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gavra, and I’ll quote myself in regards to that point:
There is no concept of “morality” within Judaism that differs from halacha in any way.
“So morailty is relative?”
I didn’t address this question in my preceding comment.
“Because in a case of a machlokes, for person A the same act is moral and for person b it is immoral.”
That can very well be the case. It would be immoral to break a minhag inappropriately. If someone’s psak is to do A while another person’s psak is not to do A, it would be moral for the first person to do it but immoral for the second person to do it.
“I’m not setting up a argument per se, it just seems funny.”
May I submit that you might find it funny because your idea of morality is influenced by non-Jewish ideas on the subject?
“Incidently there is a moral sense outside of halacha. Rashi says in many places that “mishpatim” are rules that we would come up with on our own like no stealing, no killing etc…
Though this doesnt disagree with your main point, which may not be incorrect”
Those examples are within halacha, not outside it (killing and stealing are halachic points – even if we could have figured them out on our own), so I’m not following your point on that.
What is “morality”? Morality is halacha. If it is anything halacha says to do, it is moral. If it is anything halacha says not to do, it is immoral. There is no concept of “morality” within Judaism that differs from halacha in any way.
If halacha says to kill someone, it is moral to kill him and it is immoral not to kill him.
What didn’t work for you has worked for others.
The Wolf (who doesn’t listen to any music, Jewish or not, these days)
Wow, you hold the most stringent opinion.
Arguing that the money is better spent on young people, smart people, cancer research, or whatever as opposed to comatose people isnt materialistic. It may be wrong but it isnt inherently evil nor based on “Dark and evil places”
Arguing to save the lives of young people before older people, most certainly is inherently evil and based on dark and evil impulses.
How do you dare argue otherwise, even as a possibility? Do you forward the same argument about saving white people before black people as you do about young people versus older people? After all, white people tend to live longer than blacks, lead more productive and wealthy lives and contribute more to charity and culture.
“Has money really altered the value of life as you say? Or has it just changed the need for the different decisions?”
the latter. Though it isnt just money. There is a staffing shortage a bed shortage. A comatose patient in an ICU is litteraly taking a bed that can go to somebody else. I am not saying “somebody else who needs it more” but without the Torah as a guide (and even in select cases with it) it is a bed that can better serve somebody else.
uniq: Feivel and Syag are 100% correct in that you have allowed modern Western thought corrupt your values away from Torah values.
The comatose patient can die without the bed. How is that “a bed that can better serve somebody else”?
You are saying that the comatose patient’s life is less valuable than the non-comatose patient.
Feivel: Yasher Koach for expressing and relating the 100% Torah-true opinion on this matter. Every word you wrote on this thread is on the button and Emes.
Reb Wolf: The cohabitation issue is the most relevant part of the law, as a practical matter. The only part of the law that was upheld is that which bars filing for State marriage licenses with more than one spouse. But the polygamous communities in America as a matter of practice do not file for multiple marriage licenses anyways. They simply live together in religious marriages without filing with the State. And the law that previously technically prevented that, is what was overturned.
(It should be noted that even before it was overturned that law was rarely enforced unless the person was also violating other laws such as abuse of a minor. The case that got it overturned was of a man with multiple wives that made his lifestyle very public as part of a TV show. The Attorney General tried to prosecute, even though he violated no other laws, and that got the law declared unconstitutional.)
akuperma: Federal court in Utah has already overturned Utah’a ban on polgamy (a bit over a year ago) on a basis that would be applicable to all such bans.
Rav Avigdor Miller said (and reprinted in one of his recent Q&A seforim) that it is possible that one day contemporary rabbonim will end the cherem. The Vilna Gaon also said he was in favor of ending it.
Feivel is a doctor.
For most folks, the real question is whether to say (the traditional) Gut Shabbos or to say (the more modernishe) Good Shabbos.
What do you say?
A catered dinner of exotic foods is an indulgence in gashmius.
Well said, newbee.
ca: Which country? Why didn’t you dispute or ignore the bill (considering the circumstances you described above)?
ubiquitin: Disregard the quotation marks around suffering. I didn’t intend the quotations in the sense you understood it. (i.e. that they aren’t suffering.)
The hospital staff can at times go further than just not treating a suffering patient and let him die. At times they will facilitate his death. Or not feed him. Or not treat him for common ailments readily remedied that will cause death if left unattended. All of this has been widely reported on over the past decade and longer.
ca: They billed you or your insurance? Did you have to pay?
Oxford (or virtually any insurance carrier) charges a different deductible amount to different customers. So you are paying a higher deductible than many other Oxford insurance customers. The amount of your deductible is based on what your employer (or whoever setup your insurance plan) negotiated with Oxford.
There is no less gashmius in Teaneck or the 5T than in Brooklyn.
Who was this imaginary loshon hora about, lc? Read the NY Times or any number of papers over the past ten years. A large segment of the medical establishment believes the cost of keeping the infirm alive often tends not to be worth the cost. And they frequently act upon this belief if someone isn’t paying attention to the patient in the hospital. This isn’t some kind of well kept secret. Some have been pretty open about it.
Overall housing and the cost of living costs far more in Teaneck or the Five Towns. Talking about gashmius.
ubiquitin: See some direct, stringent and specific criticisms about MO from Rav Ahron Kotler (in Mishnas Rabi Ahron) and Rav Shimon Schwab (in Selected Essays and Mitteilungen, the Bulletin of KAJ):
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/modern-orthodox-judaism
There’s no explanation for it in the medical/dental literature?
Don’t know his secret. He isn’t a health food aficionado, either. His diet is large on sweet foods and drinks.
He has a full set of healthy teeth k”h.
I know someone who brushes his teeth about four times a year, and uses mouthwash about ten times a year, and has been doing so at this frequency for over ten years and has very little trouble with his teeth. He goes to the dentist every six months or so, gets a cleaning and a clean bill of health from the dentist.
Anyone care to venture an explanation how he manages so well?
Hospitals in America, these days, often feel an old infirm patient is better off dead than “suffering” alive. And is liable to let the patient die rather than try to preserve his life.
Don’t worry at all. Just call and ask your shaila. It’s a simple phone call.
Artscroll Shas.
Gut Shabbos / Gut Yom Tov.
“Shabbat” is a Sefardic pronunciation. The Ashkenazic pronunciation is “Shabbos”. Traditionally Ashkenazim say “Gut Shabbos”. Someone pronouncing it as Shabbat who isn’t Sefardic is doing so for zionistic reasons and is changing their traditional minhag, something they should not do.,
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I couldn’t make out the audio what Rav Dovid answered about shechting the parah adumah before the beis hamikdash. Did anyone hear the response?
L’Cholov!!
Sam: Who – and why – do you think made up the ball in his hand idea?
Like Bubbe always says, you’re not going to melt in the rain unless you’re sugar.
Rashi had Ruach HaKodesh.
Gut Yom Tov!
You need a reason to eat cheese cake??
If you arent sure why you avoid it, you can eat.
Incorrect. Just because someone isn’t sure doesn’t give license to eat. His posek’s reasoning for not eating cholov stam, even if he isn’t aware of the reasoning, may well be because he rules it to be cholov akum.
His keilim are cholov stam.
Anyone who doesn’t want chulent should check their yichus.
Rav Moshe paskened l’halacha that it is assur to use a timer on Shabbos to turn on/off an air conditioner.
That kind of food can make a lot of people sick.
for the yeshiva guy its not so bad because the alternative would be to go to manhattan and pay battery park tunnel fee.
No, they’d be using the Brooklyn Bridge at no charge.