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bpt – Fighting them won’t help, perhaps talking or pleading.
Also Charlie is wrong. While technically a woman can’t be an “Aid”, the Bais Din isn’t calling her as one. And as far as the yeshiva, they didn’t just rely on her statement, the Bochur admitted it!
I don’t know what yeshivos you went to, but most that I know would/do chuck on a first offense, if it was serious enough!
Ofcourse -“Unfortunately some Mechanchim are dangerously impulsive/explosive/hurtful.”
This statement applies to every human being, not just Mechachim. In the time of Chazal you could expect a Rebbe to be a Malach -therefore the Torah requests to look for such people. In our day and age, the Rebbeyim/principals who are Malachim are far and few inbetween.
Every person has to work on themselves and not worry about the next guy. This is very hard and the biggest Nisoyon of our generation. I’ve had some very bad things done to me and I tried to get Justice, but I didn’t succeed. Real Justice will be in the next world!
Of course – There definitely is a mentchlich way to do it. As we know, in our day and age, that it’s not always the biggest Mentchen that reach to levels of power. Unfortunately a lot of people don’t see their own chesoronos and behave not in the proper way.
If you go to the very frum yeshivos, you have to play by the rules or expect to suffer the consequences if you don’t and they catch you!
“I think the biggest obstacle to this solution is the pupil in question and his/her parents themselves. They don’t want to go there.”
I agree. It’s mainly the responsibility of the parents to get their child into a new yeshiva, not the old yeshivas’. If they would move quickly to get into the MO yeshiva, 9 times out of 10, the kid would be accepted. If they dawdle and fight the old yeshiva or try similar types of “Ultra-frum” yeshivos, they most likely won’t be successful and the kid is “Meyiish”(gives up). After this, it becomes very easy for him to go OTD! The parents have to take their ego out of the equation. Right or wrong, accept the Yeshiva’s decision and move on. Fighting city hall doesn’t work. I don’t mean that you can’t try to speak with them or have s/1 intervene on your behalf, but if this doesn’t work, send the kid to a MO yeshiva!
Popa – Is this a first -saying I have “a good point”?
Anyway thanks.
I just have a question to all the posters who are decrying the decision of the yeshiva (if indeed the OP statement is accurate). Is it that you think there is nothing wrong with a boy talking to a girl or you think they should have Rachmonus? If parents think there is nothing wrong and there are am sure plenty who do, why not send to a MO school? I heard that there are 2 MO schools, one in NJ and one in Balto., closing for next year. I just have the feeling people like to pretend they are frummer than they really are.
It’s not like everybody is becoming right wing, but everyone on the outside has to pretend they are. Why are you upset if a Yeshiva actually practices what they preach? The yeshiva doesn’t have to accept lower standards. If you want lower standards go to a MO school. If you want to fake about videos, Tzinus and everything else that these yeshivos don’t allow, don’t complain when you get caught. Or don’t be two-faced and send your kids to the MO schools!
aries – “sorry, yes it can be the whole case. Why doesn’t the Rosh Yeshiva tell such a yenta that you are not allowed to Masser?”
On one hand it can the whole case and on the other it might not be. Why don’t you judge up the yeshiva favorably, just like you do the boy? So until people hear from both sides they should refrain from any negative comments!
If they keep all their 7 mitzvos they get Olam Haboh.
What do you think happens to goyim who keep the 7 mitzvos of Bnai Noach?
I’m no lawyer, but let’s test the lawyers and everyone else (since this a fun game).
Does NJ have misdemeanors -like felonies & misdemeanors?
Bored – “we are discussing normal rational people not the radicals. Raidcals on either end will never be satisfied with anything except there own way.”
Most of the comments I read on the net were vile, antisemitic and disgusting regarding Chassidim. If you call these people normal and rational you are sadly very misguided. As a matter of fact, I think the rational people in this country, whether Yiddin or Goyim, accept the newspaper’s apology!
