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“In caring for the children, I taught them blessings and Hebrew songs. When they went to bed, I recited the Shema with them and t old them Jewish stories. I knew many miracle stories of tzaddikim, and I invented others. The children were captivated by these tales that allowed them to escape to a different world. They used to beg me, “One more story, one more story!”
Occasionally Dr. Koczak would sit in and listen. He told me that me was impressed by the impact I had on the children……
On such occasions, I would talk with Dr. Korczak at length, sometimes late into the night. Dr. Korczak asked me to tell him about how I had come to learn in the Bais Yaakov Seminaray. He was curious and open to everything that I told him.”(ibid, p. 91)
“He was a totally assimilated Jew, whose parents were unaware of their rich heritage. I learned much from this great humanitarian, and he in turn learned to appreciate Judaism from me.”
(ibid, p.89).
YesOrNO – thanks so much!
Actually, it would be more fun if we had a contest to see who can guess which person goes with which CR name. Each person gets to ask each other person 3 questions before guessing.
Whoever gets the most correct answer is the winner. Winner gets to become a moderator.
GH – If in fact there is a source in the Gemara as others have stated, then your post is highly problematic and inappropriate.
Even if there isn’t, I think that it is still unnecessarily negative. If you would prefer to call it “cancer” then call it cancer, but don’t attack those who use a different term than you do. That strikes me as close-minded especially if you haven’t asked them why they use this term. Maybe there is a good reason for it.And there is no reason to assume that calling it “The machla” instead of cancer has any connection to how open people are about it. You can call it “The Machla” and be open about it and you can call it cancer and be closed about it.
“Does anyone suspect that various CR bloggers are consistantly faking their beliefs/identity”
I’ve wondered about that whenever someone posts something that makes the hashkafa or opinion he is supposedly advocating look bad. Does he really hold of the hashkafa or is he actually against it and deliberately trying to make it look bad? (I think this happens with both/all sides).
I’ve always thought so especially if they are a tinok shenishba. Even if someone is not a tinok shenishba, I would still think that he could be a tzaddik especially if he is someone who saved someone’s life, whether physically or emotionally.
I’ve also always been under the impression that someone who dies “al kiddush Hashem” (religious or not) is considered to be on an extremely high level. (I think there is something specific said about such a person – I forget what, but I know they are considered to be on a really high level).
And anyone who is killed because he is Jewish is considered to have died “al kiddush Hashem”.
btw, there is a really fascinating book called “Gutta: Memories of a Vanished World” by Gutta Sternbuch & David Kranzler about her experiences as a Bais Yaakov student and teacher before and during the War.
At one point, she worked in Korzak’s orphanage. He used to encourage her to teach the kids about Yiddishkeit and Emunah. He told her that it’s too late for him, but he thinks it’s good for the kids to learn about Emunah and Yiddishkeit.
I am not Hashem and I don’t know His Judgments, but based on what I know of Korzak, I would imagine that I would have what to be jealous of in terms of his Cheilik in Olam Haba. (Although at the same time, he has what to be jealous of my cheilik in Olam Hazeh).
We don’t know Hashem’s Judgments, and we don’t know each person’s story – his Mitzvos and his aveiros and his life-story and the specific challenges he had to overcome. Hashem judges each individual based on his potential and how well he fulfilled it.
There are so many factors that go into judging a person and most of these factors are unknown to others. That is why we can never (or almost never if not never) judge another person.
Also, how do you define Non-Religious vs. Religious? There are many Mitzvos and Aveiros in the Torah. Most Jews perform some Mitzvos and commit some Aveiros regardless of whether or not they define themselves as Religious.
How would you compare someone who keeps Shabbos but speaks Loshon Hora vs. someone who doesn’t keep Shabbos but never speaks L”H? Why should the first person be considered Frum and the second one not-Frum? Or what if someone has been Frum his whole life but never bothered to learn Hilchos Shabbos properly so he is in fact mechalel Shabbos every single Shabbos?
Or what if someone keeps all the technical halachos but has no relationship with Hashem whatsoever vs. someone who has a hard time with technical halacha but is very good at Chovos HaLevavos and has tremendous Emunah and Bitachon?
