MyShadow, not all schools are that expensive, but many are.

Mazal, first of all, I think anyone spending beyond their reach is very foolish whether we are talking about a wig, a car, a kiddush or a house. Yes, I deffinatally say that some women don’t want to look like they are wearing wigs. I’m sure there are some sheitel machers that only sell the wigs that look like wigs just like there are some groceries that only sell certain hashgachas. There are those sheitel machers that sell very natural wigs. The two business people have very different clientel. While there is a possibility that if the second type of woman wasn’t in business her customers would wear the other kind of wigs, there is also the possibility that these woman wouln’t cover their hair. A cousin in the business was told that by some of her customers just starting to cover their hair.

I think that what is considered tniyus in one community may not be in a diffieremt one i.e. long hair in the Syrian community. Many people writing here are posting what their rov said as the absolute bottom line. It’s just not. We unfortunatally don’t all follow one rav. There is no absolute anymore. Iy”H when Moshiach comes we will have it again.

I was not insulted by what you or anyone said, Mazal, but the tone of many of the posters (not nessaserily you) says that if you don’t agree with them, you are the lowest of the low. That “always right” attitude annoys me no matter what the person is talking about. Personally, I felt the “nissayon” of Indian hair sheitels (which many rabbonim mahttered) was not bain adom l’Makom but bain adom l’chavoiro. All women I know of stopped wearing any wig they were not 100% sure was European. I had heard though of self-rightous hat-wearing woman practically throwing a wig-wearing woman out of shul. I wish I had heard that only once but I had heard it from too many women. I’d say the Yidden passed the first part but failed on the second.

I hope you were not offended by what I wrote, Mazal. If I did offend you, I appologize.

Feivel, you are very funny.

I get shoes on 6pm.com or shoetrader.com. I have been very successfull there. Good luck. It’s so hard to find the right pair.

I’m sure he didn’t cure “millions of Italians”. That would have been front page news all over the world. Most people cure at best in the hundreds before they publish. I hope he is right, but he might just be selling snake oil. Where was this published?

I hope this year will bring you Yiddishe nachas from all your children, Shindy. Most children do come back eventually. If now as we would like, but they are back. My sister had a lot of heartache with one of her sons. He is married now to a frum girl who went to yeshiva. They are more MO than he was raised, but he is frum and a baal tzadaka and a mentch. That is a big thing. It is a world compared to what he was.

Actually, I read in the October issue of Reader’s Digest (sorry, I do read things besides the Jewish papers) that acording to police records, violence by strangers against children is down to the level it was in the 70s. What has changed is the hype by the media i.e. radio, internet etc. This causes the level of paranoia to increase. You have to use sense, but you can’t make yourself or your kids too crazy.

BTW, to those that are very paranoid or controling about where there children are, how do you send a child to sem in Israel when in most sems from Friday afternoon until Sunday, the sem has only the girl’s word where she is? I’m not judging, but I’ve always wondered.

It’s 12:50, erev Shabbos. Yes, this site is addictive. Please don’t change it!

A gitte Shabbos and a git gebentcht yur to everyone.

We may have differeces in opinion at times, but we are still all klal Yisroel.

I generally give to organizations that I know are real and to my own yeshivos. There are some organizations that my husband and I support so I give to those. I feel bad about just throwing out other tzadaka letters but I can’t give to everyone. Many people try to give at least $1 to everyone. Some one once told me that her father worked in a yeshiva. When they got checks for only $1, they threw them out because it wasn’t worth the work and what the banks took. I was a bit annoyed to hear that so now I either give $10 or up or I don’t give at all. When I get a letter signed by a prominant rabbi, I usually throw it straight out. Not that I don’t hold from the rabbi, but you don’t know if it is real or not.

Milchig, I hope you enjoy it. I like to cook with wine. I like Kedem’s Burgandy becasue it has a strong flavor but I find it too dry to drink. It’s good with chicken or lamb. We like semi-sweet wines here at my house. My husband likes to have a variety of wines in the house. He goes to the wine store and buys a few assorted cases at a time.

I made a black and white rolled meat loaf for Yom Tov. My mother used to make a chicken meat loaf with an egg in it for Rosh HaShana. My kids don’t like the egg so I stopped making it like that.

