havesomeseichel

Good to start early- you can ask teachers before they get ambushed by tons of parents and girls. Also have your daughter think about who they would ask recommendation letters from… It can make a big difference. I would advise talking to someone that knows your daughter personally, one that your daughter has a kesher with or likes her (just because female teachers would probably know more and feel more comfortably about giving seminary advice.).

Some good questions to pose (I went through these with someone I know and it helped narrow down choices for her).

(In no order of importance, just as they popped into my head)

1. Small or Large? Each has their own benefits. Is your daughter a social butterfly who would be more comfortable with a large crowd that can be varied in types (up to a point)? In these the staff might not know each girl so personally and each girl will not know the entire seminary that well (unless your daughter is the type to know the whole school’s name the first day of high school…) Or would she like a smaller, family-like setting where the staff knows the girls, each girl knows the rest of the seminary and it is more likely that the girls are more of a similar mindset hashkafically and academically, if your daughter has specific topics she is interested in or questions or subjects, or specific needs (food allergies) a smaller sem might be more suited and can adjust year to year easier than larger ones… Seminaries can be 30 girls (shoshanim, tiferes) to 150 (BJJ, Hadar)…

2. I hate the terms academic or non-academic. I dont like the questions that are “put yourself in a box and dont leave it for anything” type. Most seminaries teach, some just do more of it and stress it. Really book-ish? Are there not enough class hours in the day? (most girls by the end of sem love their teachers). If she is somewhere in between, I would recommend leaving this question unanswered until the end…

3. How yeshivish? (another boxy term I hate. Everyone is a little different and what one person considers one thing, another may consider it the opposite. for lack of better terms, here it is…) Is your family set on kollel-life? Is it possible or definite that she will go to some sort of college (community, touro, regular/secular college)? Some seminaries will try to convince your daughter that she “must do this” and if it is against your daughter’s ideals it can pose a problem if she doesnt want to end up that way.

4. Does your daughter think “out of the box” ever? Does she either question what teachers say, does she think for herself…? Some seminaries or types encourage it and others dont. There are BY or non YU seminaries that allow people to ask questions, albeit sometimes after class so not to take up time in class. Some seminaries discourage any type of self-expression of ideas, thoughts ect.

5. How old of a sem do you want? there are those that are in their second year, some that have been around for a while… It can make a difference: experience can be a good thing!

Ideas: Besides asking a teacher, have your daughter ask a girl whom she thinks is quite similar and find out where she went to seminary and what she thinks.

Vouchers are a long term goal, you are right SJSinNYC, but we need to start soon… if we pressure long enough and hard enough (especially if there are elections coming up soon) it can happen. But schools need to fix their yearly deficit. Why should they be allowed to run negative every year? Something has got to change about the way schools are run.

Any school administrators here? Maybe you can lend us some insight…

Nothing is inherently evil or bad. Everything should be balanced.

how do you set something like this up?? thanks for all your help. I am lost when it comes to things like this. I know how to do basics but beyond that I am lost!!

artchill- please translate… I dont do yiddish well…

I understand seperating church and state, and that is why the money was to ANY school, it can be the “athiests elementary” for all the program cares. It was supposed to help get the smarter kids out of public school and into private better educated schools. Did you know that the NY gov once gave a lot of money to Catholic schools for taking attendance (required by law to makes sure the students were coming to school). That way the schools got money and the govt wasnt violating church and state… maybe what we need is a nice gov who wants a lot of the brooklyn vote… (even though it is quite small comparatively to the entire state. It is just one that can swing easily)

I was just worried…. Glad to know we’re still CR-buddies… 😉

so if I still want to access my email from gmail.com I can’t use IMOP (or whatever the letters were?)

what is IMAP? what does it do? how much does it cost?

plonis… i know it ruins the joke if you explain it but what was that gemarra joke?

I guess we should all vote for something called school vouchers- This is where the government gives each family a coupon for the amount it would cost for them to teach your child that year in public school. You can give this to ANY accredited school that you want: public, private, religious (any), prep, magnet…

The government would pay that amount to the school and you would have to make up the difference. Of course tuition would only increase (the parents would still be out the same amount of money) but then those who couldnt pay still are as if they “paid” part of it! The schools end up with a little more money (and the average student is better educated in the public school-parents have the choice now!)

The government wont push this now but if we pressure our governors and senators (some of this would be federal aid), eventually the message will be heard. google your representative’s name and email them!

anon- it is not standard but doctors are aware of the genetic component. That is why when you go to a new doctor, they give you a form to fill out which asks you for your vital information (illnesses you may have C”V) and your immediate family’s info. This is true even when your medical records were sent over- they have a simple reference sheet. One of the diseases they specifically ask for is diabetes. But it isnt purely genetic so it shouldnt have much to do with shidduchim. Many people have it and the rest of their family has no sign of it so shidduchim shouldnt rest on something small like that.

artchill- you forgot about a few things. In a school there are other expenses besides teachers. What about gas, water, mortgage/rent, electricity costs? Costs: chalk, board markers, desks and chairs, books (even second hand it adds up. If the students are required to buy their own, then there are still the teacher’s edition and copy to think about), light bulbs, pens for the office, paper… the list goes on and on- and these are the bare bones! what about if there is a plumbing or sewage problem? You wouldnt want your child to be in a school without a working sink or bathroom. what if there were other basic issues with the building? a leaky roof? electrical issues? They need a better accountant if tuition isnt covering the costs but how much is this “bare bones tuition”? It must include all of the above…

Azoi.is…What I meant is that the hanhala should not rely on others but should make up the difference somehow. Take less of a paycheck home for themselves. By expecting Gvirim to pay it still is on the public dole because once they cant pay, everyone else is told to pay up.