Or someone who excels at Bein Adam L’Makom but has a hard time with Bein Adam l”chaveiro vs. someone who excels at Bein Adam l’chaveiro but has a hard time with bein Adam l’Makom?
As Chazal say even the simplest Jew is as full of Mitzvos as a pomegranate. May be zoche to always see the good in every Jew!
RE: Golfer’s second to last post (#88): Maybe all the men should send their wives and/or kids and/or moms and/or sisters instead of their brothers. That way I would finally get to meet their wives, etc. I’m super-curious to find out what their wives are like. And then I can finally meet you for coffee.
Golfer – you’re safe! B”H, I only saw both of your responses now at the same time. Actually, I even kind of saw your second one first, since I went to the bottom of the page first and as I was shifting up to where I left off, I saw your second post first.
I actually had not yet seen your post before I posted my apology since it wasn’t up yet (even though you might not be able to tell from the order that the posts were modded, although you can tell from the numbers).
As for where you can meet me for coffee, sorry but I don’t know how I would be able to let you know that 🙁
And by the way, I didn’t really think you were insulted – I was just playing it safe. I know that you are not the type to bear grudges or think badly of others.
Golfer – I hope you weren’t insulted by my strong response! I just saw SYAG’s (after I posted) and I see that she said the same thing but less strongly.
Let me know if you’re insulted, so I can ask you mechil (and I am serious).
And you’re definitely welcome for coffee!
Golfer, while you are right that each person should work on himself to be moichel others, IMHO, you can’t tell people that they shouldn’t be insulted by people who insult them. And the fact that it’s a “computer person” doesn’t matter. They are still real people. That concept has come up before (by others) and I think it’s ridiculous.
It may happen occasionally that someone is insulted by something ridiculous in which case, PERHAPS, one can tell them that (but be very careful before deciding that it’s ridiculous or that it’s your place to say so), but that has nothing to do with whether or not they are computer people.
In fact, I think that it can be easier to be insulted by people in the CR than in real life. For one thing, in real life, you can choose who you talk to, whereas in the CR, you can only choose whether or not to be in the CR.
Also, in real life, it is easier to let people know if you are insulted: They can see your facial expressions, and it is easier to have a conversation with them. In real life when people insult me, I let them know so that they can have the opportunity to ask me mechila and not get gehinnom. In the CR, it is not possible to do that, and it really concerns me.
I think that it is a big Mitzvah to let someone know (politely) if they insulted you, and really cruel not to.
Again, on the person’s part – of course he should work on not being insulted and/or being moichel, but I don’t think that’s something that you can tell others to do (and it isn’t always a healthy approach -many people need to work on validating their feelings)
When are you going back? Didn’t the zman start already?
I used to think that family was totally irrelevant and that people who looked at family were closed-minded, but over the years, I have come to realize that that was close-minded of me, and that family may matter to some extent.
The question is to what extent and in what ways. But even that is individual (and may depend on the family to some extent). I can see how it’s possible that for people who are coming from a different kind of background than I am, certain things might matter that are hard for me to understand.
I am not disagreeing withe the above comments at all – I actually very much agree – but I also believe that it’s important to try to see both sides and not be too judgmental of others who are coming from a different kind of background/mentality and may look at things differently.
And I think it is pretty obvious that when it comes to many things, people are highly influenced by their families. So while the individual is more important than the family, it may make sense to try to find someone who is match in both ways if possible.
Personally, I have always been hesitant to date guys who are coming from cultural backgrounds that entail a different perspective than the one I grew up with regarding husband/wife roles because I think it would create big problems in my marriage.
I don’t make assumptions based on background and I do check out the individual, but so far, I have almost always (if not always) found that it does make a difference in terms of a person’s inherent mentality on these issues (which is the very reason why I have the mentality that I do and why I don’t think it’s something that would change).
No matter who you marry, there are tons of adjustments because each specific family within any “type” is different anyhow, but when you throw in a different “type of background”, it is likely to be even more difficult.
