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Big boy – go look it up in Alice in Wonderland. I’m pretty sure it says he’s an egg.
LB – I think the issue is that they are concerned about potential side effects. There are people who think that it might cause autism. I think that most people say that there is no evidence to support that and that it’s all a ridiculous myth.
I don’t know anything about vaccines, but I personally know someone who got messed up from the flu shot and then found out that approximately one person in (15,000? I’m not sure if that was the number) will get messed up from it.
One in 15,000 might not sound that high, but it’s not insignificant, it happened to someone I know, and I’m not particularly concerned about dying from the flu, c”v. Very few people my age die from the flu, and it’s not clear that the flu shots help, so why would I go out of my way to put myself at risk of one problem in order to solve another problem that’s not even a problem? Maybe when I’m old, it will be worth it, but right now, I don’t think so.
“Just because a principal makes a unilateral rule and its broken , doesnt make it an averiah. it doesnt mean you should break the rule either. Only its not an averiah”
I’m not sure about that. I think it could fall under the category of “zilzul morim”. I wouldn’t ordinarily go over to a teenage girl and tell her that she is doing an aveirah when she breaks the school rule, but if she asks the question, I think it might be appropriate to tell her that she is.
Your giggling example is a bad example because it’s not deliberate. The issue in this case is that she wants to deliberate break the school rules in front of the principal in order to make a point to her. It seems to me that that could be considered “zilzul morim”. You have to respect your principal even if you don’t agree with her. I think that is really the bottom line here. Even if you don’t understand the rule, you still have to respect your principal and her right and duty to make rules as she sees fit.
In Alice and Wonderland it says that he’s an egg.
Meno: “People who consider looks to be important should be makpid on looks because otherwise you will have a harder time staying married.”
And girls who think that boys shouldn’t be so makpid on looks shouldn’t marry those boys.
ZD – I agree that the other thread is probably missing information. However, from what was given over (by more than one poster), it does sound pretty clear that he believes in Daas Torah.
“We have no proof that he said that about random people. It was likely a reason that he said 2 specific people should marry and with a reason”
I’m not sure what you mean by this? Are you saying that the Gedolim don’t tell everyone who to marry and only do so in specific cases? I don’t think anyone implied otherwise, and either way, it still means that he believes in Daas Torah, since he is saying that any time a Gadol does tell someone whom to marry, he has to listen.
Aside from the other thread, I have heard that he believes in Daas Torah. I once heard that someone asked him why he doesn’t wear techeilis and he responded, “Rav Elyashiv doesn’t wear techeilis, and I should wear techeilis?”
Just want to remind everyone that Jared Kushner is Jewish (and possibly Ivanka as well) so the halachos of L”H apply.
“We’re always hearing here – ask your LOR.”
DY: “I always hesitate to say that, because not every “LOR” is a competent posek.”
That is why I also hesitate to say that every time someone asks a halachic (or any type of) question in the CR and instead I do try to answer it if I am able to. I know that there are some who feel that the appropriate response in such cases is always: “ask your LOR” but my 2 hesitations are:
1. I don’t know who they will ask. & 2. I assume that most people who ask questions in the CR are doing so because they don’t in fact have someone to ask.
“LU: 1. Don’t play dumb”
Uh…thanks for the compliment. Since I wasn’t “playing”, I guess I must be dumb iyho. I would appreciate it though if you could explain to me what you are talking about, since I’m apparently too dumb to understand.
Has there been a change of moderators? And if so, how do you know that?
LB- Did you read my above posts where I already brought this information for you from the Shemiras Shabbos k’hilchasa?
Iacisrmma- that is really interesting! I have never heard that. The SSK mentioned several minhagim but I don’t remember seeing that.
Joseph, I understood LB to mean that she thinks they should.
How does halachipedia work? Can anyone contribute?
cuckoos
cookies
WTP – lol, I was thinking of that. There may be some that do, but certainly many that don’t.
LB -this is a chiddush to me as well. I think it’s probably a matter of semantics.
I never heard the term Noachide used until relatively recently. I think that the term Gentile used to be the only term used for non-Jews.
I guess now that the term Noachide exists, some people have redefined the word Gentile. However, I am not sure that the definitions you were given make sense.
