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I know. j.j.
Daas Yachid, you mean it CAN happen to me even though I think I’m childless? What if I’m also husbandless? and carless? Can it still happen to me?
and as long as he gives it back to me after I hand it to him 🙂
Joseph – okay, I’ll look into it when I get married, IYH. As long as the guy is nice and not controlling, I don’t think it would bother me.
Iacisrmma, please reread the above posts from Daas Yachid:
“I just don’t think it’s right to discuss the individuals in the story, and to assume the worst.”
“There is an organization called “KidsAndCars”. They have a .org website with information and articles about this, including a Pulitzer Prize winning 2009 Washington Post article, which very much informed my opinion on this when I read it several years ago.
I will quote one line from the site, which I think is relevant to this discussion, and even more so to some of the disturbingly ignorant comments on the YWN news article.
“…blaming them only deepens the heart-rending impact of these incidents for families who are already overwhelmed by guilt and grief.”
There are halachos about reading news, believing news, and repeating news. Please remember that you are talking about real people. You would not talk this way if they were here in front of you. They may very well be reading this, or others who know them may be reading it. You do not know the details (and have no reason to believe the details were reported accurately), and you have no right to judge.
Joseph, I would think it should depend on the couple, and what works best for them. Besides, some men might prefer that their wives do the banking to avoid bitul Torah and shmiras ainayim issues.
ps: And of course, the wife should be more focused on her husband’s needs and the husband on his wife’s needs.
Person1: I agree with you, but I do have one qualification. It is very important for girls/women to realize that al pi halacha, they can’t spend money without okaying it without their husbands first, and even if their husbands are the nicest people in the world and even if (maybe especially if) the wife is the one earning the money, they might not appreciate it if their wives spend money without asking/discussing it with them first.
I knew two newly-married ladies who did not realize that, and their husbands were not so happy about it. In one case, I felt a bit guilty, because I had been out shopping with her, and when she said something about buying an article of clothing for herself as a surprise for him, I had a feeling it was a bad idea but I didn’t say anything. Her husband is extremely nice so it didn’t exactly ruin their marriage, but I think she wished she had realized that ahead of time.
I’m not saying that men should be controlling or domineering, but I think there is something in between a wife feeling controlled and a wife spending money indiscriminately. Each couple has to figure out what works best for them, taking their spouse’s needs and personality into account.
DY: “I’m not sure why you think that wouldn’t be effective. If something will be needed when you leave the vehicle, you won’t forget it.”
I’m not an expert on the topic, but my guess is that it depends on the person. There are people who are very spacey and are capable of forgetting anything! ADHD personality -types seem to be very common nowadays (not that I can compare to any other generation – I just know that today they seem to be quite common).
Two role models come to mind:
1. A particular friend of mine whom I have known for many years. I was always jealous of her because she has certain personality traits that make her very well-liked by many people as well as an extremely popular, well-liked, successful educator (all of these are things that I have always wanted to be). Even though jealousy is generally not considered to be a positive trait, and my intentions definitely had a very large measure on not-l’shmaness, it seems that there must have been an element of “kinas sofrim” since I was zoche, b’chasdei Hashem, to be able to develop those traits in myself to a large extent.
2. Sara Schnirer because:
a) she did not allow her marital status to define her.
b) she did not let her marital status, gender or societal norms restrict her from fulfilling her potential.
c) Her motto in life was the same as my name and motto (“lilmod ulelameid”)
d) She was brave enough to act against the tide but at the same time, she made sure that everything she did was in accordance with Daas Torah and was done l’shma. And she wasn’t radical for the sake of being radical – when being radical was the right thing to do, she was radical, and when being traditional was the right approach, she was traditional.
How do you email moderators? How do they email you?
Sparkly – sorry, I wasn’t trying to fish for information; I just get confused sometimes by your posts trying to figure out who is who and what is what. I guess since there are so many inter-connected conversations happening on different threads, it’s hard to keep track.
In any case, from the little you have said about him, he sounds awesome, and I hope that everything works out for the best.
Slowgoing: “did not see anyone mentioning that a wife has the right to say “Ee Efshy B’Takonas Chachomim”, keep her own earnings and release the husband from supporting her. Admittedly, it’s not a good recipe for Shalom Bayis”
True. Also, not a good recipe for shalom bayis for her husband to act overly-domineering and controlling, using the fact that according to halacha the money belongs to him if she does not release him from supporting her. Also, not a good recipe for shalom bayis for a wife to spend money w/o discussing it with her husband…
Bottom Line: if you want shalom bayis, talk about the situation. Wives show respect for your husband, and husbands show respect for your wives, and shalom al yisrael! (I know – people who aren’t married make the best marriage counselors, and people who don’t have kids are the best at giving child-rearing advice :)!)
The Goq- DY is right. It is a common occurrence – one that can and does happen to anyone, and I think that I have heard that it has become much more common recently. And it is quite dangerous. And I feel terrible for anyone whom it happens to – can you imagine having to live with that for the rest of your life??!! So it definitely is something that we should take measures to try to avoid. But at the same time we have to be careful to do it in a way that doesn’t hurt anyone who is already suffering more than enough.
Sparkly – maybe she is the one working and earning the money in the first place (I know halachically it still belongs to her husband, and she can’t overspend w/o his permission. I’m just pointing out that she may not be able to work harder than she does already).
Also, we don’t know that the things she is spending on are extras.
Bottom line, what they need to do is talk!
oh, okay then. I thought it was the other one. He sounds great then from what you said about him. But I thought he didn’t want to go out with you (we’re talking about your brother’s friend whom you weren’t sure if you should say hello to, right?) If he does want to go out with you, amazing! Go for it!
Sparkly – it’s sad not to have any role models. I think we grow only from having role models. It doesn’t have to be someone you know personally – it can be someone from Tanach or Jewish History, or someone who is famous today, but I think that in order to grow there has to be someone who is an example to you on some level and whom you want to be like in some ways.
I don’t know why you think I enjoy giving mussar. It’s actually one of my least favorite Mitzvos! The only two Mitzvos that I can think of that I enjoy less are Kibbud Av V’Eim and davening b’zman.
Health, it’s not a question of how many years anyone has been there. There are thousands of people in Lakewood, and neither you nor I know all of them or even most of them, hence, your statement is ridiculous in addition to being completely assur. I know tons of people in Lakewood and nearly all, if not all, are the way I described. You obviously choose to know different people. Your loss. But don’t judge and label and malign the city based on your perceptions and choices.
I’m so confused – is this the same guy as the one who doesn’t want his wife to cover her hair?
Sparkly: 🙁 that’s so sad. You can’t think of anyone AT ALL?
Joseph, I really hope you are joking.
Sparkly – I thought you liked your brother’s friend because he is really Frum.
Joseph: “My father and zeidas.”
Cool!
zd: It’s definitely better than looking in a Smartphone while walking.
In any case, it’s not dangerous to walk down the sidewalk without glasses on even if you are very nearsighted. You might just want to make sure to put them back on before you cross the street, but I don’t know if it’s necessary. I am extremely nearsighted, but I can see a CAR. There have been periods of time in my life when my glasses broke and I had to manage w/o glasses temporarily. It was extremely difficult and inconvenient but not dangerous.
?????
Because a guy who cares about Torah sounds more like your type than a guy who would prefer that his wife not keep Halacha (from what I know about you.)
Sparkly – it’s too hard to be perfect. It’s not TOO hard to take small steps. A small step can mean once a week for one hour being careful not to do a specific thing. Or finding a better alternative for one thing that you do that is problematic.