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ChaBaD is good for the litvish we as their derech is boring dull and dry. We give you something to talk about : )
QWERTY I’m still waiting for a response to my source you can’t read. Is philosopher going to do all your work for you?
QWERTY you should ask your friend who claims to be chassdishe if asking for a bracha from one’s Rebbe is avodah zarah? Why would there need to be an intermediary for a bracha from HaShem?
QWERTY at least they look like yidden, every modern orthodox couple I’ve seen tries to look like a goy in public out of shame of yiddishkeit.
Diversion and deflection par for the course. Have you nothing to say after a month of being completely incorrect and exposing your ignorance in Torah?
QWERTY ask the ChaBaD rabbi at your ChaBaD Shul, he’ll understand the joke.
I still haven’t gotten a response for the source I provided.
I guess it’s checkmate and now the diversions will begin.
Philosopher could you mind explaining how the Or HaChaim is wrong in this source? Maybe you have a better understanding than he does?
וישק לו. פירוש לו נשק אבל אין נכון לעשות כן למת אחר כי המת גדוש בטומאה וטומאתו בוקעת ועולה עד לרקיע ותפגם הנפש הנושקת אלא לו ליעקב כי חי הוא אלא דורמיטא קראתו כישן ונרדם
ויחנטו הרופאים. עשה כן יוסף משום כבוד אביו כי כן משפט הנכבדים ומכל שכן גדולי המלכות, או כדי שלא יטעו בו כשלא יחנטוהו שלא מת או שמת ולא הסריח ויעשוהו אלוה כי הוא פלא בעמים המזוהמים וסובב לבלתי יעלהו לארץ קבורתו, ואם לא היה טעמים הנזכרים הדבר פשוט כי בלא חניטה לא היה מסריח, וצא ולמד ממעשה ר’ אלעזר ברשב”י כאמור בש”ס (ב”מ פד:)
או אפשר לומר כי לצד שישראל שעמדו על הר סיני פסקה זוהמתן (שבת קמו.) ולזה צדיקי ישראל מאז והלאה לא היו מסריחין אחר מותם ואפילו עיפוש הנשאר בבטן יבש ויהיה לעפר כי זוהמת הגוף היא המסרחת אוכל שבמעים מה שאין כן קודם לכן, והגם שנאמר שגופו של יעקב לא יסריח כי לא מת אבל על כל פנים עיפוש המאכל אשר ישאר בגוף האדם כנום כי ירבו לו הימים יתעפש ויסריח ולזה חש יוסף וצוה לחנוט
או אפשר כי יוסף לא ידע מסוד זה וצוה לחנוט
Philosopher would you mind translating my source that shows you are completely wrong for QWERTY?
I suggest both philosopher and QWERTY get back to reading the צאנה וראינה and quit wasting our time.
Judging by qwertys hysterical responses to everything I believe QWERTY may actually be a woman. There is no way a man could possibly be this irrational, plus look at who she is in good company with, another unstable chabad obsessed woman.
I’ll take the Or Hachaims’ words over two women’s minds preoccupied by sinas chinam and modern mushugas:
וישק לו. פירוש לו נשק אבל אין נכון לעשות כן למת אחר כי המת גדוש בטומאה וטומאתו בוקעת ועולה עד לרקיע ותפגם הנפש הנושקת אלא לו ליעקב כי חי הוא אלא דורמיטא קראתו כישן ונרדם
ויחנטו הרופאים. עשה כן יוסף משום כבוד אביו כי כן משפט הנכבדים ומכל שכן גדולי המלכות, או כדי שלא יטעו בו כשלא יחנטוהו שלא מת או שמת ולא הסריח ויעשוהו אלוה כי הוא פלא בעמים המזוהמים וסובב לבלתי יעלהו לארץ קבורתו, ואם לא היה טעמים הנזכרים הדבר פשוט כי בלא חניטה לא היה מסריח, וצא ולמד ממעשה ר’ אלעזר ברשב”י כאמור בש”ס (ב”מ פד:)
או אפשר לומר כי לצד שישראל שעמדו על הר סיני פסקה זוהמתן (שבת קמו.) ולזה צדיקי ישראל מאז והלאה לא היו מסריחין אחר מותם ואפילו עיפוש הנשאר בבטן יבש ויהיה לעפר כי זוהמת הגוף היא המסרחת אוכל שבמעים מה שאין כן קודם לכן, והגם שנאמר שגופו של יעקב לא יסריח כי לא מת אבל על כל פנים עיפוש המאכל אשר ישאר בגוף האדם כנום כי ירבו לו הימים יתעפש ויסריח ולזה חש יוסף וצוה לחנוט
או אפשר כי יוסף לא ידע מסוד זה וצוה לחנוט
Is a neshama in a guf sheni Hadak still considered alive?
