mentsch1

5T
All things are mortal but the Jew; all other forces pass, but he remains. What is the secret of his immortality? (Mark Twain)
Your questions essentially boil down to an attempt to understand Gods plan, and no one can know that.
What is clear is that our stubborn insistence on following Rabbinic Judaism has allowed its adherents to perform a feat of survival that is miraculous and noted as such by goyim.
And your question of “what is the point?” Is somewhat shallow coming from someone who hasn’t know the adversity of a holocaust. Those that did and still saw “the point” are the ones that keep the miracle known as “the Jew” immortal.

Avirah
Just use Sefaria ! 🙂

here is my question to all those who are makpid on pouring water into the wine bottle
Are you careful to not pagum after kiddush?
bc you aren’t supposed to drink from the kos, then pour it into other peoples cups – thats pagum
In order to not pagum, you would need to pour off first, then drink (plus it’s more hygenic)

Sam
your 2nd and 3rd paragraphs are somewhat contradictory
In the 2nd par. you are arguing the political likelihood
In the 3rd you point out that statistics and likelihood are irrelevant

Shimon
Nice way to kill a thread
Anyway because it always pays to verify I just googled it
Regular members of Knesset only pledge to be loyal to the state of Israel
The president, Prime Minister, and all other ministers pledge to fulfill its laws
But there is definitely nothing in there about supremacy of its laws

True
But since the press release makes it sound like a kiruv club, I find it hard to fault them
Besides
Another plus, it seems to have irritated the LGBT crowd. That alone tells me it must not be what they are looking for
I would like to think this is the roshei yeshiva trolling the LG’s

Always
Or America is really a failed experiment as indicated by our ignorance and values
We did have a brief moment. But we seem to be in quick decline
In either case
My point has always been that the Brit’s were ahead of us as a social /political “enlightenment “. I do not dismiss British evils. They continued expansion into the early 1990’s. But they where still ahead of us. They weren’t a Wild West Country all they way through the 1800,s. They didn’t fight a civil war that killed half a million (their civil war was in the 1600’s) had we stayed as colonies in all likelihood many of the early evils of America would either not have happened or came to an end earlier. In stead it was their example that was a light unto the nations and forced the reckoning that caused the war to finally end evil.
And you can’t dismiss that the founding fathers were hypocrites

Always
First. Whether or not their political theories were of value it doesn’t change the fact that they were mored bmalchus and started a war that killed thousands for political reasons.
Two their written reasons (federalists papers) aren’t going to be intellectually honest and say “hey we want to keep slavery”
I found this nice quote about the fathers complaining they were “slaves” because of a lack of representation
The irony in using this sort of language was not lost on many British Tories, who called out these rebel hypocrites. “We are told, that the subjection of Americans may tend to the diminution of our own liberties; an event, which none but very perspicacious politicians are able to foresee. If slavery be thus fatally contagious, how is it that we hear the loudest yelps for liberty among the drivers of negroes?” wrote Dr. Samuel Johnson in 1775. Indeed, these sentiments not only labeled many of the American leaders as hypocrites, but it also took a swipe at the very notion that America was founded on principles that were universal for all humans

Always
The only thing snarky is your founding fathers statement
I am simply presenting an alternative understanding of the founding fathers (happy now?) actions through, what I believe, to be the lens of the torah
It is very easy to buy into the idea that somehow america was founded by people rising up against a brutal regime (an idea expressed by a poster)
but it simply isn’t true
In some respects the “brutal ” monarchy we were fighting against was certainly more humane than the govt we created. Slavery, trail of tears, Jim crow. We could be a very brutal country. On the slavery subject we were many years behind the more civilized monarchy.
It was certainly a haven of sorts for the yidden but only to an extent. We all can agree the closed borders in 1939 where catastrophic. And those yidden that arrived before the war were decimated by assimilation. I stand by what I said.

Truly enjoying this thread and still waiting for ujm to tell us why he is so knowledgeable in these matters

But I need to take issue with Jackk
our rejection of the monarchy is American propaganda written by the victors.
The truth, we were paying a pittance in taxes that went to a standing army that protected us
the reality is that our forefathers wanted to protect the slave trade.
The brits had already outlawed the trade and even after independence enforced it by boarding american ships
There is a confirmed story of a british warship boarding an american vessel suspected of slavery. The captain tied his slaves to the anchor and when it became apparent that the slave ship would be boarded, he dropped anchor which removed all the slaves (drowning hundreds ) from his ship. The brits couldn’t arrest the captain because the slaves where no longer on the ship.
These are the “men” we look up to as the founding fathers.
Their names grace building like Browns university (family money made in the slave trade)
Say what you want about the monarchy but it is only in the last 50 years that America has earned the right to call itself a relatively moral country

Emes
Addressing your two points
2) do you really think the state will attempt to prosecute tens of thousands of chassidim? Even if they just pick a few handfuls to try to make a point, do you not think they would rather go to jail? And that’s not very good optics for the state. I don’t see them being able to win that battle. If it was me, I would gladly sit in jail.

2) again. All they can do is pull funding. Either from Yeshivos or various programs. But then it looks like they are singling out Jews and what politician wants to be labeled an antisemite?

The way I see it, the only thing they can do ( besides pulling the funding) is the clear that a high school does not meet equivalency and therefore the graduate will not get a GED/diploma
But as I said above they just don’t care. So what is the big concern here?

pepper
The case in question was an institutionalized woman. Everyone learning in MTJ signed.