Of course, the extent to which this is likely to be a problem very much depends on the specific person, and everyone has to know himself.
Well since my kabbalah was to stop posting in the CR, how do you think I did? (j/k).
Warrior – great examples!
A person can do teshuva for anything.And by the way, there are bigger aveiros than stealing money. Causing someone to do an aveira is worse I think, since you’re affecting the person spiritually and you don’t even gain from it (usually). And I would think that hurting people emotionally could also be considered worse than stealing money.
But one can do teshuva for those things as well. If you kill someone, c”v, you can still do teshuva even though the person can’t be brought back to life. Doing teshuva doesn’t necessarily mean undoing the deed. When it’s possible to do so, you must do so, but when it’s not possible, then that is not a requirement of your teshuva. Your requirement is to do the most that you possibly can to undo the damage – no more and no less.
If you stole money from people and it’s not possible to return it, then you should at least try to ask mechila if possible. If it’s not possible, then you should ask a sheilah as to how to do teshuva.
I have heard some interesting stories regarding people who did really big aveiros bein adam l’chaveiro that couldn’t be undone and they asked sheilahs about how to do teshuva and were given interesting answers. It usually had to do with giving back to the tzibor in some way.
One story had to do with a baalas teshuva who had been oiver on gilui arayos and was told to build a mikva.
which old thread?
In the CR, it can be. Many of the controversial debates are over facts.
I also agree with Goq.
In addition, you also have to keep in mind that to some extent these things have to do with personality and what the individuals are used to.
So even phrasing it Goq’s way may not be enough for some people. There are some people who are very chilled-out by nature and may themselves have a very open home (and maybe a lot of their friends are like that), so the concept that some people have a different mentality may be very foreign to them and it may have to be expressed much more clearly. And even then, you may have to be accept the fact that they may not “get it”.
By the way, my earlier comment, “Let’s not and say we did” was referring to the Title of the thread “Let’s hock about…”. I had not actually read any of the posts (due to my philosophy of “let’s not and say we did” when it comes to such topics). But I just realized that if anyone actually did read other posts, it’s possible that my comment could have been taken as referring to something else (although I don’t know what that would be).
So I’m just clarifying that it was meant to refer to the title (which I think was all that I had read).
Thanks for the compliment, Golfer!
I agree with what you said about the other posters.
I also think that I come across the way I really am.
“For your part you’d probably find exactly what you expected in an ordinary sort of way.”
Not sure what you mean by that.“Question – According to the Piskei Teshuvos [that I may continue eating without a new bracha if I had such intention while making the bracha achrona], why when I bentch al hakois do I make a borei pri hagafen on the wine [if I already drank during the seudah]? Surely I plan on drinking it, and the birchas hamazon will not stop that?”
Maybe it’s because you specifically had in mind that the original bracha should not cover the cos shel bracha. You can ask the same question by the arba kosos by the Seder. Perhaps it’s the same answer there.
Golfer – Sometimes someone can end up in a situation in which he has a safeik regarding whether or not he is supposed to make a bracha. When someone is unsure whether or not he is supposed to make a bracha, one halachic solution is to ask someone else (who has a reason to be making that particular bracha anyhow) to be motzi you.
Let’s say for example that I ate cake and I don’t remember if I said an al hamichya or not. The rule is: “Safeik brachos l’hakel” – when there is a safeik with brachos, it is better to miss out on the bracha and not make a new bracha (since it might be a bracha l’vatala.)
But it is even better to find a way around the safeik – one way to do that is by having someone else be motzi you. That way, if I really did forget to say al hamichya, I am now covered but at the same time I don’t have to worry about a bracha l’vatala.
“And if you’re in middle of eating why wouldn’t you politely decline and say, “I’m not up to bracha achrona yet, I’m still eating”?”
You’re right – the issue here was that at the time the guy asked him, he didn’t think it would be a problem to say the al hamichya since he was finished the pastry. It was only the rice that he was not finished and since al hamichya is not the bracha achrona for rice, he assumed that it was okay to say an al hamichya on the pastry and continue eating the rice.
It was only afterwards that he realized that there might be a problem.
