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pushata – I like how “ad-dlo-yada has become a verb, as in “required to ad-dlo-yada”

By verb do you mean “peulas hamitzva”, like the blowing of the shofar or the reading of megilah?

Instead of the peulas hamitzvah, (which is the drinking) it might be the kiyum hamitzvah (being drunk).

Meno – you say that drinking is the mayseh hamitzvah and ad dlo yada is the shiyur, no, adaraba:

Drinking is not the mayseh hamitzvah but only a hecher to the mitzvah of “libsumay b’purya”.,

The tzura (element) of this “libsumay b’puya” mitzva is “ad dlo yada”.

in other words, the mayseh hamitzva is “libsumay b’purya” and the kiyum hamitzva is when he reaches the goal of ad dlo yada.

The cheftza of the mitzva is the drinking and the gavrah is being drunk.

SLeeping is just one way of being ad dlo yada. Someone who uses medical marijuana (or other narcotics) might also reach ad dlo yada that way. My kasha is, if MITZVOS TZRICHOS KAVANA, how does he and she have the proper kavana to be yotzeh the mitzva of ad dlo yada when asleep? Bi’shlomo when drinking , until he or she reaches shikrus Lot (of not knowing anything what is happening) there is “some ” kavana ability – therefore one can bentch after the seudah even in a state of ad dlo yada…but just as one canot bentch while in a state of sleep, how can one have kavonas hamitzvah of ad dlo yada while sleeping?!

Anyusername, the quote is a “yesh makilim” – implying that others are machmir not to use a cloth napkin, so if nose is bleeding at a kiddush on shabbos, I should use a lettuce leaf to hold my nose. It might look strange, but “al yayush mipnei ha’maligim” (do not despair from the mockers).

The answer is: Men don’t want to share the scotch with their wives and daughters. Al tachzik tova l’atzmecha.

Yaish, wine is wine. Drinking is drinking. Of course at different times we drink wine for diffrent reasons. We make kiddush on wine – women are michuyav. We drink daled kossos – women are michuyav. Simchas yom tov al hayayin – women are michuyev. If chazal felt a danger or a reason to forbid women from drinking, they would have. We can make a lomdes to distinguish this wine from that wine and this drinking from that drinking, but either women can or can’t drink, either they should or shouldn’t…one revi’is is meshaker (according to halacha)…if ess past nisht for women to be drunk – does it pas for men?! If it is not torahdig for women, is it torah=dig for men? Be honest – you are against the evil of drinking, you have a bias, but Chazal aren;t agreeing that it is evil, adarabah, they mandated it. So why do you think they were only mechatyev men>! Logically, it applies also to women!

YM – “to become heavily intoxicated to the point of Ad Delo Yada would be a gross violation of a [Jew’s] tafkid to be [aware of Hashem at all times] and an explicit divergence from hashkafas HaTora.”

I might a slight change in your point to show that it applies to both males and females.

Why would you target females when the logic is applicable to males?

Yet, Chazal were michayiv ad dlo yada. What makes you sure they excluded women???

lower – “as she can be motzi thru someone else”, sure, when her husband is away, she is forced to depend on a strange man to make kiddush for her…does she go to the strange man’s house or does she invite him into her house? (Of course keeping hilchos yichud). What;s wrong with THAT picture?! You say I am pushing a “women’s lib agenda” to allow her to make her own kiddush or am I pushing proper behaviour of a married bas yisroel not to depend on strange men to make kiddush for her??

fff – “If the guy is really a serious learner in Lakewood, I cannot imagine he would agree to be set up, let alone his parents approving of it. If he is willing to go out, I would question how serious is. ”

This girl ,besides all her personal maalos, is an actuary, earning 6-figures. She can easily support the long term learning of this bochur and can work remotely from EY using internet. This allows a serious lerner to reach for his dreams!

On top of that, she is machshiv Torah learning as her father is a RY and Rosh Kollel in a MO yeshiva. Plus, her parents would help major expenses like buying a house, car, bungalow, flights etc.