Yid.period -“if they caused a misconception of how they perceive women, doesn’t that make them wrong?”
Yes, they were wrong -that’s why they apologized. I’m sure they won’t do it again. Hindsight is always better than foresight.
Did you ever do anything wrong in your life?
Bored – “By them not acknowledgeing that they were in the room they are showing the world how narrow minded they are and how all that concerns them is is their own agenda.”
My problem isn’t that people came to this conclusion -it’s understandable. I think they realized this also -hence the apology. My problem (if you read my previous posts) is that they think that if someone doesn’t do the correct thing always, they have the right to spew all kinds of hatred at them. If you read some of the comments on the net, the mildest was just comparing Chassidim to the Taliban/Radical Muslims. Some openly called for violence. It doesn’t really sound that these people believe in the Constituion about free speech. They believe in free speech as long as the speech is PC! For Frum people to publically denouce this newspaper (even if they are wrong, which I doubt because all they did was cause a misconception of how they perceive women) will only add fuel to their fire of Hatred & Antisemitism!
Bored – “if it is being sold at a newsstand it is PUBLIC therby allowing anyone to view and comment.”
They have the right to comment, but it seems most of the negative comments are based on antisemitism.
And the apology was because after the firestorm, they didn’t want to leave the false impression (about women denigration) on the main society and the gov., who asked that the photo shouldn’t be altered.
It wasn’t an admission of guilt. They aren’t ever going to show pictures of women, but they might be more careful with gov. photos.
This apology isn’t to change the mind of all the people who said Chassidim are like radical moslems and all the other negative comments. A person with bias will always have bias, no matter how mant times you show them the Truth!
There is a topic in the CR called “Heartburn”. There are many suggestions there. I posted there as well.
Check it out.
Heartburn is the symptom you get from “acid reflux”!
Is a divorced guy considered an older single?
Bored in office -“How can you say that a newspaper being sold at newstands does nto have other readers. It is being sold to anyone who wants it. Does the newsman only sell it to chasidim??”
I got news for you. This is a Yiddish written paper. Anybody who buys it, whether through subscription or newsstands, reads Yiddish. All the readers know the policy about not showing pictures of women!
“Please keep davening, I know her”
Does she live in Lakewood or is she from NY?
kapusta-
Thanks!
Hakol Tov – “i suffer from nose bleeds only in the winter. It is from the steam”
Besides what I posted above, a person should have a humidifier or a vaporizer in their room. This will keep the membranes moist. Depending on the size of the room is the size of humidifier you get. You might even need more than one.
RedNails19 -“Health- can you tell me more”
I can’t work you up over the net. Go to your PCP and let them
search for a cause.
Rednails – An “open vessel” is a diagnosis of exclusion. In other words, you have to be worked up, eg. blood disorders, HTN; just to name a few.
Wolf – “It was a violation of journalistic standards. It was a violation of honesty. It was a violation of truth.”
Only in the world’s eye, not in their readerships’.
Also the double standard, when the mainstream media misleads the general public, eg. with the photo of the muslim man crouching behind a boy. The only outcry was from Jewish groups – I didn’t hear the world or the mainstream media decrying this propaganda.
Wolf – “Do you think the average reader will see the photo and think “there was a woman there but the paper removed her?” Or do you think the average reader will take the photo as a factual representation of what happened?
I think the latter is true.
If the former is true, then perhaps the newspaper is further violating tznius standards since men looking at every photo must be wondering “Was there a woman in that photo? If so, who was she?”
The Wolf”
Wrong on both counts. Yes they make the assumption that there is the possibility of women in every photo. Since the readers do it with every photo, they don’t think twice like you say -“Was there a woman in that photo? If so, who was she?”
Again don’t put your assumptions on them.
boredinoffice – “Health – when a paper is published and sold at newstands it is for the public. It does target a reading group but anyone can look at it and draw any conclusion thet want. The readers may know that any women have been reomved but that would hardly be the point.