The no cook one sounds easy and yum. I make a different cranberry sauce.

1 bag cranberries

1 cup sweet wine I use Kedem Plum Royal

1cup sugar

1 cinmiman stick

1/2 orange peel julianed

Put it all together and boil for about 25 min. Use a bigger pot than you think you need because it boils over and makes a mess easily.

Gels beautifully so you can put it in a mold.

I’ll go with bein_hasedorim’s reason about the men.

About women’s clothing, this is fairly new. I got married it the late 70s and everyone wore colorful clothes (not red, of course) from the most Chassidish to the most Yeshivish. It was concidered incorect to wear black. I think the black thing started when there were many affairs one after another. If you spilled something on a turquise dress, it showed and you didn’t always have time to go to the cleaners. On black, it doesn’t show. Also if everyone wears the same color, then people don’t notice if it’s the same dress 3 times in a row or not. Colorful dresses, you propbably would notice.

This is just my thought.

aryehm, switching suddenly from caf to decaf will give you the same symptoms whether it is a fast day of not. You have to switch gradually. I found out the hard way when I bought a pound of decaf by mistake instead of my usual coffee.

( not even other Rabbanim , besides the Rosh Hayeshivas).

Smart Gal, how do you know that the schools didn’t listened to ANYBODY? Lakewood has grown incredibelly in the past years. In the past-even a few years ago when there was the same problem-the Roshei Yeshiva were like the Chassidic rebbes and ruled Lakewood. Now, Lakewood seems to be turning into Brooklyn, where some people pick the Rabbi that agree with them.

Also, while I agree this situation isn’t like Brisk, it’s no secret that to get into Brisk, you need pull. Talk about elitism.

Unfortunatally, these days, the non-Chassidish schools are businesses like grocery stores. You can pay for my product? You can shop.

A lot of the problem is dollors and cents as many people said. To build, you need money. Grandparents can pay for just so much. Perhaps we might be well served to look at how it used to be in Chassidish circle: a boy learned until he got married, then went to work and learned either before work or after work or both. If a person sincerly wants to learn, he can.

Lets ban Uncle Moishe! He takes many of his tunes from goyishe songs.

Oh, just for fun,but not becuse there is anything goyish about it, you know the nigun called Neshama’s Nigun? Do you know WHY it is called Neshama’s Nigun? Not because it is so hartsig that it touches your neshama but because it was first sung and recorded by Shlomo Carlbachs daughter Neshama. That should put a twist in your knickers.

I’m just wondering why about half of the discussions in the Coffee Room are about tznius? Easy target? Heads in the gutter?

As for saying pregnant women look like beached whales, perhaps the writer should go to a meeting of ATIME where the women would give anything to “look like a beached whale”

So we must be tzius but we can hurt people? Is that how it should be?

The owner ofthe colony was (I think) Chaim Kaufman. He stayed in our bungallow colony a few years. He DIDN’T stay in his place because he said people bothered him too much. My friend’s husband worked for him a few years. He also owned Mintz’s bungallows

My mother always made meatloaf from chicken with an egg in the center for Rosh Hashana. She also made tomato sauce to go with it because we didn’t use ketchup.

I like to make a pastrami roast. You put it in the oven at about 300 for 5-6 hours depending on the size. It is so good.

I usually make chicken cutlets for the second night because it is light.

Azi, I’m sorry if I hurt your feelings, but (isn’t there always a but) if you were really honest you would see that if you were really interested in an answer, this would not be the place for it. People can give an opinion but you don’t know who everyone is. You don’t know how learned people answering are although I’m sure many people are. You don’t know where people are frumkeit wise. The answer would be different if you are asking someone from Lakewood, Tush, Gateshead or Teaneck. As my father would say, if you want to ask a question about a mezuza, you don’t go to a shoesmaker. If you really wanted an answer, you wouldn’t say that you don’t have to ask a rav.

Hi Jewel, welcome. I would just reiterate what others have said about going slow and keep in touch with a rabbi. You cauld also learn one on one through an organization called Partners in Torah (PartnersInTorah.org). It’s a great organization!

