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I think the most prevalent use is in situations when you don’t have a siddur – for example, at a simcha.
Davening should be interesting, maybe exciting. Fun ?
Psachyah (Yerushalm).
What about another name for Hasuch, and why (2) ?
Nitpicker – I see no reason Sam2 should need a source for that, sounds pretty simple – a drink is a drink (water being the exception).
Now this could be an interesting conversation (unless its an old one- i didn’t search).
How is YWN CR a dangerous situation ?
Far east – it is a clear halachah not to show affection publicly, don’t remember chapter and verse without looking it up. It is a very obvious application of Tznius – of course, we could question exactly what could be called “showing affection”. The idea here is that in the privacy of your home it is different, even though its in front of the kids. This is already a question of sechel (or if there are sources, I’m not aware. Never looked into it too much)
I agree Wolf, just wanted to know if you have any thoughts.
I love the story with your mother!
“Ain l’davar sof” – true, but you could just as easily start from the other end – you certainly don’t want your kids being friends with others who do [fill in the blank], so where do I stop and draw the line and say this is too much?
Sam2- that’s the point, isn’t it ? IF YOU”RE HONEST WITH YOURSELF. As we generally are not – if you disagree, I have to assume you have no sifrei mussar at home, nor have ever learnt any – we have a problem.
Welcome to planet earth after cheit Adam harishon, buddy – there’s a reason the eitz hada’as is called “Ilana d’Sfeika”, The Tree (of) [that creates] doubt, by Chazal.
On the other hand, LBK, if you’re baking for the purpose of distributing it in small amounts you may not have to take challah.
This raises another point.
SAM2 – you listening ?
Eid echod works based on the assumption that the other is aware of the issues, and is believed that they dealt with them properly. You are sadly out of touch with reality if you think that most Jew today (worker, learner, man or women) is sufficiently knowledgeable in Halachah.
Toi – great point! I’ve wondered if people “shtel” on that.
skiaddict – so you’re going to spend lots of time and money, and not care to accomplish this mitzvah too ? Why give davka in a way that you’re not yotzei – because of a theme ?!
The Biur Halachah is a chumrah, relative to the recipient. The Aruch HaShulchan (and many others) paskens that “manah” means an important portion, and even a kzayis or k’beitzeh isn’t enough. It has to be an honorable portion.
You stand by yours, but you won’t respond to my points ?
No. R’ Elyashiv says even seltzer isn’t.
I’m not sure why not trusting yourself would cause you to fall more. Chazal took what are considered by many to be pretty extreme measures to help us avoid problematic situations. I have heard people actually ask this about many gezeiros Chazal: Why can’t they trust us more.
If you feel that FB is the type of situation you currently are in, fine. But I didn’t think it was so obvious – as you felt the need to start this thread…
Wolf – ok,I won’t tell you. JK, of course it happens, but I heard a Chazal once (course can’t remember where) that Hashem assures us that there won’t be a proliferation of mamzeirim. Which He could accomplish in any number of ways.
OOM – do you have a filter ? K9, for example, forces safe search, and you have to switch the settings there. It worked for me.
Wolf – I’m sure we could get to the point where we would all agree that the “display of affection” would be inappropriate in front of the children. Without the need for specific examples, how do you judge where the line should be drawn ?
As you’re posting about it, I take it to mean that you feel that this can be clearly understood to be ok, so I imagine you have some clearly defined parameters you can express.
Perhaps my above definition should now be restated as: The basic requirement of Yiras Shamayim is not to needlessly trust your own judgement in a risky situation.
BREAKING NEWS: Poskim have been printing Tshuvos for quite a while now!
um…why would someone eat your cholent and not your cake ?
Hello Sam2! So you dropped out of the above thread, but you want to start again here ?
It has nothing to do with better. It’s called different – the fact is its very probable they eat things you don’t want to, and why should you change your hanhagah just to eat someone else’s cookies ?
The basic requirement of Yiras Shamayim is to avoid situations where there are pitfalls. Obviously, if it is necessary to be in that situation, the rulebook changes, and you then learn how to navigate with care. If you only care about the black and white issurim of the Torah, however, the Ramban calls you a “naval”.
Being that everyone here seems to agree that there are dangers, and it doesn’t sound like there is any particular situation which requires it….
Don’t know what they say specifically, but I don’t see the grave danger of seeing in big block letters how there are people who don’t believe.