I think that in order to be a Noachide, one has to keep all 7 Mitzvos bnei Noach and be doing it because G-d said to (there may be other qualifications, but I don’t know).
What if someone only believes in One G-d but doesn’t keep all the other 7 Mitzvos? What would he be then?
LB- that is one of the problems with the movement -that he is not following Daas Torah and simply deciding things on his own. That is one of the ways that you can determine if a Rav is reliable or not.
LB- no one said that. Whoever is granting him the semicha is doing it based on his education/qualification. But Joseph is saying that person can happen to be his own father just like it can be someone else.
taverns
vacuums
Rebshidduch – that sounds like an excellent idea.
Mammele: “I thought obeying mechanchim was a mitzvah, hence disobeying would be an aveira. (If nothing else, they are the parents’ shliach in chinuch. Does this not apply to girls?) Do you all believe it’s not a mitzvah to obey/aveira to disobey) teachers etc?”
Mammele +1. That occurred to me as well.
“I apologize, LF, seems you were right.”
Based on what are you assuming he’s right? Did I miss something?
“Or maybe it’s been deemed controversial and a Beis Din must be convened to rule on the matter.”
I used to think that until I saw that my response to a word game post took around 10 hours to moderate. See this post for an explation of long moderating time:
btw, your above post went thru really fast despite it’s being close to 1:00 am!
NCB: “Lilmod: You understood my point perfectly.”
Thank you.
“I believe there was some misunderstanding from the mystery mod’s side which helped that escalate to the point it did.”
maskim.
“I did specify at one point that I wasn’t saying whether or not their bias was a good or bad thing, just that I don’t agree with it being displayed in a mod-specific way.”
That was definitely my impression. I didn’t think that you were attacking the mods in any way, and I even thought that your words could be seen as a defense of them, since most people would consider it a maaleh to be unbiased.
Person1: “As for watching movies, I just wanted to add that It’s often about families rather than individual guys. So I would say “modern” was a better term than OTD. In any case I don’t really mind, I was just amused at how extreme that statement was.”
I hope you weren’t offended by that statement (about movies). I was a bit hesitant to write it, but figured it was clear that it wasn’t meant personally and was just in the context of the discussion.
My original statement about boys who learn english being considered OTD actually had to do with a statement made by another poster on another thread, and I actually disagreed with him there. Since your posts came shortly afterwards, it reminded me of that thread and I was sort of trying to be funny (humorous) by bringing it in here. But if you hadn’t seen the original thread, I guess it sounded funny (strange) rather than funny (humorous).
“Still I suppose writing here takes more effort to me than most other posters, and I often edit my posts. I imagine that if you read my posts closely you’d notice some awkwardness every now and then (or you might have noticed already)”
Actually, I think your posts might display much better english than most others in the CR. Maybe that’s because you actually edit yours.
Rebshidduch, I vehemently disagree with Mammale’s saying to be pushy. It will totally annoy the shadchan and turn her off.
Before the invention of caller id, you could call people as often as you like. But nowadays, if you keep calling someone, it annoys them since they can see on the caller id that the same person keeps calling.
I would not call more than once a day. If you leave a message, wait two days before calling again.
I’m not sure that you should leave a message the first time you call. I would wait until the second time, although it’s not a big deal either way.
I agree with Mammele that if you are having trouble getting through, it makes sense to vary the time of day. However, I would probably start by calling between 9:00 and 10:00 pm, and then try calling in the morning (before approximately 1:00).
Randomex – I think I was thinking of Devora Doresh. However, I’m not familiar enough with any of these books to be able to compare Devora Doresh to Gemarakup. I had no idea that in one the readers are asked to solve the mystery, and not in the other.
I guess that Gemarakup is more similar to Encyclopedia Brown, which I am familiar with, since unlike the others, it was around in my childhood.
sometimes schools have rules but they don’t care if specific individuals break the rules as long as they do it quietly. This is because the rule can still have the effect they want it to have even if a few specific individuals break it quietly.
I don’t know if this is the case in your example, ZD, but I can see it possibly being so, at least to some extent.
Sometimes, just the fact that the students are forced to do so quietely gives the rule the intended effect.