Also, a friend of mine said that when he started learning about Judaism, someone he met told him that the Hashem, the Torah and Judaism are all true and beautiful. People are people. We would like to beleive that if they are religious they are perfect and good, but it isn’t always the case. If you’ve been reading here in the Coffee Room, I’m sure you see what I mean. Just look to what you and your rabbis think is right and ignore others who need improvement.

Good luck. You are fabulous!

ml, Passaic may be more expencive on food, but you are less than an hour from Brooklyn and about 20 from Monsey. You could go there for big shopping. Passaic is a beautiful community. There is a kollel, a variaty of shuls, a bakery, milichig and fleishig restarounts and 2 sforim stores. Transportation to Manhattan is easy. Its a great place to live.

Welcome back, Feif Un. You are probably right about that rebbe not thinking he did wrong. I’m told that in BY Sem in NY, they discuss answering children’s hasgafa questions other than calling a kid an apikores. That was not your issue, but it’s a good start. Now if rebbes would be required to take some classes in teaching.

Azi, I was just wondering. How big of a tzadik are you that you think you should be talking to your mother about her tznius level? Do you think you are that much better than her? How is YOUR tznius level? Do you shout in the streets? Do you jump lines in stores because you are in a rush? What is your learning level, sinse you are such a tzadik? How often are you in the bais medresh? Do you pick up a sefer even bain hazmanim or just when it is in your way?

When you will get married, your wife can wear what ever kind of a tichel you want or if you are a girl, you can wear as heavy a tichel as you want, but I think your mother’s ruchnius is NOT YOUR BUSINESS.

Worry about your avlahs not someone elses.

I sent my daughter to Bais Chaya Rochel in Gateshead. That is the “new” Gateshead-only 10 years old instead of 60 like the “old” one. That sem prepares the girls to be the next generation of Yiddishe Mothers. Most of the classes were either halacha l’maase (dinai kashrus or Shabbos) or hashgafa. Even when they learned Chumosh or Navi, they learned with hashgafa in mind. The girls had “vocational classes” in the afernoon. My daughter took a few computor classes over ther 2 years there. There is very little opportunity for a girl to do things she shouldn’t in a town like Gateshead (think of a town like Lakewood used to be) but some girls managed. Some people ALWAYS manage to do what they shouldn’t. Those girl were generally cought and told not to come back after a bain ha zemanim. BCR goes by yeshiva z’manim. My daughter was not brainwashed. She came back saying that Torah was important to her but she is not kollel material. She ate all meals including Shabbos in the sem. Rabbi Katz had as much control as a father does.

Oh, the cost was about a third of what my friend paid that year for her daughter’s year in Israel.

Was these years in sem a nessesity? From the change for the better that I saw in her, I would say yes. Perhaps if a girl has a very possitive high school experiance, which my daughter didn’t, sem would be more of a luxury.

I couldn’t see sending an 18 year old away to a place where every Shabbos she is on her own. Come to think of it, my son was 20 when he went to Israel. I wouldn’t have let him go so young if he would have wanted to.

I do understand the tzniyus crisis in Lakewood. Lakewood is no longer just a yeshiva town. The cheaper property rates have brought in many other poeple who are not “Lakewood types”. These people and their not-yeshivish way of dressing is a crisis to the more yeshivish in the community.

On the other hand, some people take things to the extreme. My mother’s friend went to Lakewood to go to her grandson’s bris. She is a woman in her 60s who dressing atractivly, but not “in your face”. Her sheitel is dark and just brushes her shoulders. One guest, a young woman, at the bris came over, gave mazal tov and then said that as a bubby, it would be more tzniyusdic and proper for her to wear a shorter shaitel. I guess manners arenot tought together with halacha.

Also, you might be interested to know that many people have different feelings about what is tzniyus. My daughter went to sem in Gateshead. The girls all went to that video about tzniyus where many rebatzins from around the world spoke. The next day, one of my daughter’s teachers had a few words about it. This rabbi is a world renown person. I wouldn’t mention his name here. He said that it was an important presentaton but IT WAS A SHAME IT WAS SPOILED by the American women who spoke. He felt their shaitels werent tzniyusdic enough.

Tzniyus seems to be relative to where you are.