Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Having said that, I need to prepare supper for my husband – he is king in my house (and I am his queen)! He is my Rabbi Akiva and I am his Rochel!
“A virtuous wife is a crown to her husband.” Ever notice how the crown is higher than the person wearing it! Isn’t that odd?!
I also wonder why there is no composition for an “Ish chayil” (only “Aishes chayil”)- you would think…?
Also the order of the breiya in breishis starts from the lowest forms – domem(earth, water etc.), tzomeach (vegetation), chai (animals), medaber (man)…and then woman! Woman was the “sof ma’aseh – b’machshava t’chilah”!
A woman says a brocha, “she’asani k’ritzono” because Odam was created from earth, so his tzura (form) was limited by the chomer (Material) and therefore could not be mamesh “k’ritzono”. However, Chava was created from no earthly chomer, her celestial chomer was built around the rib, so her tzura was not limited to any chomer and made completely k’ritzono!
577 wrote: “you haven’t showed how my original logic was a boich svara”
The boich svara was when you wrote: “So a husband and wife are like one body. So of course a husband’s body is like his wife… they are like one body!” This svara is without ANY m’kor.
You disagree that Tosfos can be a raya that ishto k’gufo means that only the wife is like the husbands guf, but not the reverse. To you it is poshut that they are one body and each other’s guf.
As my husband would say, adarabah, apparently THAT is a shaylah discussed in the Bais HaOtzer by Reb Yossef Engel referenced earlier. On close examination, HE is the one who equates that Tosfos as a rayah to explain ishto k’gufo. A position you seem to disagree with!
Reb Yossef Engel also brings a kabbalistic pirush that the wmoan is like the guf and the husband is like the neshama – therefore, to the man-neshama, his wife is k’gufo, but clearly not the reverse, that the husband is k’gufa.
If you have a Bar Ilan program you can search further on ishto k’gufo for others who discuss this topic:
Me’iri Sanhedrin 28b in the name of Yesh Omrim that “ishto k’gufo” is specific that the wife is like the guf of husband but NOT reverse – not like your boich sevra that they are one body and the husband is like the woman’s body; See also Mordichai simon 697 and B.Y. and Bach s. 33.
(I need the Bar Illan but my husband knows these mkoros off the cuff!)
577 wrote: “Goldenpupik: the only boich svara here is yours. You are taking that Tosefos grossly out of context.”
Have you ever heard of the Goan Reb Yossef Engel? He wrote several seforim such as Gilyonei Hashas, Lekach Tov / Asvon D’Oraysa. He also wrote Bais Ha’Otzer.
Well, in Bais Ha’Otzer, klall 207, “Ishto k’gufo” he learns p’shat in Tosfos exactly in the manner that you call a boich svora. According to you, he takes this Tosfos “grossly out of context”.
With all due respect, I wonder who says pshat correctly, you or reb Yossef Engel?
I just “discovered” a b’ferush Ohr Ha’Chayim in Parshas Kedoshim 20:9 that says:
“when a son curses his Father, then he is also cursing his Mother together with the Father, and the same the reverse (when cursing the Mother, the father is also being cursed) because they are one guf, as Chazal say “Ishto k’gufo” and therefore what is done to one is also done to the other”
Hence we see that Ishto k’gufo works both ways! (Don’t you love the Bar Ilan Program – I have the entire Torah literally at my fingertips!!)
Although this seems b’stira to Tosfos in Ksubos 2b, which I need a lamdon or lamdonis to answer!
My chicken soup is golden and made with pupiks. It gives my husband choyach to learn. He promised me that I will have “ah golden’a Gan Eden”, I reply, “yes my pupik’l”.
577: “Goldenpupik: your husband’s diuk does not make sense. ishto k’gufo, as you said, means his wife is like his body. So a husband and wife are like one body. So of course a husband’s body is like his wife… they are like one body! I assume (and everyone knows what happens when you assume) that the diuk was made in jest”
My husband is a adom godol and all his words have sources in Torah.
There is a b’ferush Tosfos that supports his diyuk/”jest” (which I discovered while doing my Daf Yomi – which BTW I recommend for all ladies as it creates a mutual bond with my husband’s learning as we shmooz in the same sugya – thank you Art Scroll!!).
Anyway, unfortunately there the Tosfos is in Kesubos daf 2b, first Tosfos on the Omud, “Matzi”: A woman is the “field” of the husband but the husband is not her “field”! (This implies that Ishto k’gufo does not reverse into Ish shela k’gufa).
However, if there is a way to “shlog op” my husband’s diyuk (with a raya – not merely a “boich svora” which my hubby jests that they give him “stomach aches”), I would love to hear!!!
I challenge the lomdim and lomdos in the CR!!
Cherish your mothers. The ones who wiped your tears, who were at every ball game or ballet recital. The ones who believed in you, even when nobody else did, even when maybe you didn’t believe in yourself.
Women wear many hats in their lives. Daughter, sister, student, breadwinner. But no matter where we are or what we’re doing, one hat that moms never take off is the crown of motherhood.
There is no crown more glorious.
-Ann Romney (First Lady, 2012)
“our women? women are people not property.”
I keep saying that to MY husband!
He quotes chazal: “Ishto k’gufo”, a man’s woman is like his body.
My husband is m’dayek: We don’t say the reverse – “ish shela k’gufa”, that a woman’s man is like her body!
For those curious, the other two “divrei booros” – questions of nonsense asked by Anshei Alexandria:
Would Ben-Ha’shunamis be metameh?
The dead who will resurrect in the future, do they need sprinkling of ashes?
I sat silent hoping someone will say a word of emes. B’mokem she’ain ish – in a place that there is no man, a woman must speak up (who does daf yomi and happens to know shas):
A braysa at the end of Nidah 69:2 – The people of Alexandria asked R’ Yehoshuah b’ Chananyah twelve questions…three questions were mere nonsense – “divrei booros” (70:2): Does the wife of Lot m’tameh? He answered them, “A mes is m’tameh but not a ntziv melach”.
Anshei Alexandria were told the answer. Now you too.