GAW- ok (i guess?)… 😉 glad to see we are on the same page (or post?)

Heshy- I think it is excessive. i guess it depends on for what subject and if the kid is disabled or whatnot. If it was advanced gemarra where the rebbi would have to spend hours preparing I see maybe 50. If it was an AP course or Regents, it still is high. Well, what is the rate for babysitting in your area? if it is 20 an hour, then I might see it. But it still is quite high.

esther h- no. Life is about working to better yourself and knowing that “not everything is fair”. Schools dont want to make anyone feel bad, but in fact by not pushing them they are hurting them. The best thing would be to have some classes split and others together.

Reasons to split: (i like lists;) )

1. Each level will be taught at their level. Always there will be some who are higher than others and teachers want to teach to the average kid. So if it is split, the smartest are pulled out and the average is now a lot lower…

2. More attention per child at the level they need.

3. Those who are not outstanding or failing are lost if everyone is mushed. At least if kids are split, they still can stand out easier.

4. kids can make friends who are at their level. I was in a class ages ago when I was smarter than the rest of the class (not to boast- I was in the low class). My friends were all in the higher class and I felt so out of place because I understood the material already and was sitting there bored while other kids still didnt understand it. This is how it would be if the classes were not split- kids sitting there bored while other kids couldnt get the hang of it.

5. You are less likely to have too many kids who cant read and write by the time they leave high school.

Reasons to keep them together:

1. the teachers might like it- they have to teach to a lower level. (I am not being fair- but some teachers like it…they dont have to change the material year to year based on the level. The average stays the same each year.)

2. You dont get the shidduch question “well, was he/she in the honors chumash track or the low track?”

3. Esteem for the lower level kids.

4. The teachers are forced to keep the pace of the class moving and the lower half the class will be forced to learn the material.

5. You wont get the excuse “but we’re the low class… its too hard for us”

Dont let your friends drive after drinking if they are the least bit tipsy or acting funny. DUIs should be treated like murder.

iswhatitis- If you read most of what I wrote dealt with MENTAL ISSUES, not people seeking advice from professionals. I am sorry if it was unclear but all I meant was that if there is a mental issue, then you should tell the prospective side the extent of it. Common advice and needing someone as a sounding board for their ideas (not because of any “issues”) does not fall into the category of my comments. I only want to stop people from hiding real issues from the prospective side to stop so many divorces and family issues because one side hid something really important from the other.

Thank you for your misunderstanding. 😉

It is a little late to complain about this… we all knew this was coming…

kapusta- I agree that a vacation can be recharging, but make it a “stay-cation” or make it small. keep it minimal and dont make your “battery recharge” be on the expense of others. I have absolutely no problem with sending the kids to grandma and going to a hotel for a few days. What I have an issue with is when people go to E”Y for a few weeks in the summer or pay a lot of money to go to a hotel for Pesach or own a second home or something large like that and cannot afford tuition. What if you knew that because you upgraded to a nicer hotel room that the school cannot afford to stay open and a few hundred kids are out of school. It all has to be in proportion. That’s all.

SJS- even “non luxury schools” have overheads just like other schools…

It seems from the posters that tuition is lower in BYBP but it must not be covering their needs as too many parents are paying. This is an endless cycle and giving money seems like throwing money down the drain unless accountants and professionals are able to look where the money is going. Are there too many secretaries? Staff? do they spend too much on extras?

Joseph- I disagree with you here. It takes a lot of planning but it can be very rewarding. Your kids can end up smarter and ahead of their grade-counterparts and they learn many skills like perseverance and individual work. They also gain an inner drive to work by themselves and for themselves. They can really gain an interest in the subject matter and if they are able to help pick some of it, they will be even more interested! (like american history, state history, world history ect and can concentrate on aspects that they are interested in, not what the teacher likes).

It is a cheaper alternative that can reap fabulous results. The parents dont have to do the teaching themselves as long as there is one parent per level. Or you can join similar levels together for subjects that it doesnt matter what age they are and give different assignments on the topic.

Joseph- Oh, you can instead call parents and tell them not to send their children to school because they cannot pay. Some schools are not letting kids into classes if their parents were unable to pay. And that is not embarrassing?

They make these boxes- more pricey than the slapstick cheese traps (by the way try peanut butter as well) that the mice walk into and die. I think it is a glue trap (no way did I set them out or deal with them) but you threw away the whole box so it was a neater clean up job…

Check out major appliances like ovens, dishwashers ect. Look inside and behind them because they might be hiding there. Unfortunately we found out the hard way… cooked mouse. Check for their presence in these appliances and behind them ect. If they are in your kitchen and something major like a dishwasher stops working- they might have eaten the cords.

I HATE MICE AND RATS!!!

NY MOM- well said re: siblings! A person who is able to manage living with a sibling who has problems (disabled, ill ect) is a true baal/as middos as they have been tested and found to be great, rather than just good (and never had a test)- they may be lucky that they werent tested but life is about tests, isnt it? Although it should still be told (if genetic components) early on, it should be with a certain level of respect that they have been able to get this far with all of life’s tests. They can be tested later on in life and you will have an inkling now how they will deal with it.

What is this about a picture? you should hang a picture when rats come?