For example, in my high school, we weren’t allowed to wear knee-his. Most girls did wear knee-his but made sure they sat tzniusly so no one would know.
One time the teacher went around asking everyone if they were wearing knee-his or stockings, and she kicked out everyone who was wearing knee-his. There were approximately 4 girls left in the room. That was the only time that anyone said anything and the teacher even explained afterwards that the only reason she said anything was because she saw a girl not sitting tzniusly.
Yichusdik: “As to ITFT’s last words, I value each and every poster here, including ITFT. If I took it personally it would tarnish if not diminish that value. I’m not interested in that, and so I choose not to respond harshly. Being thin skinned has a lot to do with not having confidence in one’s convictions, and lashing out because of a perceived slight would reflect a lack of confidence. I don’t lack it, and thus don’t feel a need to take it personally or lash out.”
+1,000
I saw a cute cartoon several years ago entitled: “blonde goes back to work after 20 years”. The girl starts typing on her computer, and when she gets to the end of the line, she puts her hands on the left side of the computer screen and pushes it.
Remember those days?
I knew a girl who had gone to high school in Lakewood. She told me that when she was in school, clunky shoes were in style, and the school had a rule against it.
So she davka wore clunky shoes to school (It sounds like she may have been a similar type to you, JA, :). She was waiting for her teacher to yell at her. Instead, the teacher said something like, “Chanie, those shoes are not matim for you.”
She thought that was very smart of the teacher. If the teacher had yelled at her, she would have been like, “ha, ha, got ya”. Since the teacher responded the way she did, it made her think about it, and think about whether or not the teacher was right that it’s not her type.
“Is an email message enough for the shadchan? Would they set you up or just ignore the email because they have so many others?’
There is a good chance that they will ignore it. That is why you should follow up with a phone call in a day or two if they don’t respond to your email.
“If its a more charedi school, probably wont make a differnce as most will obey”
I think she has said that she lives in Lakewood. A modern school wouldn’t make such a rule and it wouldn’t be appropriate.
“You also dont want people obeying rules in front of the principal and then disobeying them behind their back.”
The Principal specifically said that it’s a school rule and not about tznius so they don’t have to follow it when they are not in school.
That was actually very intelligent, imho, since it avoids the problem you mentioned.
And it also means that the girls don’t need to feel restricted. Of course, they will complain anyhow, but it’s really not a big deal, since they can change as soon as they get home, just like they can change out of their uniforms.
“What footnote? If you mean the ???? ???”
sorry that is what I meant.
“he says no such thing.”
He very clearly says such a thing:
????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ???? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ???? ????? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?????
“If you think it doesn’t apply today, you are misinformed.”
not in any of my circles, Boruch Hashem.
I just reread it – he brings the possibility that it is only talking about a girl living on her own. I could hear that in those days that was so uncommon that it would have been suspicious.
But today it is common enough that I don’t think it’s an issue.
btw, from the footnote there, it is not a chiyuv even b’makom chashad.
I didn’t realize that’s what chashad meant. I still don’t get it. People aren’t choshed frum girls for things like that, there is rarely a reason to be, and it doesn’t make sense to me at all that anyone would be.
Again it could be that it is referring to a girl who doesn’t want to get married, but even in that case, it doesn’t make sense to me.
Joseph: “Sending a telex, telegram, pagers, walkmans, CRT monitors, mainframes, dial up modems, floppy discs (3.5″ or 5.25″), Polaroid instant cameras, record players, tape recorders, ham radio, transistor radio.”
They had telegrams in your days? I’ve only read about those in books. And what’s a telex?
YYTZ – thanks! +1 million.
Do you have the exact source in the Lekutei Moharan?
RY- could be, don’t know. Thanks.
really? so what does it mean then?
nishtdayngesheft:”It seems reasonable for a school to have a dress code. Perhaps this is a newish item (I don’t know, my daughters only wore after an injury) so the dress code was updated.
There is no reason to get carried away and say these are unreasonable Chumros.
Just like professional offices have dress codes , a school can also and it is not just tznius matters.”
+1.
JA: “Actually she did tell us that it’s not a problem of tznius but she just made the rule just BECAUSE.”