Being that the paper is a public paper avaiable to anyone the disclaimer is needed to justify what to someone may be ignorance/stupidity/uncaring/altering facts the list goes on and on.”
Your argument would be correct if there were other readers. Like for example the NY times, some people have a subscription and some buy it occasionally. Here even the ones who buy it occasionally know what they do with all women. There is no logical reason for them to put any disclaimer on any photos.
A disclaimer is only needed if someone could be misled.
Anyone on this frum YWN blog ever bought this newspaper? I highly doubt it.
BY – Apology accepted. I can’t tell you what went on for obvious reasons. And you will have a very hard time figuring it out because it was deleted. I think we should all stick to the subject of the posts and not try to judge up or figure out the posters themselves.
Wolf -“The newspaper decided to take none of them and instead make their readership believe that no women were present at all.”
This is your underlying mistake. Their readership makes no such assumption. The only assumption that they do make is that if women are present in the photos, they will be removed. It doesn’t matter what the political or social status of that woman is. Don’t put your assumptions that you have when you look at media on them!
BY – Homeopathy is a form of alternative medicine. So are the others and there is a lot more. Too many to list here. I believe in some forms of alternative medicine, not all. I’m sure you don’t believe in faith healing, unless the faith is Judaism. But there are those that do believe in it and will try going to those faiths even if it’s not their own personal faith. When it comes to alternative medicine, I’m not like the firm believers that it will work no matter what. I think that a lot of it -is nothing wrong to try it. It might work, it might not. But when it comes to regular medicine, I believe most of the time it will work (remember I said most).
Charlie – ” with no statement that it was doctored, would not violate lifnei iver”
Or for this matter Genevas Daas or any other Issur.
The reason is because the people who buy and read this paper expect the photos of all women to be removed. This is a given to them. The MO like you aren’t the supporters of this newspaper.
BTW, all the thousands of comments on the web comparing Chassidim to the Muslim fanatics is simply due to their guilt. These people have left their religion whether they are goyim or yidden and they are constantly looking for excuses. These people haven’t learned from history, any civilzation based on hedonism doesn’t exsist anymore. In the last thirty -forty years we’ve had the gay revolution, legalizing abortions and so on. We’ve also had terror attacks from muslims and the worst downturn of the economy since the depression. The non-religious want to blame this on anybody they can. They can’t put 2 & 2 together -maybe Hashem isn’t happy with a totally lustful, amoral society.
toomuch00 -“they melt the blood vessel closed with tiny amount of fire.”
Not exactly; either we use chemicals or electrical heat.
Most bleeds will stop if you pinch the fleshy part for 5 to ten minutes straight without checking in between. Lean forward and spit out the blood from your mouth. If it doesn’t stop, do it again, but first blow out your nose. This will remove the clots. If it still doesn’t stop after the next 10 minutes either seek medical care or twist a gauze into a tree and put it up the nose after blowing, and squeeze another ten minutes. Don’t remove if it stops -leave the gauze up there a few hours and then remove gently. If it feels stuck, squeeze a few drops of oil (baby oil) or H2O2 up there and then remove. OOmis is right -if this happens all the time, you have to seek a cause. I could write a whole Megilla on medical treatments, but I don’t want to bore you. Two things I like -one is this clothespin device that is made for nosebleeds. It’s great for kids because you put it on them and they can move around. They don’t have to sit still for 10 minutes. The other meant for medical professionals is the “Rhino rocket”. It’s shot into the bleeding nostril and tamponades the bleed.
truthsharer – “The no compression rule is only for adults, children still get the breathing, IIRC.”
You made a TYPO!
Mother in Israel- Nowadays only medical professionals check for a pulse. Depending on what type of layman you are will depend whether you give breaths or not. I posted the two methods above.
eclipse – After all that you posted about your hubby, how come they keep him as a rebbe?
