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I generally don’t answer on these topics as I was always taught by my father never to look at other people especially when it’s money related but maybe (& just maybe) it’s actually very good they made this party and went.
It’s very possible they connected there with other well-heeled people and they’ll make even more money which would very likely just grow their giving to the charitable causes etc.As an “overseaser” who learnt in Israel I am on the hesitant side on sending away.
I saw a lot of my friends do things that wouldn’t do in there home town and not because their parents would get them in trouble but because they don’t have to be accountable at the weeks ends on what is really happening and how they look as over the phone you cannot really know what is happening.I heard form a bookstore owner in Yeushlaim about a Bochur who came in and ask to charge his (fathers) CC and then he’ll take cash. He was ready for the store owner to take a nice chunk of the amount the main thing he’ll give him cash (as he wanted his parents to see a purchase in a seforim store & not know that he took cash…). What exactly he wanted to do who knows, but it was suspicious so he told him no way!
My humble opinion is, if you aren’t too far from home there is some kind of accountability as חברך חברא אית ליה וחברא דחברך חברא אית ליה & also if the topics does come up (not in a suspicious way he may very well see from his body language something and help out in the issues.
On the other hand there are many cases where the Bochur does grow immensely by changing environments and starting with a clean slate etc. but the above point needs to be address more than most parents think!!
There are a few lectures on this subject with whiteboards and all by Rabbi Akiva Tatz on TorahAnytime.
If the mods would allow, i can post the links.The names of the lectures are “Living in Two Worlds Successfully – Brooklyn” or “Ohr Somayach Yom Iyun: Moral Dilemmas”.
SHY
I’m not going to argue with you regarding the Crown Heights community because though I’ve visited there, I must admit that I didn’t hang around that place enough to compare.
But one thing you seem to agree Lubavitch in Melbourne is in a bad state and if they start missionizing their Chassidus to me I’m gonna tell them have a look at what SHY wrote here and please fix your problems before even contemplating teaching Chassidus to so called “snags”.Regarding the uniform, I hope your kidding me. The official cut is short – actually very short, those who wish can add an extra piece (now is that twisted or not??).
And the episode between the 12 graders happened (I barely posted here because I din’t want to attack anything and everything. I only write things I know firsthand) not only that but one year for Purim the 12 grader girls got dressed up as expecting females (not all, but a large majority).
So just to clarify “Lubavitch in Melbourne is problematic (even though I think it’s from the biggest communities) and do not learn from them. If so then I’m half way there. It frees my mind knowing that what they preach is baloney and even another Lubavitcher has given me a gushpankeh for that
THANKS!!SHY
I was waiting for someone to point out the fact that my other post was posted on Shabbos Australian time. For that I have two answers.1. I was in the US over the weekend for business.
2. I think (and this I’m not sure but it may answer why others may seem to be posting on Shabbos or any weird time) the time of posting is when the mods put it up and so technically I could have sent it erev Shabbos GMT +11 and the mods only posting it later.
But yes, the real answer is I was in the US over the weekend.
Ok now for a few small scoops on Lubavitch in Melbourne.
1. Do you know that the official school uniform for Beth Rivkah is above the knees??
2. The boys and girls of year 12 (the last year of school) had a water fight! (I don’t know of any frum school anywhere that would not make a big fuss and story over it and make a cheshbon hanefesh were they went wrong)
3. One Sukkos I was by a Lubavitch party and was asked with astonished and shocked faces if “I sleep in the Sukkah! (BTW doesn’t it say the the Shulchan Aruch HaRav that one needs to sleep in the Sukkah unless he can’t for the Halachic reason)
And the cherry on the cake I’ll leave for the next post just because I realise that when you bunch a few things together the Lubavitchers on this forum seem to pick and choose which points to respond to.
So sorry for not replying straight away (and waiting until Monday – yes, in Australia it’s well into Monday!!)
So It would have hold true claiming that Lubavitch in Australia is worse than everywhere else if not for the fact that I was in Crown Heights too! The situation there is slightly different. There are many more from the older Chassidim who seem to be “normal and frum” but the younger generation is almost the same.
It’s appalling (and sadly appealing). It maybe be because of all the “Aussies” coming there as the centre of gravity and then mixing in with the crowds and lowering the level, but whatever the reason is, the younger generation isn’t much better, at all, that the Melbourne Lubavitch community.I have been following both threads by CS from the start.
As an Australian I must admit there are things that Lubavitch do which are great i.e. I’ve used there Chabad centers during some of my stop overs in the Asian region.
BUT WARNING!! The situation is out of control. The amount of frei kids coming out of their school (that’s why Mr. Kornhauser has started a new cheider) is appalling and anyone who thinks their Chassidus is fine and I’m gonna join them, take this as a warning! It’s true that in everyplace anything can happen, and you need tons of Teffilos and Siyata Dishmaya but joining Lubavitch isn’t doing hishtadlus on your behalf to bring up frum normal Yidden. If you would like examples, I’ll give them (I hope the mods won’t delete some of them as some are borderline tzniyus and disgusting)Secondly, after seeing RSO nagging about the Sundial story I went and checked it up myself and yes it doesn’t make sense. If you say the suns rays were blocked by some hilltop far away in the distance that they goyish professors couldn’t see and only the Baal HaTanya could figure it out, then maybe the shade in my backyard in Melbourne is from the Himalayas in Asia. Anyone on this forum can understand that even though there may be huge, massive mountains in their country etc., it is not affecting their shade unless they live in the vicinity of it and they can view it from their position. It does affect the weather but not shade and a sundial works on shade!