QWERTY your reference to a now irrelevant goyish artist both dates you and exposes your exposure to tameih teachings.
I place you as a boomer. Studies have show leaded fuel has had severe mental consequences on your generation. Further discussion on any serious subject is going to prove to be beyond your grasp.
B”H the EPA has provided protections to the younger generation who’s mental acuity has proven intact during the course of this discussion.
Philosopher I will then daven for your shalom bayis, you obviously have sublimated your problems with men into this discussion.
QWERTY have you tried iamamother? It might be more on your level.
Philosopher I’ll daven you find your bashert this coming year. There is no reason you have to continue being this miserable.
I’m sure your future husband can easily walk you through this issue in understanding a Rashi.
פארוואס זאל איך הערן אז קיינער זאגט גארנישט
ועל דרך הקבלה יעקב אבינו לא מת שלא היתה מדתו כענין שאר מדות הקצוות שהן גורמות ההפכים, ובאור זה כי מדתו הוא המכריע ואע”פ שהוא כלול מכל המדות ומקבל מהן בעבור שהוא עולה דרך סלולה עד ראשית הראשית שהוא מקור החיים, על כן אמרו ביעקב לא מת ולא אמרו כן על אברהם ויצחק לפי שהן מדות הקצוות לימין ולשמאל הגורמות ההפכים ולפיכך יעקב אבינו לא מת אך נשאר קיים בגוף ובנפש, הגוף הזה הוא הגוף השני הדק שבו הנפש מתלבשת בצורת גוף ויש לו ממש אבל הוא דק עד מאד מתלבשת בו לעתים מזומנות והוא מערב שבת לערב שבת או מיום הכפורים ליום הכפורים הוא משוטט בעולם בשליחותו של הקב”ה ומתראה למי שהוא חפץ בו כי הראשון הגס נחנט ונקבר כפשוטו של מקרא, וזהו מאמר החכם שאמר מקרא אני דורש שנאמר (ירמיה מו) הנני מושיעך ואת זרעך, מקיש הוא לזרעו מה זרעו בחיים אף הוא בחיים כלומר מה זרעו בחיים בגוף ובנפש אף הוא בחיים בגוף ובנפש והוא הגוף שהזכרתי.
Don’t worry this isn’t a ChaBaD source 🙂
“This is why Ruchniyus is so evil”
What?!?
I suggest the conversation continues in Hebrew/Yiddish in order to create a barrier of entry for the dentist that forgot to take his meds.
Philosopher are you a reform “rabbi?”, was this the subject material for your bas mitzvah vort?
To those that want a summary of this thread:
A narcissistic retard dentist and a woman debate a Lubavitcher and a Litvisher over a Torah subject they can’t comprehend.
My joy is the Litvisher and Lubavitcher joined forces.
Dentist the rock you crawled from under is calling.
Here is a test for the mods:
Rumor has is Shach was well versed in the works of a certain mad Austrian painter yimach shemo hence his aversion to the Lubavitcher Rebbe. I didn’t hear this directly but a big Rav said it! It explains the litvish hashkafa until late to be an elitist, until ChaBaD showed up and everyone decided Kiruv was the only way to maintain baal habatim. Do you think bochurim from brisk, volozhin, and slaboka put Tefillin on disenfranchised yidden before the Rebbe?