North of Eastern Parkway is Bed-Sty. Does the restaurant provide armed guards?
It’s scary the reaction that the world has when it comes to anything religious esp. the frum Jewish religion. I wasn’t there in that time, but all the anti-semitism that this has provoked reminds me of pre-war Europe. I saw thousands of anti-semitic comments all over the net. Even if the newspaper committed a crime (which they didn’t), its’ still shocking the reaction. We live in such a liberal society were you can abort fetuses, men and women can Marry their own gender. Anything goes, but what is the world up in arms about -something they perceive as a denigration of women. (Btw, I read newspapers with women pictures in it, but I respect that way of thought, even if I personally don’t do it.)
They are pitiful hypocrites. Not only Don’t babies in their mother’s stomach have any rights, but a lot of Goyishe companies
won’t give Jobs to people who are Shomer Shabbos, “claiming”
“Undue Hardship”. This happenned to me over and over. This world will end and Yetamu Chatoyim Min Haaretz and Reshayim Od Ainum! This includes all the assimilated Jews who find nothing better to do than to put down Jews who don’t look at women!
Adorable – I can’t answer that because it would reveal too much about me. Suffice it to say I’ve trained in a few or many different areas in mainstream medicine.
BY – “problem is that some people may think that the truth is in alternative medicine or something else that you (i’m guessing) would knock and call it superstition.”
Please don’t make assumptions about me. As a matter of fact I do believe in alternative medicine secondary to mainstream, if it makes sense as opposed to homeopathy (which makes no sense to me). The honesty I was refering to wasn’t about medicine per se.
Hagoh – The CPR for trained laymen and medical professionals is as easy as taking a CAB:
Check Responsivness.
Non-Responsive.
Call for help. (And AED.)
Not Breathing or Not Breathing normally.
Begin Compressions -30:2
30 compressions to 2 breaths.
Push fast – At least 100/min.
Push hard – Depth around 2 inches.
Keep cycling until AED, Breathing or relieved by others!
Shticky Guy –
What’s the difference between in-laws and outlaws?
OUTLAWS are WANTED!
BY – “i know people like him, and their whole self-worth is their brains, so if they feel threatened that they’re not smarter than others, it’s like someone’s taking away their oxygen, so they’ll fight back as we would if we couldn’t breathe.”
Very clever insight, but not me! I’ll try to explain, but not too deeply, so I don’t get blocked again. What bothers me is when people aren’t honest. This gets my goat. I can’t stand dishonesty, whether it’s directed at me, someone else or something else. I sometimes am brutally honest and some can be offended by this. I don’t sugar coat a lot of things I say or post. But I come here to help people, not to hurt them.
How could it be 2:30 twenty -one minutes ago, when now it’s 2:43?
Mischiefmaker – I posted the new version for laymen above.
Thanks to all.
Next time, send me the plane tickets and I’ll do your shopping for you and ship it to you. I’ll have one ticket left over for My vacation.
I wouldn’t waste my money on them. It only protects the thyroid, you still will get plenty sick elsewhere from the radiation.
Walton – Please start learning Gemorra. The Gemorra says on exactly your question(s) -Anybody who says Dovid Hamelach sinned -Aino Elah Toeh (Is only making a mistake)!
To all those above who helped me get Unblocked, thanks! I doubt they would have done it without your input.
BY – No matter where you live, (even if you live in Omni and just like Tov and Momma Leah’s), thanks. Anyway, I don’t live there anymore.
“just look at us when we are done and tell us that we look beautiful.”
IDK; if I was a woman, I’d like to be told I was beautiful when I didn’t wear makeup, like before I painted my face!
LSS – You gotta make sure to do this part first –
“Tap and shout “Are you ok? If no response, call for help -“You call 911″. Check for movement, breathing, coughing -if none, begin compressions”.
It’s horrible to push on someone’s chest if their heart is still beating.