I personally know a case of female get refusal where the husband got a local brooklyn BD to grant him a HMR. The wife continued to refuse the get (it was deposited at the BD) even after the husband remarried. What the exact circumstances were? why did they allow him to circumvent the cherem? I can not answer.
But my thinking is, that once the marriage is deemed unsalvageable (and taking into account that the seforim pasken leniently on the cherem) then a hmr is an option.
But clearly the Rabbanut is being machmir. I would love to know their criteria. It seems apparent that the criteria is not the same across the BD spectrum.

For what it’s worth I bought my shofar from the famous beitar maker (he is featured in the “picture this” Feldheim book)
At the time I asked him if any care was necessary and he said no. Though he recommended keeping it in the cotton bag that he sold it to me in.
I’m just not sure why people feel vinegar is necessary. As I’ve stated its use (among other methods) is to remove the smell. But why yearly treatments are necessary escapes me. My father‘s shofar is 50 yrs old and still sounds/looks the same with no treatments or cleaning.

rightwriter
Ever try out a shofar in a store?
who knows how many lips were put on that.
and if you borrow the shul shofar and think a quick wipe is all it needs, since I am in the health care field, I can tell you that’s not how it works
So definitely not for the faint of heart
But it’s my shofar, why is there a need to clean it?

Ujm
I’ve got relatives in EY marrying off daughters.
I can tell you that they turn down shidduchim all the time because of the question “will you buy the couple an apartment “
The answer is no and that is that. It’s not “more or less the same” as here. I’ve never heard of anyone having the chutzpah to demand that here

And OP
Where do you live that it is only once every two weeks?
Here in Flatbush it’s a daily occurrence

Yungerman
Though what you say is true, it doesn’t explain how so many families have a kid off the derech.
Why would the same parent/role model have several “regular “ kids and one off the derech when they all had the same role model ?
A few years ago I went to daven in an EY kollel with my brother. I saw the Rosh Kollel learning with a heavily tattooed young man. I commented to my brother how nice it is that this talmid chachum does kiruv. He said “that’s his son”
It’s a plague and I don’t think I’m ready to blame the parents.

Ubiq
I recognize there is a greater question of hishtadlus here. I just take issue with the idea that there is something not hashkafic about ownership
And Jackk
If you want you can subscribe to the NRA and get their magazines. They have a section on all the newspaper clippings of people who saved themselves with guns. I know two frum people whose lives were saved. Now we can argue that their lives were meant to be saved anyway, even without a gun. But as someone else has already said. Areas with people carrying guns tend to be safer.
We need to focus on getting the guns away from criminals. Stop and frisk etc. if we aren’t doing that , if we are allowing BLM protests etc. please don’t strip me of my right to protect my family.

Jackk
As I have said earlier in other threads it makes sense to make it harder to get weapons. Especially since goyim can’t be trusted.
But your understanding of guns is limited if you think banning ar15 will solve the problem. As has been said before the assault rifle term is one that is cosmetic. You would have to ban all semi automatic rifles of 9mm caliber or larger to really remove military grade rifles from the population.
In todays climate that is not going to happen.

I grew up MO
Many in the local YI had kippahs with “never again” written on them. I believe that statement is koach v’otzam yudi
But to all those arguing gun ownership isn’t Jewish or we should point to other countries. How does that help us as Jews in the post holocaust era?
I’m sure the Jews in prewar Germany also thought there was no issue. I’m sure they pointed to the safety of western countries
How do you ignore the increase in attacks on Jewish institutions? We have had ponway, Philly, Jersey and just this past shabbos.
Just 2 years ago the discussion in all the shuls in Brooklyn is if you should have armed misspallilm.
Rav Bender trained his staff to carry arms.
Are you living in reality or just hoping for the best?

Reb eliezer
Notice how the media keeps referring to the weapon used as “ar 15 style”
I don’t like commenting without facts and the truth will eventually come out but this “style” word combined with Illinois strict laws leads me to believe it wasn’t an “assault weapon” but a standard semi auto rifle (possibly a mini 14)
And if I am right then this only proves what the anti ban people have been saying for years; there is no functional difference between an ar15 “assault rifle” and a standard semi auto

OP
In the 1970’s 50% of homes had guns now it’s around 32% (google it . Source NYT so hardly right wing)
So if access to guns is dropping while shootings are increasing, is the problem guns?
These types of shooting were unheard of in the 1970’s.
I have drawn the conclusion that our society is rotten.
How can we only discuss gun control without acknowledging the need to govern speech and hate?

Gefilte
I personally know of 3 cases of heter meah (besides for the one I mentioned involving Rav Moshe)
Two of them the wife refused the get
One the wife was permanently incapacitated
Silent-Majority is completely uninformed

Ayingle
The case was in regards to a mentally incapacitated/institutionalized woman

The relative did receive smicha from Rav Moshe but that happened after
According to him everyone in the Bais Medrash at the time signed
Quoting this person (but not in Rav Moshe’s name) “probably close to 99% of the tshuvos I have seen on the subject of The cherim treat it leniently Bc of the lapse in time”

akuperma
“every bullet has a lawyer attached”
but you may have stumbled on one of many roadblocks to carry in NYC
They may have to grant these licenses but they can theoretically mandate everything from special training (which i believe in) to mandating expensive hard to find insurance
they can create gun free zones. everything from bars (i certainly hope so) to schools. All of these things will then send it back to the courts