I’ve noticed those will no Kabbalas ol tend to judge others to make themselves feel better about their short comings. It’s easy to try and make ChaBaD look bad when you don’t amount to anything. This entire thread is proof of this.
Call me a child, it’s a compliment compared to the gnats that post in this forum.
Menachem:
Why feed into the ego of this overpaid tooth shiner that can’t understand Torah at the level of a child?
I hope that all of QWERTYs children become Lubavitchers, and they laugh about their fathers mesorah.
Hakatan:
According to shaar hagilgulim a wife returns with her husband to be his bashert in gilgul.
Enjoy your Sunday friendship circle breakfasts @ ChaBaD.
QWERTY take your check mate.
I’m signing off.
You’re not the shoiteh gadol, I am for bothering to argue with one.
This was a complete waste of my time.
Because you are not mentally capable of answering his questions CHECKMATE.
Time to go back to VIN the coffee room is apparently too much for you.
Since we like to source R. Shach on ChaBaD let’s see what he thinks about Modern Orthodoxy:
“Shach wrote that Yeshiva University-type institutions posed a threat to the endurance of authentic Judaism. He called them “an absolute disaster, causing the destruction of our Holy Torah. Even the so-called ‘Touro College’ in the USA is a terrible disaster, a ‘ churban ha-das ‘ (destruction of the Jewish religion)…” [53] Shach writes that the success of those people who were able to achieve greatness in Torah, despite their involvement in secular studies, are “ma’aseh satan” (the work of the satanic forces), for the existence of such role models will entice others to follow suit, only to be doomed.[54] In conversation with an American rabbi in the 1980s, Shach stated, “The Americans think that I am too controversial and divisive. But in a time when no one else is willing to speak up on behalf of our true tradition, I feel myself impelled to do so.”[41]
QWERTY what are your thoughts?
“ I asked her if she was taught in yeshiva that Lubavitchers are better than other Jews”
The only reason you are upset about this is because no one is saying you are the best Jew. Your gaavah is so strong you think you know better than your own gedolim, those whom have not condemned ChaBaD as idol worshippers Chas v’Shalom.
I’m having trouble not believing you are not a 14 year old Bochur at this point.
My 15 year old son has most likely studied more Torah in a Lubavitch mesivta than you have in your life. It shows when you can’t even engage in a proper Torah discussion with Seichel.
I’m sure HaRav Gadol HaDor David Berger questions the authenticity of the Zohar to promote his chuzpadik crusade against Lubavitch. I attribute it to the spiritual corruption of limud l’chol in the MO system, which Baruch HaShem is on its way out soon.
So when the Rashbi states in the Zohar:
קודשו בריך הוא אורייתא וישראל וכל חדShould we write off the entirety of Kabbalah as well?
That’s checkmate!
The biggest question in this thread is why Lubavitchers even have to defend themselves against such an obvious am haaretz.
QWERTY if you want to have a conversation outside of mere conjecture why don’t you engage Sechel in an honest Torah discussion? Please see the thread he posted.
Until then I will continue to disregard you as the Baal gaavah, and obvious perpetrator of sinas chinam you are.
“At the same time, his mother noticed that he was learning chassidus to the detriment of the gemora, and directed the father to take take from his all-important position and teach the child himself.”
YU hosts “pride” clubs, does ChaBaD? Maybe he should have learned chassidus to avoid this terrible aversion to the derech. Modern orthodoxy obviously has an Avodah Zarah problem with “pride”. G-d have mercy on these tormented souls.
Yankel
I’m struggling with a big question:
Who is the bigger idiot, the idiot or the idiot that argues with him? Obviously qwerty is the idiot, so what does that make me?
Oh I wish I was on such a high level as Zaphod to escape the clutches of the coffee room!!!
QWERTY,
Please let the troops in EY with the Moshiach flags on top of armored vehicles know,as a dentist,the Rebbe is not Moshiach.
Remember the Rebbe Melech HaMoshiach let r. Shach he needed to have his Tefillin checked.
Maybe you should do the same!
The Rebbe is Moshiach
It isn’t worth it to entertain Qwerty who actively posts motzei shem ra against the Rebbe.