In any case, the reason for not marrying a girl whose father is not a Talmid Chacham or whose brothers don’t measure up (in Middos), is because of the assumed effect on the girl.
If it in fact has that effect on her, then presumably she won’t be interested in the type of boy who doesn’t want a girl with that effect. And if she is an exception and it doesn’t have that effect on her, then presumably it would be okay for the type of boy who (normally) cares about these things to marry her.
Bottom line – people who are on a certain level generally prefer to marry people who are similar to them.
Although, there are exceptions – I don’t have good middos, but I want to marry someone with good middos. But my brother has good middos, so I guess it’s okay.
Yekke – I see that you (apparently) did respond, but your responses are still awaiting moderation (unless of course, you were responding to someone/something else).
I don’t know when you are going back but I assume it’s soon so I wanted to thank you for taking the time to read and respond to my posts (if in fact you did).
If I have a response to your response, it will probably have to wait for next bein hazmanim for you to read it.
Shteig Well! Hatzlacha in your learning! And thanks for your intelligent and politely-written posts which are always appreciated during bein hazmanim.
Geordie: “I have heard in the name of Gedolim, (I forget who but perhaps someone can let us know) that any girl who studies in a seminary nowadays, has the status of of a bas Talmid Chochom of old. This is the great achievement of Sarah Schneirer”
I have heard this also, but I also don’t remember who said it. I didn’t think it specified “seminary” though – I think it was “Bais Yaakov”. My understanding was that it referred to high school. But I could be wrong.
On the one hand, it is due to the achievement of Sara Schnirer, but I had also thought that it had to do with the fact that nowadays the home is not the biggest influence on a girl.
This can either be a positive thing or a negative thing, depending on what her home is like and what her school is like. But it does seem to put more control in the girl’s own hands. Even if a bas – non-Talmid-Chacham was doomed in the olden days, it seems that this is less likely to be the case today.
And yes, I’m moichel you.
My eyes still hurt.
If the reason why you are saying that it’s okay to eat the rice in Case 2 (and possibly in Case 3) is that he had in mind when he made the Al Hamichya that he wants to eat rice, wouldn’t that be the same as someone who made an al hamichya but had in mind that he wants to continue eating cake?
In the case of someone who made an al hamichya and had in mind that he wants to continue eating cake, I’m think the halacha is that you are not allowed to continue eating cake. I think that I read in a halacha sefer that it’s a machlokes and therefore you are not allowed to continue eating the cake since we are choshesh for both opinions. That also seemed to be what the biur halacha you quoted (Siman 190) was saying as well.
Or do you see a difference between the 2 cases?
I’m changing my list: Reb Shidduch, Lightbrite, Reb Yidd, Winnie the Pooh, Mammala, Rebbetzin DY and kinderlach, Rebbetzin Joseph and kinderlach, Rebbetzin Meno, Rebbetzin Geordie, Yekke’s mom and sisters, and Randomex’s mom and sisters, and Rebbetzin Froggie and kinderlach, and Gofish and Golfer and all other female posters and all male posters’ wives and kids or mothers and sisters.
If you’re not on my list, it’s an accident and please be moichel (or let me know if you’re not, but only if you’re for real).
Mazel Tov Takahmamash!
BUMP (since it doesn’t show up that I responded and I want to make sure that Yekke sees my last 3 posts before he goes back to Yeshiva.
Also, I wanted to add something since I realized after I wrote my third to last post that maybe it wasn’t so clear.
My main point was that I don’t understand why you didn’t understand my svara.
There are three situations: 1. He ate mezonos and rice and said al hamichya and started eating rice, and now wants to continue eating rice.
2. He ate only Mezonos and said al hamichya and didn’t start eating rice, and now wants to start eating rice w/o a bracha.
3. He only ate Mezonos and said al hamichya and didn’t start eating rice and wants to start eating rice w/o a bracha five hours later.The question was: If you are allowed to eat the rice in the first case, would you also be allowed to eat the rice in the second case?