It had actually occurred to me after I wrote my last post that she might not have given a reason. Sometimes it’s not kidai for mechanchim to give reasons for these rules because the students will just argue with them. If you don’t give a reason, they are more likely to try to figure it out themselves or to realize that the school has a right to make a dresscode and they will understand better when they are older why schools do that.
One of my favorite poems is:
Poems are made by fools like me,
but only G-d can make a tree.
“but rarely if ever do they rebuke those who make too many chumras.”
Actually, they do that all the time. Just look at the username of the poster before you.
“If you prohibit the permitted people will find out it was just some chumra and that you lied and begin to question other things you have said, Maybe they were “Chumras” too”
That is very true if you lie about the reason why you are forbidding something. For example, if you claimed that it was meforsha halacha in the Shulchan Aruch that you can’t wear these kinds of shoes.
That’s not what’s happening here. Schools are allowed to make dress codes. The school presumably has a uniform too even though there is nothing in the SA about it.
Presumably, the principal had a good reason for the rule and would be happy to explain if Johnny asks her. Maybe she even did explain and Johnny didn’t hear or understand the explanation.
In any case, we are not allowed to assume or to say that she had no reason for this rule.
Avi:”If a man knows that he cannot have children”
That possibility had not occurred to me. I imagine it’s pretty rare for someone to know that he definitely 100% can not have children. Unless he’s over 70 and not unrealistic enough to assume that someone under 60 will want to marry him.
Avi: “and this yetzer hara is not bothering him”
?
“I don’t know why you think chashad doesn’t apply”
What’s chashad mean? That people will think she’s gay? I really don’t think that’s an issue nowadays. At least not by girls.
I don’t know why it used to be – it sounds strange to me. But maybe it was different then because people’s fathers married them off, and because in those days, most girls preferred marrying anyone rather than being single because girls had no lives back then, it was impossible for them to manage on their own, and/or people had different expectations of marriages.
Nowadays, people assume that if a girl is single, it’s because of the shidduch crisis, or because there aren’t enough normal guys around, etc. There are so many normal single girls today that most people aren’t that judgmental about it. They are only judgmental in the sense that they assume they are overly picky.
But I just realized that maybe it’s talking about a case where someone davka doesn’t want to get married and doesn’t do any hishtadlus at all? I could hear where that might be different. But even then, the only chashad anyone would have is that she has issues or had a bad experience.
flatter
artists
“(like the Yishuv)”
Until recently, the Yishuv was the only one besides Maarava. I think there may be some others now.
“watched movies.”
I once went out with a boy who was completely Israeli and whose parents were not from an English-speaking country. He spoke such fluent english that people thought he was American. He had learned it from watching tv as a kid (he was unusually smart, ba”h).
However, he was bt, and not Chareidi. Watching movies is generally not considered acceptable in the Israeli Chareidi world, certainly a lot less than taking english lessons. And the term “otd” was not meant literally in this case – it just meant “doing something unacceptable”, so watching movies would probably fall in that category in this context.
btw, I would imagine that even most boys who did one of the above would not be able to write english so well if they were born in Israel. I don’t think my sister can do that even though she wasn’t even born here, isn’t Chareidi, had an academic education, and grew up in a house that looks like a University library.
He doesn’t have to be that old. He could just be from Ethiopia.
We spoiled Westerners have no hasaga of how the rest of the world lives….
Shabbos
armrest
I always thought loaning was incorrect, but I could be wrong.
MDG-“BUT POVERTY DISFIGURES THEM”
Health: “So the OP should be – Being Makpid on Money!
I only want to marry a girl that’s got a lot of dough!”
That doesn’t mean that all poor girls are ugly. It just means that SOME of them may appear to be ugly but they really aren’t. But there can be some poor girls who don’t even appear to be ugly.
“Is it okay for a 20 year old girl to call a shadchan whos a rabbi about setting her up?”
yes.
So it’s a good thing I moved out of Lakewood. Now I can be Moshiach 🙂
Actually, I doubt the Rav meant that literally. It was just his way of saying that it won’t be someone obvious. Your Rabbi actually couldn’t possibly know what city Moshiach lives in.