He has to be out of his mind to attribute the koichos of amalek to the Rebbe, this is an obvious sign of sinas chinam.
Qwerty the pleasure you find in disparaging Lubavitch is not a good thing. I’m saying this with concern.
All others engaging him should seriously think about the consequences of him being goaded into saying any more foolish statements.
Ukraine should have surrendered from the get go. This nato proxy war nonsense isn’t going to solve anything.
I don’t hate you, I feel sorry for you.
“ Hashem will ask them why the messages didn’t get through to them.”
To say you know the thoughts of HaShem is a level of yeshus and gaavah unsurpassed in the CR. Everything you criticize the Rebbe of you exhibit in your own behavior. This entire thread is projection of your own issues.
Please quit making a fool of yourself and get the help you need.
Yankel: If you are correct then let’s see qwerty logically refute sechels sourced claims.
Harris wins people kvetch about Antifa wokeism Communism BDS voter fraud J6 etc.
Trump wins people kvetch about America First Nazis, racism, dominonist Xtianity voter fraud trump assassination etc.
Guess what, neither are going to do anything remarkable.
Much like the war in Gaza, the war in Ukraine, the civil strife in Britain things will grind on to be incrementally worse with no clear exit strategy or cathartic events.There is no going back like Trump proposes, and the way forward is gradual decline so might as well speed it up.
It says in Derech Mitzvosecha each yid has a role as a body part in klal yisrael. Sinas Chinam causes a yid to spiritually cut himself off from having the body part he hates, effectively creating a spiritual mum in himself. Just like a Korban wasn’t accepted by a kohen doing the avodah with a mum, when someone who holds baseless hatred in his heart for another yid has his davening rejected.
“ The Chazakah is that all Lubavitchers are idolaters.”
“ I didn’t say that all Lubavichers are idolaters.”
Which is it buddy? Is only Lubavitchers at your ChaBaD house that aren’t idol worshippers?
“ As for my position vis a vis the Rebbe. He was a Kofer”
Why don’t you tell this to your ChaBaD rabbis face? I’m sure he will think you are considered qualified to make such a judgment.
No qwerty I have given up. To declare all of ChaBaD idol worshippers and disparage the Rebbe says more about you and your sinas chinam. The level of hypocrisy you display going to a ChaBaD Shul is proof, you can’t even act on your supposed convictions.
The Rebbe Rashab is right sinas chinam rises from a place beyond sechel as observed in the lack of any intelligent replies to sechel’s sources.
What’s funny to me is how angry you are with ChaBaD, I would love to know where that stems from, probably no reasonable place. I would suggest picking up sn English copy of Cheichaltzu by the Rebbe Rashab and do the homework to discover why you hate fellow Jews so much.
“ Until the Gedolim pasken that davening in a Chabad minyan is Assur I’ll continue to do so”
Why haven’t they paskened so? If ChaBaD is so trief why haven’t modern Poskim put them all in cherem?
I find that emphasizing limud l’chol in yeshivas like YU is far more problematic than some nut jobs in 770 allegedly davening to the Rebbe.
Inquisitor QWERTY has indicted himself in idol worship by davening in a ChaBaD Shul.
“ according to Rabbi Akiva anyone who supports idolatry is an Idolater.”
Checkmate
You can’t whine your way out of this one.
So based on your logic R. Lichtenstein is an idol worshipper for giving ChaBaD a haskama and associating with R. Kolartsky?
Haha coffee just accept you wasted your time on coming up with nonsense lol.
I listened to the podcast, in no way do any of the Poskim interviewed dismiss the entirety of ChaBaD.
I implore everyone to listen to this podcast, it’s probably the best counter to everything qwerty has to say.
In no way does R. Shachter condemn the entirety of ChaBaD during this interview, he expresses concern about a rumored small contingent in ChaBaD that may or may not be davening to the Rebbe chas v’shalom. I agree 100% that is avodah zarah and should be rightly called out. To condemn the entire movement is a major shtus as expressed by the yeshivish rabbonim on this podcast.