My feeling was that you can’t. My “support” was based on the fact that presumably you are not allowed to in case three, and since case three is the same as case 2, then you must not be allowed to in case 2.
There are two possible answers to this svara: A. You are in fact allowed to eat the rice in Case 3.
or B. There is a difference between case 2 and case 3 which allows you to eat the rice in Case 2 and not in Case 3.I am not sure why you don’t understand my svara. It sounds like you may have a reason why the two cases are different, but since I didn’t know about the difference, that doesn’t mean it’s not a good svara.
Are you saying that there is a difference between the two cases? If so, what is it?
Is it that in the Second Case, you are assuming that when he said the Al Hamichya, he specifically had in mind to eat rice, and in the Third Case you are assuming he didn’t? If so, I didn’t actually say in the third case that he didn’t have this in mind. What if he did have it in mind? Would you then say that he is allowed to eat the rice 5 hours later?I forgot to add – it’s the exact same case – he ate regular mezonos and rice, and made an al hamichya on the regular mezonos while planning to continue eating the rice.
Yekke : “4. You keep mentioning “unless you do something considered a hefsek”. Simply deciding to stop eating constitutes a hefsek. When you finish eating and bentch, and you don’t have in mind to continue eating, I think that would be a hefsek.”
Yekke, the halacha is that the bracha is chal forever (or until the end of the day) unless you do something to create a hefseik.
Simply deciding to discontinue eating is not necessarily a hefseik. According to Rav Elyashiv as quoted in “V’zos Habracha” and requoted in the Dirshu Mishna Berurah (Siman 179, #10 (depending on the edition)quoting “Vzos Habracha” Chapter 20, “Heseich hadaas m’achila u’shtiya א ) most of the time it would not be considered a hefseik nowadays.
Regarding a bracha achrona, the bracha achrona itself can create a hefseik regardless of whether or not you intended to continue eating ( I believe it’s a machlokes and we posken to be choshesh for both views).
The issue here was that “al hamichya” is not the bracha achrona for rice, so perhaps it doesn’t create a hefseik for rice, and if someone made an al hamichya on the regular mezonos, perhaps they should be able to eat rice now even if they hadn’t started eating rice beforehand.
I was saying that that doesn’t make sense since then they would be able to eat rice 5 hours later even if they hadn’t specifically had rice in mind (as long as they had in mind that the rice should be chal on anything). You are saying that they wouldn’t be allowed to eat rice 5 hours but that they would be in your case (even if he hadn’t started eating rice). What is the difference between the two cases?
Maybe there is a difference (and therefore a reason why the svara is not a good svara) but I don’t think you’ve given one yet.
Is your point that in one case he specifically had in mind to continue eating and in one case he didn’t? That could be, but it seems shvach to me,( esp. since in general if one makes a bracha achrona with intention to continue eating, the bracha achrona might still create a hefseik) If you started eating the rice, you can have in mind that the al hamichya should not go on the rice , but if you didn’t start eating the rice yet, then you can’t have in mind that the al hamichya doesn’t go on the rice since you didn’t eat any rice yet.
In any case, I think that I originally stated that this wasn’t necessarily a “proof” but just a “support”.
“It doesn’t sound like in his case he was mechaven that the al hamichya shouldn’t go on the rice. I think there is a big mokom to differentiate.”
Avadai he was – He writes that he was planning to continue eating the rice, so the al hamichya was clearly not meant to go on the rice. Also, he writes that the al hamichya was said on the Mezonos (meaning the regular Mezonos).
I have a lot more to say on the topic, but I have to go.
Yekke – thanks so much for your vort – I was thinking about it today while davening mincha shemona esrei and during Yom Kippur Kattan as well – “Yodeiah ani b’atzmi sheain bi lo sorah i’lo chachma lo daas v’lo svuna..” And it gave me more kavana.
Everyone else – no time to comment now (but will try to do so when I have time), but I think Yekke’s going back to Yeshiva soon, so I wanted to mention that.
Oiveyizmir (my apologies if I spelled your name wrong): In all the debates going on here, I feel like you’ve been forgotten.
