and lean on. I know that all of us here might not be considered “close friends”, since this is an anonymous forum, but you can definitely talk to us and we will offer everything we can. I hope you are able to get someone in the real world that you can feel close to and open up to, and have those feelings of friendship you seek.
Shticky Guy, nice poem, and glad to see you here. I once thought like you too, and felt that all the “depressing” poems just make this a sad place, but I then saw it in a different light. I see it now as an opportunity to offer people support who are going through difficult things, aside from just being a thread for poetry. This is a really great support group, and I feel that I actually make a difference here. I think we have all had positive impacts on each other here, and have all improved a lot. So yes, it is nice to have some upbeat and positive poetry here, but I think that it’s the more serious and heartfelt poetry that really makes this thread worthwhile.
blabla, that’s so beautiful! I’m so glad you reached that point in your prayers, keep it up, and things will continue to get better!
Think first, thanks so much, that means a lot. And yes, I will definitely pray for you. Your poem was so beautiful. It’s so great to hear how this thread has helped you become a better person.
SaysMe, thanks so much. You are definitely right, it isn’t healthy to worry or dread things too much before they ever happen. That would just make it worse. We should try to stay positive while we can, and whatever happens, happens. Thanks for the help.
kapusta and PE, thanks so much.
kapusta, thanks so much.
PE, thanks so much for that beautiful poem, it was really helpful.
I just typed this up, hope it doesn’t come across as too depressing:
With pesach coming up
my heart sinks yet again
knowing what’s in store for me
knowing exactly when
Cleaning doesn’t bother me
shopping is fine, too
even though I barely have time
with all my school work to do
When the family comes to town
each sibling with a spouse
I find myself with no one else
I feel alone in the house
I set the table, and clean it up
smiling all the way
but the smile is a mask
true feelings it doesn’t convey
it’s an automatic reply
then I find myself on my own
and that is when I cry
I know this occurs to many
I’m not the only one
but when family is all one’s got
then there’s no where else to run
You may all think I’m so strong
giving support and care
but I’m struggling just like anyone
and I find it difficult to bear
But even when my family
makes me feel alone
I can always come to this thread
and feel right at home
You are all my family
You’re on my mind so much
I’m thankful that I have you all
my heart you all do touch
Think first, that is a lovely poem, and that is a wonderful thing you did. May it be a merit for you to have success in whatever you do.
RedNails, glad to see you here! Very cute poem, even if it’s not your own.
PE, SaysMe, thanks for the support. I had a very difficult shabbos, unfortunately. Loneliness can be a hard thing to deal with sometimes. I hope this week will be better.
SaysMe, that’s so terrific you felt true happiness on Purim, and the positive outlook you have about it is inspiring. May that happiness and calmness you felt carry over to the rest of the year, as well, and may your prayers all be answered for the best.
blabla, kapusta, hope your Purims were both nice.
Mazal tov!
blabla, may G-d answer your heartfelt prayer on this special day. SaysMe’s reply is absolutely beautiful. Please know that you are not alone on this day, we are all with you in spirit, and care about you very much. I actually had a very rough day today, physically and emotionally, but I am thankful that I came out of it okay, and I know that it was for the best.
Hope that everyone had an inspiring Purim, and wishing everyone a great shabbos.
kapusta, I second SaysMe’s hug!
I thought you meant drum toms, and was going to suggest Guitar Center or Sam Ash, until I saw you meant shoes.
Shticky Guy, nice poem! And glad to see you here!
SaysMe, thanks, and I’m glad there are so many people here to give support and encouragement. Hope you got in touch with PE.
kapusta, your hugs definitely go a long way! Keep them coming.
blabla, Think first, hope all’s well.