Girls hope the biy will change with time – and become less of a shlump – but it doesn’t happen.

Bochurim hope the girl won’t change – stay just a she is. Softspoken, aidel, fit. But she will change. The size 2 becomes size 12, The aidel maidel becomes an opinionated pisk.

Hashkofos – everyone can deal with it by learning to leave to G-d the relationship with G-d.

rofeh – “The 4 kosos are different than the wine drunk for add’loh yadah; The 4 kosos are consumed around the seder table, at home, without exposing herself to the (ugly) events/non-tzniyus of the outer world.”

So…based on that “svoras ha’beten”, a woman at a Pessach resort is OSSUR from drinking dalad kossos?!

According to Mrs Joseph, “Women are prohibited from drinking and getting shikkur on Purim according to l’chol hadeios.”

Who has the sefer ” l’chol hadeios”???

Now770, do you have a source that the instant golus ends, moshiach arrives? Between day and night there is twilight ‘bein hashmoshos”, a time of transition. When the yidden went out of mitzrayim, were out, yet the first 7 days they were not totally free of mitzrayim, they were chased, this lasted till kriyas yam suf – it was a transition period. If you say something, do you have a source or is it just how you feel today?!

Funny to see all the opinions that say it must davka be wine – not scotch, yet they are yotzeh with SLEEPING…

is sleeping a by-product of grapes?!

If sleeping is kiyum hamitzvah, surely an alcoholic beverage, especially one t which is “domeh l’yayin” by beng a “mashkeh ha’meshaker” – certainly that is closer to the chiyuv than sleeping!!!

Maybe have a bit of wine, zecher to the seudah in shushan, and then reach ad dlo yada with whiskey, rum, vodka, bourbon, scotch and a bit of brandy.

Lchaim!

Any recommendation on which scotch to do the chiyuv of ad dlo yada for women?

Full disclosure: The girl`s father is Rosh Kollel in a MO Kollel (hence references to Rabbi JB Soleveitchik and Rav Hershel Shachter – in another thread etc).

The consensus is that the girls whose father`s are Rosh Yeshiva or Rosh Kollel get the pick of the boys because they can afford to pay (if they are successful fundraisers). It makes no diff if the Kollel or Yeshiva is MO…they get the top boys.

For the boys in Lakewood watching this thread – take notes…it`s happening…live.

The Moetzes Gedolei HaTorah membership is political. Rav Pam wasn’t political so he was kept off the list. Old boys club.

Rav Shachter and Rav Belsky until his petira are the poskim for OU kashrus. They are not “mashgichim” but decide halacha policy and shailos. These are giants of Torah and halacha – not just in kashrus but many areas of Halacha, and their yedias HaTorah is far beyond the well-known roshei yeshivos and accepted rabbonim in America and Israel. That is why they are the poskim for the OU – an internationally recognized kashrus authority. To belittle such a godol b’Torah requires a ma’chah! Wez wouldn’t tolerate if someone belittled the possek of the EIda HaCharaidis or other accepted poskim of our generation. If you disagree with his shitos about Israel, just as you might disagree with Rav Cook and other gedolim of past generations, you still must be respectful.

In the early 60’s-70’s, many Rabbis of Conservative shuls (especially in smaller out of town cities) were frum yeshiva learners that were unsuccessful in getting a paying rabbonus (the frum shuls did not pay). Their daughters were “a member of and prays in a Conservative/Masorti synagogue.”

wasntme – following “precedent”, I cited the chazal: pook chazi my ama dbar, go see what others are doing. That is why the halacha is that we make a brocha shehakol on water (and not Borei Nefoshos). Seeing what other Yidden are doing and following their precedent is accepted in Yiddishkeit.

I was talking about Rav Shach too.

Rabbi Norman Lamm – a rov, a ben Torah, a mechaber of seforim and Torah articles.