First of all, how is the situation? Has it changed at all? Has it gotten better? Worse? Have you found out anything more? You mentioned that you were considering speaking to your neighbor or having your wife speak to his wife? Did either of you do that in the end?
Second of all, I really want to commend you for the way that you have been handling the situation. It must be a terrifying situation to be in. I know that personally, it gets me very nervous when I hear people fighting. And I get really upset when I hear family members being abusive to each other (even if it’s “only verbal” as you put it).
It must have been very difficult for you to refrain from calling the police when your Rav told you that he will handle the situation and that it would be (halachically) problematic for you to call the police. And when the fighting and screaming continued, it must have been really hard for you to restrain yourself.
You are right for being cautious about calling the police, but you are also right for being concerned about the situation and realizing that you should try to do whatever you can to help and not just say, “well, I called my Rav, and now I can wash my hands from the situation.”
If you still hear fighting, I would recommend that you call your Rav and find out if he is in fact doing anything. Tell him about your concerns, and tell him that the fighting is still going on, and ask him what he is doing about it. You mentioned that he is a well-respected Rav in the community, so the first step is to find out if he is really taking care of it.
But if his answer leaves you unsatisfied, then you should speak to someone else. Find another well-respected Rav/Poseik and ask him what to do. Perhaps you should speak to your neighbor yourself or have your wife speak to his wife, as you mentioned. If you are really concerned that someone is being abused (even if it’s “only” verbal), you definitely should try to do whatever you can, but make sure that you act rationally and don’t act on your emotions. Doing so could exacerbate the situation instead of helping in addition to the possible halachic issues involved.
Remember that as a Frum Jew, the most important thing to remember is not to violate any halachos. If something is against halacha, then it doesn’t help. If you are unsure if the psak you are given is correct, ask a bigger Poseik. But don’t do something against halacha.
Hatzlacha Rabba! I hope that the situation improves and that Hashem gives you the Siyata Dishmaya and the wisdom to act correctly.
Not everyone was able to get ahold of the special glasses (like me). Personally, I would be terrified to drive tomorrow.
As Ubiquitin wrote: “Becuase there are millions upon millions upon millions of people that will be staring at the sun tommorow. On a regular day people dont stare at the sun as a. there isnt much to look at and b. the sun is too strong to stare at. Tomorrow, the sun will be weaker making it easier to stare at and more interesting”Knowing that you are not supposed to look at the sun can make it hard not to do so.
I’m scared to go outside during the hours of the eclipse.
For real or for a joke? I don’t want to have it on my cheshbon that I insulted anyone, even slightly.
“That does not necessarily mean that the Rav was the wrong person to call or that he is not handling it the best way possible. It might or it might not…. The Rav is well-respected in the community, but it is possible that he was the wrong Rav to call. In that case, it is necessary to call another Poseik before calling the police.”
I realized that I should qualify my above statements. While Rabbanim can definitely make mistakes, and if one has reason to believe that his Rav was mistaken, it can make sense to ask someone else (if the second person is qualified to answer the question and if he tells the second Rav what the first Rav said), at the same time, one should not run to assume his Rav was wrong without a good reason.
In this case, based on the way the situation was described, I’m not sure if there is necessarily a good reason to assume his Rav was wrong. His Rav told him that he would handle the situation and he doesn’t seem to have a good reason to assume that he is not (I’m not sure that the fact that the situation wasn’t resolved in 3 weeks proves that he is not). It would probably make the most sense for him to speak to his Rav again and ask him what he is doing and relay his concerns to him before he speaks to someone else.
TLIK: “When there is a suspicion of molestation, one could easily argue for a shailoh to be asked. Why? Because it is not happening at the moment, and the delay in asking a Rov is not occurring while dangerous activity is happening. When danger is happening in the present, even a sofek sakana, one must act immediately.”
TLIK (and everyone else) – In this case, it is not happening at the moment – it is an ongoing situation. It happened 3 weeks before and then again the night before.
No one’s life is in immediate danger. He never stated that he was concerned that someone’s life was in danger and that IMMEDIATE action must be taken. He is even doubtful if there is any physical abuse going on at all.