BPG’s Father – I’m not disagreeing with the idea, but that has nothing to do with the discussion. They safely assumed only adults read their seforim.
Wolf – the way you wrote that, it just means that he saw the situation as ironic, not that he condoned showing affection. If he did indeed say that he thinks its ok, did he specifically take it as far as your examples ?
mdd- You don’t understand that rishus is not always measured by how big the aveirah on its own, but by what it represents in the larger picture. He came to undermine the true emunah in a way that totally pushed out of the Jewish people. That’s why he’s in boiling excrement (Gemara Gittin) – he’s the waste product of Judaism.
The Halachic question is about a goy believing in “shituf”. That has no bearing on our question.
mdd – way too complicated for this forum, sorry, I keep on posting things like that, gotta stop. But what does killing have to do with anything ? I don’t care what historians say bout him, Paul, or anyone. I care what Chazal and our Chachamim (Ramchal for example) said, and they put him in a special category of his own.
Judgement, yes. Who says that includes anyone being lost for good ?
Oh no, Wolf, we already had you in mind this past Shabbos 🙂
Of course that is possible. I just don’t think that is the trait of jealousy. I simply desire something you happen to have. I just as easily could have seen it elsewhere – there you have the same desire, separated from jealousy. In short, being desirous is not the same as being jealous.
Probably the Be’er Yosef, based on the Targum Yonason.
Any Sefer that talks about these things, really. Would need to check things up for chapter and verse. Bal Yidach mimeni nidach. Kares doesn’t mean completely, permanently cut off either.
Those that are in the mishnah on Perek Chelek is a complicated issue.
Except Osoh HaIsh. He’s gone.
I think envy implies, by definition, that your desire is, to a certain extent, at the expense of your happiness for the other. If I am fully content with your having it, and simply want something I don’t have, which I happen to know about by seeing it by you, I am not envious, simply desirous. If your having it fuels my desire, that means I am not happy with your having while I don’t.
The concept of Ayin Horah (which def. exists, no matter how you deal with it), is based on the acknowledged difficulty we have in truly “fargining” others.
Too important to be ignored.
After Matan Torah, no Jew can be left behind.
Yes, I was.
It may not be feasible, but I was saying that I could relate to the idea that joining for a tefilah, and then going around, or making an appeal, is a politer way to go about things.
A lot of very serious people around here have some heavy-duty lightening-up to do.
If you care about the collectors, but don’t want your davening disturbed, you can put a little effort towards thinking of solutions. For example, I put down a few coins/bills, and as they come by they understand to take one. (Don’t know if it would work everywhere, but it works for me. Just an example.)
After Matan Torah, no Jew can be left behind.
The collecting is bad, but what really gets me is when they just stand there, refusing to acknowledge that you actually may not be giving/have cash on you to give them.
PBA: You make the assumption that this is a town with numerous minyanim…
I don’t agree with it, but I could hear that someone would assert that it’s more courteous to join a minyan, and then go around collecting, as opposed to just passin’ through.
Sam2 ?
Yes, I responded to you about the parameters of jealousy.
I needed a zchus one day, I ate cheerios ,and I got one. Causation proved.
ok, avhaben, didn’t get that. I think it says it clearly though, don’t need that proof.
Thye basic idea of listening to them is because of repect – point is not to disobey. R’ Moshe therefore says that maybe its only in front of them – i.e. as soon as you leave your mother’s house, you can take the coat off.
The questions about yeshiva is discussed in the poskim – def, don’t listen IF it’s clearly detrimental.
Wow, those capitals are really convincing!
Thanks for adding that brilliant, NEW twist to the conversation…
Wolf – am sincerely waiting for an answer, I value your thoughts on such topics.
I agree. I would add that i don’t see that the people who get worked up about it are always the ones so focused on their davening…
It can’t be whatever you want, but I know what you mean.
I was trying to say that’s the only place you’ll find it.
Yes, its a b’feirushe se’if in the Fifth Shulchan Aruch.
ZK – and the reason given is because a Yid won’t regret it if his request is not fulfilled. Meaning he understands that he does not have the ability to force G-d’s hand, and therefore is giving whole-heartedly in any event,
1)while many people donate to these places expecting a yeshuah, as evidenced by those who complain afterwards (including in other YWN CR threads) that it didn’t work for them.
2)and these places barely stop short of promising that it will work for you.
Did you lose your Rav’s number ?
And what does your question have to do with your opening statement anyway ?