Furthermore, we are talking about adults, and the OP mentioned that he is thinking of having his wife go speak to the wife. So apparently the wife is not dead or dying if he thinks that his wife can speak to her. He also apparently has not seen any signs of physical abuse.He has had ample opportunities to speak to speak to both the husband and wife since this happened. He is clearly not personally afraid of the guy and can go over himself to see if he is abusing his wife.
“Not even those who may hold that mesira is “not an issue” in the medina shel chessed would “immediately” call the cops based on a playground rumor.”
How is this different from a playground rumor?
DY: “If the OP thought there was immediate danger, why did he post to the CR instead of calling someone who could deal with an emergency? Do you think he didn’t have kavanah that day in Shemoneh Esreh?”
+1
“Multiple people explained that to you multiple times”
Which doesn’t mean that it makes any sense (as I have pointed out multiple times), but I can still try to be polite, can’t I?
Daas Yachid: “I think this entire exercise is one which lends itself to someone being insulted.”
Good point! I sincerely hope that I didn’t offend anyone. If I did, I apologize and hope that you are moichel me. Please let me know if you are not.
Let’s not and say we did.
The reasons why that case did not fit my above description are the following:
The OP was not talking about something that was happening at that moment. He was talking about an ongoing situation which required an ongoing solution. He was trying to figure out who the best people would be to help with this ongoing situation as opposed to doing more harm. He realized that he was (understandably) very emotional about the situation and in danger of over reacting and acting on his emotions. He did not think that someone was about to die. He did think that this was a situation that required intervention and he was unsure who the best person to deal with it was.
He spoke to a Rav who is respected in the community and who knows both the family and himself. Knowing both the family and the OP, the Rav had some understanding of what the situation really was about (and to what extent the OP was over reacting or not) and determined that he would be the best person to handle the situation (which may have meant that he was handling it himself or it may have meant that he was calling the people who he thought could best handle it – whether that was the police or Shomrim, or whatever).
Since this is not a situation that can be handled in a second, it is still going on. That does not necessarily mean that the Rav was the wrong person to call or that he is not handling it the best way possible. It might or it might not. Whether it does or not, it is an emotionally scary situation to be in. The OP is naturally very nervous (and since we don’t know him, we don’t know the extent to which he has a tendency to get nervous). He is still unsure as to whether or not he is over reacting.
The Rav is well-respected in the community, but it is possible that he was the wrong Rav to call. In that case, it is necessary to call another Poseik before calling the police. Calling the police on a fellow-Jew is a problem and can only be done after asking a sheilah.
If someone is pointing a gun at someone, yes, you call the police right away. That is not what is happening here. This is an ongoing situation involving shrieking. It has been going on for days, and the people are going about their business with no obvious signs of physical harm. The OP has no reason to believe that there has been any physical abuse. He never wrote that he felt that anyone’s life was in immediate danger.
In all the time, it has taken for him to post and people to respond, he could easily have called a poseik.
I suspect the reason he went to the CR instead of a more logical address (another Rav, Shomrim, etc) was that he realizes that he is being very emotional and needs someone to calm him down.
The last thing he needs is to have people frighten him into acting on his emotions.
What he needs to do is to speak to a reliable Rav (and not anonymous posters) someone who can hear him out and evaluate the situation and determine if this is a situation that does in fact call for police involvement.
SYAG – First of all, I very much appreciate your polite response to my post. I deliberately refrained from getting too involved in that thread because I am trying to avoid getting into fights with other posters and I was rather unhappy with the way that discussion was going.
I also appreciate your explaining where the other posters were coming from and why they responded as they did.
It is possible that they understood the situation that way and that was the reason for their responses, and I happy to hear your limud zchus for them so that I can view them more favorably.
If that really were the case, you are right that it would in fact be the correct thing to do to immediately call the police and not a Rav.
However, that is not what was happening there. It is very possible that it was an innocent mistake on the part of some of the posters, but unfortunately, it was a mistake that could cause a lot of damage.
(I will continue in another post because I am afraid of exceeding my word limit and getting modded).
ZD – I agree 100%!!!!